Borgeson box with Bergman coupler question

[Dino]

I installed the Borgeson box and the Bergman coupler, the one that's like the stock one. Everything went in fine, but this is as far as the coupler will go. If it would go 1/4" more then the set screw would fit into the divet. The thing is, I don't see how it can go further because the steering column is bottomed out against the firewall. Is there an adjustment I'm missing?

[Kern Dog]

The two cars that I worked on, the Bergman adapter coupler fit all the way down.
Maybe your column has collapsed a slight amount? The center shaft is actually a shaft within a shaft, designed to collapse in the event of a front end collision. When I swapped my Borgeson in my Charger, I had to pull the shafts out slightly...

[Kern Dog]

.
Looking here, you can see how the center shaft is constructed.



They were pressed together and molten plastic was injected to fill the open spaces here:



A little known secret...if a man wanted to switch to a manual steering box, he could extend the inner shaft to effectively make the shaft longer to reach the manual steering box...no need for the $200 adapter. There is still quite a bit of engagement of the shaft within a shaft to be safe.

[Dino]

When I restored it there was no sign of collapse. Is it possible I collapsed it trying to fit it on? I did bang on the steering wheel a lot. Do I need to remove the whole column and take it apart? It's been a while since I've done this.

[Kern Dog]

I had to take the column out to swap steering boxes but if the column is back in but too short, you may be able to put a pair of Vice Grips or a pipe wrench on the lower section of the shaft and tap it forward...I'm just spitballin on that though. The drawback of making the shaft slide apart is that there may be an increase in vibrations due to the plastic between the shafts crumbling away. Actually, if the column had collapsed a bit, the plastic "pins" have already broken so there may be no noticeable change.

[Dino]

I didn't have much room with the column in the car so I took it back out. I put some vice grips on the shaft and with a few taps it extended well over an inch. It's back in the car and the coupler is all the way down onto the steering box. 

[Kern Dog]

Heck yeah, man. That is what I did. No rattles or vibrations from there.

[Dino]

I was looking forward taking it for a spin. I have a hydrobooster and added a small cooler, so it took forever to bleed the system. When I fired it up I had an immediate whine which turned into a loud schreeching when turning the wheel or applying the brakes. I shut it off and saw foam coming through the vent hole on the steering reservoir cap. Removed the cap and slowly saw the foam drop to the cold level. Started it up again for a second, just long enough to see fluid come out the hyogh pressure line at the box. Dammit...

[Kern Dog]

I tried Hydroboost 3 years ago. I could never get adequate boost to the brakes and burned up 3 new power steering pumps in the process.

[Dino]

I tried Hydroboost 3 years ago. I could never get adequate boost to the brakes and burned up 3 new power steering pumps in the process.

That sucks. They're great systems. Maybe something was wrong with the booster.

I've got the brakes and steering working. I didn't drive very far but first impressions on the new box are good!

I did an alignment a while back but something's off. I centered the steering wheel with the box but the wheel is not centered when driving straight. The tie rods are centered so I may have the pitman arm off by a tooth. I guess I could pull the column back a bit and realign the wheel, but I'll try the pitman arm first.

[Kern Dog]

I don't think it is possible to have the Pitman arm off anything but 90 degrees given this design:



My Tie rod sleeves are not the same length from side to side either.

[Dino]

Oh yeah. I forgot about that part. 

Since the alignment is good, I'm going to pull the steering column back a bit and turn it a notch or two. That should do it. This would be way easier if the steering wheel wasn't keyed.

[Kern Dog]

The Borgeson shaft that the steering column attaches to has no master spline, nor any visible 12:00 mark. It is easy to get the coupler installed off the mark since technically, there is no mark.
Rick Ehrenberg from Mopar Action has often stated that you must use a torque wrench to find the center by measuring the point where the highest torque reading shows when turning the shaft.
No.
I turned the shaft full left, then full right to determine the amount of turns the gear set takes full left and full right. From there, I turned back HALF the amount and marked the 12:00 position with a paint pen.









I am lucky enough to also have a steering wheel setup where I can clock the wheel on the hub...in case I am off the mark a bit.



Yes, I have since replaced the brake pedal pad!

[Dino]

I did the same as you and marked the center of the box.

I pulled the column turned it a few notches. Much better. I'll take it to work tomorrow and get a better feel for the box.

[Dino]

Alright, I've been driving it for the last few days. The steering slop is completely gone. The steering wheel is still slightly off but since I've been playing with ride height, I'm doing another alignment so that'll be fixed. Temps today were in the mid 90s, but feels like 105. I figured that was a good time to see how the old girl would do under stress. I took it for an hour drive one way, leaving around 1 this afternoon. Water temp stayed around 198 (usually steady at 185), until I stopped at a train crossing and didn't shut it off. It went up to 230 here and dropped back down to 200 once I got moving. All this time I have the AC on full blast. Car drove great, but I did notice early on that steering at standstill was pretty tight. It's not like that when cold. I also noticed the brakes may stick just a tad when leaving from a stop. I took the slop out of the brake pedal and I wonder if I turned the pushrod out too far and I'm putting a bit of pressure on the booster. Car does stop on a dime. No problem there. After a while of driving I noticed the steering started making a noise, like a swooshing noise. I have a hydrobooster and it sounds like a fluid pressure issue. Once I got back home and everything cooled off, it was quiet as a mouse. I am using the original Saginaw power steering box. I have a small cooler and an inline filter. I'm using power steering fluid, not ATF. I think Borgeson recommends a certain brand so I'll change the fluid, and back off the brake pedal and try again. If that doesn't work, I'll remove the filter and keep changing one thing at a time until I find the issue.
Despite all this, it is an absolute treat to go hard through corners on pothole ridden roads, without being afraid to lose the car. 

[b5blue]

Mine makes a very slight swoosh noise you can't hear if the A/C and/or radio is on. I bought the recommended pump and P/S fluid. (No cooler or filter yet.) 

[Kern Dog]

Alright, I've been driving it for the last few days. The steering slop is completely gone. The steering wheel is still slightly off

 Borgeson recommends a certain brand so I'll change the fluid, and back off the brake pedal and try again. If that doesn't work, I'll remove the filter and keep changing one thing at a time until I find the issue.
Despite all this, it is an absolute treat to go hard through corners on pothole ridden roads, without being afraid to lose the car. 

Two points:
1) If you have a steering wheel that is slightly off center, you can "center it" by rotating the tie rod sleeves. Turn each side an equal amount and the toe setting will not be affected. You could start with 1/4 turn at a time and road test to see if it is centered, repeat if necessary.
(Putting it clearer, rotate the left collar 1/4 turn, lock it down. Rotate the right collar the same direction 1/4 turn and lock it down.)
2) I used this:



Available at any GM dealer but it was $15 a quart.

[Dino]

I just ordered Driven power steering fluid as recommended by Bergman. Close to $17 a quart. I drove it some more today, same ridiculously high temps, and that fluid pressure noise came on after 5-10 minutes. It's less obvious when going straight but still there. I also noticed that the wheel does not fully return to center after a turn, I have to help it along a bit. Be it due to the current fluid, the heat, or something else, it seems that the system has low pressure.

I bought some alignment toys so I will make sure everything is up to snuff. I may end up buying the QA1 UCAs if I can't get enough caster. I'd really like to push it to around 7 degrees and see how it does, but no way I can do that with just the offset bushings.

[Kern Dog]

I got it to 6 degrees with stock arms, offset bushings and spacers between the lower ball joints and knuckles. I'm now at 8 degrees of caster, 1 degree of negative camber, 1/8" toe IN. Steering returns to center quite well!

[Dino]

Nice! I'll see if I can get those results.

[Dino]

I only got 4.5 degrees caster on the driver side and 3.5 on the passenger side. Camber is -1 degree. Tie rods are way off and the car tracks to the right even without crown in the road. I'll get some new UCAs and start over.
I got tired of messing with the steering wheel so I filed a spline in the keyed section. Should've done that eons ago!

Oh and I flushed the power steering and hydroboost, filled it up with Driven fluid, and it works great! No more noise, no excessive heat, and steering is like a modern car. It's not a cheap upgrade but well worth it. I am however disappointed in the Bergman coupler. For one, I had to buy another spring clamp, the 3.5" one since the original coupler uses a 3" clamp. And you really don't have much choice. There are barely any tabs on the new coupler to hold the metal cap on. You can bend the tabs all you want but there's just not enough for them to grab onto. Also since the coupler sits at an angle on the steering box, no idea why, it will pop off within 2 minutes. Yesterday I noticed that the new seal has already ripped and there's as much grease on the outside as there is on the inside. I'm going to probably end up buying the other coupler from Borgeson and consider this a $250 write off.

[Kern Dog]

If you liked the spring retainer, why not make your own? I did that with some 3/16" welding rod.
Your pull to the right is due to the caster difference.

[Dino]

If I need to buy material to make the clamp, I might as well just buy the clamp. My free time is also limited so I can't waste too much of it.

[b5blue]

15.00   https://www.megapartsusa.com/proddetail.php?prod=181-SCC102   

[Dino]

Yeah I got mine at Van's for $10.