I was wondering how many of you use subframe connectors on your old Charger. I have a '66 and a '69 but was thinking about installing them on the '69. I've heard that you have to put a buldge in the floor so they will fit properly? Is this correct? Does the car handle THAT much better? I do plan on racing the car some, but not on a regular basis. Please give me your opinion on them. Thanks!
Justin
"CornDog"
I definatly recoomend them , depending how the subframe connector is designed it can be cut into the floor or it can stay under the floor & barely be noticable , I use .125 wall 1"x2" box tube , & I stay under the floor pans
I put 2"X2"connectors,from (ART) on my 69 ,with out cutting the floor,
You shouldn't need to cut the floor on a second gen car (68-70). These cars are old and weren't the stiffest to begin with so the connectors should help in every case. You want the suspension doing all the work and not fighting your frame.
More info:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,4534.0.html
Troy
Just today I placed the order with Year One for them. $ 113.00 - 20% (Hunt5 code) = $ 90.40! You cant beat that. I'm installing them because I'm spicing up the 440 on the rebuilt with Bulldog heads and Engle cam. Also the car is in the body shop and I want him to paint them so they look like original equipment.
I bought a 25' piece of 1"x2" steel for $20 and made 3 sets. On a second gen they are just straight tubing and you have to make a plate on the end towards the front. Obviously these are welded in - not the MP bolt-in pieces.
Troy
they made a difference on mine, feels far better
they need to be welded in though, even if you buy the bolt in ones, or the movement of the body will start corrosion where they're bolted in
I had my 66 done with a bit of chassis gusseting as well (recommended by Chryco) and I could feel the difference as I backed out of the shop and turned away. It was by far one of the most noticeable differences done on the car. tightend the car right up.
You won't regret it. Do a little reaserch, it's not really a big job.
Ron
yep i alos put them in my 70... used 2x2 tubing and didnt cut the floors check out the pics.. havent drove her yet,but she will deff be stronger i coud tell when i was jacking her up and down..
-ray
(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a105/charger666/IM000163.jpg)
(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a105/charger666/IM000162.jpg)
(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a105/charger666/IM000249.jpg)
(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a105/charger666/charger7-3-05009.jpg)
I just had them put in my 73. They had to cut through the rear floor pans but they did an awesome job because they welded the section they cut through to the frame rail they put in. It cost me 400.00 to get it done.
69 charger man: On you Photobucket page look at the top for "Account Options" and click it. Near the bottom of the page where you'll see "Display IMG Yes No [IMG]...[ /IMG] for most message boards". Make sure you choose "Yes" and then use that here on the message board. Then your images will display the right way.
Troy
Quote from: Troy on November 07, 2005, 10:20:39 PM
69 charger man: On you Photobucket page look at the top for "Account Options" and click it. Near the bottom of the page where you'll see "Display IMG Yes No [IMG]...[ /IMG] for most message boards". Make sure you choose "Yes" and then use that here on the message board. Then your images will display the right way.
Troy
thanks i fixed it
ray
Quote from: Troy on November 07, 2005, 04:22:50 PM
I bought a 25' piece of 1"x2" steel for $20 and made 3 sets. On a second gen they are just straight tubing and you have to make a plate on the end towards the front. Obviously these are welded in - not the MP bolt-in pieces.
Troy
That's exactly what I was going to do Troy, but I spoke with kevin my body guy and by the time he measures and cuts the hole for the emergency cable and fits them in place, the cost would have surpassed the cost of just buying them already made. I was waiting for the YO sale for awhile. The ones from YO have the plates and cable window already in them. I should have planned it better and I should have fabricated them myself and installed them before I gave him the Charger. The ones I bought from YO are 2"x2".
I bought 1"x2" on Chryco's recommendation and you don't have to cut a hole for the parking brake cable at that size. If I didn't know someone to do the work cheap I would have bought premade ones on sale. As it is, I had access to a chop saw and metal cutting tools so my only other expense is the welding which I had to pay no matter what. With the price of steel these days I'm not sure how much cheaper it is though. Considering that I can sell my 3rd set it worked out well for me.
Troy
To bad you are not close. I would of offered to weld them on for you. :icon_smile_big:
I need lots of welding so make a weekend trip... :D
Don't forget, I have three cars and the subframe connectors are definitely the simplest welds on any of them.
Troy
I got the subframe connectors from US CarTool for my '68. They are cut to fit the contours of the floor - just a little grinding, and they fit great.
http://www.uscartool.com/Bframeconn/index.html
I went with the MP bolt in SF connectors and had them welded.....these connectors sit just under the floor. The car is much stiffer. The US Cartool laser cut SF connectors are pretty slick. If you're looking for a stock look that would be your best bet.
Ron
I had Magnum Force www.magnumracing.com (http://www.magnumforce.com) fabricate a set for my '73. Actually, my '73 was the basis for the jig they made for all their future '73 sub-frame connectors. The connections used are bolted (rear) and welded (spot through a few of the front mounting holes). I've attached a few photos of the beasties. Good guys.
Dan
here are what I make last year,take some time but they look good and working
Do it. Its a night and day difference.
Quote from: 73SEDan400 on November 15, 2005, 11:27:44 PM
I had Magnum Force www.magnumracing.com (http://www.magnumforce.com) fabricate a set for my '73. Actually, my '73 was the basis for the jig they made for all their future '73 sub-frame connectors. The connections used are bolted (rear) and welded (spot through a few of the front mounting holes). I've attached a few photos of the beasties. Good guys.
Dan
I bought the same ones, thanks for being the prototype!
How were they to install? I received the parts, but I won't be able to install them until the spring.
doctorpimp (must be a story there, somewhere!), :P
Magmum Force installed the subframe connectors for me, as I was kind enough to lend them my car for the day. But I imagine that you fit them up, mark for the bolts, bolt it up, and then spot weld the front attachment holes then all will be fine.
I actually brought the car back to them a second time, as they did not have their jig properly marked and did not know which way was up. It may have been your order that "allowed" me to go back to the shop, and get a peek at their super-charged, tubbed, Nitrous, '68 Hemi Daytona clone (http://www.magnumforce.com/cars/daytona/daytona.htm). Any excuse.... :icon_smile_tongue:
Dan
Quote from: greenrt_se on November 17, 2005, 02:41:51 PM
here are what I make last year,take some time but they look good and working
those look just like the us car tool ones. those things are the cat's ass!!!
if you put in the us cartool subframe connectors, would you have to pull the seats and carpet for fear of lighting them on fire when welding from the botton?
Quote from: dkn1997 on December 03, 2005, 11:50:26 AM
if you put in the us cartool subframe connectors, would you have to pull the seats and carpet for fear of lighting them on fire when welding from the botton?
Ummmmmmmmm....YES ! :flame: :lol:
Ron
Ps. I was at a bodyshop fire recently....you guessed it, the owner was welding on the underside of a van and lit it up pretty good. The fire extended to 3 other vehicles and roasted them too as well as taking out all his paint supplies and spray booth. The inside of the shop was gutted and it was pretty wild when we pulled up. Paint, thinners, clearcoat all likes to burn.....major fuel for a fire ! If you're doing any welding on the underside remove the carpeting and drop the gas tank/drain the lines....don't take any chances.
:2thumbs: I'm doing my 68.:iagree: My buddy just bought a wirefeed welder about a month ago to learn how to do his own welds. He started to patch his floorpans and cought fire. :nono: Guess what's under the car on the bottom side??? YEP! he didn't clean the oils, tranny, and whatever fluids off the bottom of the car. No big deal, he was able to put it out quickly but could have been bad and scared the hell out of him :slap: Chuck........................
That happend to me to.. I just kept welding :P
So, anyone have them just bolted in? I would prefer this approach if it will work, let me know what you guys think.
Dont. It dosnt make much of a difference bolting them in. To get the real benifits they need to be welded. Its no big deal you cant see it till you go under.
im not worried about looks... it would just be more convenient for me to bolt in thats all
Quote from: 73SEDan400 on November 15, 2005, 11:27:44 PM
I had Magnum Force www.magnumracing.com (http://www.magnumforce.com) fabricate a set for my '73. Actually, my '73 was the basis for the jig they made for all their future '73 sub-frame connectors. The connections used are bolted (rear) and welded (spot through a few of the front mounting holes). I've attached a few photos of the beasties. Good guys.
Dan
Hey Dan. I'm thinking of getting a set of these for my '73 and have a few questions. Did you have to cut into the floorpan at all? How do they fit around the t-bar crossmember(my biggest concern)? Did you lose any/much ground clearance by putting them in? How much difference do they really make? What kind of difference would I feel by installing them(less body roll / more responsive road feel / etc.)? Do you think I could replicate them from steel tubing very easy? $250 sounds kind of steep.
Thanks,
Zach
DO it man... My cost was actually free... i had some thick walled 2x3" tubing laying around so i cut and welded them in....
How does the emergency brake cable route with sub-frame connectors? Over the top with rubber hose sleeve or what?
off set slots cut into the driver side box section :yesnod:
picture from Automotive rust technology www.autorust.com . i have fitted these connectors & torque boxes from these guys to mine .... awesome stuff only minor trimming to fit :yesnod: :thumbs:
Tan - Thanks for the picture.
I was looking at the laser cut connectors that match the floor contours like US Tool sells. Any one have a picture of the cable routing on these?
yeah i know the ones you mean now :yesnod: , probably the same sort of set up for the cable :-\
a guy on here fitted that type to his 69 .. i believe he had pictures up on his web site . i think he goes by then name of -- 69green R/T SE.. or something he lives in Finland.
I picked up the bolt-on MP ones from Mancini Racing for my '69. They did not recommend notching them out for the parking brake cable, they just told me to route the cable over it. They said the notching may weaken the bar.
The underside of my '69 project is painted, & I wanted to paint the connectors nice to match. So, to install them I ended up grinding the inside mating flanges of the subframe connectors. I also marked on the car where the subframe connectors would meet, & ground those areas to bare metal, too.
I ended up installing them with a combination of bolting them on, and using panel-bond adhesive. The adhesive is supposed to be as strong, or stronger, than weld. If anything, they will at least be stronger than if I had just bolted them in alone. And, I didn't disrupt the freshly painted undercarriage.
the guys doing the body work on my car used competition enginering bolt on connectors and just welded them in, no cutting or fabrication at all, they look really good, almost stock if you didn't know better.