Lighter gen 2

[Mike DC]

The center part of the K-frame has been replaced with raw tubing.  I don't see anything else obvious, is there other work too? 

I can't imagine that modification alone dumping anywhere near 40 pounds. 

[Rolling_Thunder]

no sway bar, tow tabs...       I dont see much else either ?   Enlighten me!

[69bronzeT5]

On a more serious noted.  IMO when you road race or auto cross you need parts that are strong.... not just light.  I guess, my concern would be make it strong, worry about weight second......

I totally agree.

[Charger440RDN]

Here is the Mr. Angry 68 Charger in the autocross in this video, would this be the type of result your'e trying to achieve with the Charger? Cool video take a look:

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9xM-UM-vhw

[R2]

The K frame was lightned with moly,,,tubular in some spots.....
You guys are correct though....the additional weight loss is due to the drag links,idler arms,etc,,,,steering shaft all changed over to moly and i put some motor ears on the car as well,,,and got rid of the motor mounts,,,,,
So there was alot more than just the K frame mods to loose that much weight,,,sorry i forgot to mention it all
There is a guy locally that does all this stuff,,and does great work,,,,
It was a way for me to get some weight off the front of the car ,,,,, and get some pan clearance.

Just thinking of other options for weight lose off the front end,,,,,some of which worked for me,
Doug

[Ghoste]

Was it Mopar Action or High Performance Mopar that some years back to a bone stock New Yorker or something and just kept on taking parts off and running it down the strip to see how much difference each part made?  They started with non essential bolt ons and eventually I think they even started cutting off sheet metal.

[Mike DC]

   
There was a Hot Rod issue in the 1990s where they took a cheap huge fullsize GM (1970s Catalina?) and hacked it to bits making it faster.  I think eventually they had it down to a roofless, doorless, fenderless hulk.  They cut the weight about in half. 

[Ghoste]

Same principle and era, different brand.  I keep thinking MA, it seems like an Ehrenburg experiment.

[Charger440RDN]

   
There was a Hot Rod issue in the 1990s where they took a cheap huge fullsize GM (1970s Catalina?) and hacked it to bits making it faster.  I think eventually they had it down to a roofless, doorless, fenderless hulk.  They cut the weight about in half. 

At that point it's not even a car  Just buy a motorcycle 

[Ghoste]

It does prove the point about losing weight though.  

[Hemidog]

Here's the 64 Imperial after Dr. E-bergs Weight Loss Diet!

[Ghoste]

There you go, I knew I wasn't imagining it.  I seem to recall some quote by Dick Landy years ago too where he claimed he had a kid on staff and between rounds he would hand him a file and tell him to go grind a couple of pounds off of the 67 Coronet.

[motorcitydak]

 
I do not think I would go that far as to take a file to my car or cut all the panels off. Im just looking to shave 6-800 pounds off it and like most guys are saying, I want that to come off the front end and from the interior. I do not think there is much room for improvement on the back side of the car.

I also would not be going as far as to use titanium bolts to save a few pounds either. Ill be using grade 5 and 8 bolts thru out the car

R2, does your guy build a full tubular K member? Mancini has em and when I add in the tubular control arms and other light weight components like a manual steering box, I should save about 80 pounds more there. I want to use a tubular K member, but I just do not like the stock ends and tube in the middle, just does not look rite to me.

[R2]

I think AlterKation and Magnum Force make the full tubular K frame setup....

http://www.magnumforceracing.com/store4/magnumforce_kmember.htm

I would bet the guy (Bob) that did mine could make what ever you want / need, very talented ....he has pics of some of his tube K frames on his site,,,,see below..........

His link is www.bobsprofab.com    
very good guy, honest,,and does nice work,,,he is located near Norwalk Ohio (probably not too far from Detroit,,,which is where i grew up,,,fyi,,,)

hope this helps........

[motorcitydak]

Well I cannot say for sure, but I am relatively posative that I have made up my mind for what to do with my front end.

The Magnum Force stuff is nice but the setup I could run is just over $6,000. It does cut weight but it also uses coilovers which there is an obvious controversy over. I am just going to look around to find something that is a modified and stronger K member still in stock configuration.

Also, the Alter K Tion is nice, but I know for a fact that what I have decided to go with will destroy that setup in a race.

I have been talking to the guys at Hotchkis about the parts they have for my car. The setup is awesome, they built the e-max Challenger with the same parts. The car tears up the road course and auto cross. They told me they hit an auto cross in Ohio and came in 3rd place over all only losing to a 2000# race-prepped Corba and a race-prepped 700hp Corvette with a nascar driver behind the wheel. Their front end setup is around $1500 and they have a rear sway bar I am going to run for $350 or so. The rest of the rear end parts I cannot use because of my plan for a 3 link. They say that they are the hands down fastest mopar at the races and that includes magnum force and alter k tion equipped cars. I just have to say that I am gunning for that title once my car is completed. I will have their technology with more power and less weight. It should be very interesting if I can race that car with mine

[suntech]

My honest opinion........................you talked to a great salesman!!!!  

[Charger-Bodie]

Id go with the Alter-k-tion over any of the others . Bill is a very personable guy to deal with and he understands his product. XV is also very nice but not worth the diff in price IMH.

[motorcitydak]

The only thing I am waiting to see about the car is what it will pull on a skid pad. I was told that in January they will be doing a lot of testing with the car. They will be doing the skid pad, slolam and seeing what kind of lateral G's the car can pull and how fast it will run the course.

The salesman did not really push the stuff on me, I was just calling up to ask a few questions about some of the parts they are running. I also wanted to know the prices. I was convinced to use it after a lot of searching over the web to find the absolute best parts or kit I could run that actually has been tested. They not only build a 70 T/A Challenger but they campaign it all over the country in auto cross with out some huge logo on it. Unless you know the car, you would not know its a company car. They are also the only company that did not stick with the stock mounts for the UCA's. They just used them to anchor the new mounts that put the mounts into a proper locations.

[Ghoste]

What is it about the upper mounts that they don't like?

[motorcitydak]

Id guess the geometry of it was not exactly what they wanted so rather than deal with it like most other companies do, they build their own way to move it to an optimal position. They are a little expensive tho at $650, but I think it is absolutely worth it. Check em out

http://www.bangshift.com/new-products/Hotchkis-Performance-Now-Offers-Mopar-Suspension.html

[HPP]

They altered the mounting points to take the anti-dive geometry out of them. This also has the additional benefit of reducing dynamic caster changes during suspension travel. Not something you would significantly notice in normal driving, but it does provide a more linear and predictable suspension movement during aggressive movements.

[Ghoste]

Okay, that makes sense.  What would be the reasons for an oem to not design these things into it? 

[Rolling_Thunder]

Okay, that makes sense.  What would be the reasons for an oem to not design these things into it? 

back in the day they were concerned with things like ride quality, production cost, bushing wear...       My bet is that one of those things were effected  (notice new arms run heim joints - not bushings)   

[motorcitydak]

The bushings would also add in a small amount of deflection. That is just not acceptable on a race car. The front end setup also includes all new bushings to their spec's to control every aspect of the suspension. One thing I find strange is that they are using the factory LCA. I can just brace it a little which is what they did but tubular's are so tempting that I will most likely go that route. Every part of the front end will be built to allow absolutely no deflection, twist or flex. I want the front end as solid as possible.

[HPP]

The engineers had to create designs that were suitable for a wide range of drivers who had grown a custom to cars as a more luxury oriented item. People were willing to accept softer rides with less feedback that what we have today. A lot of that has to do with driver perception. In the 40 ears since these cars were built, the driving public's perception of what constitutes performance has changed and we are more demanding drivers now. We are willing to give up the anti-dive geometry and control it with higher spring rates. We are willing to pay more for shocks to control those springs.