Here are some pictures of my Charger that HLPAG lied lke a mo fo on their e-bay add on. Also is a direct quote from the add. I have plenty of other pics of rusted areas and or damage that they failed to mention and that their strategicly (spelling) taken pictures failed to show, but don't want to bore anyone to death..
"LOOKS LIKE IT STILL HAS ALL OF IT'S ORIGINAL BODY PANELS ON IT AND IS READY TO BE RESTORED! THE TRUNK PAN HAS ALREADY BEEN CUT OUT AND READY FOR THE NEW ONE TO BE INSTALLED! THE 1/4'S HAVE THE TYPICAL CHARGER RUST AND WILL NEED SOME EASY WORK DONE TO THEM! THE REAR WINDOW AREA LOOKS TO BE NICE AND SOLID! THE REAR RAILS WILL NEED SOME WORK BUT SHOULD BE EASY TO DO! THE CAR IS PRETTY COMPLETE AND HAS A BIG BLOCK IN THE CAR THAT IS NOT RUNNING! MOST OF THE INTERIOR IS THERE BUT WILL NEED TO BE REDONE! "
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00198.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00166.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00165.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00158.jpg)
Ouch! I'd be looking for your money back, "rails need some work" you've got to find them first :down:
you must have some course for legal action, good luck
Quote from: AirborneSilva on October 02, 2005, 06:58:42 AM
but don't want to bore anyone to death.
Don't even worry about that part, if we can help we will and this needs to be seen to those who don't know the Illinois hillbillies.
Rear rails need some work huh? What rails ??
These guys shoud be shot on sight, I really don't understand why they're still in business, since when is it ok to falsly advertise over there???
All I can say is do anything you can to get your money back so get a lawyer asap.
There has to be a more efficient way to warn potential buyers about these guys.
I wush there was something I could do, for everyone caught up in their web of deceipt.Whatever happened to that woman who bought one for her hubby ?
Thanks guys, and yeah I'd love to find that women who was taking them to court. I will be filling a complaint with e-bays fraud protection and see if I can't get any money back out of it, to help with the restoration. I have been told by a few members that since it is a true R/T it is worth the effort and time to fix her up, and I agree, but man do I feel like I've been rapped!!!! :flame:
Exactly, sure it's worth fixing it but this is not what you paid for now is it?
Ebay will probably be unable to help you out but file the complaint anyway.
I think you need to file a complaint somewhere in IL. since that's where they are but I have no clue where to do so.
Here for instance, the shop where I work is connected to acoat selected, if they get complaints about us doing a bad job with their products, or misadvertise or do anything not up to par with the contract then we're in trouble.Don't tell me these guys can actually get away with all this, land of the free is nice but don't overdo it.
Hey doc, I have no clue as to where to begin in Illinois either so that is why I'm starting here http://pages.motors.ebay.com/services/purchase-protection.html ( a forum member posted this for me), it certainly looks like I meet their criteria but we will see.
Quote from: AirborneSilva on October 02, 2005, 07:20:58 AM
Thanks guys, and yeah I'd love to find that women who was taking them to court.
paintstallions@hotmail.com
What'd you pay for that car? Can you post more pictures of it?
I think he paid $5k for it :shruggy: .
Yeah, I found the other thread. $5k...I'm scared about the rest of the car.
they got brass balls, saying that the trunk was cut out. there gonna mess with the wrong person one day and get hurt. Rene
Quote from: BigBlockSam on October 02, 2005, 09:50:59 AM
they got brass balls, saying that the trunk was cut out. there gonna mess with the wrong person one day and get hurt. Rene
That's for sure... I can see how the wrong person could hurt them a real good bit after he/she bought a car from them.
Texas Acres has frame rails. Might wanna check them out
http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal.html
(http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal/rails.jpg)
Quote from: 68-70 Charger on October 02, 2005, 10:01:30 AM
Quote from: BigBlockSam on October 02, 2005, 09:50:59 AM
they got brass balls, saying that the trunk was cut out. there gonna mess with the wrong person one day and get hurt. Rene
That's for sure... I can see how the wrong person could hurt them a real good bit after he/she bought a car from them.
As long as they post pics!!!
Quote from: DodgeChargerGuy on October 02, 2005, 10:43:05 AM
Texas Acres has frame rails. Might wanna check them out
http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal.html
(http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal/rails.jpg)
Thanks for the link, I will definetly check them out when I can come up with the money to start buying the plethora of parts/panels I will need.
here are a few more pics.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00197.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00195.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00186.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00139.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00133.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00121.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00118.jpg)
That makes me mad to see that. Do you have budget enough to fix it? Any skills to do work yourself?
dooooh!
This is an absolute crime! I'm furious for you bud! I would contact the attorney general for your state and his state. I'd take legal action immediately and let him know that you are taking action.
He's lucky that someone hasn't come by his shop and taken him out. I can't believe that he's still pulling his tricks.
Good luck and post what you plan to do and how you make out.
Mike R in Reading PA
aka
MFR426
Reality Check: Now that the "Save all Chargers at any cost" crowd has had their say, time to face the facts, You got SCREWED, the car is junk, period. If you can find all the parts you need (some are not available new and would have to be found used ) and IF you can find a body shop willing to do the work (tough to do in this day of get it in and out quick insurance jobs ) you're looking at a minimum of $5000 for replacement parts ( have you tried to find a decent 69 Charger fender? ) and roughly $7000-$10,000 on labor costs, this does NOT include the paint job, the drivetrain, interior, etc. If you do find a shop willing to do the work,they will likely have your car for at least a year, probably more - it'll just sit in the corner gathering dust while they slap new fenders on toyatas and chevies every day, when the shop is slow, they'll bang on you car a liitle bit, just enough to justify sending you a bill each month.
So now it's late 2006/early 2007,you've just picked up you car from the body shop. it doesn't run because it has no engine, so you have to hire a flat bed to bring it home, it's in primer so you'd better get it in the garage right away-No garage? all that new metal work will start rusting literally over night if not stored indoors.
So now you've spent over a year of your time and a total of $20,000, what do you have? A primered rolling shell that is already starting to rust. You'll have $40,000 in that heap before you can ever slide behind the wheel and turn the key for the first time. I get the feeling that if you had $40K just laying around to spend on an old car you wouldn't have bought this one.
If you are an expert welder / fabricator / body man, can do the work yourself, have a good sized garage to work in with all the tools needed, and enjoy a challenge this car might be worth doing.
I've personally junked cars that were more Rare/desireable and in better shape...
Otherwise, I'd look for a different car, and try to sue the crooks that sold you this heap. :flame: :flame:
Sorry man!! :flame: But I have seen parts cars in better shape than that. :rotz:
If you can't get your money back - you might be able to recoup some $$ by parting it out. There is a law of diminishing returns and I think this one is way over the hump. Daytona R/T is right about how much money you will have to sink into it and what you will end up with. Put your money into something worth your time and energy.
Well said Daytona R/T SE :yesnod: My '69 383 4spd was in better shape then that but it was also nuthing more then a parts car that I bought with out considering the resto cost. And mine had no floors either and was missing the right rear frame rail. That is why I sold it. It plain sucks to have to part one out, and like me, you may want to restore it. But in reality, thats what you bought. A parts car. I'd get a good attorny. But in the end, it's you thoughts as what to do with it.
Quote from: Daytona R/T SE on October 02, 2005, 01:26:39 PM
Reality Check: Now that the "Save all Chargers at any cost" crowd has had their say, time to face the facts, You got SCREWED, the car is junk, period. If you can find all the parts you need (some are not available new and would have to be found used ) and IF you can find a body shop willing to do the work (tough to do in this day of get it in and out quick insurance jobs ) you're looking at a minimum of $5000 for replacement parts ( have you tried to find a decent 69 Charger fender? ) and roughly $7000-$10,000 on labor costs, this does NOT include the paint job, the drivetrain, interior, etc. If you do find a shop willing to do the work,they will likely have your car for at least a year, probably more - it'll just sit in the corner gathering dust while they slap new fenders on toyatas and chevies every day, when the shop is slow, they'll bang on you car a liitle bit, just enough to justify sending you a bill each month.
So now it's late 2006/early 2007,you've just picked up you car from the body shop. it doesn't run because it has no engine, so you have to hire a flat bed to bring it home, it's in primer so you'd better get it in the garage right away-No garage? all that new metal work will start rusting literally over night if not stored indoors.
So now you've spent over a year of your time and a total of $20,000, what do you have? A primered rolling shell that is already starting to rust. You'll have $40,000 in that heap before you can ever slide behind the wheel and turn the key for the first time. I get the feeling that if you had $40K just laying around to spend on an old car you wouldn't have bought this one.
If you are an expert welder / fabricator / body man, can do the work yourself, have a good sized garage to work in with all the tools needed, and enjoy a challenge this car might be worth doing.
I've personally junked cars that were more Rare/desireable and in better shape...
Otherwise, I'd look for a different car, and try to sue the crooks that sold you this heap. :flame: :flame:
:iagree:
i said before it was worth fixing but now that i see more pictures, i have to agree with Daytona R/T SE . it'll cost you alot of money and time. sue there ball's off and part the car out to get back some of your money. Rene
God damn, hlpag is pathetic. I wish you the best of luck in getting some money back.
heres a link to The Better Business Bureau Serving Chicago and Northern Illinois.
only showing one complaint against them. maybe they can steer you in the right direction.
http://www.chicago.bbb.org/commonreport.html?bid=46000098
I agree with the rest of the guys-that car is too far gone to spend the time and money. I have a 69 383 G code car and have spent about 40K on it doing most of the work myself. It's taken me about 10 years too AND it was in better shape.
I'd get my money back (hopefully it can be done) and find a complete car in better shape.
Mike R in Reading PA
I agree with the previous posts, that car is not worth the 40 K plus it's gonna taketo make a legit roadworthy R/T again...
the crooks said in their listing, and I quote,.. "an Easy Fix" "a Simple Fix".. show that to any bodyman and see what they say...
Then show it to a lawyer...
..and as regards HALPAG?... they're goin down... :flame:
I followed your other thread but held back from saying anything until I saw some pics.
These pics made me sick to my stomach. I too agree with Daytona R/T SE. You are going to spend a large pile of money to even make this "thing" a driver. Try your options with ebay or filing a complaint with the AG's office. I'd use a lawyer as a last resort, they will just suck more money out of your pocket. If you could get half your money back that would be better than nothing. I've seen cars in this shape sell at Carlisle for 3k.
Quote from: NHCharger on October 02, 2005, 07:30:43 PM
I followed your other thread but held back from saying anything until I saw some pics.
These pics made me sick to my stomach. I too agree with Daytona R/T SE. You are going to spend a large pile of money to even make this "thing" a driver. Try your options with ebay or filing a complaint with the AG's office. I'd use a lawyer as a last resort, they will just suck more money out of your pocket. If you could get half your money back that would be better than nothing. I've seen cars in this shape sell at Carlisle for 3k.
Yes, I'm afraid to go to a lawyer, the wife and I just don't have the money for that. thanks to all for your replys. I will be sending HLPAG an e-mail through e-bay and see what happens. I will also follow the link to the better business bureau. I will see about contacting the AG too, as stated we just don't have the money for an lawyer.
shit that car is so rusted I would be afraid to touch it so it wont fall apart,
"trunk pan has been cut out" they ment rusted out ... take it back man
Why did you deal with Hlpag, it's all over the internet how bad they are. I am sorry for your predicament. :rotz:
A re-body is the best bet. That poor Charger is flatlined.-----------------------------------------------------------------
I really don't want to start a pissing contest, that is not my intention since as you can tell I have enough problems, but I have some telling me that yes it will take work and money but it can be restored, now I have some telling me it's a total loss. I am not a body and fender man so I don't know what to believe or think. :-\
It *could* be made whole again. The question is: do you have the time, money, patience, skill, and/or connections to get it done? I've seen worse put back on the road but it does take a huge amount of work. If you had documentation and the numbers matching drivetrain then maybe you could come out all right in the end but it's a HUGE undertaking. Most people would part that car out - if there were any decent pieces left. Some people could manage to get it back together because they are skilled but they won't be paying labor to someone else do it. With hourly rates around $60-80 do you want to pay someone to weld in frame rails that will cost you $500 each? The metal alone will be in the thousands of dollars. With the money you'd put into the car by paying for the work you could just put it in the bank and buy a better car. I'd do everything possible to get rid of that thing before you get in too deep.
Troy
Quote from: cudahob3 on October 02, 2005, 09:05:02 PM
Why did you deal with Hlpag, it's all over the internet how bad they are. I am sorry for your predicament. :rotz:
A re-body is the best bet. That poor Charger is flatlined.-----------------------------------------------------------------
Trust me, I wish I had found out about them too.... I also had a hell of a time finding this forum so how am I going to find out about these mother fuckers? I'm sorry but I don't need to be told that I'm a dumb ass, I know that :flame:
Airborne,
I don't think anybody here is calling you a dumb---. I think you trusted these guys to deliver what they said they would. I've trusted people in the past and have been burned, too.
My motto now is:
"Trust But Verify"
you ain't no dumb ass, you got ripped off. has happened to me several times in my life. Rene
God Tony, I wish I could tell you mine was worst than mine but I cannot. But by the time I was done cuuting mine up for the repair I was where you are now. Seems mother natuer did the cutting for you.
Quaters, well that is nothing and normal. Send me your number and I will do some calling and see if I can find you something that will fix the problem.
It rolled off, yoy have a Fork lift? :icon_smile_big: :flame:
Send me there address as well, retired 18th Airborn and with in driving distances, well break in the 440 anyway.
FUCKING LEG's
Ken
It will be saved if you dont give up. Busting some jaws, well we will talk about that.
Quote from: cudaken on October 03, 2005, 12:00:54 AM
God Tony, I wish I could tell you mine was worst than mine but I cannot. But by the time I was done cuuting mine up for the repair I was where you are now. Seems mother natuer did the cutting for you.
Quaters, well that is nothing and normal. Send me your number and I will do some calling and see if I can find you something that will fix the problem.
It rolled off, yoy have a Fork lift? :icon_smile_big: :flame:
Send me there address as well, retired 18th Airborn and with in driving distances, well break in the 440 anyway.
FUCKING LEG's
Ken
It will be saved if you dont give up. Busting some jaws, well we will talk about that.
Brother Airborne Troop, you and I know that LEG's are the lowest form of life on this planet and these bastards just proved it once again :yesnod:
I hate to say this but I would not tackle that project even if the car was free! I feel sorry for you. I almost drove out there to look at a few chargers about a year ago but luckily I found this site first.
:o
That is a shame. You spent a lot of money for a fender tag and vin. :flame:
If all else fails look for a donor car. I know of person that bought a solid car to replace the rotted car. The only good parts on his rotted car were the front fenders and hood.
Good Luck
Robert
Quote from: 67_Dodge_Charger on October 03, 2005, 10:41:52 AM
:o
That is a shame. You spent a lot of money for a fender tag and vin. :flame:
If all else fails look for a donor car. I know of person that bought a solid car to replace the rotted car. The only good parts on his rotted car were the front fenders and hood.
Good Luck
Robert
I don't even have the fender tag, that has rusted off >:(
Unbelievable. :icon_smile_angry: I was going to say something like "not to bum you out but you'll be lucky to save that thing" and then I read what Daytona wrote. Yea, the car is not a goner but you're looking at some serious, serious body issues that are not easily or inexpensively fixed. If it were a Hemi car it would be a no-brainer, just because you could easily recoup your expenses or dump it if things got too deep. But a regular R/T is not nearly as valuable. Actually I think Daytona's $40k estimate is a pretty conservative number. Some very nice R/Ts are going for that but I'd say unless you know how to do all this stuff yourself you could run much higher than $40k.
I would contact every form of authority in and around Lake Villa, Ill. and maybe the feds in order to make life for the HLPAG people as miserable as possible. They are nothing but lying thieves, and that's been proven time and again on this site alone.
I posted on the other thread with some ideas on documenting, & now that I've see the photos, I'll chime in with my opinion on the car. I would agree that it isn't worth fixing unless you can do the work yourself & have a parts car that is complete. That would mean that the parts car would need to be in better shape than this one. (Kind of counter productive, you think?) Like a few others have stated, I've parted & scrapped cars in better shape. There's nothing to add about telling you helpgagme in Lake Vulgar, Illinois are scum, but if you are saying you can't afford a lawyer, you can basically forget about the cost of trying to resurrect that rolling POS.
I know it's an R/T & somewhat desirable, but bailing on that car now & finding a better one to start with might be best. (That's what I would do, & have done.) Aside from the money, the time & energy that car needs will probably suck the life out of you quickly. Some things only you can answer are, what part of the restoration could you handle yourself? What kind of patience do you have? How much of the project will your wife be interested in? What kind of patience does your wife have if she isn't interested in the car? I'm not an expert on restoring cars or saving relationships, but I do know what my own limits are for both.
It might be difficult looking at that pile of rust for $5000 & bailing on it, but it might be taking one step backwards to take two steps forward. Both financially & motivationally.
I just looked up the cost of the frame rails from TEXAS ACRES. If you save this car the used one like I used would be the best bet. Said $100.00 to $275.00 so figuer with it being a Charger $275.00 plus shipping so figuer a nother $100.00.
Like I said when I did my Charger it took around 40 hours to install the frame rail's and new trunk floor. I reused my innner wheel well's, made patch's but in your case might want to add them to the list. Can you weld? Have a good air supply? Hardest part was cutting out all the spot welds from the doner parts.
Not going to try to talk you into saving the Charger but after doing my self it not that tuff. Not like you have to be a brain surgon. It like doing a detail model car, parts are just a little bigger! ;)
What do the front rail's look like and where the front bar's mount? My front rail's had some rust, but did not need to be replaced.
Ken
WOW. I'm so sorry. When is someone gonna lllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll take care of these people. They'll pay a price someday. Carma's a bitch.
What pictures did they give you for the description before you bought it? I'd be gathering all pre-auction advertisement.
hey, i live in michigan and i seen a ad in the auto swapper for a 1969 charger from hlpag. they wanted 25000 for it and they wanted to ship it to me. but instead i drove 450 mi with my trailer and i was sick the cars they have there are junk i seen the car you bought there sorry these guys are justtrying to make a quick buck. if i would have had it shipped to me i probably would be in jail right now. I just joined this web site i wish i could have warned you guys sooner shawn
airborne what user name did they use on ebay.
They used the name vcode4406. ? The link to the auction is in the first post of this thread. ? http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,3584.0.html
Airborne, I'm in the Chicago area, and if you need anything delivered or filed in-person with the BBB or whoever, let me know and I'll do what I can to help out. ? I'd love to see those bums burn.
Good luck sir, I hate to see that happen. I'd go after the false advertising about the trunk being "cut-out" that implies it was intentionally done to resore. Since it corroded out that is completely diffrent and fraudulent...you know I'm thinking of making up some HLPAG voodo dolls and selling them on e-bay, I bet I'd make a fortune!
holey crap man.sorry to hear that.Anytime a car is primer black I get to wondering because flat black hides alot again sorry to hear that.
I need to stop checking out this thread because it keeps pissing me off! Those guys make me fu***ng sick!
Quote from: cudaken on October 04, 2005, 11:03:02 AM
I just looked up the cost of the frame rails from TEXAS ACRES. If you save this car the used one like I used would be the best bet. Said $100.00 to $275.00 so figuer with it being a Charger $275.00 plus shipping so figuer a nother $100.00.
Like I said when I did my Charger it took around 40 hours to install the frame rail's and new trunk floor. I reused my innner wheel well's, made patch's but in your case might want to add them to the list. Can you weld? Have a good air supply? Hardest part was cutting out all the spot welds from the doner parts.
Not going to try to talk you into saving the Charger but after doing my self it not that tuff. Not like you have to be a brain surgon. It like doing a detail model car, parts are just a little bigger! ;)
What do the front rail's look like and where the front bar's mount? My front rail's had some rust, but did not need to be replaced.
Ken
Ken, yes I can weld and have a 110 hobart 125amp welder - I'm not the best of welders but I get the job done and had figured that I would have to do some welding on the car but not to the extent that I obviously have to. Thanks for taking the time to check out the parts for me, I'm still not sure what is going to happen with the car, I may be stuck but only time will tell and of course the AG and BBB as well as e-bay.
I have not looked at the front rails but the engine bay is in real good shape so if that is any indication then I'd say the front rails are not too bad. I am in Calif. right now visiting friends and family so I can't look at it. I am leaving things up to the wife right now, she is from NY and writes a mean business letter so she is drafting one up to send to HLPAG and is copying the AG and BBB.
Quote from: Recharger on October 04, 2005, 09:58:16 PM
They used the name vcode4406. ? The link to the auction is in the first post of this thread. ? http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,3584.0.html
Airborne, I'm in the Chicago area, and if you need anything delivered or filed in-person with the BBB or whoever, let me know and I'll do what I can to help out. ? I'd love to see those bums burn.
Thank you for the offer, it is very kind. I will keep you in mind if things go that direction
I don't know how practical this idea is but if things don't work out with you getting your money back from those crooks you might try spending some time getting the trunk area repaired and then reassess your interest in the project at that point. It's not like you're going to screw it up any worse than it is and it will give you some practice with your welder. Maybe cut out all the cancer, weld in the rails and start patching in the new metal and maybe it will take shape. At that point maybe you could sell it for $5k or $6k or keep on restoring if it's going well. I don't know. I'm just trying to give you some hope I guess. :-\
Quote from: bull on October 07, 2005, 02:15:19 AM
I don't know how practical this idea is but if things don't work out with you getting your money back from those crooks you might try spending some time getting the trunk area repaired and then reassess your interest in the project at that point. It's not like you're going to screw it up any worse than it is and it will give you some practice with your welder. Maybe cut out all the cancer, weld in the rails and start patching in the new metal and maybe it will take shape. At that point maybe you could sell it for $5k or $6k or keep on restoring if it's going well. I don't know. I'm just trying to give you some hope I guess. :-\
Thanks Bull, if a refund doesn't work out (and I don't have a lot of faith in the system), that is what I'm going to do.
Yeah good point bull, just start having fun with it, that's what I'd do. Can't hurt it anymore. :yesnod:
Don't forget to measure and find a friend with a Charger to reference off of.
Quote from: cudahob3 on October 07, 2005, 08:58:39 AM
Yeah good point bull, just start having fun with it, that's what I'd do. Can't hurt it anymore. :yesnod:
Don't forget to measure and find a friend with a Charger to reference off of.
Yeah, if/when I start to cut and weld on that thing I will certainly be asking for pictures and probably measurments so if/when that happens I hope you guys are patient with me :icon_smile_big:
I hope things work out okay, it is quite possible. The legal system can be a PITA & sometimes a joke, but it does work if you're patient. I had a bad experience in a body shop about 18 years ago & got stiffed. I ended up paying for bad body work, paying for work that wasn't done at all, performing some carpentry services in the body shop building, & laying out the expense of the building materials. (We had worked out a partial trade in services.)
I documented everything possible, had a good lawyer who took the case on contingency, (meaning he doesn't get paid unless he collects the damages) & actually won in court. The A-Hole shop owner never appeared, & went out of business. I was awarded $13,000 through a civil suit, (3 times the actual damages) but never saw a penny because the guy disappeared & didn't own anything on paper.
It wasn't a small claims case, & my lawyer told me to make it a civil suit against both the shop, & the owner personally. He said so because the shop actually could not provide certain services I was promised, & it was the owner who mislead me. (Here's why having a lawyer is very important.) This was in New Jersey at the time, but it might be very similar elsewhere.
Good luck, Bob
Tony, to bad you are so far away, I would do the rear rails for $800.00. Like I said, 40 hours worth of work. If I can make $20.00 a hour and pay no tax I am a happy man.
If you take 40 hours X say $52.00 a hour that = $2080.00 Or if you got to a high end shop say $80.00 a hour X 40 = $3200. I would shot for say $2500 back and save her. You would be doing the Mopar world a favor, one more R/T not made into beer cans.
By the way, have you checked the hidden vin's to make sure it is a real R/T? Dash pad's can be replaced. Well, infact they all can be changed with skill labor. Saw a solid 71 Charger 318 become a 71 Super Bee, not me I will add. But 110% sure the hack's you bought yours from would never go that far.
Ken
Ken, if I can atleast get some money back outta these guys I might have to see if we can work something out here. If it is possible I would like to save her, but we will see what's going to happen.
Where can I find the hidden vin#'s? I did think of them changing the dash pad #'s but it looks like that unless they changed out the whole dash pad it doesn't look like that has been changed - but then again what do I know :icon_smile_big:
The numbers Cudaken referred to are located on the front radiator and rear trunk lip. They are stamped into the metal and should match the Vin# on your dash and title.
The first pic shows where to look on the radiator support. Mine is on the back side of the support but, they are also found on the top rail.
The second pic is where to find the trunk number. I didn't look to see on your car but, this is often hid by the weatherstripping
Quote from: AKcharger on October 04, 2005, 11:19:44 PM
Good luck sir, I hate to see that happen. I'd go after the false advertising about the trunk being "cut-out" that implies it was intentionally done to resore. Since it corroded out that is completely diffrent and fraudulent...you know I'm thinking of making up some HLPAG voodo dolls and selling them on e-bay, I bet I'd make a fortune!
Good Idea! You also may raise awareness :)
Quote from: 694spdRT on October 08, 2005, 09:10:16 AM
The numbers Cudaken referred to are located on the front radiator and rear trunk lip. They are stamped into the metal and should match the Vin# on your dash and title.
The first pic shows where to look on the radiator support. Mine is on the back side of the support but, they are also found on the top rail.
The second pic is where to find the trunk number. I didn't look to see on your car but, this is often hid by the weatherstripping
I checked the radiator support, the numbers match, but the one on the trunk lip is rusted gone :( so I am convinced this is a true R/T
Well Tony at less it is a real Rusted / Trash. ;D Told you that what R/T stands for ;D
Ken
Quote from: cudaken on December 02, 2005, 07:20:44 AM
Well Tony at less it is a real Rusted / Trash. ;D Told you that what R/T stands for ;D
Ken
I'll never doubt you again Ken :icon_smile_big:
Air borne,take my advise,I do all my own bodywork,welding,and painting. Cut your losses on that one! I am from New England,and have repaired more than my fair share of rotted Mopars.Thats way more of a project,than you want to get into. If you could do the job yourself,you may think about it,but to have to pay someone else,you would be better off to get a clean southern,or western body!I know Ken said he would help you out,but you are looking at about 250 hours of bodywork,to put a rear clip on that correctly! I know there are some really good guys here,but you cannot expect Ken to do 250 man hours of bodywork for free!I bought a 70 Charger body from Texas last year,it had some rust arond the rear window,and the trunk floor was cut out,and one from another car was ready to be welded in,but the rest of the car was flawless,as far as rust was concerned!I paid $3500.00 delivered to me in Rhode Island! I gave the car to a friend of mine who was going to restore one from New England,that looked just like the one you bought from that a$$hole!If you want to see that car that I bought from Texas,It was on the cover of the Mopar Collectors guide,September 2005.It is now the replica of the watermelon Daytona That Mike from Dayclona built! You are always better off to start with the best body you can find!I would'nt touch that car,just put it aside,and get a lawyer to get you yuor money back!Do you have anything from them describing the condition of the car,in there writing,or on there letterhead? If you do then thats your amo,go get em!
Chargervert, if Tony can get the used parts cut like mine was it would take me about 40 hours to get the rails in. If I go out my goal will be to get it rolling with no wood beams holding up the ass end. Key will be if we can get a used 69 Charger subframe with the tail light panel still in places. If we can't, I can still work around it.
Here is now I cut up my doner car rear frame.
Cuda Ken
Ken,Thanks to the good people like you in this hobby,it really helps make up for the scumbag ripoff artists like the A hole who sold him that rust bucket! Last winter I put frame rails,trunk floor,trunk extensions,wheel wells,and rear quarterpanels on my friends 68 Satelite convertible. It took about 250 hours to do the whole job.That Charger that he bought is in a lot worse shape than the Satelite was! The rest of the Satelite was rock solid,just the tail end was wasted. I'm not saying that you guys couldn't do the work,but what I'm saying is that I think he can get a better body for the money he put out,and it would be to his advantage to pursue legal action against that jackass,than to take the hit on that car,and spend a tremendous amount of time and labor on that rust bucket! If you guys seen the thread about the guy who bought that yellow R/T for $750.00,then you guys know there are far better bodies out there for the same money that Tony paid or less!
Chargervert, I do apreciate your input and I am pursuing legal matters with these nice individuals who sold me the car (through the Illinois AG), but, even if I lose I can not nor will I just give up on the car. I have a bit over $6K into it (that includes the price of getting the car shipped to me), so just writing it off is not an option. If you know of an R/T that I can get for $750 PLEASE tell me, I will buy it today!! As for Ken helping me out, I hope and pray that when the time comes I can get him out here to help me out but can't do anything until after the AG's findings. Also, Ken and I have discussed compensation and no I never have expected him to do anything for free but the compensation is between him and I (but he is giving me a hell of a deal on his labor). Also, yeah if it werent for guys like him in this hobby/love of the Mopar then I'd really be screwed...
I don't know if they have parts you can use, but if you look at what they show in the pics, they have frame rails and front clips. Might be worth a try.
http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal.html
(http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal/rails.jpg)
What I meant by write it off,was to get your money back,and get a better car! Tony, I have fixed some really rusty cars, over the years. But all B.S. aside, I cut up two 69 R/T SE Chargers,that werent as bad as that car that they sold you! One of them was a trpple black electric sunroof car! Where are you from,because I get calls all the time about cars for sale! If you want another body, I can get a hold of you if something decent comes up! Last year, I bought three Mopars,I bought a 68 Charger roller,for $100.00,I bought a 70 R/T Challenger,383,4 speed(turn kry car with a non matching,rebuilt 383,and an 18 spline Hemi trans) solid car for 5 grand,and it came with a truck load of extra parts,and another 68 Charger complete solid driver for 4 grand.There are still lots of good deals left out there!As far as Ken helping you out, the point I was trying to make,is that if you do all that work,even if Ken gives you a huge break,you will still have more into that car than it will be worth!If the AG cant do something for you than get a lawyer,and take him to court!Even if all you get out of him is a better car!
Tony, have you been looking for parts, subframe with tail light panel like I posted. Contact the yard and see if you can get one. Better be looking, 69/70 (could use) are going fast.
Ken
hey tony, I know it does not make a difference, but i sent them an email telling them what scumbags they for jacking you like that.
Truly sad. I don't know how ebay still lets them sell cars. maybe nobody complains. The usually F everyone, but not usually as bad as they got you. They always lie about thier cars, but they are usually clever enough with the wording to kinda sorta leave themselves an out. But I think you will get them this time. bold face lies.
and unlike the previous guy who sued and got no money from the bodyshop, you will get money from them. They certianly have it. how could they not? they drag cars in that they probably got for free and filp them for 5k each.
Man, that thing was a mess. I certainly couldn't tackle or have the know how to restore a car in that condition. :icon_smile_sad:
i nearly bought a charger from those loosers >:(, just imagine seeing the stunning photos they sent me over the net then waiting 3 months for it to arrive hear in britain and finding it in that condition, man i`d want to kill someone :flame:
i am so glad i went with the charger i got
Tony all so all most bought a Charger from them Sean68charger.
It will be saved
Ken
Hey man, dont feel too bad, I also bought a car from HLPAG about 2 months ago. I didnt know anything bad about them either. I just found this site about a week ago. I was shocked when I saw my car the first time, but luckily I drove there to see it in person before I bought it. It was not near what they said it was either, I was really ticked off after driving 5 hours to get there. I offered them half of their asking price, they refused, and I left. I talked to them a few days later and they threw in a bunch of parts that were missing and lowered the price 2500.00 and I went back and brought it home. Its not near as bad as yours though. But I would agree with the other guys in that it would be a shame to junk yours. I hate to see any of them junked even though sometimes its not possible to save them. I pray your mess gets straightened out somehow. It sucks when you get screwed like that. Dale
Quote from: DodgeChargerGuy on December 10, 2005, 05:17:35 PM
I don't know if they have parts you can use, but if you look at what they show in the pics, they have frame rails and front clips. Might be worth a try.
http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal.html
(http://www.texasacres.com/parts/metal/rails.jpg)
Thank you for the link, I may be talking to them when the time is right.
Quote from: chargervert on December 10, 2005, 05:55:16 PM
What I meant by write it off,was to get your money back,and get a better car! Tony, I have fixed some really rusty cars, over the years. But all B.S. aside, I cut up two 69 R/T SE Chargers,that werent as bad as that car that they sold you! One of them was a trpple black electric sunroof car! Where are you from,because I get calls all the time about cars for sale! If you want another body, I can get a hold of you if something decent comes up! Last year, I bought three Mopars,I bought a 68 Charger roller,for $100.00,I bought a 70 R/T Challenger,383,4 speed(turn kry car with a non matching,rebuilt 383,and an 18 spline Hemi trans) solid car for 5 grand,and it came with a truck load of extra parts,and another 68 Charger complete solid driver for 4 grand.There are still lots of good deals left out there!As far as Ken helping you out, the point I was trying to make,is that if you do all that work,even if Ken gives you a huge break,you will still have more into that car than it will be worth!If the AG cant do something for you than get a lawyer,and take him to court!Even if all you get out of him is a better car!
Sent you a PM
Quote from: cudaken on December 10, 2005, 06:59:36 PM
Tony, have you been looking for parts, subframe with tail light panel like I posted. Contact the yard and see if you can get one. Better be looking, 69/70 (could use) are going fast.
Ken
No I haven't, I have kinda put this on the back burner until I know what is going to happen with the AG....
Quote from: dkn1997 on December 11, 2005, 10:32:05 PM
hey tony, I know it does not make a difference, but i sent them an email telling them what scumbags they for jacking you like that.
Truly sad. I don't know how ebay still lets them sell cars. maybe nobody complains. The usually F everyone, but not usually as bad as they got you. They always lie about thier cars, but they are usually clever enough with the wording to kinda sorta leave themselves an out. But I think you will get them this time. bold face lies.
and unlike the previous guy who sued and got no money from the bodyshop, you will get money from them. They certianly have it. how could they not? they drag cars in that they probably got for free and filp them for 5k each.
Thank you, I'm sure it went in one ear and out the other - or they probably got a good laugh outta it. People like that think it's funny when they stick it to someone (so I'm sure they are laughing good and loud :flame:)
Quote from: sean68charger on December 12, 2005, 05:08:26 PM
i nearly bought a charger from those loosers >:(, just imagine seeing the stunning photos they sent me over the net then waiting 3 months for it to arrive hear in britain and finding it in that condition, man i`d want to kill someone :flame:
i am so glad i went with the charger i got
Consider yourself lucky!!!!
Quote from: DBR/T on December 12, 2005, 08:09:13 PM
Hey man, dont feel too bad, I also bought a car from HLPAG about 2 months ago. I didnt know anything bad about them either. I just found this site about a week ago. I was shocked when I saw my car the first time, but luckily I drove there to see it in person before I bought it. It was not near what they said it was either, I was really ticked off after driving 5 hours to get there. I offered them half of their asking price, they refused, and I left. I talked to them a few days later and they threw in a bunch of parts that were missing and lowered the price 2500.00 and I went back and brought it home. Its not near as bad as yours though. But I would agree with the other guys in that it would be a shame to junk yours. I hate to see any of them junked even though sometimes its not possible to save them. I pray your mess gets straightened out somehow. It sucks when you get screwed like that. Dale
I wish I could of gone to look at the one I bought but I lived in Hawaii at the time, I'm now in S. Arizona so it would have been easier to get there but I was on a budget and they got every bit of that budget plus a bit extra >:( I'm glad you were able to work somthing out, hopefully the AG will get something done for me as well, then I can get Ken out here to help me save this poor thing.....
Tony, looks like you where posting to your self there buddy? I would go away and contact that yard and let them konw what you are looking for. From the look of there stock they don't cut them like did mine.
Ken
Ken, is that 40 hours like 45 minutes stripping time?????? sorry I couldn't resist ;D
Quote from: cudaken on December 13, 2005, 11:47:58 AM
Tony, looks like you where posting to your self there buddy? I would go away and contact that yard and let them konw what you are looking for. From the look of there stock they don't cut them like did mine.
Ken
Yeah I talk to myself all the time :image_294343: the wife and dog don't listen to me so I have to talk to someone ;) but I felt the need to answer some of the posts people put up. I will see about sending that yard an e-mail and let them know what I'm looking for (what exactly was that again :icon_smile_big:), I hope that things will get settled with HLPAG soon because the wife will not let me spend a penny until after we know what the AG says....
What is the AG ?
I personally would want a straight rust free body ,To build from.
Quote from: nascarxx29 on December 16, 2005, 03:37:24 PM
I personally would want a straight rust free body ,To build from.
can't argue with that but what was described to me and what I got were two different things.
One more opinion for the HLPAG car:
I think it greatly depends on what you want out of this.
Do you want a totally restored Charger with an original-looking interior & nice bodywork? If so, then it's not realistic to make it from that baseline. Certainly not as your first Charger restoration. I also vote to sell it before a $5K mistake turns into a $20K mistake and you're still not done.
Trying to pay a shop to build that car could push you into $25K of investment into a car that still doesn't even run. At which point, your mind will start to wander back to right now . . . "if I had just sold it back then, I wouldn't have gotten $5K back but I might have gotten burned for as little as $2-3000 after selling the car & parts . . . man, I've spent that much just on the small stuff for this car during the last couple of years . . . but after a certain point I had gone too far with this car to bail out anymore . . ."
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Happiest future scenario for that car?
I think it's salvageable for a guy who has been re-skinning old cars for years and doesn't care about the specifics right now. He might take it, hang some new rails & skins on it, and just make a fun race car out of it. Forget the interior, put hot drivetrain in it, and move on.
Then 10 years from now (and when a lot more reproduction parts are being produced for Chargers), he might sell it to someone who looks at the VIN and decides to take it all the way back to stock R/T condition. Happy ending.
It might happen but this is not what you bought the car for. And the investment from those two owners that I just dreamed up would probably still be more, TOTAL, than the car is worth. Do you get my drift? Even the ideal happy ending isn't truly cost-effective. It's just spreading the cost out to two smaller money-losers instead of one BIG one.
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You bought this car to get a restorable Charger R/T street car, and you didn't get one by any reasonable yardstick. You've gotta either change your goals & plans for the car or sell it and build another one. I hate to be so blunt with your dreams, but I'm really trying to help.
Quote from: Mike DC (formerly miked) on December 17, 2005, 04:27:13 PM
One more opinion for the HLPAG car:
I think it greatly depends on what you want out of this.
Do you want a totally restored Charger with an original-looking interior & nice bodywork? If so, then it's not realistic to make it from that baseline. Certainly not as your first Charger restoration. I also vote to sell it before a $5K mistake turns into a $20K mistake and you're still not done.
Trying to pay a shop to build that car could push you into $25K of investment into a car that still doesn't even run. At which point, your mind will start to wander back to right now . . . "if I had just sold it back then, I wouldn't have gotten $5K back but I might have gotten burned for as little as $2-3000 after selling the car & parts . . . man, I've spent that much just on the small stuff for this car during the last couple of years . . . but after a certain point I had gone too far with this car to bail out anymore . . ."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Happiest future scenario for that car?
I think it's salvageable for a guy who has been re-skinning old cars for years and doesn't care about the specifics right now. He might take it, hang some new rails & skins on it, and just make a fun race car out of it. Forget the interior, put hot drivetrain in it, and move on.
Then 10 years from now (and when a lot more reproduction parts are being produced for Chargers), he might sell it to someone who looks at the VIN and decides to take it all the way back to stock R/T condition. Happy ending.
It might happen but this is not what you bought the car for. And the investment from those two owners that I just dreamed up would probably still be more, TOTAL, than the car is worth. Do you get my drift? Even the ideal happy ending isn't truly cost-effective. It's just spreading the cost out to two smaller money-losers instead of one BIG one.
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You bought this car to get a restorable Charger R/T street car, and you didn't get one by any reasonable yardstick. You've gotta either change your goals & plans for the car or sell it and build another one. I hate to be so blunt with your dreams, but I'm really trying to help.
I hear ya, but can you tell me how to get outta the car without losing most of my $6K invested ($5K for car and $1K for shipping)? I will be doing most of the work on the car myself, yeah this is my first restoration and yeah I know, talk about jumping in feet first but as you know it wasn't suppose to be this deep...
That would be the perfect car to pro street,tub it and four link it! You won't have to cut much out,its already gone!
Quote from: chargervert on December 17, 2005, 10:08:57 PM
That would be the perfect car to pro street,tub it and four link it! You won't have to cut much out,its already gone!
Yeah you're right, but I REALLY want a car to restore and street it.... Man this is getting depressing :icon_smile_sad:
Quote from: AirborneSilva on December 17, 2005, 10:28:50 PM
Yeah you're right, but I REALLY want a car to restore and street it.... Man this is getting depressing :icon_smile_sad:
I feel sorry for ,getting screwed that way. Hope all turns out well. Good luck.
Silva,
What did you really want to do with this project in the first place? Do you want a stock R/T driver? A mildly modified one? A General Lee? And is this your first experience with a Charger and your first heavy restoration?
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I'm asking because of the principle of stock vs. modified parts prices. Most novices in the old-car world walk into a project with the notion that rebuilding a car/part to factory-stock condition is cheaper & easier than making any modifications. They don't realize that this is getting less true every year.
The components of these cars are getting really old & outdated. The factory designed them to last 3-4 years. That's how long the average first owner kept a car in 1969 and they didn't care about resale in those days. Get it? The factory didn't really design a 1969 Charger to last any longer than the early 1970s. So trying to keep a car "stock" often doesn't really save you any money over just modifying it these days.
Example:
Of course it costs hundreds of dollars to do a whole custom instrument cluster with modern guages & switches . . . but you should realize that you WILL also spend several hundred dollars rebuilding your factory stock one to look & work like it should in the first place. And the modified one will take less searching for old parts & dealing with refurbishment methods that only "sorta" make things as good as new. In my experience, the restoration industry has a hell of a lot more concern for winning show trophies than it does just making the parts continue to work for years to come.
The old car magazine writers refer to this issue as the coming "street-rodification of musclecars."
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What I'm saying is that although it would cost a TON of money to fix the car you bought, you should realize that it was gonna cost a TON of money to buy any Charger for less than $10K and make it into a nice driving one. Nobody sinks $30K into one of these cars just to show off their wallets. We all do it to get the cars working right in the long-term.
.
Though about talking to a body shop school? If they're looking for a final exam, let them tackle your Charger.
It would be a lot easier, (in my uneducated bodyman experience) to cut the back end off and find a donner back end.
QuoteIt would be a lot easier, (in my uneducated bodyman experience) to cut the back end off and find a donner back end.
Yeah, but at that point the donor body is almost always gonna be better than the one being fixed. I wouldn't cut up a decent 318 Charger body to try to save an R/T that's already gone. I'd rather build the 318 Charger in that case.
If I needed framerails for a Charger R/T then I'd cut them out of something else. There are still lots of B-bodies out there that aren't gonna be saved and the framerails & floors are the same on all of them. I'd hack up somebody's Satellite parts-car with rusty floorpans.
.
Tony, I would do the Charger in steps but I would not start out with the goal or restoring the Charger to new shape. They are right to a point, restoring any car is a losing proposition unless it is a high dollar car like a Hemi Daytona and you get into it real cheap, say $20,000.00. I have seen rust free bodys cost well over $40,000.00 to restore.
But, you need to understand what a restoration is. It is taking out every nut, bolt, clip, and replacing them. Flip the car up side down and detal every inch of the car. Including parts that no one will ever see again. I have seen the under side of the package tray detailed? Got to make sure the chauk marks where there or some happy sh-t like that. Restoration is like talking to God, and living to tell the tell.
My thinking is you need to do one like mine. I call them street peelers. Good looking car, solid and fun to drive. My floor pan is not pretty, but no rust holes. Springs work well, but not detailed, gas tank does not leak and is black not restored. Brakes and hard replaced but not painted and detailed. Body would look good, but there would be some small flaws that most people would not see. You getting the idea Tony. My Charger was done that way, and little at a time.
With you doing some of the work, cost of seats, engine trans paint and body you should with carefull shopping get by with $20,000.00. Get her on the road around $15,000.00.
Most of the rust your Charger has is normal where I live. Rear tail panel and frame rails only added around $1500.00 to $2000.00 depending on what you pay for the parts.
I will call you later, maybe yet today.
By the way, before any nah sayers say it can not be done, I have my Charger Title that says it can be. Want to bet yor car?
Cuda Ken
PS, mine broke in half from rust just like Tonys.
Ken, thanks and you are right, my verbage is wrong. I want to build this car to street it, not for show. I just want a safe reliable 69 Charger R/T, I do not want to "restore" it from the ground up. this is not a numbers matching car and I will want to add A/C to it, I'm not sure if I'm even going to paint it original color either. As our MTV generation would say, my bad. I have heard that there are different degrees of "restoration" and I certainly was not going for any high degree, midle of the road is fine since I will not be building this to sale or show, just to enjoy is all.....
I wouldn't have paid for the thing in the first place due to misrepresentation on their part. My buddy boned out a 70 RT four speed car five years ago that was in better shape than that thing. He did part the thing out, though.
Here is my street peeler. My rust was just as bad as Tonys, my guess there build number's follow each other. Mine was first ;D
Cuda Ken
Quote from: RT DAVE on December 20, 2005, 06:19:18 PM
I wouldn't have paid for the thing in the first place due to misrepresentation on their part. My buddy boned out a 70 RT four speed car five years ago that was in better shape than that thing. He did part the thing out, though.
If I had that choice I wouldn't have paid for it either - have you never bought anything off of e-bay? and don't tell me I should have gone and looked at it, from Hawaii that would have cost way too much, I went by the description plain and simple and got screwed, now if all your going to do is tell me what an ass I am then don't waste your time - I KNOW I GOT SCREWD THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!!!
Tony, don't worry about people that second guess. You know the old saying about hind site. Neither one of us would have bought are cars if we knew what was coming. Guess it something like getting a child with special needs. You love it, work with it and make it the best you can.
Tony my friend, don't worry about the second guessers and people that parted out better than yours. Screw it, you have what you got and make it the best you can. And remember what I told you when you show the PIC's at the first show you go to.
Plus, you will do something that other's did not have the guts to do.
If I was you, I let this post die and not answer it any longer. People love to beat you down, makes them feel better about them self.
Just remember what Steve told me "Ken, you and I both know you will never fix this Charger, when you are tired of it laying in your drive way I will dragg it off". I wish I had a PIC of his faces when I melted the hides in his drive way. :icon_smile_approve:
By the way, never claim to be smart, nor am I a banker. I really don't care what the Charger is worth, to me it is price less!
Ken
thanks for putting it back in perspective for me Ken.
Quote from: AirborneSilva on December 20, 2005, 06:25:31 PM
Quote from: RT DAVE on December 20, 2005, 06:19:18 PM
I wouldn't have paid for the thing in the first place due to misrepresentation on their part. My buddy boned out a 70 RT four speed car five years ago that was in better shape than that thing. He did part the thing out, though.
If I had that choice I wouldn't have paid for it either - have you never bought anything off of e-bay? and don't tell me I should have gone and looked at it, from Hawaii that would have cost way too much, I went by the description plain and simple and got screwed, now if all your going to do is tell me what an ass I am then don't waste your time - I KNOW I GOT SCREWD THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!!!
I'm wasn't familiar with all of the logistics on how you purchased the car, so I shouldn't have jumped on you like that. The point I was trying to make (and didn't) was that you probably could have backed out since the car wasn't as described. I would think that ebay would have allowed you to back out due to this, but I wouldn't know because everything I've bought has been as described. My apologies if you think my entire purpose was to kick you while you're down. My main intention was to inform you and others that you don't need to complete transactions if there is misrepresentation on the part of the seller. It was my mistake for adding that part about my buddies car. His car, btw is not something I would have boned now or then. I kinda thought he was a dumbass for cutting it up, but he made more money that way.
ebay is just there to make their money, not help with fraud.
youll see all of hlpag's auctions their feedback is private ( so nobody can see they suck ) and the bidders names are private ( so nobody can warn them ). why does ebay allow this, feedback is there for a reason so you can see who your buying from. :cussing:
airborne
you gotten any status on your case from the AG?
For some of us, buying without seeing is only way to make our dream come true. I'm from Finland, and recently bought a -68 Coronet Convertible from eBay. I made a decision based on images and talking with the seller over the phone. Flying to see the car would not have been possible. Currently car is sailing somewhere at Atlantic ocean. It will be pretty exiting moment when it finally arrives... ??? :o
Its too easy to be smart afterwise. For me these cars are hobby and passion, not something to be reasoning with. I rather make my dreams come true than think: "I've should have done that...."
Good Luck with your Charger project Tony. :)
Hey janimm....
I'm from belgium an i'm planning of buying a Charger but i'll definitly fly over to the states to check the car out, unless a third person ( perhaps someone from the board here) who lives in the neighourhood wants to go and check out for me.
I'm just too affraid of spending over $ 10K on something not even worth the half of it...
I know what you mean besause some days i 'm also thinkin of putting my dream into the fridge because i'm a little bit scared of making the trip to the US and detting it all done.
But hey lots of other guys did it before me and pulled it of also, so why could't I???
Anyway i hope your Coronet turnes out to be a nice car....
the boys are at it again, private feedback, private bidder list. THANKS EBAY FOR PROTECTING THE BUYERS.
4 at once, must be their red tag sale
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-Charger-1968-CHARGER-R-T-AWESOME-PROJECT-CAR-SUPER-SOLID_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6199QQitemZ4601026512QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-Charger-1968-CHARGER-AWESOME-PROJECT-SUPER-SOLID-FRAME_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6199QQitemZ4601031855QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-Charger-1969-CHARGER-R-T-AWESOME-COLOR-COMBO-BUILDSHEET_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6199QQitemZ4601025497QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dodge-Charger-1969-CHARGER-R-T-SHOWROOM-COLOR-COMBO-SUPER-SOLID_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6199QQitemZ4601027958QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
THIS WOULD BE AN EXCELLENT PROJECT CAR FOR A FATHER AND SON TEAM!
LOL......yhea........Bill Gates and his kid maybe. They're the only ones rich enough to bring these heaps back.
Looks like the HLPAG leftovers after making all those Ginny Lee's. ::)
YeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeHaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
BBD
Where do they get them all? It's like an endless supply of Charger with all there parts riped off. :flame:
I think they're taking off all the parts, and using them on their GL's. All what's left is a carcase. Here's a pile of rusted junk, go make a nice Charger if you can... :rotz:
A heap of bondo and a primer paint to cover up the rust, whamo a HLPAG special.
Heeee Haaawwww, get ya one, father son. :icon_smile_blackeye:
Yeah, now you can't warn the people to stay the hell away.
Quote from: sharpspike on December 30, 2005, 08:13:19 PM
the boys are at it again, private feedback, private bidder list. THANKS EBAY FOR PROTECTING THE BUYERS.
4 at once, must be their red tag sale
Hey Guys,What about a 68-70 B-Body SHORT INNERSTRUCTURE CLIP that would get rid of the biggest part of the uglys if you are going to save the car?
Quote from: Highbanked Hauler on January 12, 2006, 08:09:38 PM
Hey Guys,What about a 68-70 B-Body SHORT INNERSTRUCTURE CLIP that would get rid of the biggest part of the uglys if you are going to save the car?
Are you offering it or suggesting it ??? And yes the plan is to save the car (even though some think I should junk it) but I have to wait until the Illinois AG gives me the go ahead - and who knows how long they are going to take!
Quote from: BigBlockSam on October 02, 2005, 09:50:59 AM
they got brass balls, saying that the trunk was cut out. there gonna mess with the wrong person one day and get hurt. Rene
Where's that guy with the hammer who took out that crooked Mopar parts vendor a few years back? He could be the HLPAG Vigilante!!!! Someone needs to stop these a**holes. Good luck with whatever course of action you decide to take. Keep us posted. Al
That gives a whole new meaning to the statement,"someones gonna nail that son of a bit*h! Easily repairable head ,skull removed for replacement,easy resto for amature Doctor,and son! :icon_smile_big: :rotz: :icon_smile_evil:
Quote from: chargervert on January 16, 2006, 10:19:04 AM
That gives a whole new meaning to the statement,"someones gonna nail that son of a bit*h! Easily repairable head ,skull removed for replacement,easy resto for amature Doctor,and son! :icon_smile_big: :rotz: :icon_smile_evil:
Now that's funny, I don't care who you are :yesnod:
Quote from: genlee1970 on January 15, 2006, 09:30:54 PM
Quote from: BigBlockSam on October 02, 2005, 09:50:59 AM
they got brass balls, saying that the trunk was cut out. there gonna mess with the wrong person one day and get hurt. Rene
Where's that guy with the hammer who took out that crooked Mopar parts vendor a few years back? He could be the HLPAG Vigilante!!!! Someone needs to stop these a**holes. Good luck with whatever course of action you decide to take. Keep us posted. Al
Yeah where are the waccos of the world when you need them :icon_smile_big:...
Quote from: sharpspike on December 29, 2005, 12:02:58 AM
ebay is just there to make their money, not help with fraud.
youll see all of hlpag's auctions their feedback is private ( so nobody can see they suck ) and the bidders names are private ( so nobody can warn them ). why does ebay allow this, feedback is there for a reason so you can see who your buying from. :cussing:
The easy/obvious answer is don't buy anything from someone on Ebay with private feedback. I agree that Ebay shouldn't allow private feedback at all, but they do. Ebay is a dangerous way to buy a car IMO. I don't mind buying $50-$100 parts from people with public feedback but I'm not brave enough to buy the big ticket items without myself or someone I trust seeing the item first.
Whatever happens, I hope airborne gets his money back AND gets to keep the car AND hlpag gets fined and/or run out of business. Hlpag is a scourge to this hobby that needs to be eliminated.
Rene is right! He will cross the wrong person one of these days. not everyone handles things as civilized as Airborne Silva has! I commend him! I can't honestly say I wouldn't have been on the next plane out to pay a visit to him! I wouldn't like to see what operation would be required for him to have a whole 69 Charger extracted from his ass!
Quote from: chargervert on January 16, 2006, 07:50:13 PM
Rene is right! He will cross the wrong person one of these days. not everyone handles things as civilized as Airborne Silva has! I commend him! I can't honestly say I wouldn't have been on the next plane out to pay a visit to him! I wouldn't like to see what operation would be required for him to have a whole 69 Charger extracted from his ass!
just hope its a general lee with his father and son driving it. :drive:
I am also angree for you. :icon_smile_angry: I live locally in Illinois, and see adds for these cars all the time. It is hard to find cars around here like it because the suck them up and destroy them at Luedke. About 2 years ago I started looking hard for a 68-69 R/T, at came across them. When I saw what they were trying to pawn I was furious at the shotty work and false advertisement. I am very leary of Chargers in this area because of them, which is prob. why I still have not found one. I wish you the best of luck on getting something back for your car, but have to agree with Daytona R/T - way to much money and work to restore. I Jjust cant believe these guys are still getting away with this :flame:
Hey Airborne, Check the cars for sale section, 69 Charger 2002 has several 68-70 Charger project cars for sale! The prices range from as low as $1500 to $6000. He is in Louisana, those cars he is selling are from the south,and have a lot less rust,than that one you bought! Some of the cars are R/Ts I think his prices are reasonable!
Quote from: chargervert on January 19, 2006, 05:37:07 PM
Hey Airborne, Check the cars for sale section, 69 Charger 2002 has several 68-70 Charger project cars for sale! The prices range from as low as $1500 to $6000. He is in Louisana, those cars he is selling are from the south,and have a lot less rust,than that one you bought! Some of the cars are R/Ts I think his prices are reasonable!
Thanks for the heads up, I'll take a look but don't think the commander in chief will let me buy anything at this time - we just plunked down $5k for a two car garage kit and still have to pay for the slab it will sit on...
Were keepin an eye out for ya!
Quote from: chargervert on January 19, 2006, 09:23:11 PM
Were keepin an eye out for ya!
Yes you are, and I DO appreciate it ;) I am going to run that 68 and 69 R/T by her (if I can catch her at the right moment that is), and see if I can't squeeze some money outta her. I wish I could get some kind of an answer from the Illinois AG....
That guy 69 Charger 2002,said he has over 35 Chargers right now! Good luck gettin them by the boss!
I just sent an e-mail to a lawyer that a member of our forum here gave me. The lawyer is based in new jersey so I hope they can help me, I'm tired of waiting for the Illinois AG to do something and have to wonder if they can even do anything to these errogant Mother F*ckers in the first place. When I bought the car I wanted something that I can get on the street in 2 or 3 years, now many of you are telling me that it will never see the street again, or that it will just be too cost prohibative. The more I wait the more pissed I'm getting and the more anxious for a charger R/T that I can actually work on and get on the street to enjoy before I'm too fu*king old to enjoy it :flame:
Hey Airborne, I feel your anger,but you don't want to throw good money after bad! I have been building,and restoring Mopars,and specifically Chargers for the last twentyfive years. there are better bodies out there for the same or less money,just put it aside,and let the law take its course,if you can afford to grab one of those other Chargers,from that other guy, I think you would have a far better starting point!
Chargervert, I really wish I could. If I get a lawyer it would have to be one who took it on consignment, I don't get money they don't get money kind of thing. If I had the money to go out and hire a lawyer then yeah I would just go buy me another charger and as you said let the law take it's course (with the AG that is). I just don't have the money (maybe after the garage is built), and I just don't see anything happening with the AG and don't have much faith in a bureacracy (spelling), that I'm sure the AG is, it is afterall part of the government! I try to stay calm, but when I see and hear about others and their chargers/mopars (and I am genuinly happy for them), I just want to choke the living sh!t outta those bastards. I had dreamed of getting another charger R/T for as long as you have been restoring them, so when I FINALLY got my chance and now I'm getting the royal shaft and just don't see anything happening from the folks who are suppose to be helping me, well I just get so damn mad :flame:
I did get a letter back from the lawyer in Jersey, here is what he wrote back (well most of it, some of it was personal notes that I wont reveal)...
"I'm sorry to hear about your experience on eBay. When
it comes to the collector car hobby, eBay certainly is
both a blessing and a curse.
Unfortunately, none of our attorneys are licensed to
practice law in Illinois. I would advise that you
speak with an attorney in your home state who
specializes in consumer protection. Since your
transaction was on eBay, it's possible that you may be
able to sue the seller in your home state, which would
naturally be easier for you.
Having an attorney who is involved in the hobby would
certainly be a bonus, so maybe you could start by
contacting local car clubs, to see if they have an
attorney member who can help you out. Many states have
consumer protection laws which make these types of
cases very attractive for attorneys."
I have contacted the local car club, well e-mailed the president of the club, so I will see what comes of that but in the mean time I will see if there is any fraud division here in Arizona that I can contact (yeah more bureacracy!!!). I guess I need to contact e-bay too, yeah I've been putting off that battle!!
Here is a copy of the message I just sent to e-bay. I am not going to hold my breath with these guys and think that I may be screwed with them anyway since it has gone past their 30 day window that they convienently put in there know that if you try to resolve the problem with an ass like I'm dealing with it will likely be drug out much longer then 30 days...
"The 69 Charger that I bought from this company was not in the condition that they had advertised it to be in. Many have told me that it will be cost prohibative to even attempt to repair it. I have tried to contact them through a certified letter asking to resolve the problem as well as their state attorney general, they just ignore us. This matter is longer then the 30 days after closing due to the fact that we have been trying to resolve the problem without involving e-bay so I would hope that your 30 day window would not apply since it is not my fault that it has gone on this long."
That is sad, very sad. They flat out lied and cheated and stole, they are low life fu#@$%ing criminals, and ebay is facilitating this Sh$#%t. They should be somewhat responsible or help or something. Too bad there isn't real justice in this instance, not fair.
They (HLPAG) should really get theirs.
Yeah and I have a feeling that e-bay is going to stick it to me with their 30 day policy. They say you are suppose to file your claim with them within 30 days after the closing date, but then on the other hand they want you to try to work it out with the seller before filing a claim, now how in the heck are you suppose to do that within 30 days and remain resaonable?!?!?!?!?! It seems that by me trying to do things right I am going to get another door closed in my face ::) I think that e-bay ahs it wired that way to protect themselves from having to pay any claims...
Hey, you guys remember someone put a link to an ebay ad of a red Charger, they wanted about 8000K for it, it was very rusted out, no windows, most of front end gone, all or most interior gone, had running 383 in it, matching #'s, it came with a new 4 sp out of car? I don't think it was an R/T, if it had a 383. I don't know. That thing looked at least worse, maybe a lot worse. Someone was saying it was worth five grand, I wonder why so many are saying this car is worthless? That it will cost 40K to restore? I mean, if that car was going for 8K, it looked a lot worse IMO. :shruggy:
Quote from: SeattleChargerDog on January 28, 2006, 06:10:00 PM
Hey, you guys remember someone put a link to an ebay ad of a red Charger, they wanted about 8000K for it, it was very rusted out, no windows, most of front end gone, all or most interior gone, had running 383 in it, matching #'s, it came with a new 4 sp out of car? I don't think it was an R/T, if it had a 383. I don't know. That thing looked at least worse, maybe a lot worse. Someone was saying it was worth five grand, I wonder why so many are saying this car is worthless? That it will cost 40K to restore? I mean, if that car was going for 8K, it looked a lot worse IMO. :shruggy:
Did that car actually sell for $8k? The asking price is rarely a good indicator of what a car is worth. The problem here is that the car was misrepresented and flat out disguised. Money was paid for a car that really didn't exist as described. The odds are fairly good that most people would back off the deal or pay a LOT less than the asking price if they knew exactly what kind of shape the car was in. So, it's not the condition of the car as much as the selling tactics that were used. Sure, a car could be made drivable for a lot less than a concourse resto on a real R/T which is why you see a disparity in the estimates. In the end, it all depends on the owner and what they want out of the car. If you go back and read the very first post you'll see the text of the ad.
Troy
damn. that sucks so much it looks like a michigan car.
you sould ask them about the fram rails "what were you refuring to the half of the fraim rails that isnt rusted away?"
Got tired of waiting to hear from the AG so we called, they said they hadn't heard from HLPAG (no real suprise there the arrogant mother f*ckers), so they are going to call them next week. The AG did say that HLPAG was not obligated to respond - well what the hell good is the AG then? we pay are f*cken taxes so they can send letters to ass wipes and then get ignored? sounds like a liberal organization - hell there isn't any bark let along bite to them!!! It has also been almost a week and I haven't heard from ebay yet either, guess they are ducking me as well :flame:
I spoke too soon about e-bay. I went and checked my messages and as I had suspected they are punking out. They want you to try to work it out with the ass wipes who rip you off, then when it takes longer then 35 days they say - sorry, you should have filed soonner - what a bunch of shit! Here is what they sent me back.
"Hello Anthony,
I appreciate you notifying SafeHarbor with your concern.
We have received your email regarding a recent purchase on eBay.
Our records indicate that listing #4575436016 ended on September 16,
2005. For this type of item, there is a 35-day maximum filing period to
submit a claim with our insurance partner. Unfortunately, because more
than 35 days have passed since the end of the auction, this item no
longer qualifies for coverage under the Vehicle Purchase Protection
Program.
To review the details of this program, as well as the qualifications
necessary to be entitled to this service, please see the following Help
page:
http://pages.motors.ebay.com/services/purchase-protection.html
There are other options available to help you resolve this situation
with your trading partner. The following Help page describes these
options and outlines the steps that you can take as a buyer to resolve
this issue.
http://pages.ebay.com/help/tp/isgw-buyer-protection-steps.html
Although this item is not eligible for the Vehicle Purchase Protection
Program, I would like to assure you that we will investigate your report
and take appropriate action based on our policies. This action may
include issuing a warning, enforcing a temporary or indefinite
suspension or terminating the seller's membership with eBay. Due to
privacy concerns, we do not discuss the details of any action taken
against another eBay member's account. This assures our members that
their personal account histories will remain private.
I understand your frustration regarding this matter. Please know that
we don't take these matters lightly. Unfortunately, the 35-day deadline
is not something that can be changed. You should know that this is not
an eBay policy, but is the policy of our insurance provider. They
simply will not consider claims that have been filed after the 35-day
deadline.
Our goal is for every member to have a safe buying experience on eBay
and we regret your purchase did not go as planned.
Regards,
Rousseau
eBay Motors
Trust & Safety "
I made a voodoo doll oh HLPAG and have been poking it with pins and setting it on top of my exhaust manifold for a week now, I'm hoping that will have some effect for you
I wish I lived back there. I would start a car check service, Smear my ads all over internet, autotrader, ect. I could charge 75$ to go check out the cars for poeple, take my own pics, and make a ton of money :icon_smile_big: :icon_smile_big: But it wouldn't last because the last thing those guy's want is some guy like me looking at their cars. :icon_smile_evil: A guy could make a living of them until they try to take me to court and get a restaining order. But I think of how much attention I can create, I'm one of those guy's that never goes away and, goes out of my way( ALL WITHIN THE LAW ) To achieve my goal ! :coolgleamA: I'm so sorry for all who have been deceived, it sickens me to no end :puke: Class action, there is strength in numbers. :wave:................Chuck................
I bought an HLPAG car but got lucky. My charger had truck rust and the front floor pans were rusted. The resto of the car, especially the frame rails, are in good condition. I did ask them for specific pictures which they supplied. I was dealing with a guy named John. In talking with him he seemed irritated at people there and what was going on during my multiple phone calls for the purchase. I heard he doesn't work there anymore. I check their pages every so often to laugh at their crappy ads and even crappier cars. I played russian roulette with them and got lucky, I wouldn't look at a car from there ever again after all of the problems I've seen people have with them. I'm sorry you got so screwed over by them. I hope you can find a way to resolve the problem. Nothing like spending money on your dream car and have it turn out so bad.
Thanks for the well wishes sixpack. I hope that this will all be over with soon. We got a letter back from the AG with a letter attached from the owner of HLPAG stating that they were an "easy going company" and that they wanted to resolve this matter. They of course slammed us though in thier first sentence saying that this was sold as a project car - yeah no shit but the description and the actuall condition were two different animals, which in my book make it false advertisement and just out and out lieing! Anyways, we sent the AG a letter back reitterating what we want, so hopefully the "easy going company" will see the err of their ways and we can move forward.
Have you thought about just finling a civil suit, or is that what you're talking about here?
Quote from: bull on February 18, 2006, 01:11:53 PM
Have you thought about just finling a civil suit, or is that what you're talking about here?
Yes I have thought about a civil suit, if this does not happen the way I feel is equitable then I will be searching for a lawyer and will take em to court.
Perhaps we can replace the word "Rust" with the name "HLPAG" then it'll start to showup in Google searches?.. :shruggy:
Quote from: Brock Sampson on May 28, 2006, 05:57:54 PM
Perhaps we can replace the word "Rust" with the name "HLPAG" then it'll start to showup in Google searches?.. :shruggy:
That doesn't sound like a bad idea ;) I think I may start a web site that kinda chronicles this whole thing, from their actual e-bay add and then pictures of what it actually looks like.
this is for Daytona R/T SE in all respect i dont think any mopar isent worth restoring. if you yourself like it then thats all that matters. sorry to say this but if you have litterally junkeda mopar in a scrap yard then you may not be a very big mopar fan :'(.
Quote from: AirborneSilva on May 28, 2006, 08:07:37 PM
Quote from: Brock Sampson on May 28, 2006, 05:57:54 PM
Perhaps we can replace the word "Rust" with the name "HLPAG" then it'll start to showup in Google searches?.. :shruggy:
That doesn't sound like a bad idea ;) I think I may start a web site that kinda chronicles this whole thing, from their actual e-bay add and then pictures of what it actually looks like.
I'd be willing to help with that...and I'll make a copy of this thread for my car club - 350 members strong.
Quote from: 68chargerboy on June 05, 2006, 10:43:55 PM
this is for Daytona R/T SE in all respect i dont think any mopar isent worth restoring. if you yourself like it then thats all that matters. sorry to say this but if you have litterally junkeda mopar in a scrap yard then you may not be a very big mopar fan :'(.
Sorry to be the one to have to break the news to you, but the tooth fairy doesn't leave mopar parts under your pillow at night. When you are trying to restore a car in the condition of the one that AirBorneSilva bought from HLPAG you have to cut up other old mopars to get the parts. Many of these parts are not available new in the aftermarket and the NOS stuff dried up decades ago...So the only option is to part out other cars for the parts....which means cars go to the crusher after they are stripped.
And yes, I have scrapped many old mopars over the last 30 or so years of screwing around with this stuff: Chargers, Road Runners, Challengers, New Yorkers, Imperials, you name it, I've stripped it for parts and then politely sent it to the crusher. Along the way I've fixed a couple of cars that were rusted to death, cars that others said weren't worth fixing, cars much like the one AirBorneSilva bought from HLPAG. I've also pulled many cars out of the weeds/junkyards and resold them to others who later used them for parts or restored them themselves.
Back to your original comment, 68chargerboy:
By my definition, a "Fan" is a habitual spectator, someone who sits idly by and watches others do what the "Fan" can only dream of doing...
So you're absolutely right, I'm not a big mopar "Fan"
Daytona,
I dont really want to start a fight hear but if you are implying that i dont have/restore mopars i think your wrong. when i was 7 years old i always wanted a 68 charger. i worked with my dad and saved my money for another 7 straight years until i was fourteen and bought a 68 440 4/speed with all of my own money then when i was fifteen i bought a 1968 440 coronet with my own money again then right before i turned 16 about 4 months ago i bought my 3rd mopar a 66 monaco with a 383 and i still have all 3 and am restoring bothe the charger and monaco at this time. so if you dont think that i have or restore ,mopars your definitly wrong.
Quote from: 68chargerboy on June 10, 2006, 06:42:21 PM
Daytona,
so if you dont think that i have or retore ,opars your definitly wrong.
??? ALL-RIGHTY THEN! Good luck with that! :shruggy:
[
Quote
Whatever happened to that woman who bought one for her hubby ?
Quote
is this the lady?
http://cglfc.com/main_frame_cglfc.html
I don't get to read all this stuff too regularly,and I'm not trying to put my nose where it don't belong but,what happened with this?Still ongoing?Feel real bad for ya.Just read all 6 pages,don't usually do that but i was hoping somewhere I would see some good news...
Quote from: poppa on November 22, 2006, 09:54:17 PM
I don't get to read all this stuff too regularly,and I'm not trying to put my nose where it don't belong but,what happened with this?Still ongoing?Feel real bad for ya.Just read all 6 pages,don't usually do that but i was hoping somewhere I would see some good news...
I wish I had good news to report. It seems that I am too small of a fish and no one, to include the FBI's internet fraud division really gives a shit! In the words of the Illinois attorney general "mediation failed", my states attorney general just refered the case to on to illinois (even after we told them that illinois did nothing - I think they didn't read that part), the illinois BBB wrote them (them being HLPAG), a letter telling them that we were not happy with our purchase. Having written to the two MOPAR mags asking for help in anyway they could I was treated to silence. I was told by a lawyer that I was indeed defrauded and that I had a case, BUT, that the money I would spend in not just fighting but trying to collect I would maybe break even at best - so, it looks like HLPAG gets away with another screwing and I am stuck with a car that I can either crush or try to restore (to one degree or another), and hope that before I am too old to enjoy it that I can complete it since it is not the "easy to do" charger that was advertised.
IMO, I would sell that car and start over and cut my losses, I know easy to say, but restoring that would always make you mad prob. If you restore that car it might always have the Hlpag ill feelings in it, you know? I feel for you, I would be pissed and would be easy to get a little or a lot demoralized by that.
I did an ebay search a while ago and there were some reasonably low price chargers on there for 3-4 grand that were mostly decent, very good starting points. I met a guy here in Seattle that rented a car trailer and drove all the way to pennsyvania or new york or something with his 67 dodge pick up to get an a body mopar.
I ran an ad on the site here and someone about twenty miles away contacted me after about four months and I got mine for low price, have to rebuild engine, but car is basically all there with some small dents and quarter rust. IMO I would get rid of that car asap so you never have to look at it again or think about it anymore. :Twocents: Again, I feel for you. They will get their's, God is the great equalizer. I am not religious that much, but helps to think about karma sometimes, at least to tell yourself to feel better,
Sincerely,
Nate
Quote from: SeattleChargerDog on November 23, 2006, 12:49:45 PM
IMO, I would sell that car and start over and cut my losses, I know easy to say, but restoring that would always make you mad prob. If you restore that car it might always have the Hlpag ill feelings in it, you know? I feel for you, I would be pissed and would be easy to get a little or a lot demoralized by that.
I did an ebay search a while ago and there were some reasonably low price chargers on there for 3-4 grand that were mostly decent, very good starting points. I met a guy here in Seattle that rented a car trailer and drove all the way to pennsyvania or new york or something with his 67 dodge pick up to get an a body mopar.
I ran an ad on the site here and someone about twenty miles away contacted me after about four months and I got mine for low price, have to rebuild engine, but car is basically all there with some small dents and quarter rust. IMO I would get rid of that car asap so you never have to look at it again or think about it anymore. :Twocents: Again, I feel for you. They will get their's, God is the great equalizer. I am not religious that much, but helps to think about karma sometimes, at least to tell yourself to feel better,
Sincerely,
Nate
Thanks Nate, I do understand what you are saying and yeah, I look at the car sometimes and want to choke the life out of hans and his boy oscar, there are also times when I look at it and see the posibilites too. If I were to sale it I'm not sure I could get much for it the way it sits and I just can't take that kind of loss, certainly if someone wants to make an offer I would consider it but it would have to be a serious offer and they would have to know all about the car - I would not want to do to someone what was done to me!
Quote from: AirborneSilva on November 23, 2006, 02:45:25 PM... I would not want to do to someone what was done to me!
Which is of course, the biggest problem with trying to sell it. You have a conscience.
However it goes down with this particular car, I hope you eventually end up with the Charger you dreamed of.
Thanks Ghoste...
I'll agree with Daytona rt/se first page comment. Except one thing. Being a Restorer it will probably cost you more Then $40,000 he sez. Sell it on ebay with good pictures of rusty trunk & all to not deceive anybody & Explain in your Description how you got scammed by these scam artist to help alert any other unsuspecting victims in the Future. If you got no money for a Lawyer how did you figure you would restore this car? ??? ::) LEON.
Quote from: hemi-hampton on November 24, 2006, 02:32:56 AMIf you got no money for a Lawyer how did you figure you would restore this car? ??? ::) LEON.
Well I know you are able to just jump right in and get cars done, but I will have to do a little at a time. So, how much do you figure I would be able to get for my charger on e-bay?
I would bail out this project in a heartbeart and just accept the fact the most likely you will not be able to able to get all your money back. This project will bury you financially. However, all is not lost. Sometimes in life - you just need to move forward with things. If you lose some money on this project - it is not the end of the world. You can easily make it back on a second car that you buy with all the knowledge that you've gained from this experience. Take whatever money you get from the sale of this car + any money you would have dumped into this car and go out and find the most solid charger your money can buy. In my opinion, you can easily get back anything you have lost on this car if you make some smart moves on a second Charger. Consider your experience with this car a life experience and an education...........RT/SE
Quote from: RT/SE on November 24, 2006, 10:07:52 AM
I would bail out this project in a heartbeart and just accept the fact the most likely you will not be able to able to get all your money back. This project will bury you financially. However, all is not lost. Sometimes in life - you just need to move forward with things. If you lose some money on this project - it is not the end of the world. You can easily make it back on a second car that you buy with all the knowledge that you've gained from this experience. Take whatever money you get from the sale of this car + any money you would have dumped into this car and go out and find the most solid charger your money can buy. In my opinion, you can easily get back anything you have lost on this car if you make some smart moves on a second Charger. Consider your experience with this car a life experience and an education...........RT/SE
I agree! You will come out better in the long run no matter what if you just sell this one and start over. So maybe you won't have the money to turn around and buy another Charger immediatly, but you really should cut your losses and go from there. There's no point in attempting to restore this car. As everyone said, it would be a lot cheaper to take the blow from this car than putting in all of the money to restore it. Don't fall in love with the car, fall in love with the model. Ditch this one and pick up a solid start!
If you were Lucky & Squeezed $2,500 from it you lost $2,500. Best advise I can say to anybody who wants to save money on a Restoration is Always buy a Solid Rustfree car. This will always save you money in the long run. If you must restore a Rustbucket basket case, Not worth it unless you git a Real Hi Po Model like RT/, Cuda, 6 pak or hemi car with low production #'s. Who wants to put $50,000 into a 6 cylinder 74 Valiant or Pinto, Maverick, Gremlin, Pacer or none R/T 318 car only to sell for 5-10 when done? LEON.
Quote from: hemi-hampton on November 24, 2006, 02:32:56 AM
I'll agree with Daytona rt/se first page comment. Except one thing. Being a Restorer it will probably cost you more Then $40,000 he sez. Sell it on ebay with good pictures of rusty trunk & all to not deceive anybody & Explain in your Description how you got scammed by these scam artist to help alert any other unsuspecting victims in the Future. LEON.
I have to say this sounds like a pretty good idea to me, really. If you can't get anywhere with making hlpag face the music I would use the Ebay format to kill two birds with one stone: rid yourself of the car and all the bad memories it creates while telling the entire Ebay audience exactly how you got ripped off and by whom. There comes a time when you have to move on and although that decision is totally up to you I'd have to say IMO I would go out with a bang by starting over and telling a large group of online buyers what I think of hlpag. Even if the car doesn't sell you'd have a large podium from which to speak. Eventually you'll sell the car but I wouldn't hesitate to do the first couple auctions with a high reserve just so you get some exposure before lowering the reserve to actually sell.
I like that idea too. make sure you use all of their alias names too and put a link to this thread. I wonder if troy has any of the threads from the old site saved somewhere, the ones with that ahole patrick, anyone remember those?
Agreed, put the car on Ebay with a high reserve just to see what it gets, then as other people have said put a link in the ad to this page and let other people find out about these HLPAG crooks, can you post a few more pictures just to get a better idea of the work involved?
I agree with bailing. Another way to look at it to ease yourself is by cutting your losses on this one and buying into something better, you will save more money in the resto in the long run than trying to fix up the car you have now.
Has anyone sent this link to the HLFAG guys? I just e-mailed them and let them know the Charger community is on to them. They should run out of suckers soon. The internet is a great tool. Why do you think they sold that thing. They build them for a living and dumped that project. Thats gotta tell you what kind of little people they are.
They don't care. They used to come on the old site and ignorantly berate anyone who dared question their integrity.
Cool huh? I just used the word integrity in a thread about the worlds worst Charger criminal.
Thats ok. I just called them the smallest men I have ever heard of. They can e-mail me all they want. They probably can't come up with an intelligible come back for my e-mail anyway. Oh, I probably shouldn't have used the word intelligible. If they read this, they might not figure it out.
Hey guys, yeah those ass hats don't much care what I or anyone says about them because to them they are doing nothing wrong. I am once again torn about restoring (to a driver level), or e-baying it since one of our members has made me a generous offer to use his shop and that he and a buddy of his would help me to do all the sheet metal work, so once again I am stuck with what to do! I may put it on e-bay with a high reserve, as some have suggested, to see what kind of response I get, I'm just not sure at this point because I am also looking at it as the old bird in the hand is worth two in the bush thing....
Quote from: AirborneSilva on November 23, 2006, 10:29:43 AM
Quote from: poppa on November 22, 2006, 09:54:17 PM
I don't get to read all this stuff too regularly,and I'm not trying to put my nose where it don't belong but,what happened with this?Still ongoing?Feel real bad for ya.Just read all 6 pages,don't usually do that but i was hoping somewhere I would see some good news...
I wish I had good news to report. It seems that I am too small of a fish and no one, to include the FBI's internet fraud division really gives a shit! In the words of the Illinois attorney general "mediation failed", my states attorney general just refered the case to on to illinois (even after we told them that illinois did nothing - I think they didn't read that part), the illinois BBB wrote them (them being HLPAG), a letter telling them that we were not happy with our purchase. Having written to the two MOPAR mags asking for help in anyway they could I was treated to silence. I was told by a lawyer that I was indeed defrauded and that I had a case, BUT, that the money I would spend in not just fighting but trying to collect I would maybe break even at best - so, it looks like HLPAG gets away with another screwing and I am stuck with a car that I can either crush or try to restore (to one degree or another), and hope that before I am too old to enjoy it that I can complete it since it is not the "easy to do" charger that was advertised.
Hey, I think everybody understands that you are upset. Admit it you made a bad move, but don't blame the government for your bad choice. Many AG's offices have an informal mediation process to help consumers resolve their disputes...the AG's office can't represent everyone that comes to them with a legal problem as their private attorney (could you imagine if they could, what kind of budget would they have and who could they say no to?), they represent the State's interests not yours as an individual, they take action against companies that victimize a large number of people. We have a legal system for people like you to resolve these types of disputes. It is unfortunate that it sometimes costs a lot to participate in the system. Why don't you try Small Claims court to at least get some of your money back and to have some small victory? I might suggest you also contact the State's Dealer division, they have the ability to yank dealer's licenses...it's worth a try. To get this resolved it's going to take some effort on your part. You can't sit back and expect somebody or government agency to do all the work for you.
I get tired of people bashing Government in general. The government is not some foreign entity, it's run by people just like you and me.
You don't know me, you don't know what else I have or have not done to TRY and gain some satisfaction, so please, kindly take your anger towards me an put it where it properly belongs.
Ok, Well ABS, have you thought of this. The car maybe worth more as parts? Does it have half decent front fenders? They are going for what $500-900 on ebay each, Grille if it is in good shape $1000 or so? If you have dash all parts, tail lights, etc, that you may just get a lot back out of your car.
BTW, most of the time FBI or the like does not get involved unless the fraud is above $60000. I was told this by an agent. Again, I am not trying to tick you off but you have THREE options.
1. Sell the car as is
2. Restore the car
3. Part the car out.
JUST MY OPINION....
Best of luck.
Tom
Thanks Tom, good points all and I have considered all of them - each has it's pro's and con's. No you did not upset me, what does upset me is when someone tells me I shouldn't be mad at the government for not doing what I believe is their job (to protect us from crooks like HLPAG), and I can bitch about the government all I want, I am an american citizen, I am a veteran and I vote so I will bitch about them all I want but I'm not saying you, or anyone else, has to agree with me just don't whine at me when I do - that makes me mad!
Did you pay with Pay Pal? That is the best way to get the cheese back.File a complaint with them :yesnod:
Quote from: BMOTOXSTAR on December 06, 2006, 08:05:59 PM
Did you pay with Pay Pal? That is the best way to get the cheese back.File a complaint with them :yesnod:
No unfortunately I did not, and thanks to my wife not listening to me when I asked her to CC e-bay on our complaint to Illinois AG (within the 35 day window), e-bay wont do anything for me either.... But thank you for putting that out there so if anyone else gets screwed and they used pay pal they will know to file a complaint and hopefully get some satisfaction...
That really blows. I have been ripped off on parts and thank god I used Pay Pal. But as a seler I have also got ripped off and had to give a re-fund. With Pay Pal the buyer has great protection.
I have always been leary on cars on E-Bay.I feel for you bro.
BMOTOXSATR :rotz:
I think I've made a similar comment in this thread before but I'll throw it in here again. It is unfortunate that you didn't get what you wanted and it is too bad that it sounds like you won't be able to get any justice.
However, that being said, I would restore it, rebuild it, whatever you want to call it. For me that's the fun in it. Sure being done and driving them is fun but for me I enjoy the work and rebuilding them more than anything.
Just my opinion. Adam
Judge Judy
Quote from: AdamMopar on December 07, 2006, 08:22:37 AM
I think I've made a similar comment in this thread before but I'll throw it in here again. It is unfortunate that you didn't get what you wanted and it is too bad that it sounds like you won't be able to get any justice.
However, that being said, I would restore it, rebuild it, whatever you want to call it. For me that's the fun in it. Sure being done and driving them is fun but for me I enjoy the work and rebuilding them more than anything.
Just my opinion. Adam
Hey Adam, I have a spare room :icon_smile_big: Yeah I do lean more towards rebuilding her then anything else since I just don't see getting the kind of money out of it that I would need to even attempt to try and find another one.
Airborne have you tried ringing up HLPAG and maybe coming to some kind of compromise? Or have you tried that already? Who knows they may feel a bit of guilt and give you half back or something?
I did ask for half back, they pretty much laughed in my face and said I knew what I was getting..... these ass hats are VERY arrogant!
Quote from: AirborneSilva on December 06, 2006, 08:24:30 PM
Quote from: BMOTOXSTAR on December 06, 2006, 08:05:59 PM
Did you pay with Pay Pal? That is the best way to get the cheese back.File a complaint with them :yesnod:
No unfortunately I did not, and thanks to my wife not listening to me when I asked her to CC e-bay on our complaint to Illinois AG (within the 35 day window), e-bay wont do anything for me either.... But thank you for putting that out there so if anyone else gets screwed and they used pay pal they will know to file a complaint and hopefully get some satisfaction...
Pay Pal at this stage would not have helped. You have 45 days after the transaction to file a complaint. I learned that after Jesse stole our T shirt money.
I'd be extremely pissed off!!!
Quote from: AirborneSilva on December 07, 2006, 05:54:42 PM
Quote from: AdamMopar on December 07, 2006, 08:22:37 AM
I think I've made a similar comment in this thread before but I'll throw it in here again. It is unfortunate that you didn't get what you wanted and it is too bad that it sounds like you won't be able to get any justice.
However, that being said, I would restore it, rebuild it, whatever you want to call it. For me that's the fun in it. Sure being done and driving them is fun but for me I enjoy the work and rebuilding them more than anything.
Just my opinion. Adam
Hey Adam, I have a spare room :icon_smile_big: Yeah I do lean more towards rebuilding her then anything else since I just don't see getting the kind of money out of it that I would need to even attempt to try and find another one.
Hey if you were close I would be there. I don't have much time now as most people, of course when I have time I don't have money. Everyone knows how that goes. :yesnod: Good luck. Adam
Yeah I do know how that goes Adam, I'm in one of those periods where I have more time then money too :rotz:
Looks as though this seller may be in the same boat. Notice the one pic the car was at their Lot and now it's up for sale.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1968-69-dodge-charger_W0QQitemZ190058900162QQihZ009QQcategoryZ6199QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Yeah that does look like good ole HLPAG's lot! Looks like she is getting a descent price for the car on e-bay, it's up to 4,600 and for the condition it's in and not being an R/T I'd say that's not too bad, maybe I'm wrong though - God knows I was wrong when I bought mine!!!
Any news on what you're gonna do?
I'm trying to find me some real rails so I can get started on her.
Hey ABS, I don't know you but I've got some wheel well trim and some door panels and probably some other stuff I'm not going to use and you are more than welcome to it. ( PAY IT FORWARD GUY'S ) I think that there is enough of us guy's here that we can spare some parts, NO CHARGE. :nono: ..This is called taking care of our own. :patriot: I'm sure you've helped plenty as alot on this site have. This site has saved me money and time and keeps on giving me a wealth of info. So the least I can do is offer some stuff I know I don't need. Just PM me when you're ready. I really hope this brings out the true color of this site and it's members...Chuck...A.K.A. Skip68.................
Chuck,
That is very generous of you and those are all parts that I can use, I'll send you a PM tonight after work. Just so you know, I am also into Jeepin (another MOPAR product :icon_smile_big:), and have helped out many jeepers with spare parts as well as putting on their lift kits for them.
Thank you,
Tony
No problem. :wave:
What does HLPAG stand for, is that the user name? They suck, that is for sure.
BMOTOXSTAR#079
HLPAG = hans luedtke performance auto group
and yes, they suck - to put it nicely.... Their user name on e-bay is "vcode4406"
I can give you 2 front driver turn signals (i have a 69 clear lenses). I'm not going through the thread again to read it all cause I forget everything and don't know the condition of your lights. I have a front valence that came on mine that i replaced that needs some work too. I might have a trunk lid in the summer too, if I do body work and replace mine.( i have a mint trunk lid but it doesn't go on right cause of crappy body work, but if i fix that i will offer up mine to you) it will need a little body expertise but is solid(it's on my car now)
v/r
Mike
Thank you Mike, PM sent...
Just Curious here, I posted about an original RT GL that HPLAG was restoring the other day and I was referred to this discussion about what crooks they are and the junk they sell, I must say it is very eye opening. Anyway, after reading 7 pages of this I was wondering what became of the car the thread was about, is it being restored, did the money get refunded/resolved or was the car left for dead and a new project located. Hopefully there was a happier ending for the buyer, it didn't appear to be headed in the best direction though. Just wondering, I hate seeing people get screwed like that.
I am the unfortunate soul to have had dealings with good ole HLPAG, I'm glad that someone sent you to this thread and you were able to steer away from those crooks.
I have just started to work on the car, I am going to save it cause it is an R/T, if it was just a 318 I would part it out like some suggest. I was not able to recoup any of my money, seems we pay our attorney generals to be "mediators" and not to uphold the law and prosecute criminals so they are getting away with screwing me. With the help of some good folks here on the board I hope to get my justice when the car is finished and looking awesome, of course HLPAG will never know, nor would they even care I'm sure, but I will know every time I sit in the drivers seat and take her for a ride, I will also think of those whom have helped and hope that some day we can meet up at a mopar get together (or any other time for that matter)...
I also hope that we can keep this thread alive so that others like you can stop on by and see what good ole boys the Hans Ludtke Performance Auto Group are, then go elsewhere to get the car of their dreams.
I wish they'd just get into Camaros or VW Bugs or something.
Wow, looks like htere`s no rust where the body used to be.
Quote from: Ghoste on January 12, 2007, 08:30:58 PM
I wish they'd just get into Camaros or VW Bugs or something.
I have a VW Baja Bug i'd almost donate to the cause!! lol
Any pictures?
Please don't hijack the thread, it is too important for those whom may want to read through it and see what HLPAG is up to. If you want pictures of his bug then PM him, Thank you....
No I was asking for pictures of yours? It would be cool to keep a diary in this thread of every little stage of the car's resto
Quote from: JMF on January 17, 2007, 07:16:40 AM
No I was asking for pictures of yours? It would be cool to keep a diary in this thread of every little stage of the car's resto
Oh, sorry.. I did just take a bunch of pictures for someone whom is helping me out with the project, he's giving me a list of items I need (which is going to be extensive I'm sure), and is going to give me a step by step run down on how to attack this. I will try to post some pictures tonight after work.
I feel your pain , everyone keep this in mind , every second , every hour , every day and every year that goes by , the project cars get thinner and thinner , its not like they grow on trees . Look I would say that car is worth 3k tops . I go to salvage yards twice a week , i want to make this very clear , THE PRICE OF STEEL IS SO HIGH , AND NO SIGN OF COMING DOWN , THEREFORE MOST YARDS ARE CRUSHING EVERTHING !!!!!!!!!!!! EVERYONE , I MEAN EVERYONE MUST BUY ANY PARTS CARS AND OR PARTS BEFORE YOU DON'T HAVE AN OPTION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IT IS AN R/T , THERE IS SOME VALUE THERE . I ASSUME NOTHING IN MY THREAD YOU AGREE WITH ?
Here's some of the pictures I took the other day. As you can see I from the previous pictures I haven't done much, I have just removed the rear axle and pretty much all of the interior (well what was there).... Yes I know, I need to get the shop Vac out and clean out the inside so I/we can see better :icon_smile_big:
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010051.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010047.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010040.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010039.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010030.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010029.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010028.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010025.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010024.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010023.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010034.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010018.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/Pics%20for%20Doc/P1010011.jpg)
There is lots more pictures but I don't want to get Troy mad at me.....
fenders, doors, look good. I took on a job like that with a 68 firebird. It can be done, i promise. I knew nothing when i took it on, but a floor pan here a trunk pan there and a lot of searching and hard work I got it back to original, and i'm a moron(i promise you are smarter than me). I know you can do it. Hang in there Tony and take one section at a time. I wish i had pics of the firebird when i started it and when i sold it(long story, ex fiance, etc... we are still friends though but neither one of us owns the car now), and yes, a shopvac came in handy. very familiar sight right there!!
I will look in my pics in my upstairs tomorrow to see of i can find some pics of that firebird(i remember some somewhere)
:2thumbs:
v/r
Mike
Thanks Mike, Yeah the drivers side fender is not bad at all but the passenger side will need some grafting in a few areas. As for the doors, I will just need to rebuild or buy new hinges. When I look at and think of the whole project ahead of me I get overwhelmed but then when I look at one area (like the rear rails I need to replace), I feel good about being able to accomplish that. There is a member, whom I don't know if he wants me to mention him by name (but I damn sure will when all is said and done, he and all whom are helping me will certainly deserve kudos), is helping me with the planning and step by step guide so that way I wont have to guess what I need to do next or what part/s I will need.
Is this a PP1 car? I always liked that color.
I really couldn't say if it was PP1 or not, I just know that the original color was Hemi orange - damn now I feel like I should know :rotz: :icon_smile_big:
Oh okay, I guess it does look orange now that I look at the pictures again. Lighting does something to it hahaha
For some reason I like to start with the worse part & that usually is the Back. That means 2 new Frame rails & 2 peice Trunk & both left & right Trunk Extensions, ect, ect. Then I work my way up to the front. You can buy most of these sheet metal parts needed from Sherman & Associates. Good luck, It can be done. LEON.
Thanks Leon, I believe that is that battle plan. I just bought some used partial frame rails last night so when they get here I will get to work on them. When I look at just one area, like the frame rails I feel good about being able to accomplish getting this thing together, I just need to remember that and not sit back and look at the whole car, then I get overwhelmed :o
I'm just glad you're rising to the challenge.
Quote from: Ghoste on January 19, 2007, 10:17:11 AM
I'm just glad you're rising to the challenge.
Thank you, I just couldn't see letting an R/T go to waste.
Holy crap man, that's a horrible sight -- but you're gonna have that much more of a story to tell, sense of accomplishment, and a big grin on your face when you get her done. And there is certainly good there to go with the bad.
Anyhow, nothing new or terribly insightful to add, just wanted to give a thumbs up :thumbs: as well for tackling it.
I know its easier said then done but don't get discouraged...stay focused on the areas you are going to tackle first and before you know it you will feel good about the decision to save the car. It does look like a hell of a undertaking but you have support here and I have seen others taken on similar basket cases. A friend of mine bought a Challenger on ebay that was suppose to be solid and just in need of a light restoration. He had got a lot of pics of the car and thought it was worth what he was ready to bid for it. The car didn't look bad and the underside looked to be solid except for a lot of under coating. Once he got the car he was reasonably satisfied until he started to take things apart. The car was a quilt under all the undercoating. Frame had major repairs that were hidden and even alot of the body panels were bondo and patches. It was a mess. He was really depressed. I remember when we sat in his garage and it seemed everything we took the grinder or wire wheel to revealed a patch job. A winter season later he had the car in primer and all the major work was done. A short time after that he had paint on it and the motor rebuilt and in and eventually it was one of the nicest 340 Challengers I have seen. But he put in a lot of late nights and was determined to get it done.
You see.....even in the Mopar hobby there can be a happy ending!.....so don't let the villains get the best of you!
Sydome, thanks for the words of encouragement. I am feeling pretty positive right now about the car, but I'm sure there will be time when discouragement will raise it's ugly head, but I know that I have enough people that want to see me succed and see this car on the road again. I am getting help from a few of you guys, in more way then one, and that is much appreciated - more then I can say.
I am waiting frame rails right now, but in the mean time I removed the windshield (without breaking it :icon_smile_big:), removed the dash and have that apart (what was there anyway). I have some more things to remove out of the inerior so I hope to get to that this weekend, weather permitting.
While your waiting , check out these pictures of Blusmbl 68 Charger that I restored last year.Keep your head up and a positive attitude , and I have no doubt your car will look the same in the near future.
http://flickr.com/photos/blusmbl/sets/72057594083101141/
I'm glad to see you started on it. You will get there, just like we all will, someday. ;) Adam
Thanks guys, the frame rail deal fell through :'( so if anyone knows of any please let me know.. The guy who had the rails was honest enough that when he started taking them out he noticed some areas that were of question so he decided not to sell them, I do appreciate him being honest and not selling me junk.
Hey Mark, yeah I did contact Texas acres, they wanted I believe it was like 250 per side, that's out of my budget right now. I haven't heard of Wild car auto wrecking. I will be doing all my own blasting on the car, so all parts will be blasted and if they need replacing I will know then, hopefully I can repair most parts, the left front fender concerns me so I will probably need to replace that and I know that is not going to be cheap...
I thought that's who you were talking about, I did send them a parts request but never heard back from them, which surprised me since I asked him about something else and he was a super nice guy... thanks for the link and number...
Wildcat doesn't have a lot of '68-'70 b body stuff. But it doesn't hurt to try. Ask for Dennis, he's a buddy of mine who knows his Mopes.
Quote from: 472 R/T SE on January 25, 2007, 07:33:15 PM
Wildcat doesn't have a lot of '68-'70 b body stuff. But it doesn't hurt to try. Ask for Dennis, he's a buddy of mine who knows his Mopes.
Thanks, I will.
If it's of any reassurance to you, my 69 was almost as bad as yours is. The only thing I had going for me were solid frame rails. I replaced everything else (quarters, trunk floors/drop offs, outer wheel houses, rockers, interior floors, fabbed up pieces that weren't available) It can be done, just takes time. At times, this will irritate you to the point where you want to give up on it, DON"T!!! It will be worth it in the end to look at what you have accomplished. I can't tell you how many times I said to myself "Why the hell am I getting this deep in this car" Now, 16 months later, it's near ready for paint and in a few short months it will be painted, have the running gear installed and be back on the road.
Tony I'll contact you shortly, sorry I was mia for a while.
Oh and I don't mind you mentioning me, I have nothing to hide :icon_smile_big:
It can be done, money and time (5 pages of thumbnails):
http://gallery.musclecarrestorations.com/gallery2/v/Chrysler/Completed/Dodge-Charger-70-001/
Some sample pics:
Quote from: Doc74 on January 31, 2007, 10:21:04 AM
Tony I'll contact you shortly, sorry I was mia for a while.
Oh and I don't mind you mentioning me, I have nothing to hide :icon_smile_big:
Cool Doc, I do appreciate all your help with the technical advice and spending as much time as you do explaining things to me. Oh, and the mia thing, don't worry about it, I know you are a busy man...
MOPARHOUND, one word - WOW!!! ok another - DAMN!! that was one hell of a job, I can only hope mine will turn out half as nice. Thanks for the link too.
MOPARHOUND, You forgot to mention that that guy probably has $100,000+ into that purple 70 R/T's Restoration. ::) LEON.
Quote from: hemi-hampton on January 31, 2007, 10:52:27 PM
MOPARHOUND, You forgot to mention that that guy probably has $100,000+ into that purple 70 R/T's Restoration. ::) LEON.
Forgot? Again...........
Quote....money and time.
Quote from: AirborneSilva on January 31, 2007, 07:53:37 PM
Quote from: Doc74 on January 31, 2007, 10:21:04 AM
Tony I'll contact you shortly, sorry I was mia for a while.
Oh and I don't mind you mentioning me, I have nothing to hide :icon_smile_big:
Cool Doc, I do appreciate all your help with the technical advice and spending as much time as you do explaining things to me. Oh, and the mia thing, don't worry about it, I know you are a busy man...
Thanks for understanding, I finally sent out a small text to your hotmail today.
Doc, First, Welcome to the USA! and second, "small text" hell my friend that was a small novel :icon_smile_big: thank you, I did get it and read it over, just didn't have the chance to respond.
Thank you again for all your help, it is much appreciated.
Quote from: AirborneSilva on February 02, 2007, 09:17:58 PM
Doc, First, Welcome to the USA! and second, "small text" hell my friend that was a small novel :icon_smile_big: thank you, I did get it and read it over, just didn't have the chance to respond.
Thank you again for all your help, it is much appreciated.
Thanks for the welcome ! I'm glad I'm finally with my woman...here's hoping she feels the same :icon_smile_big:
Ah yes, I may have typed a bit much...sorry about that, I get carried away sometimes but I always say better explain too much than not enough...actually I just made that up but it sounds good :D
I'll have a new pc in a week or so which will give me back access to my old drive and files . Then if I can get some faster internet connection it'll become a bit easier. I can' really see pics larger than 100k right now which is a drag.
After what those hlpag a**holes did to you I don't see how any of us who have the means to help can just sit and watch so no need to thank me, it's my pleasure.
Well I have acquired a parts car, there's not much left of it so I got it cheap but the rear rails and all connecting pieces are there. The trunk floor pan is not useable and most of the floor pan that I need is not useable but the inner wheel wells are both good, and there is a few places that I will need to get patch pieces from that are good and will make easy fixes since I don't have to worry about matching the shapes.
Nice. That was the way I would've gone as well. I'm guessing you got it for less than what those thieves wanted for just the rails.
Quote from: nh_mopar_fan on February 07, 2007, 08:36:07 PM
Nice. That was the way I would've gone as well. I'm guessing you got it for less than what those thieves wanted for just the rails.
Yep, I got it for less then half of what they wanted for just one rail. The guy parted out pretty much all parts that you don't have to cut off (there is still some pieces but not much), and just wanted to get rid of what was left. One rail will need some work but it's nothing major.
Any pictures of the parts car?
Not much to look at but when I get it here I will take some pictures.
hows yer car coming along? send me a list of parts u need and i'll dig through my stuff to see if i have somethin for u.
Thank you Mike,
I've been meaning to update this. I have finally gotten some rear frame rails sections, I cleaned them up and fixed a couple minor spots on them so they are about ready to be installed (just as soon as I can get a guy I know to help me with the measurements and placement - I do not want to screw this up or everything else with be screwed too!!)... I will get you a list, and THANK YOU :icon_smile_big: :yesnod:
did you say somewhere you wanted to put A/C in it? If you did I have all the A/C parts out of mine you can have. As far as the other parts I will look and see. Mike
Quote from: charger_mike75 on April 16, 2007, 04:31:49 PM
did you say somewhere you wanted to put A/C in it? If you did I have all the A/C parts out of mine you can have. As far as the other parts I will look and see. Mike
Yep, as a matter of fact I did say that :icon_smile_big: I didn't know how hard it would be to do since it's a non AC car...
skip the a/c man youll have the windows down listening to the gine and the tires frying anyway ...imo
Yeah I'm getting old and like my comfort, I even use the A/C when I go out 4 wheeling :icon_smile_big:
Just now found this thread
Whats the update on this story? its been almost two years
Do you still have the car? did you sue them? (I would have in small claims court at least while on my vacation)
Just a tad bit on ebay;
Never buy a car without inspecting first (or any other big ticket items! for that matter) Having it inspected by some one you trust ebay has links to provide this service for Most cars sales bought and sold on ebay are covered by insurance to 20 k in most cases but rules must be followed as in this case you were defrauded even though you were over there 30 day period that sucks should be up to six months or at least 3 months 90 days. :rotz: :flame: :brickwall: :RantExplode:
Ebay should never allow sellers feedback to be private :RantExplode: :flame:, By the way when I see that I never bid on item there is a reason they are hiding it.
I would think the FBI Internet fraud would go after these guy's or Federal postal Mail inspectors for Mail fraud. If it was me or you they would!!!
Did you ever try Mail fraud department? of the postal dept. f payment was made in mail you could go after them for mail fraud I would think Evan though it was a deal made on ebay payment came threw the mail.
Sorry you got the shaft by these guy's but not every one that sells on ebay is a bad guy.
I have pretty much tried everything you have suggested to get some satisfaction from these crooks but the FBI doesn't care (not enough money), the Illinois AG doesn't care (as far as they are concerned they did their job), we talked to a lawyer who told us he would take the case but we would end up spending more money then we would get back, and we thought of small claims but if we win how do we collect from crooks who really don't give a damn and are so far away? So, we just decided to get to work on it, which in and of itself has been both exciting and depressing. What I have done so far is to remove everything that was left in the interior (except the passenger door window, haven't figured that out yet), I have bought some rear frame rails sections, cleaned them up a bit and am waiting for a guy I know in my jeep club to find the measurements of the rear rails so I can splice them in, which is making me pretty nervous since I don't want to screw that up! I have gotten the front valance and lights that go in it from mikepmcs, thank very much Mike, and lots of information from Doc, many thanks to you too!
When you are sued in small claims they have the opportunity to pay then if they don't pay it goes on there credit record till payed as a judgment against them, And after that you have the opportunity to file a lean against his home and other property as well, until the dept is paid.
If I were you I would do it too!!!!!!!!! At least you would have the satisfaction of knowing they cant buy any thing on there credit for many years! or until they make you happy enough to remove the deal by saying its paid in full. Maybe it would force them too settle with you, Which I'm sure they would as it was and is a full on Fraud case which in itself is a felony in most states. If you would win in a civil suit against them the state might even go after him after that.
At least file the papers and I bet he settles out of court.
Its your money and time But its money and time well spent.
If you do file you will get a court date to show up, just show up with all your pics and tell the judge the whole story.
By the way if you google his ebay name this story comes up first Before any Ebay adds!
Doright, I apreciate your input but I have talked to too many people to include lawyers and members of law enforcement, they all tell me good luck! I was sold the car under a business name (his business not mine), and have been told that I could only put a lean against the business and have further been told they will just change the name and still get nothing. I'm trying to just put that behind me (but I still want people to know how they screwed me and others, so it's awesome this thread comes up when they are googled :icon_smile_big:), and move on with the business of trying to get this car back on the road someday, hopefully sooner rather then later. I still do get frustrated and certainly feel that if some harm did happen to come to good ole hans and oscar I would certainly not feel sad in the least, but I am trying to focus on the restoration, the law has failed me so I need to let that part go and learn from it!
I am glad your ready to move on and compleet the car and I wish you the best of luck with it.
On the other hand :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame: :flame:
:rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz: :rotz:
Any new picture of the car or parts car?
I pretty much have the parts car cut up, and the Charger has not changed, I am waiting on a guy I know to get the factory measurements for the rear rails so we can get those on.. I will definetly post pictures of the rails when I get them on, hopefully soon.
Tony,
I don't know if you saw this thread but you might want to look at all the pictures Hemigeno posted. He's got some great ones of the frame rails in there. It's seven pages but might be worth it to show your welder.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,25239.0.html
On another note, how's your steering wheel horn pad looking?? I see your wheel is kind of toast but is the horn pad salvageable?
v/r
Mike
Quote from: mikepmcs on April 18, 2007, 03:56:17 PM
Tony,
I don't know if you saw this thread but you might want to look at all the pictures Hemigeno posted. He's got some great ones of the frame rails in there. It's seven pages but might be worth it to show your welder.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,25239.0.html
On another note, how's your steering wheel horn pad looking?? I see your wheel is kind of toast but is the horn pad salvageable?
v/r
Mike
Hey Mike, thank you for the link I'll go check it out, and the welder will be me (I sure hope I don't screw it up :o), anyway I will check out the horn pad and see if it can be saved, I have been kinda ignoring the steering colum as I thought the wheel was a lost cause and figured it was something to worry about WAY down the road.
Let me know, if you need the wheel. I just took mine off as it was correct for a 68(horn ring vice pad), so I put the grant correct for the 05 DOH movie on it.
I was going to sell it but if your pad is just a clean and dye job, you can use this wheel and convert it to a 69 by using the pad. It's black.
I'd much rather you get it then sell it. I'll keep the horn ring and give it to another member that might need it. If you don't think you can use it, that's fine too and I'll search for another deserving member, but right now you are first on my list(ok actually 2nd this time but Jim Shine's 68 has a mint wheel on it and he passed). No offense to anyone else, but if you read this thread you'll most likely agree with me.
Lemmie know brother. :icon_smile_cool:
v/r
Mike
oh, and here is what it looks like too.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,26936.0.html
v/r
Mike
Quote from: mikepmcs on April 18, 2007, 04:12:28 PM
oh, and here is what it looks like too.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,26936.0.html
v/r
Mike
That is really kind of you, I wish I could help with parts as well :cheers:
Quote from: mikepmcs on April 18, 2007, 04:08:27 PM
Let me know, if you need the wheel. I just took mine off as it was correct for a 68(horn ring vice pad), so I put the grant correct for the 05 DOH movie on it.
I was going to sell it but if your pad is just a clean and dye job, you can use this wheel and convert it to a 69 by using the pad. It's black.
I'd much rather you get it then sell it. I'll keep the horn ring and give it to another member that might need it. If you don't think you can use it, that's fine too and I'll search for another deserving member, but right now you are first on my list(ok actually 2nd this time but Jim Shine's 68 has a mint wheel on it and he passed). No offense to anyone else, but if you read this thread you'll most likely agree with me.
Lemmie know brother. :icon_smile_cool:
v/r
Mike
Mike, once again you are the man - Thank You...
Here is a picture of the center pad, it has no cracks so I think cleaning and a dye job would make it look like new. How do you get it off though? I don't want to screw it up. Oh, I looked at the wheel and it looks great to me.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/P1010095.jpg)
Here is a picture of what is left of the Coronet "parts" car that I couldn't get many parts off of, I did get some sheet metal that I can use for patches here and there.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/P1010097.jpg)
Quote from: CharlieCharger on April 18, 2007, 04:26:05 PM
Quote from: mikepmcs on April 18, 2007, 04:12:28 PM
oh, and here is what it looks like too.
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,26936.0.html
v/r
Mike
That is really kind of you, I wish I could help with parts as well :cheers:
Mike has been very good to me and I can't thank him enough. I do apreciate the thought of wanting to help and if you live in our nations captial area I will be moving there in a couple of months so I can certainly use some help with this thing, man the more I look at it the more I see needs to be done and I get a little overwhelmed and fearful that I'm going to screw it up....
Tony,
I assume you are talking about the pictures of my wheel, right, meaning you could put it to some use? If so, it's on the way!
v/r
Mike
Quote from: mikepmcs on April 18, 2007, 04:38:18 PM
Tony,
I assume you are talking about the pictures of my wheel, right, meaning you could put it to some use? If so, it's on the way!
v/r
Mike
You assume correctly Sir :yesnod: and thank you agian for your kindness, when you come down to visit your parents you are definetly going to have to let me know so the wife and I can buy you dinner or something....
That's right, you are in the DC area now right?
v/r
Mike
No yet, we should be there in a couple of months. You know how slow the federal government works!!! We are still waiting for the "Official" phone call to offer the wife the job, seems some idiot who does personel actions was against my wife going back to work due to her illness, the person who hired her for the job asked him if he was a doctor and that shut him up but he has been dragging his feet due to his oposition of hiring my wife.
I have a copy of the factory frame measurements on a B-Body,
Send me an e-mail and I will send you a pdf file
Dave
sales at autorust.com
:yesnod:
E-mail sent, thank you :yesnod:
Go ahead and file fraud prootection with Ebay.....I bought a similar Coronet on Ebay once....same story, strategic photos and a fraudulant description.....I emailed him all the questions of the stuff I couldn't see in his photos, and asked for new photos or a description and again the replies were fraudulant....
I sent Ebay Fraud an email and a concurrent email to the seller 'firm, but not billegerant' asking for my money back or a sizeable discount on the car, and he did........ you got nothing to lose by trying....but R/T or not, that car is a long way off........
Rob, yeah it is a long way off and sometimes that can be very depressing, I have thought about selling my jeep so I can get a running 68, 69 or 70 Charger R/T then I can take my time with this one and not be so depressed or anxious to get it done - and I really love my jeep!
As for your suggestion of contacting E-bay's fraud department, done - but not soon enough, they basically told me to go pound sand that I waited too long (it had to be within 35 days of the sale closing). Which rubs sand into the wound, especially since when my wife was composing a letter to the Illinois AG I asked her repeatedly to cc e-bay (this would have been within the 35 day window), she did not and I am screwed!
i say you kill them!!
Quote from: autodynamics on April 23, 2007, 12:13:59 AM
i say you kill them!!
I'm thinkin it would be justifiable homicide :devil: :yesnod:
Well I was hoping to have some good news and pictures to post, but I do not :'( A guy I know (he is in my 4X4 club), owns a body shop and told me he would come over to show/help me how to get the rear frame rails (partial rails), on and get them the right length as well as squared up. I called twice, left messages both times but never heard back from him.
If anyone here lives in S. Arizona or knows of someone I can enlist to help out in this critical area I'd sure appreciate it. I'm just so afraid that I will screw it up and have the car going down the road sideways.
On another note, I have finally decided to create a web page detailing my wonderful buying experience I had with hlpag. When I get it up and going I will post a link.
The rear frame rails are not so much the most important issue in terms of squareness. What is critical is the alignment of the leaf springs. Are the front mounts still ok? Under the back seat. Are you replacing the rear spring mounts? Under the trunk? Those are the areas you need to concentrate on.
I am not suggesting the rear frames are NOT important, just saying the critical area is the springs. The frame IS important, as its what supports the rest of the car, and does need to be strong. The rear end will sit on the leaf springs, and that can also be adjusted to be square. Be patience with it, take your time and do a lot of corner to corner measuring. If you get agitated, walk away.
Remember, we do this for fun.
Dave
Hi Dave,
thanks for the reply, I will be replacing the rear spring mounts, the fronts look ok but I will know better when I can sand blast them. Here is a visual for you so you will understand why I need to replace the rear spring mounts, and remember in the description that good ole hlpag put on the ebay add - "The trunk pan has already been cut out and ready for the new one to be installed!" - cut out my butt :flame:
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00165.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00166.jpg)
Hitler would be proud of HLPAG...the only thing missing from their lot is the gas chambers!
I think they have them underground, hopefully Han's right hand man Oscar (the lying dirt bag I dealt with), will be the first to test em out - I'll buy the gas :devil:
Well, that sure looks like you have project on your hands there. Take your time with it, we have fixed ones in worst shape then that. All it takes is some time and money. Most of us have more time then money.
I would get the car up in the air at a comfortable working height, its tough to do this stuff when your on your back. Get it at least to a height you can sit on the ground and work in front of yourself.
Thinks Safety. Make sure you support it with good jack stands, not old concrete blocks or tree stumps.
The cut away the rust on the end of the frame under the trunk edge, up towards the shock crossmember. Trim it square. Square is always neater and easier to go back to.
Then fit your replacements in place. Take your time, dont weld anything solid. Support the frame rails with stands or some other fashion to hold them in place. Make sure you have a good crossmember in the back, under the tailight panel. tack weld that in place, again dont weld it solid until you have measured it up several times. Get it right. If it aggravates you, walk away and try again tommorrow. Once the rails are in a good place, check the measurements again. Use the measurements I gave you. Check it one more time, then weld them in. Be patient, this might take you a while, but you need it right, its the foundation.
Go to my web site, look at the project picture we do, look at the methodical way we approach it. I understand we are a company that does this all the time, and have developed techniques and skills that save us countless hours. Look at the different ways we do the repairs. We are not building the space shuttle here, just trying to save a Mopar.
Remember, have fun. If its not fun, walk away and try again later. Sooner or later you will make progress and then you have some motivation, some inspiration. Next thing you know Ole Chip Fooose will be calling.....
Dave
:thumbs:
Hi Dave,
Thank you for all the info, I'm trying to get an e-mail together with some quesitons and pictures, or maybe I should put it in the form of a post so if someone else runs into this they will have some answers. I will post as soon as I can.
Thanks,
Tony
Measure the rails and cut the old out, set in the trunk pans if possible, and then use self tapping screws to hold the rails into place.
then mock up the leaf springs and make sure they get straight, after that make your marks and weld it up. then remove it all and do the front perch. trust me, you want that in its exact same spot. not long ago we replaced the entire ass end of a 69 RR that looked real close. so if you need any pointers send me a pm and i'll help if I can.
Dave and Moparguy01 (and anyone else whom cares to jump in here with words of wisdom),
Thank you very much for your help to this point, now here are some questions that I have (and I'm sure there will be more).
First, Moparguy, I am doing partial rails (money right now is VERY tight but I hope that changes by mid summer - if all goes right!), anyway I wish I could have done full rails but this is what I have. After looking at the existing rails, what's left of them, I think I have to cut forward of the shock crossmember that the shocks connect to. here is a picture that will explain way. I also have another shock crossmember that is in better shape that I will put on once I get the rails installed.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/P1010005.jpg)
The next two pictures shows where I think I should cut and join them, let me know what you think, and I'm sorry if reading the lettering is hard – it looked better before I uploaded the pictures.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/oldrail.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/newrail.jpg)
I am confused on my measure points so Dave will have to answer this one since I can't upload an adobe file. Here's a couple of pictures where I think the points are from looking at the file you sent Dave.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rearsrpingmount.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/frontspringmount.jpg)
Finally, the diagonal measurement reads 71.95 but since my measuring tape does not have decimals on it I converted it to a fraction and got 71 19/20. My tape does not have, nor do I know of one that does have 19/20 so would 15/16 be ok?
I am going to put a sleeve where I join the two rails together and have some 2X3 that is pretty heavy duty stuff but it's only 6" long, will this length be good enough or should I try to put a sleeve in there as long as I can?
I unfortunately do not have any trunk pans or the rear crossmember but I did buy some ¾" square tubing to help me tack things in place while I quadruple check my measurements, then check them again before I make my final welds. Does that make sense?
Thank you for your time and energy. I hope your brain doesn't hurt half as much as mine thinking about this!! I hope all this makes sense, it's getting past my bed time :icon_smile_big:
I use part of the old frame as a sleeve. Part of the old frame should fit inside the new frame. Cut 1 slit into each bottom corner of old frame. This will let old frame move into new frame. Use about 6'' of old frame inside new frame. Also, I did not hear anybody else mention this but get a Carpenters level, one about 4' long. Lay this ontop of roof of car & make car Level. Now, Once you got frame rails in place but just before you weld lay this level across the top of both frame rails at same time & make sure level before you weld. Once level weld. Weld a continuous bead on inside of frame to old frame. I cut the very top edge/lip off of old frame & weld along this cutoff of old frame to new, do this for the entire 6'' of old frame inside the new frame. This will make it strong. Thats the short version. Completed version may take a book. Hope this Helps? LEON.
Thank you Leon, good tips :yesnod: I am going to assume that I should level the car side to side.
Here is a link to the web page I'm building to let the world know how the good ole boys at hlpag do business, there's not much to it right now but let me know what you think. I am wanting to keep it on the time line as things happend and I only want to print the truth so they have no way of coming back on me. As I make changes and add pages I will update and when I'm done please let every car person, especially MOPAR folks, know about the page. I hope that I can put a dent in their business and save someone from what they did to me.
http://tonysilvajr.com/Charger.aspx
Quote from: hemi-hampton on May 11, 2007, 10:33:10 PM
I use part of the old frame as a sleeve. Part of the old frame should fit inside the new frame. Cut 1 slit into each bottom corner of old frame. This will let old frame move into new frame. Use about 6'' of old frame inside new frame. Also, I did not hear anybody else mention this but get a Carpenters level, one about 4' long. Lay this ontop of roof of car & make car Level. Now, Once you got frame rails in place but just before you weld lay this level across the top of both frame rails at same time & make sure level before you weld. Once level weld. Weld a continuous bead on inside of frame to old frame. I cut the very top edge/lip off of old frame & weld along this cutoff of old frame to new, do this for the entire 6'' of old frame inside the new frame. This will make it strong. Thats the short version. Completed version may take a book. Hope this Helps? LEON.
I agree with pretty much everything Leon said. I like to have the trunk floor in place, because its easy to locate that because of the braces in the back. then i hold the trunk floor in with self tapping screws, then push the rails in. but like leon said, make cuts along the old rail, then hammer it up so its tight against the new rail section before you weld. and then once the rail is tacked into place, remove the trunk floor and weld the rails inside.
I like how in the Auction they convienantly forget to open the trunk lid & snap a shot of that easy to repair trunk. Plus the perfect use of dark shadows to hid whats really behind that rear tailight panal, all strategically obscured by well placed dark shadowing. My as well be done like a Magician with Smoke & Mirrors. LEON. :scratchchin: :rotz:
Thank you guys, things are becoming a more and more clear. I am still not clear on my measuring points. Russ I sent you the file so could you clear that up for me? Also, I will not be able to have the trunk floor in place as there is no trunk floor and I can't buy one right now. We are WAITING for a phone call that is going to take us to the east coast but the government (and one of it's inept employees), is doing it's usual take their time. I need to have this car ready to roll before then though.
Leon, yeah the wife looked at the Charger the other day and noticed the black peeling, she could see the orange coming through and asked why in the world someone would cover up that orange with flat black, I had to inform her that they were trying to (and succeding in), hiding things they didn't want me to see. Between the flat black paint and low light in the pictures they did a great job of making it appear as though the rust damage was minimal.
I've done some work on page 2 of my web page letting the world know how my deal went down with good ole hlpag. here is the address.
http://tonysilvajr.com/Charger2.aspx
Airborne,
Good job on the site. And I just thought I would tell you how great I think it is that you're diving headfirst into this project. I probably would have sat in a corner and wept if this had happened to me, but it's obvious you aren't going to let anything stop you from having the car you've always wanted. Good luck man. I wish I had some parts or something to send to you.
terrible,
Thank you, I have another page or two to make, then do a little fine tunning. Sometimes I do feel like sitting in a corner and weeping, I get so frustrated and depressed then I just have to walk away. I have to learn to focus on one thing at a time, when I can do that I am ok. I hope that with my web page and this thread (which some have told me if you google HLPAG this thread comes up before their web page, I think that is great and is a good reason to keep this thread alive :icon_smile_big: :yesnod:), we can put a big dent in their business and steer an unsuspecting person away from them crooks.
Thank you again and thanks for the well wishes.
Hey Airborne, so are you in Hereford AZ? That's kind of funny. I used to live in Sorry Vista, oops, Sierra Vista. Hey not sure who you've been talking to down that way. But I may have some friends who might be able to help somewhat. Let me know, I will see if I can get hold of them.... You can pm me with their names. I knew several Mopar people there.
Charger74,
Yep, I certainly do live in Sorry Vista :icon_smile_big:, hopefully for not too much longer though. I could use all the hlep I can get, I'm so afraid of getting these rails wrong so if anyone of your buddies knows what they are doing I sure would appreciate the help.
I will see if I can get hold of anyone. But I would check, there is a body shop there called Kendall/Brooks I think. At least used to be, call them and see if Clinard still works there. If so, tell them Brent Leistner asked him to call you.
Also, at Ideal cars there on 92, go to the repair bays. Ask if Jeff Bettancourt is still working there. He has/had a pretty nice 68 from about high school on. Other than that, I know of someone in Benson, but not to sure how helpful he would be.
Also check and see when/ if there is going to be a Sonic cruise nite this year. GO to it and talk to anybody. Maybe ask around for Trent Driver. Again, drop my name if you find him. Right now, that is about all I can suggest. I will try to get hold of someone and let you know...
Thank you Brent, I will see if I can look them up next week...
Thanks again,
Tony
Well I have the rear rails mocked up but the measurements that Dave from Auto Rust gave me do not match what I have, I am not 100% sure that I am measuring from the same points that are in the diagram though. below are pictures of my points of measurement;
This is my rear point of measurement.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/DSC00615.jpg)
This is my front point of measurement.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/DSC00610.jpg)
The measurements are 76 1/8th" diagonal and between the rails is 34", I measure the between the rails in two places, one about where the crossmember for the shocks goes and towards the back of the rails.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/DSC00618.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/DSC00617.jpg)
I haven't been following the thread, but it looks like your making good progress. :2thumbs:
Thank you Harlow, I don't feel comfortable in welding the rails up quite yet though. The shackle on the left side hangs pretty much straight down but the one on the right hands down at an angle, even though the diaganol measurements are the same. Also when you look at what's left of the rear crossmember that's attached to the tail panel it looks like the back of the rails line up, but again when I look at the shackels I get a bit nervous to start welding.
Dont forget the Level I mentioned? LEON.
Quote from: hemi-hampton on May 24, 2007, 08:09:44 PM
Dont forget the Level I mentioned? LEON.
that is a very good point cause it could x measure even with a twist and diamond ...
I have not forgotten Leon, I'm trying to get things lined up first.
What I sometime do is line up a existing hole with the new hole. For Example that large round hole size of quarter in bottom of frame rail near front leaf spring perch. If you insert into new frame & overlap or line up these 2 holes then you should have it right. If this hole not where your cut is find another hole or something else. LEON.
About the only thing there is to line up is the lip on the rails where the shock crossmember connects to.
Ok, I am getting close to welding in my rails but want to see what you guys think before I do something I can't undo. I have gotten the rear crossmember (thank you Dave from Auto Rust), so I have another refrence point but would really like to have more eyes and learned opinions as well.
Here you can see (well if you look close), where I cut what was left of the old crossmember off the rear tail panel and it appears that the new one lines up with that. It is a little lower so it doesn't appear to line up exact but if I was to jack it up to touch it it would line up with it...
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20and%20crossmember%20mock%20up/DSC00626.jpg)
Here are pictures of what it looks like from the side with the springs attached;
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20and%20crossmember%20mock%20up/DSC00620.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20and%20crossmember%20mock%20up/DSC00623.jpg)
So, should I make my diagonal measurements then start welding?
I like to do that type of work on a more level concrete floor, Dirt back yard makes me nervous. Have fun. LEON. :scratchchin:
I wish I had a concrete surface to do it on, if we can ever get moved I WILL have a garage, or else :RantExplode: but for now this is what I have to work with
Quote from: AirborneSilva on June 08, 2007, 11:18:37 PM
I wish I had a concrete surface to do it on, if we can ever get moved I WILL have a garage, or else :RantExplode: but for now this is what I have to work with
Do you have a board that you could put under the two jack stands to help level the car better? I'm not sure how much of a difference it would make, but it couldn't hurt.
I was a little bored last night so I did a little cruising on e-bay and found another 69 in about the same shape as mine. It sold for more then I bought mine so it makes me feel slightly better, but I like the fact that the person selling the Charger at least took pictures that were not taken so as to hide things so I'd have to say kudos to the person selling the Charger but I do hope the person who bought it knows what they are getting into.
Here is the ad;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290126679869&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:middle:us
Yeah, But I see Reserve not met so high bidder not obligated to pay anything & I think Price to high already considering the good stuff was gone/replaced (440, 4speed, dana) :Twocents: LEON.
Quote from: hemi-hampton on June 17, 2007, 11:34:46 PM
Yeah, But I see Reserve not met so high bidder not obligated to pay anything & I think Price to high already considering the good stuff was gone/replaced (440, 4speed, dana) :Twocents: LEON.
All good points :yesnod: I guess I was focusing in on the fact that the seller was at least honest about the condition of the car.
Now this is awesome! I got an e-mail from an individual who saw my web site while trying to find info on HLPAG and it saved him from going to those rip off artists YEE HAW you M***er F***ers at HLPAG I hope I can affect MANY more negative sales for them crooks. Here is the e-mail I got;
"Thanks for posting up your experience with Luedtke. I've ben considering one of their general lees for a awhile. I did several searches to see if the company was lagit. but didn't find anything. Just today I found yours and a military man in iraq who got took on a 68 shelby clone. I hope you get your money back."
Sounds like your providing a useful service. The more the better. Congratulations. LEON. :2thumbs:
Quote from: hemi-hampton on June 18, 2007, 11:12:49 PM
Sounds like your providing a useful service. The more the better. Congratulations. LEON. :2thumbs:
:iagree:
Yeah Airborne. you educated another person on them. Awesome. I understand what you are going through. Never had a garage when I lived in SV. Makes it really hard to level the car on dirt, plus not to mention the heat. Wish I could give you some advise. Other than this, get something underneath it before July when the monsoon season starts up, otherwise it will sink into the ground. Out where you are, you will get hit with some decent downpours. I would check with some construction companies and see if they have any wooden concrete forms they want to get rid of. They are usually 3/4 plywood.
Ok, I finally got off my tail and got the rails welded in, here's some pics.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20welded/P1010147.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20welded/P1010148.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20welded/P1010149.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20welded/P1010150.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20welded/P1010151.jpg)
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/rear%20frame%20rails/rails%20welded/P1010152.jpg)
AWESOME! That's such a huge part right there, and you've done it! Awesome work Airborne, can't wait to see your car as it progresses! :2thumbs:
Thank you Terrible, I can't wait to get it on cement :yesnod: then I can start to work on it properly. I hope to be able to get a rotisserie but we will see, it certainly would be nice to have but on the other hand the price of one could buy lots of parts too... Thanks again.
That's looking very good. :2thumbs: I know I couldn't do that.
WOW great job!
Honestly don't think I would attempt such a challenge.
Steve
Make sure you buy a BIG scrap book and document your work.
Its going to be unbelievable.
Quote from: mxzx440 on August 21, 2007, 11:03:42 PM
That's looking very good. :2thumbs: I know I couldn't do that.
Thank you, but trust me if I can do it you can too, I had lots of help from people telling me where and how to measure. If you can weld, even half ass, then you too can do it, I'm not a great welder and am a little worried when it comes to welding body panels, so I consider this practice till I get to that point, but I guess trunk pans are next (when I get to VA and get settled in that is)...
Quote from: ChgrSteve67 on August 21, 2007, 11:08:33 PM
WOW great job!
Honestly don't think I would attempt such a challenge.
Steve
Make sure you buy a BIG scrap book and document your work.
Its going to be unbelievable.
Thank you Steve, I do have a ton of pictures on my computer (man I hope my hard drive doesn't crash LOL)
Get you some 2 or 4 gig flash drives and use those for backups.
They are dirt cheep these days and fit great in a safety deposit box.
Quote from: ChgrSteve67 on August 21, 2007, 11:22:02 PM
Get you some 2 or 4 gig flash drives and use those for backups.
They are dirt cheep these days and fit great in a safety deposit box.
I'm a computer tech and have three DVD/RW's on this computer, so you'd think I'd have no problem backing stuff up :icon_smile_big: just plain lazy I guess :yesnod:
Absolutely wonderful job, you are doing great. Kudos to your courage to tackle such a big task. Awesome!!!!! Keep it up, the whole job is just one step after the other. You have started with the hardest part and conquered it. You are the man.
Steve
Thank you, I anguished over the first weld for quite some time then decided I had asked enough question and just needed to do it. I think it turned out well. Thank you again.
Awesome work Airborne. This is a big step. So how are things down that way? Hope it isn't too bad for ya. So when are you moving away?
Thank you Charger 74, yeah it was a big step that took a long time to take, anyway, it is done. Things down here are drying out, we will be leaving one week from today.
I haven't been on here for quite a while. I'm glad to see you got started on it. Good luck with it.
Adam
Awesome job! Its a great start. I can't wait to get into my car and do the floorboards and trunk. My welding skills suck to so it should be interesting. The pictures are great. I hope you get a nice garage. Thats the only thing I am worrying about when I buy my next house.
Make SURE you put together a scrap book when you go to shows...NO ONE would believe it
Did you make the move Yet? Any progress/update? Congratulations on getting the frame rails in. :2thumbs: LEON
Nice work!
Havent seen this tread before, and know i fully understand why everybody has the opinion they have about HLPAG. I saw "shot on sight", and "law-suit" earlier!! :2thumbs:
At some point they will do it to the wrong person, and then................ :flame:
Hey Silva...any updates? I just noticed the piece of wood in the springs on the 1st photo :smilielol:
:popcrn: :popcrn:
Anybody home :scratchchin: :shruggy:
i m curious to see how the work is comming along as well.
This car is an inspiration and gives me hope for when I start mine. Please post updates. :drool5:
hi silva,been following this thread a while now,like you i also got burned buying my '68 rt off ebay.was wanting to import my own into the uk,found one that looked just the ticket advertised as wanting a few welding repairs to the floor,front and rear frame rails the pictures of the best parts were taken and looked great !so i thought thats the one for me!!so put in a bid and finally won the car for $8800 which i think was about 5000 English pounds at the time.got the shipping organized and took two months to finally arrive(think hurricane katrina was going on at the time).when it finally arrived at my door i was devastated to say the least,frame rails were like yours,no floors at all,inner rockers,outer rockers,front torque box all rotted badly...did not know what to do so just put it in the garage and left it while desiding what to do :brickwall:.finally plucked the courage up and started cutting and welding spent a fortune with year one,and she finally started coming together,been at her for 2 years now and last peice of welding was completed this week,thought it would be the death of me early on but she finally come together,just the motor and bodywork to sort out now.
trust me your doing the right thing,just stick at it and it will come together,also when your finished your welding skills will be outstanding.double bonus... :2thumbs:
Quote from: ray on January 08, 2008, 02:01:31 PM
hi silva,been following this thread a while now,like you i also got burned buying my '68 rt off ebay.was wanting to import my own into the uk,found one that looked just the ticket advertised as wanting a few welding repairs to the floor,front and rear frame rails the pictures of the best parts were taken and looked great !so i thought thats the one for me!!so put in a bid and finally won the car for $8800 which i think was about 5000 English pounds at the time.got the shipping organized and took two months to finally arrive(think hurricane katrina was going on at the time).when it finally arrived at my door i was devastated to say the least,frame rails were like yours,no floors at all,inner rockers,outer rockers,front torque box all rotted badly...did not know what to do so just put it in the garage and left it while desiding what to do :brickwall:.finally plucked the courage up and started cutting and welding spent a fortune with year one,and she finally started coming together,been at her for 2 years now and last peice of welding was completed this week,thought it would be the death of me early on but she finally come together,just the motor and bodywork to sort out now.
trust me your doing the right thing,just stick at it and it will come together,also when your finished your welding skills will be outstanding.double bonus... :2thumbs:
Welcome and pics of your project please. :2thumbs: in a new thread of course. :icon_smile_big:
hello & welcome :wave: ( RAY)
love to see pictures of your charger also :popcrn: ............................ :2thumbs:
Quote from: hemi-hampton on November 26, 2007, 12:46:04 AM
Anybody home :scratchchin: :shruggy:
I think he gave up on the car, put it on a tow truck, went to HLPAG, unhooked the cables, put the deck of the truck up and pushed it through their front window into their "showroom" :smilielol: :smilielol:
he was last active today, so it's pretty odd that there's no update in this thread.
Quote from: Hemidog on January 10, 2008, 06:39:50 PM
he was last active today, so it's pretty odd that there's no update in this thread.
Look at me though, I'm on ALMOST EVERYDAY but do you see updates on my resto thread...not that much :Twocents:
Do you have any?
Quote from: 69bronzeT5 on January 08, 2008, 04:49:06 PM
Quote from: hemi-hampton on November 26, 2007, 12:46:04 AM
Anybody home :scratchchin: :shruggy:
I think he gave up on the car, put it on a tow truck, went to HLPAG, unhooked the cables, put the deck of the truck up and pushed it through their front window into their "showroom" :smilielol: :smilielol:
They'd have more window than car to sweep up if that's true.
Give Silva a break guys....
He did a great job so far but not everybody has time to do a 5 month resto job. I'm pretty sure he'll hang in there and post some pics when he get's along.....
wonder what happened to AirborneSilvas Charger, any updates??
CB
Quote from: CB on August 01, 2008, 03:32:50 PM
wonder what happened to AirborneSilvas Charger, any updates??
CB
yeah was wondering also :yesnod: ...prolly still welding & grinding .... love to see some progress pictures though :popcrn: ...
I know Tony and the Mrs. moved to the DC area a little while ago, he was last active July 15th. DC is a very busy place(kind of from the NOVA area myself, my entire family lives there)) and with the move and trying to adapt to that culture(meaning hustle and bustle) can be very tiring I imagine. I hope they are doing well and are adjusting to the new lifestyle of the busy DELMARVA area.
Just like everyone, we all get busy at times and this might be a little lower on the list of things to do when life happens. I'm just glad I always have this place to come back to, it's like an old friend, well 5600 of them anyway. :icon_smile_big:
Here's to the Silva's :cheers:
v/r
Mike
:popcrn:..........maybe he sold it :scratchchin:
Hi Guys,
No I have not sold my Charger, Mike is right, the Mrs. and I moved from Arizona to the DC area, NOVA which stands for Northern Virginia - Annandale to be exact. The short answer is that my Charger is stuck in Arizona, the long answer is that while the Mrs. and I are making more money then we ever have the cost of living here is so ridicules that I can not afford to get my Charger here (and people think living in Hawaii is expensive - not compared to this place!!). The command that I work for (I am an Army Civilian), is slated to move to San Antonio Texas in the within the next 1 to 2 years and some could be going as soon as within the next 6 to 9 months. I am going to try to be one of the first to get out of there, then I should be able to get my Charger and start working on her. Well that is the long and short of it. I do appreciate your guys interest as well as encouragement, just keep happy thoughts that I can get to Texas soon...
HEy, I'll kep my fingers crossed. For you and your project! :2thumbs:
CB
D.C :eek2:
Don't be hating on D C.
Actually it's not all that bad living here, if it weren't so damn expensive!!!!! A few years ago my wife said she wanted to work at the pentagon, I told her no way, well a few years later here we are and if the cost of living was, well, liveable I wouldn't mind staying here for a few years (but only a few then back to Hawaii), but like I said in an earlier post we make pretty damn good money but out of each pay check after paying the bills I have btween $150 and $180 bucks for gas (and we all know how much that costs), and any other incidentals (like medicine - I am getting older), so by the time the next pay day comes around I am close to $0.00 and that SUCKS! No money left for the Charger or for my Hemi Ram..
Quote from: AirborneSilva on August 02, 2008, 09:56:15 AM
the cost of living here is so ridicules that I can not afford to get my Charger here (and people think living in Hawaii is expensive - not compared to this place!!).
Welcome to the east coast. :pity:
D.C. is right up there for cost of living, as is any big east coast city. Think NYC, Boston, Philly,
I hope it works out for you and you get back to where its affordable. But really, is Hawaii that much cheaper then DC ?
I lived in Hawaii for 13 years and made no where near what the wife and I are making now and did just fine, had money to play and to put into my toys. We talk to friends in Hawaii regularly and gas there (on Oahu), and gas there is about the same as it is here, housing is cheaper, food prices are about the same, but you have no heating or cooling bills and that's close to $200 a month - so yeah, it is cheaper to live in hawaii then to live the the DC area.
I sent you a PM about your Charger project. I did basically the same thing, and even did a rocker replacement too. Check out my site and it'll show you that even regular guys like us can indeed, do this type of work. :2thumbs:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/3060875
Cheers :cheers:
Hey Dave, thank you for the reply and I did a quick look see at your website but promise to give it a good look over later (after the honey do's are done). Yeah I think that if we take our time and ask the right questions we can get it done, you are living proof. I will be moving to Texas sometime within the next 12 to 18 months and will be able to get my Charger then and start working on her.
Thanks,
Tony
Hey Silva, I'm in San Antonio. Do you know where you will be yet? I am on the NE side. I have lived here since '82. Give me a call when you get settled in. I can help you get familiarized with the new town and give you a heads up on waht or where to avoid. You will like SA as far as cost of living goes, but it is friggin hot here.
1fast charger, thank you. I will not be there until next summer, wish we were going sooner! I don't have a clue when we will be moving there other then "next summer" is what my command is telling us. I don't mind the heat too much, I grew up in the central valley of cali where it gets 110-115 all the time (with no humidity of course), and my A/C works great in my dodge Ram Hemi :yesnod:... We will have to stay in touch so I will have a ready made friend and fellow MOPAR man when I get there.
Thanks,
Tony
There's No rust, There's nothing left to rust!!!!!
:rotz:
Quote from: AirborneSilva on October 02, 2005, 06:58:42 AM
Here are some pictures of my Charger that HLPAG lied lke a mo fo on their e-bay add on. Also is a direct quote from the add. I have plenty of other pics of rusted areas and or damage that they failed to mention and that their strategicly (spelling) taken pictures failed to show, but don't want to bore anyone to death..
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b181/AirborneSilva/charger%20damage/DSC00198.jpg)
Tony, don't know you but I have repaired cars like yours in the past by myself...It can be done..Bout the only advise I can offer would be the fact that try not to look at how much is left to go, but how much you get done at a time. Before you know it, it will be to the point to where you kinda "Try and forget" how bad it was in the beginning...Just remember when a car is fixed from this state of disrepair, there's no better feeling than seeing the eyes of those who wrote that poor Charger off...With AMD now on board, there isn't a car out there that can't be saved with enough time, money, and patience...There comes a time when you are in so deep that it really doesn't matter how much you have in the car, you'll never recoup the "Investment"...Afterall, I know you didn't want to spend the next 4 years working on your dream car, but in the end, I don't think you bought the car looking to try and recoup your investment anyway so have fun and if there's anything I can do to try and help out, feel free to ask brother...If you do pull this off, it will be a huge feather in your cap...
This threads over 2 years old. Where'd airbornesilva go :shruggy: LEON.
Thats a shame Hlpag should be put out of business. Thats what I cant stand is a crooked operation like that. :flame:
Quote from: hemi-hampton on November 10, 2010, 09:53:16 PM
This threads over 2 years old. Where'd airbornesilva go :shruggy: LEON.
I was wondering the same, he hasn't posted in several months. :shruggy:
Cooter, thank you for the kind words. Long story short - the car is in Arizona and I'm in San Antonio Texas (by way of DC), anyway after my Mom's passing less than two months ago I have decided in her honor I am going to sell this 69 R/T and get a 68 R/T which is the first car I ever owned and was bought from her after a bit of talking.
Quote from: Cooter on November 10, 2010, 09:24:35 PM
Tony, don't know you but I have repaired cars like yours in the past by myself...It can be done..Bout the only advise I can offer would be the fact that try not to look at how much is left to go, but how much you get done at a time. Before you know it, it will be to the point to where you kinda "Try and forget" how bad it was in the beginning...Just remember when a car is fixed from this state of disrepair, there's no better feeling than seeing the eyes of those who wrote that poor Charger off...With AMD now on board, there isn't a car out there that can't be saved with enough time, money, and patience...There comes a time when you are in so deep that it really doesn't matter how much you have in the car, you'll never recoup the "Investment"...Afterall, I know you didn't want to spend the next 4 years working on your dream car, but in the end, I don't think you bought the car looking to try and recoup your investment anyway so have fun and if there's anything I can do to try and help out, feel free to ask brother...If you do pull this off, it will be a huge feather in your cap...
Thank you guys for the posts, I am still here and have lurked around the forum from time to time just haven't made any posts.
I do believe that HLPAG has been put out of business, well under that name anyway. The last time I looked for them they were gone, hopefully for good but crooks like them usually just change their name and keep on screwing people!
hey nice to hear from you ABS :cheers: sorry to hear about your mom , how much have you got done on the 69 :scratchchin: :popcrn:
I'm really curious about the progress indeed.
And if you're planning to sell it, really like to see what state the car is 1 at this time.
A word of advice on your next Charger purchase; don't buy it from Hans. :D
Thank you tan top, She was a good mother!
the only thing I've really done to the 69 is section in the rear frame rails, that's all I could get done before I had to leave Arizona for DC. Now I'm in San Antonio so the Charger is still a few hundred miles away. I need to talk to the friend who is storing it for me and get it on craigs list or something.
Patrick, I haven't seen the car in three years now but it's sitting in Arizona so I think it hasn't gotten any worse - and it really couldn't :shruggy:
bull.... Great advice! The next Charger I will physicaly put my hands on it and not just trust pictures and some clown over the phone telling me lies!
Quote from: AirborneSilva on November 12, 2010, 09:50:59 PM
Thank you tan top, She was a good mother!
the only thing I've really done to the 69 is section in the rear frame rails, that's all I could get done before I had to leave Arizona for DC. Now I'm in San Antonio so the Charger is still a few hundred miles away. I need to talk to the friend who is storing it for me and get it on craigs list or something.
Patrick, I haven't seen the car in three years now but it's sitting in Arizona so I think it hasn't gotten any worse - and it really couldn't :shruggy:
bull.... Great advice! The next Charger I will physicaly put my hands on it and not just trust pictures and some clown over the phone telling me lies!
Thanks for respond....guessing it would be to much and to hard work for me, and then I would be in over my head.
You're welcome Patrick... Yeah there's a boat load of work that needs to be done and it's not anything I really want to, nor did I bargain for. Like one of you said, with AMD in the picture now it is do-able if you have the know how and/or cash.
http://www.truemusclecars.com/ He He :popcrn:
Quote from: Iceyone on November 19, 2010, 10:03:45 PM
http://www.truemusclecars.com/ He He :popcrn:
What did he do? found a stash somewhere.
Or is this somewhat similar like what this postings are about?
This is the guy this posting is all about. I would expect a $40K car to not be missing the simple things such as wheel lip moldings and consoles.
Quote from: Iceyone on November 20, 2010, 10:08:18 PM
This is the guy this posting is all about. I would expect a $40K car to not be missing the simple things such as wheel lip moldings and consoles.
So that's good ole hans site? I knew that scumbag would come back under a different name and continue to rip unsuspecting people off! Thanks for the link, I will definetly steer clear of that one!!!!
Quote from: Iceyone on November 20, 2010, 10:08:18 PM
This is the guy this posting is all about. I would expect a $40K car to not be missing the simple things such as wheel lip moldings and consoles.
Think you would go and see and then decide to buy.....
Maybe a smooth talker!
Quote from: PatrickPeeters on November 21, 2010, 02:02:54 PM
Quote from: Iceyone on November 20, 2010, 10:08:18 PM
This is the guy this posting is all about. I would expect a $40K car to not be missing the simple things such as wheel lip moldings and consoles.
Think you would go and see and then decide to buy.....
Maybe a smooth talker!
He's not a smooth talker, he's an out and out liar!!!
HLPAG,
enough said you got screwed and he has screwed alot of other people tooo.buyer beware
Please forgive me on this, but what is HLPAG?
type it in the search block here and you'll get a ton of info or
you can google it. either way it comes up the same. BAD.
http://www.google.com/search?q=hlpag&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-US&ie=utf8&oe=utf8
HLPAG= Hans Luedtke Performance Auto Group or something like that. Goes by different names as well.(like that true muscle cars link above)
Wow... I am glad I passed on buying anything from that place.
yeah it's been a nightmare, I just sold it for a large loss. I just don't have the skills, time or money to do the job. it was suppose to be an "easy father son project" - yeah right. When I called to ask the crook questions about the car good ole oscar lied through his teeth about everything :flame:
Really sorry to hear about this. Can't believe the had the nerve to ask $5000 for that! I'v heard stories about these guys for quite a long time...