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Well...my son has a "new" car.

(http://i.imgur.com/ftJUaknh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/ftJUakn)

This is the good side. The tops of the fenders are gone and the rockers aren't far behind them. The interior is surprisingly respectable and needs very little. The dash is almost perfect, as is the steering wheel. The slant 6 smoked like a fiend when we test drove it in July, but driving it home it was fine.  The push-button auto works flawlessly but the parking brake release needs work. Where it matters it isn't rusty, the torsion bar mounts are perfect and the rear-spring section is fine as well, even the trunk and floors are fine.  Now the real work begins and....he's working fast food to pay for it (well....most of it). 

Nice ride! good luck with it, hopefully it becomes an enjoyable project for your son... if your not already there, find your way to the Forward Look web forum and Forward Look Facebook pages for help/guidance/parts/etc


Mike

Neato. Don't see the Seneca often enough.  :2thumbs:

We drove it home without a problem, ran shockingly well.  Needed to put some gas in it so added 10-gallons.  Twenty minutes later, at a friends house it died.  The fuel filter was plugged full of crap. We cleaned it and then tried it, nothing.  Pulled the fuel pump and then blew air back into the tank to clear it. Reassembled it and it ran long enough to get it home.  My first thought was to add a fuel filter in front of the fuel pump as a short-term fix but eventually I suspect that we'll need to drop the tank and clean it out.  The joys of really-old cars.

DAYCLONA: Appreciate the info on the Forward Look web-page. I assume your daughter's '61 Plymouth has necessitated a few visits already?

WOW!  COOL CAR!!!   Love those really old Mopars!  Nice change to see them these days!


Todd

I'm not big fan of 60/64 Mopars ( actually any of the big three where I could include 59s ) with some exceptions like this or 300 62.. althought I preffer the Phoenix being hardtop. A friend of mine got one in Venezuela with 318A.

Thanks for posting.  Neat car.  Please keep us updated about it.

Gladly, as I'll have lots of questions.  Headed back on the road today, so... my boy's going to have to wait for a bit for the next part of this adventure. Anybody here know where we might find some fenders for this old dog? The rest shouldnt be too-big of a deal.

 :coolgleamA: :2thumbs:

Love it.

Cool project. I like the back end of them. Have fun with it. Drive it while you collect parts.

For fenders or any parts try "Big M" in CA. I have bought several things from him and he is very reasonable and fair. He's in it because he loves FL cars and it shows. :icon_smile_cool:

271 N 7th St, Williams, CA 95987 · (530) 473-2225

Mike: Thank you, Ill give the Big M folks a call.

:popcrn::  :2thumbs:  In the late 70es my grandma in Gresham or. had a sweet lite blue phoenix with duel pipes an chrome rims next door.


      parts----------   Dessert valley auto   Arizona           Wild cat auto   Oregon           should be some in dry state near you ??  DJ,Oregon 


   my dad had 57 ply 2 dr an 3 59 ply ht an 2 wagons...  friend just got a 61 300 with cross ram,its big an red    :2thumbs:

I've been to Desert Valley but had forgotten the name. Thanks for that one. Oregon is dry somewhere?  The Phoenix is clearly much nicer, but the one I really liked was the 1960 Matador. Stunning Forward Look car.

Djcarguy:  Thank you so-much for the suggestion  of Wildcat.   Their selection of parts for this project will likely be a huge help.

QuoteI'm not big fan of 60/64 Mopars

Oh, Nacho    :rotz:   Fail. 

61 Chrysler Newport 2 door hardtop. Sweetest looking car ever made inside and out.

Let the arguments begin!

I had the same fuel issues in my '55 Plymouth when I bought it. It's been fine since spring when I last had to blow out the fuel lines. I was replacing fuel filters about every other time I drove it for a while. Not because the car would die, but just to be on the safe side. It's been on the same filter since before the Carlisle show and it's running fine. However, I'll probably still yank the tank and send it out for restoration.

Good luck with the car. I had a '59 Coronet back in the mid-'70s. It was a bugger finding parts for that before the internet and I didn't even know that Hemmings existed.

Quote from: RallyeMike on November 06, 2019, 08:57:33 PM

QuoteI'm not big fan of 60/64 Mopars

Oh, Nacho    :rotz:   Fail. 

61 Chrysler Newport 2 door hardtop. Sweetest looking car ever made inside and out.

Let the arguments begin!

as mentioned, not big fan but not that I hate them LOL. With some exceptions. The example you posted, preffer a 62 ( just like the 300 ) with tails reminiscenses.  I don't like those huge angled tails. Is just like chebbyes: I hate the 59/60 Impala/Belair for similar reasons. In fact I think all brands 60/64 period don't have a place in my taste. In some cases even 59s

I like of course as mentioned the 60 Dart/Polara series

You mean like these?

(http://i.imgur.com/6pnOeCPh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/6pnOeCP)

even the interior is pretty gaudy for a "stripper" (ie. low-end) car.

(http://i.imgur.com/1zlA5gxh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/1zlA5gx)

Check-out the Pine Tree deodorizers (remember those?)  My son doesn't think it smells quite right (a little white vingar and water, along with some Febreze should handle that nicely)

But then...there's the rust....

(http://i.imgur.com/u4icTFJh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/u4icTFJ)

and that's from a relatively-dry Colorado climate! These cars really didn't have any corrosion protection to speak of.  Thank goodness I've located a good source of parts and sheet-metal.

(http://i.imgur.com/LNSzRL4h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/LNSzRL4)

Now all it takes is time (and money).

I think your'e way ahead needing to do rust and sheet metal work than finding interior parts (if you want to keep it stock). Looks good in that department.

Rebuilt the fuel pump, drained out the bad fuel from the tank, installed a nice big filter in front of the fuel pump and got her going!  Wish he'd get a haircut.


(http://i.imgur.com/VyTscFSh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/VyTscFS)

A gift from Mom (a visit to Grease-monkey). I'd of rather done it the old-fashioned way, but my time at home draws short. Flying out tomorrow again.

(http://i.imgur.com/3jpjehDh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/3jpjehD)

Make sure he's up to speed on the importance of checking / maintaining a single master cylinder brake system! Those things still scare me.

They scare me too. The plan is for a disc brake conversion.

Yeah, I'd worry more about the brakes than a haircut. :cheers:

There is a significant list of things to be concerned about. The taillights stay on, draining the battery. The windshield wipers work intermittently,  it runs a scoush warm, the carb needs a rebuild (accelerator pump issues and it won't hold fuel for easy restarts), the radio doesn't work, etc. You know....60-year old car problems.  Much like 50-year old car problems.

This will help with all the old crusty electrical connections: http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,70039.0.html

B5 blue:  Thankyou for that one. Dealing with insurance on it today. American Collector's  is dirt cheap but he can't drive it until he's 21.

My son is chomping at the bit to get this car on the road. However, he's finally realizing just how much that entails.  I've bent the rules a little to allow for some very limited on-road activities, but the window for that has now closed. Insurance and registration is the next financial hurdle for him and he's figuring out just how hard that is to do on a fast-food job budget.  It is so-temping to just step in and fix it all for him (both mechanically and financially), but that destroys the opportunity to learn the real lessons that count here.  It's likely going to be sitting for a while now.  

(http://i.imgur.com/PDz1jqHh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/PDz1jqH)

Since "B" bodies officially began production in 1962, what is this unit? I know the chassis was derived from a Plymouth design. What did they call the various body lines in the late 1950s?

sorry if is not easy to read but had to reduce the image to upload it. They simply were splitted into small and large bodies. But by 60/61, it was just one plattform for every Mopar made but Imperials ( which it was chassis yet ) and the brand new Valiant

Nacho R/T74:  Most excellent! Thank you. So....not a B-body, a pre-B body but still considered a "standard" size.  Not overly heavy but...certainly not "light" either.

Also,  I didn't realize that there were 3 B-body variants. Neat.

Just watched this episode of Gomer Pyle.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrKXQ3Qmq5o

Quote from: lloyd3 on November 12, 2019, 09:15:59 AM
There is a significant list of things to be concerned about. The taillights stay on, draining the battery. The windshield wipers work intermittently,  it runs a scoush warm, the carb needs a rebuild (accelerator pump issues and it won't hold fuel for easy restarts), the radio doesn't work, etc. You know....60-year old car problems.  Much like 50-year old car problems.

get some deox electrical goo clean an coat all contacts an grounds?  wd40 lube brake pedal an brake lite switch? clean fuse box?tooo?

Quote from: lloyd3 on November 17, 2019, 03:03:43 PM
Nacho R/T74:  Most excellent! Thank you. So....not a B-body, a pre-B body but still considered a "standard" size.  Not overly heavy but...certainly not "light" either.

Also,  I didn't realize that there were 3 B-body variants. Neat.

I wouldn't say Pre B body or Standard size on this first unybody launch. It's an unique unibody option. Actually I think the difference between the Dart and the Polara series on 60/61 Dodges is the wheelbase. Must be something similar with Chryslers.

Oh and yes, 3 B bodies matching with the Coronets/Belvederes generations, althought some ppl consider the 73 and lates as a 3rd and a half generation due the isolation setup added on these

We've had quite the education on long-nose and short-nose starters lately. Ebay seems to have what you need until you realize that many (if not most) sellers don't really know exactly what they have.  The hard lesson for my son about all of that is the money lost on the shipping stuff back and forth.  He's also had a hard time waiting for me to get home and freed-up from chores to work on the car with him, so he often proceeds without me. That is good in that he's learning alot.  The bad news is the law of unintended consequences keeps rearing it's ugly head.  I keep telling him that progress must be very deliberate, that you don't want to introduce any more variables than necessary as you go through things.  It's a process, I suppose.  He wont have his licence until next March and much needs to be done before then.

While he's chomping at the bit get him to check out this sight:  http://www.bcae1.com   It's got great explanations and interactive schematics that allow component's values to be changed. (Like ever wonder how large a speaker wire really needs to be?)  :2thumbs:

This car has a pretty archaic braking system (single master cylinder, duel wheel-cylinders). It works, but... not up to what it needs to be to compete with modern traffic. I've researched some of the disc brake conversion kits and am trying to decide which one to focus on. Has anybody here already done this on a car from this period? None of it is cheap, obviously, and most of it will require some modifications on the firewall for mounting the new master cylinder. Is plug and play to much to hope for here?

Quote from: lloyd3 on December 06, 2019, 04:50:20 PM
This car has a pretty archaic braking system (single master cylinder, duel wheel-cylinders). It works, but... not up to what it needs to be to compete with modern traffic. I've researched some of the disc brake conversion kits and am trying to decide which one to focus on. Has anybody here already done this on a car from this period? None of it is cheap, obviously, and most of it will require some modifications on the firewall for mounting the new master cylinder. Is plug and play to much to hope for here?

lloyd3,


The brake system on these cars is total crap, I'm in the same boat with my Daughter's 61 Plymouth, after a little research/discussion on what other's have done for a "bolt-on" remedy, I'm going with the bolt on Scarebird front disk swap, their brackets/Cordoba rotors and Caddy calipers, along with Pirate Jack's A body booster/master/bracket/adj PV system to eliminate the single pot set up...

The rear brakes/axle are a nightmare as well as far as service/parts... much easier to swap in a 70-74 E body rear end for easily serviceable drums/parts or future rear disc brake swap

Mike

Mike:

What a great suggestion, thank you! Exactly what I was looking for.  I was flailing about and couldn't focus enough undistracted time on the subject. I also know just enough to be dangerous. Much appreciated!!!

My son and I got the single barrel Carter BBS carb rebuilt and back on the car and the little slant 6 is now purring like a kitten. It had clearly been worked on before and that individual got a few things wrong that we corrected.  Question: still a little hesitation coming off of idle. Don't know if it's accelerator pump travel or something else. Adjustments to the pump are limited to bending the linkage to shorten or lengthen it. I can make it travel a bit more but that hasn't been the obvious cure. Any suggestions?

Registered and titled the car today as something of a Christmas present to the boy. We then attempted to pass Colorado emissions with it. I figured it was a 50/50 chance that it would pass (it still has a somewhat smoky idle) but....they wouldn't even test it as it had an oil leak(!) if you can believe that one. Looks like it needs a new gasket on the fuel pump. We went to the NAPA store for that and a few other odds and ends and then went grocery shopping for mom.  Pretty wild parking lots everywhere we went today (December 24th!) but he and the car did just fine. On the way home, however... it stopped shifting up into 2nd and 3rd. So much for that little Christmas present!!!

Man! that's a sweet ride.

Thankyou! We've got a ways to go before it deserves that title, but...it has potential.

Well.....you can call me the King of Snake Oils now. Fairly mild weather here today (50s) and sunny with only light winds, so the boy and I went out and pulled the cover off of the old Dart.  He replaced the leaking gasket on the fuel pump and I installed the new thermostat (a 160 as it's been running a bit warm).  Got it started and then.....the snake oils came out. First was the can of Rizlone Ring-Seal (which reminded me for all the world of Motor Honey!), then we drizzled some (about a third of the bottle) of the Marvel's Mystery oil down the carb as it was at high-idle. Smoked like a fiend for all that but it settled down and seemed fine. The rest of the big bottle of Mystery Oil went into the gas tank. We then took it out and drove it around the neighborhood and let the snake oil do it's stuff.  Since the transmission has been unwilling to shift out of 1st, we just took it easy and puttered about. After about a half hour the engine smoothed out and stopped smoking (!). Even better, shortly after that the transmission started to up-shift. We took that opportunity to head off to the auto parts store for....you guessed it, more "Snake Oil"! This time it was Seafoam Trans-Tune. Added half of that 16-ounce jug to the system and set out again. We drove around a bit more and the erratic (and somewhat harsh) shifting seemed to settle down even more. Bought some gasoline (10 gallons) and headed home, where I adjusted the arm on the accelerator pump for slightly more stroke and then set the idle up just a smidgen (it was stalling occasionally when coming off idle). After that I went ahead and added the last of the Trans-Tune to the old 904 and we set back off for a few more local tours.  Net net, the car is running much more smoothly and the push-button automatic is back in service.  I'm guessing that a fluid change and a new filter is called for now?  Always more to do on these relics, eh? The next hurdle is an emission test. This time nothing is leaking.

Attaboy! Congrats to you!

We've been driving this old relic around quite a bit for the last few days. My son straightened the grill out a bit (looks like maybe an encounter with a snowdrift at sometime in it's past life?). Doesn't look quite so snaggle-toothed now.  Some real fenders would be the next image improvement.

The oil leak was finally determined to include the valve cover gasket. Finding one locally was something of a feat. Had to order one and then wait.  Another byproduct of these old cars....the wreck of the Andrea Doria doesn't leak as much fluids are this one does. Not so much leaks maybe, more like spills from the 16-year old mechanic working on it.

(http://i.imgur.com/tWnNVOhh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/tWnNVOh)

Beauty in simplicity. By a wide margin, the easiest valve cover gasket replacement I've ever participated in...

(http://i.imgur.com/iFqHQCEh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/iFqHQCE)

The next project will be to get the radiator boiled and rodded-out. It's clearly not cooling adequately. This copper unit has aged fairly gracefully and I can't see any bad spots, but who knows?  

From looking at this photo, does the engine look like its been run hot for a long time? It sure does to me or...is that just 60 years of grime? I don't suppose that there is yet another "snake oil" that I can add to the crankcase to clean it up a bit?  One sees lots of stuff on YouTube about ATF?

Quote from: lloyd3 on January 07, 2020, 09:22:39 AM


From looking at this photo, does the engine look like its been run hot for a long time? It sure does to me or...is that just 60 years of grime? I don't suppose that there is yet another "snake oil" that I can add to the crankcase to clean it up a bit?  One sees lots of stuff on YouTube about ATF?

If your looking to de-sludge the motor, the best method I've found is to do it slowly, with every oil change substitute the last qt of oil with a qt of kerosene/diesel fuel, run it for about a 1000 miles, don't rush the process as it will really load up the pan/oil pick up/filter with sludge, your first oil/kerosene-diesel fuel/filter douche I would do at 500 miles just to see how much sludge you remove from the engine, after that 1000 mile changes, it may take a while until you start seeing clean results at oil changes to determine that you've pretty much licked the sludge issue

Mike

Seriously cool car, good luck with it : ))

Luck is always a component when dealing with a 60-year old car. Our luck sort-of ran out yesterday while on our way to get an emissions test (before the temporary tags expire here on the 21st). It has been dying at inopportune times of late and I'd figured that maybe the fuel filter that I had installed between the tank and the fuel pump was the culprit. We pulled off the cover, changed out said filter (which was full of black nasty gunk), shoveled the show out of the way and then chiseled-off the ice dam in front of it, playing musical cars first to get a clear shot down the steep and now-often icy driveway (winter sucks!). We then loaded up the dog and boy and coats and gloves and headed off.  Of course, it was starting to snow again. About 5-miles from the house it died yet again, this time in 6-lanes of combat traffic. I coached my son in the fine art of negotiating a safe way to the curb (with as few obscenities as possible). It would run after a few minutes of cranking, but only at idle so... I took the wheel and crippled it up the road to a church parking lot where we did a post mortem.  After a few minutes of listening to him speculate rather wildly about what the problem might be (you've got to learn about all this stuff somewhere, I suppose) while I blankly stared at the very simple fuel-line and carburetor set-up, it suddenly all became clear to me....fuel pump!  Called his mom to come rescue us and then began the search for the necessary part which I'll now get to install tomorrow (in a parking lot, in the snow and in 20 degree weather) because he's in school.  A Honda Civic would have been far-easier.

I'd install a small fuel cell in the trunk till you can drop that old tank for cleaning.  :scratchchin:

Well, I may need to consider that. I put a new NAPA fuel pump in it this morning (in a very cold and snow covered parking lot) and fired it up. Seemed to run fine again. Took it up to the closest emissions station and put up with that crowd for a bit (bureaucracy seems to be miserable no matter were you encounter it anymore). They even went over it with a penlight under the hood (looking for a fluid leak of some type so they could avoid testing it, like they did on the first attempt?) but in the end they tested it and .....it passed. With flying colors actually.  

Notice the sign about "friendly" service....

(http://i.imgur.com/mhCRS4Jh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/mhCRS4J)

I drove it back to where I'd fixed it earlier and exchanged it for my truck. I then drove my truck down to the county seat to get some plates for it. I presented my emissions sheet, the insurance card and the registration and asked for the standard Colorado plates (my son wants to drive it too-much for collectors plates) and the lady calmly told me that I couldn't buy plates for my son's car. That only he could make the purchase. I was dumbfounded. I loudly told her that he was 16-years old and in school where he should be and as his father, I was was the authority in his life until he turned 18. Nope, she says, it's "a security issue" and he needs to fill out a form allowing me to do it for him.  I then let her know that Colorado used to be a pretty nice place to live, but because of her county employer and local government in general, they were doing a very good job of turning Colorado into California. We now have useless pot-heads everywhere (with all the resulting crime & social tragedies), miserable traffic, soaring property inflation, and the same petty little administrative state that all the rest of the liberal utopias have. God help me, but I think that these folks need to hear some of this. They expect sheep and act accordingly. If you object they seem quite surprised by that. I didn't use any obscenities but I let them know that I resented driving down there (40 minutes in heavy traffic) and wasting my time (& a half tank of gas).  She said that they were "proud" of their service and efficiency. I told them that I thought their service was abysmal, ridiculously expensive, and unnecessarily complex.  I left and headed back home. Picked up my son and went to get his car, which then decided to fight us all the way back home by stalling every 5 minutes. It's still a fuel problem of some kind but it's now parked in my driveway and can be dealt with later.  What a day!

  When I was his age I had a 64 Nova wagon that someone put sugar in the gas tank. I got pretty good at pulling the filter off the carb for a clean out to get back on the road. The aggravation stuck with me over the years and now with modern fuels quirks it's even worse. Last year I got a sweet deal on a Yamaha TW200 with a rusty tank. Rust treatment/red liner coating and new pickup filter for the tank and it's purring.
  Look at "Marine fuel filters" they make them as large as oil filters, even have dual sets for boats.  :scratchchin:

A marine filter is exactly what I need to look into. Thank you for that.

I am discovering that Colorado has adopted the "gross emitter" designation for all pre-1981 vehicles (yet another California concept?). I started hearing this tripe when we'd go to the "new" car shows when my then 12-year old son was all revved up over seeing Ferraris and Teslas at the "car of the year" slugfest here every spring. Some hi-flash bimbo (hired by the Colorado Auto Dealers Association no-less) was near the front of the show giving the kiddies and the rest of the brainless goobers in the line the story about "how new cars are soooo much greener than old cars, and because of that we need to get all the old cars off of the road ".  I'm thinking that is why I'm getting all the resistance from the dweebs at the Air Care Colorado screening center and at the DMV. What these unelected (& brainless) bureaucrats don't get is that there are so-few of these old cars left out here, the misicule amount of emissions produced by their extremely infrequent use doesn't amount to a popcorn fart in a whirlwind.  Social justice warriors tend to piss me off anymore.

Maybe I missed it, but did you drop the tank and clean it / blow out the fuel line?
The gunk in a 60 year old tank will be endless!

Not yet. I had hoped to use a good fuel filter to keep the "gunk" at bay. What we're figuring out now is that the pick-up "sock" in the tank has deteriorated and may be the culprit. Oh well, on a brighter note we found a parts car today and only about 25-miles from the house.

(http://i.imgur.com/m6ZvUBXh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/m6ZvUBX)

Looks like hell but the fenders are actually not bad, as are the rockers and back bumper. Lots of little dash and trim parts are good as well.  Wish his had that roof-line (!). This is/was a 1960 Pioneer 2-DRHT with a 318 auto.

Great thread, Lloyd.
I'm surprised to read that they have emission testing on a car that old. California only tests cars model year 1976-2015.
Sucks to see anything CA related has infected your DMV....Nobody likes bureaucracy except the bureaucrats, right?

  Fl. use to test lights/brakes/emission but dropped it in the 70's. Va. has PIA tests for too much rust and other stuff, combined with stupid taxing system makes for odd old car/truck market. Leaks is a new one on me most old cars leak something.

They have been phasing out emissions testing in WA for the last 15 years. This year 2020 is the last year they are doing it.
The lawmakers actually listened to the logic that newer cars run so clean that there is no reason to test them, and that older car are such a small % of the total vehicle fleet miles that it does not make scientific or economic sense to test them either.

Somehow, sometimes the system actually works. Considering how blue and green things are here, it's actually quite shocking.

QuoteWhat we're figuring out now is that the pick-up "sock" in the tank has deteriorated and may be the culprit.

This was the exact culprit on my 60 Plymo.... and that was 25 years ago!

Quote from: lloyd3 on February 15, 2020, 08:11:59 PM
Not yet. I had hoped to use a good fuel filter to keep the "gunk" at bay. What we're figuring out now is that the pick-up "sock" in the tank has deteriorated and may be the culprit. Oh well, on a brighter note we found a parts car today and only about 25-miles from the house.

(http://i.imgur.com/m6ZvUBXh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/m6ZvUBX)

Looks like hell but the fenders are actually not bad, as are the rockers and back bumper. Lots of little dash and trim parts are good as well.  Wish his had that roof-line (!). This is/was a 1960 Pioneer 2-DRHT with a 318 auto.

this is maybe the one I would build being hardtop

Any tips for dealing with removal of the gas tank on this car? The straps look quite good but I didn't get a close look at the rest of it.

Love these old '60 Dodges.  My dad has quite a few of them with the Polaras being his favorite.

His website hasn't been updated in probably 7 years but you can see some of them online if you want to take a look...  www.mopardoc.com

Very neat, thank you.

If the parts car isn't too rough I agree I would fix the 2 door instead but who knows how long it sat with no windshield. Looks to have tinted side windows? AC car?

The parts car simply isn't viable.  Both are 2-doors, but the hardtop has (IMHO) much prettier lines.

Finally...a warm day to work.

(http://i.imgur.com/8et9rpzh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/8et9rpz)

(http://i.imgur.com/lLCHzLyh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/lLCHzLy)

(http://i.imgur.com/72moYyUh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/72moYyU)

Now, we just have to figure out what's next. The strap bolts were shot with penetrating oil and few days ago and came right off. We'll be able to re-use them (pretty amazing).  The metal above the tank is still shiny....go figure?

Typical of most young men, while I was researching how to safely take the float assembly out (and had told him to wait a minute) he went ahead and did it. He's mildly ADHD and doesn't listen for spit unless you get a response from your directions.  Drives me nuts sometimes. Anyway...

(http://i.imgur.com/SQS67Zbh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/SQS67Zb)

and...

(http://i.imgur.com/9XIshqqh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/9XIshqq)

There is a round piece of flat metal flopping around in the tank that isn't coming out (way to big for the only opening). You can partially see it in the open tank hole shot. The tank interior isn't pretty but I can't see why it would really be a problem. The pick-up filter was loaded with fine sediments but...not sure it was the problem either.  We'll maybe hit it with a pressure washer/car wash trip but I can't see what that will really improve.

When I had to clean the tank on my former Cuda, I threaded a length of heavy chain into it, set it on a table and shook the shit out of it on all sides. From there a bit of soapy water and a few rinses and it was pretty damn clean.

Don't lose the original lock ring the reproductions suck, are thinner and won't seal properly

have you thought on get the hardtop saved/storaged and maybe someday later build it with the one you have actually ? Being hardtop makes it more interesting if you ask me...

just of course if is not rotten and just surface rust

Any suggestions for replacing the filter on the pick-up?  I'm considering just cleaning it and figuring out how to re-use it.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-Fuel-Gas-Tank-Sending-Unit-Filter-Sock-NEW-3-8/362636173082?hash=item546eccdf1a:g:7V0AAOSw5dNWpoKF

b5blue: Wonderful, thankyou! That sure looks like it.

If you need a NEW tank and sending unit, check out Vans Auto, they manufacture a lot of tanks/sending units for Mopars mid 50's to early 60"s, as well as a host of other parts for these cars, don't go to the website as most of the older year Mopar repros are not posted/listed, call for needs....

Mike

Mike: Thank you as well. Always good to have yet another source of supply. Believe it or not, this tank cleaned up pretty respectably and won't be a problem to re-use. The real battle here seems to be an almost constant failure rate of every other system on the car that hasn't been attended to for most of it's extended existence.  Now the generator is making a racket that I suspect is the bearing. Initially, I was convinced that it was the water pump but we took the fan belt off and solved that question. In the end, we'll have had to replace almost every component to make this car viable. Sure hope your daughter is have better luck with her(your?) project.

Get some "Caig Lab's De-Ox-It D-100" for all electrical connections, it works and is harmless to plastics.
https://www.amazon.com/CAIG-LABORATORIES-D100L-25C-Contact-Cleaner/dp/B0000YH6F8
I use this at home/work.cars/motorcycle everything and this one bottle has lasted 5 years.

Quote from: lloyd3 on March 27, 2020, 02:59:37 PM
In the end, we'll have had to replace almost every component to make this car viable. Sure hope your daughter is have better luck with her project.

Lloyd,

She's been kind of lucky, just  about everything works to some degree, but the vehicle sat for some 20+ years, I replaced all the ignition and charging components to at least know what I'm dealing with age wise on the components, The carb is toast (although we did get it running) the tank/sender is next on the list, currently collecting parts for the front power disc swap, I have an 8 3/4 E body rear for an upgrade over the antiquated brake and tapered axle set up currently in it, of course all new brake lines are a must, and new tires, new radiator, 4bbl swap, etc, etc, etc you know the drill, but I was blessed with it needing no body or paint (thank god!), she still wants to change the interior over to red though, just waiting for this pandemic and summer to break...

Mike 

Mike: The paint and trim-work on that car looks great.  We have a long way to go here to look that good.  Pandemic bonding at it's finest...I guess.

b5blue: I'll get some of that cleaner. There are lots of uses for it here.

Put just a film on the metal contacts and "work it back and forth" a few times connecting. Have a wall outlet, extension cord or light bulb that is too grippy wanting to not slide, this fixes by cleaning and lube to protect.  :2thumbs:

There was a tar-soaked felt material on top of the tank when we lowered it out from under the car. Before I could stop him, my son tore it off of of the tank and disposed of it. Does anybody here know what that material was and where we might be able to secure it?

Quote from: lloyd3 on April 04, 2020, 04:35:21 PM
There was a tar-soaked felt material on top of the tank when we lowered it out from under the car. Before I could stop him, my son tore it off of of the tank and disposed of it. Does anybody here know what that material was and where we might be able to secure it?

It was for vibration/insulation from steel to steel contact, the low dollar approach is some tar roofing paper (the thicker paper .080 thick), or buy a repro from assorted vendors

Detroit Muscle Technologies (DMT) makes a pad for approx $20 but I think their earliest application is 1962 B bodies, but I'm sure it would adapt, or call to see if they have your application, Jim is always working on new products


Mike

Home Depot has sticky roof repair foil meant for sealing. (Much like DynaMat but cheaper.)

Mike: My son found the 1962 DMT Mopar version you mentioned online and ordered it. I'm sure it will adapt for our purposes.

b5blue:  the line to get into Home Depot yesterday was outrageous, so I didn't make it.  That sounds like it would of worked as well.  Thank you both for the input.

 :2thumbs: Now Walmart said 1 person per 1000 sq. ft. when full one out one in rules.

Tank is in and works good. The pad was perfect.

Have you flushed the fuel lines?

Everything in the fuel system is now copacetic. He drove it around for a little bit and then we noticed some issues with the water pump, so he got to change that out yesterday.  He's getting quite the education of late.  It snowed today so no car work for the next few.

Mr. Musto: I can see what you mean about Vans Auto. They have some pretty obscure parts options. I'd never heard of them before this. Good suggestion.

Big day here today. We've evidently solved the fuel issues, and the carburetor issues, and the cooling issues for the time being. So, my 16-year old took it out for a spin (even tho it's still lockdown here and it's snowing).  This has been a long time coming. Anybody here remember what it's like to be 16 and to be separated from your car and maybe even your girl? Anyway...

(http://i.imgur.com/v8VqAr3h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/v8VqAr3)

(http://i.imgur.com/B16N4vkh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/B16N4vk)

and, his car wasn't the only old turkey on the road today.

(http://i.imgur.com/NBE3lWZh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/NBE3lWZ)

Sweet!  :2thumbs:

Quote from: lloyd3 on April 13, 2020, 03:45:16 PM
Big day here today. We've evidently solved the fuel issues, and the carburetor issues, and the cooling issues for the time being. So, my 16-year old took it out for a spin (even tho it's still lockdown here and it's snowing).  This has been a long time coming. Anybody here remember what it's like to be 16 and to be separated from your car and maybe even your girl? Anyway...


(http://i.imgur.com/B16N4vkh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/B16N4vk)

Wow! love that interior shot!!

This darn slant six still runs warm. Boiled and rodded-out the stock radiator, replaced the water pump and replaced the thermostat but... still having fairly wild temperature swings.  What am I missing?

My Cherokee had a rouge temp sender in the head. Found by using a laser pointing temp. gun. Gauge creeped up to way hot but gun showed all was fine.

While I don't have a lot of faith in the temperature gauge in this car, it is clearly getting warmer than the 180-degree thermostat should allow for. The (aftermarket) gauge is indicating a gradual increase to about 250 degrees Fahrenheit and it then starts to puke fluid.  If you run the heater it seems to behave better and for longer but still does eventually overheat. This is clearly the stock and original radiator and from experience, it should be more than adequate. I've never had a heating problem with a 6 before, ever, so this one doesn't make much sense to me. It's not running lean and I can see good flow though the radiator when the thermostat opens. The radiator cap is ancient and maybe it needs replaced as well but... these older system were never very high-pressure in my memory of them. About the only thing I can think to do now is go with a bigger radiator?  In the old days I'd just head over to the local boneyard and get a V-8 model unit but that's not so easy anymore.

Bingo replace the cap! I don't let my cap age over 5 years. (Come on it's 3.99.  :lol:) The 15.00 temp gun allows checking for blockage in cooling also. Consider flushing with a chelating agent like "Fleetguard Restore Plus".

Unsoldered a tank and rodded it?  How bad was it?  If that's all good, maybe a high flow thermostat.  Made a big difference on my 383.

Quote from: lloyd3 on April 26, 2020, 04:50:50 PM
While I don't have a lot of faith in the temperature gauge in this car, it is clearly getting warmer than the 180-degree thermostat should allow for. The (aftermarket) gauge is indicating a gradual increase to about 250 degrees Fahrenheit and it then starts to puke fluid.  If you run the heater it seems to behave better and for longer but still does eventually overheat. This is clearly the stock and original radiator and from experience, it should be more than adequate. I've never had a heating problem with a 6 before, ever, so this one doesn't make much sense to me. It's not running lean and I can see good flow though the radiator when the thermostat opens. The radiator cap is ancient and maybe it needs replaced as well but... these older system were never very high-pressure in my memory of them. About the only thing I can think to do now is go with a bigger radiator?  In the old days I'd just head over to the local boneyard and get a V-8 model unit but that's not so easy anymore.

I'll give you an "Old school/shade tree" mechanical suggestion, costs no money, you can use the old radiator cap or the new one, doesn't matter, try to have the water/antifreeze about 1" below the neck, put the cap on, but don't tighten it, back it off so that the tangs are holding it on, but it's loose not sealing, run/rev the motor up when warm/thermostats open, let the excessive fluid run out the neck and find the level it's happy running with the cap/neck venting to the atmosphere (if it does) then drive the car as you would have when it overheated before....if it does not puke/overheat, then it's time to look at a possible head gasket/cracked head/block?....does the coolant exhibit any bubbles? or an exhaust smell?


Mike

Mike:  No obvious bubbles or unusual smells, no oils or other contaminants either.  We'll pull the thermostat and leave it out for a while and replace the radiator cap.  What it does after that should identify what we're up against.

Pulled the thermostat, flushed the block completely, put everything back together added at new 13-lb cap and took it for a ride. Still running too-warm (~250).  I'm out of ideas now. Maybe a bigger radiator?

Quote from: lloyd3 on April 25, 2020, 07:04:08 PM
This darn slant six still runs warm. Boiled and rodded-out the stock radiator, replaced the water pump and replaced the thermostat but... still having fairly wild temperature swings.  What am I missing?

Did you remove the top tank and rod out the radiator?  How did it look inside?

How are you getting that reading? Could the fan be on backwards?

The fan works fine, held my hand in front of the rad to make sure it was pulling air properly. The radiator was professionally boiled and rodded out. We also pulled the lower rad hose to make sure it hadn't delaminated and failed internally....it's fine as well.

No chance the intake hose is getting sucked closed? I have a spring inside mine. Timing far advanced? Leaned out carb?  :shruggy:

Don't make any assumptions about your (new?) thermostat.  MANY of them are defective right out of the box, even the so-called high flow versions.  Check the one you have in a boiling pot of water.  Some t-stats will barely start to open up at 212*.

You might also run it with a restrictor inserted in place of the thermostat (rather than running with nothing at all) which is opened to the same diameter as your thermostat when it's wide open.  It'll take longer to warm up, but you'll be getting full coolant flow.

One more thing to consider, but not likely is I've heard of people replacing freeze plugs by hammering them inside the engine and installing a new one. They can restrict flow if they get wedged somewhere just right. But if you see good flow across the top of the radiator, that's probably not it.
My vote is the radiator, just because it was rodded doesn't mean it's as good as new.

I do enjoy this story...Old classic land yacht with a slant six, getting a new lease on life.  :2thumbs:

My boy washed his car the other day. I was surprised by how good the original paint actually looked when it isn't covered in bird poop and greasy handprints.

(http://i.imgur.com/3PbMEr3h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/3PbMEr3)

Spring is finally here for good. The other good news here is that he got hired by Home Depot last week. Progress on the car can begin again.

Quote from: hemigeno on May 02, 2020, 11:36:45 AM
Don't make any assumptions about your (new?) thermostat.  MANY of them are defective right out of the box, even the so-called high flow versions.  Check the one you have in a boiling pot of water. 

Agreed.  Reading on the web it seems the Mr Gasket ones are notorious for this.  The EMP/Stewart ones are a bit more, but no worries with mine.

Anybody here ever have any success with re-coring a radiator?  My radiator guy says he can recore with a more-densely packed unit for more heat-exchange capacity. Does that sound right?

I had one done, and yes they can ad a more efficient core, but mine cost over $300. And it still ran well above the thermostat temp of 180 idling in gear in summer.
I would see if the aftermarket makes a factory looking radiator for less $$$ if I had to do it again. This was in a big block A body and I had fan clearance to consider.

It looks really nice.  Working out the bugs is a pain in process, but satisfying when done.  Thanks for posting.

Quote from: lloyd3 on May 15, 2020, 02:15:15 PM
Anybody here ever have any success with re-coring a radiator?  My radiator guy says he can recore with a more-densely packed unit for more heat-exchange capacity. Does that sound right?

Yes it's a micro-tube core, depending on the size of the top/bottom tanks they have upwards of 6 rows available, I have a 5 row micro core stuffed into my 26 wide "factory" radiator in my wingcar, cost was about $400 to have made...


Mike

Others have sworn these were the cat's meow: http://www.speedcooling.com/26-Big-Block-Mopar-Radiator.html

Spoke with the radiator shop yesterday. They confirmed that the original unit was flowing as designed. They also want $450 to re-core the factory radiator. I told my son not to do it, that the problem had to be something else. He then pulled the head off of the 225 (a remarkably simple process by today's standards) and checked for problems. What we found was a fairly unremarkable situation (no leaks, no obvious mechanical issues, and no scored cylinders) except.... for a clearly obstructed passage in the head, caused by what appears to be an incorrect head gasket. The engine has clearly been worked on at sometime in it's past by a non-professional (imagine that one!) and it now appears that they used the wrong replacement head gasket. We'll send the head off for a service (a closer inspection, a valve grind and some new retainers) and then find the correct head gasket. Sure hope this corrects our heating issue.

(http://i.imgur.com/sROtimTh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/sROtimT)

Your son has got to love all of this really special look at the engine.  I am impressed and hope this solves the heating problem.

 :2thumbs:

This car is providing all sorts of lessons for my 16-year old.  Life lessons....like how much is too-much, what is practical, when to try it yourself and when to hire an expert. What tools do you need to own, what is safe and what is too-risky.  Also...it's a darn good thing Dad's old Honda Civic is ready to be used to go to work and go chase parts.

The adventure continues here. Spent the afternoon touring around a salvage yard east of Colorado Springs.  Little or no muscle stuff but lots of early Mopars (lots of fins!) The usual crash & bash issues (& some rust, but not as bad as expected) but still lots to work with.  I had suspected that many (if not most) of the more rural-wrecking yards are not in the digital age and I was proved right today. As you move out onto the plains where land is still dirt cheap, the yards still have lots of room and accordingly, lots of the older stuff.  Oddball stuff too, like Fraziers and Nash and Studebaker and even Hudson stuff. Quite the trek through time today.

(http://i.imgur.com/wiqLx1sh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/wiqLx1s)

a Hudson pick-up....

(http://i.imgur.com/VUmjHBEh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/VUmjHBE)

A possible reason for the heating issues on this 1st year 225. Notice the two missing holes in the old (and new) head gaskets?

(http://i.imgur.com/a9eamLkh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/a9eamLk)

To the lower left of number 3 cylinder is an obstructed water passage on the old head gasket, there is another on the lower right of number one. Both the old and the new replacement gasket have omitted this opening. We plan on drilling the new gasket to see if it helps the heating issues we've experienced with this engine.

(http://i.imgur.com/ujW5Q4uh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/ujW5Q4u)

Head work has gotten expensive. $600 to have this one one redone. Last time I was down this road was on a 1970 Super Bee. That head job was something like $350 for both 383 heads.

Going back together. My son is now learning about all the incidental costs of doing something like this and just how far his somewhat meager paycheck actually goes (after taxes). Almost everything is working out to be exactly twice as much as I remember it costing.  From gaskets to drill bits to LocTite. He had bought a torque wrench ($90) and was planning on returning it when he was done using it. As he explained it, all his "peers" at work do it. Time for both mom and dad to step in and explain why that wouldn't be happening here.  Ahhh.....life's lessons. Better to lean them now than be pulling statues down at some time in the near future.

(http://i.imgur.com/NNBQ9KSh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/NNBQ9KS)

Another lesson he might have to learn is about pushrods on old engines.  He didn't listen to me and keep track of them.

Wouldn't start, so we pulled the valve cover.  We had bent a push-rod somehow, and another had fallen out of the rocker. While turning it over to see what else might be awry, it then started, even with those two critical items missing (!). Straightened the bent one with a rubber mallet and a block of wood and reinstalled both. Let it run for a while w/o the valve cover to check everything out.  Thank God these 225s are so damn tough!  He's got an exhaust leak and even a lower rad hose leaking (assembling in a hurry and in the dark isn't recommended). Painful lessons but... good ones if they stick.

(http://i.imgur.com/6kE2ZDEh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/6kE2ZDE)

Thank you for posting all the updates. I enjoy following your progress.   :cheers:

Thanks Kern Dog. After all that it's still overheating. I'm about out of ideas.

The continuing saga....my son and I got up early Sunday and he drove the car (with me following in the pickup) 55 miles to my buddy's shop (the one with the lift).  It made it but was running poorly upon arrival. The generator was making a serious racket and it was clearly warm but...it didn't puke. The temperature gauge was hovering at 250 too so it's probably not reading accurately.  Pulled the generator and confirmed a bad bushing in the back of the unit. We also pulled a drain plug on the passenger side bottom of the engine.  Zero fluid escaped (!) until we broke through the film that had built up over the opening. My buddy then inserted a video camera probe into the opening and examined the water jacket in that area.  No obvious obstructions, which was darn good news.  My buddy also noted that the heat riser was stuck on "warm" which might also be an issue (?).

Latest discovery: In my research since delivering the car, I have also discovered to my dismay that this year of Dart has solid lifters. When we replaced the rockers on the head, I wasn't nearly as attentive to the lash as I would have otherwise been as I had presumed it to be a hydraulic lifter car. I'll pull the plugs tomorrow and scope the head from the inside. I do hope I haven't done something irreparable to anything by my sheer ignorance.  This car has far-exceeded my comfort level from the start (and on a number of levels, which is why I initially counseled against it's purchase) and we've clearly pushed beyond my mere-modicum of knowledge at this point. I'm hoping my electrical engineer (& semi-pro mechanic) friend can compensate for my now obvious shortcomings.  This car has seriously humbled me.

  Sometimes the journey is more interesting than the destination. I sunk 3K into an XJ Cherokee I bought from a friend. Finally decided to fix the A/C and the day 500.00 in new parts showed up the engine decided to pickup a mid range miss fire. (My son decided he didn't want stick shift so I just gave up on it.)
  You have uncovered an important aspect and may need to replace a few pushrods.

Well...not ready to walk away just yet. The good news is that we didn't appear to do any damage. The lash wasn't all that far-off on any of the exhaust valves and only a little snug on one intake valve. WHEW! We also compression tested it today and got somewhat mixed results. All the cylinders were in the 95-100 psi range and really didn't change much when oil was added, which surprised me.  From my reading I know that 125psi and up would be more normal/healthy. The fact that it smokes is more telling for me so... I'm going to push for a ring job anyway. We'll see if my buddy is up for that challenge.

Coming out means something different here...

(http://i.imgur.com/H93pBznh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/H93pBzn)

After a brief tidy:

(http://i.imgur.com/yuNEBIeh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/yuNEBIe)

My buddy has some really great equipment for this little job. Makes a huge difference when tackling it.

(http://i.imgur.com/NKDouqah.jpg) (https://imgur.com/NKDouqa)

First blush leaves me with this: We found a cracked exhaust manifold and a stuck heat-riser. Upon removing the freeze plugs and block-drain plug (on the passenger side of the engine) the water-jacket passages look just fine. Some buildup on the interior walls but really... nothing significant. It appears to be a typical 140k mile, 60-year old car engine and it needs rings (and little more than that, surprisingly). The recently re-done head still looks brand new and the cylinders are still at 3.40 on the nose so...not 0.010 over-bored, not scored, and not anything obviously wrong. The pan and harmonic balancer are painted a metallic green for some reason (replacements?) and the timing mark (finally found it) is wildly off (~20 degrees BTDC when number 1 is TDC). Whatever rebuilds it might of had in the past were clearly inept and thankfully...superficial at best.  My 16-year old son's been leaning on me pretty hard to go with an electronic ignition, headers, and a 4-barrel carb set-up, and... while I fully understand the motivation, I don't think I'm up to funding that one just yet (surprisingly pricey). I'll pull the parts I need tomorrow off of the donor car in the Colorado Springs junkyard (another Carter BBS in better (IE. less molested!) shape, a non-cracked exhaust manifold (w/a working heat-riser hopefully), and some throttle-linkage parts (his are abysmal). Then I'll order rings, a gasket set, hone the cylinders and put it back together.  We will inspect the timing chain and gears to see how things look first, but I'll likely go ahead and replace them anyway (my one extravagance).  If we get it up and running properly on the stock equipment, he can fund the hot rod parts later.  I'm still faced with the expense of a new wiring harness in the engine bay, a disk-brake conversion, some significant body work (better fenders are on the way), and God knows whatever else we'll likely find before we're done putting it back together.  I'm going to inspect everything for function and then clean it up, paint it all one color, and stick it back in the car. With a new temperature sending unit installed, an open heat-riser and a properly adjusted valve-train, maybe it won't be running quite as hot as we thought it was?

Well, darn it, we've got babbitt material in the pan and it didn't come from the mains or the rods. Has to be the cam, right?

Quote from: lloyd3 on March 27, 2020, 02:59:37 PM
Mike: Thank you as well. Always good to have yet another source of supply. we'll have had to replace almost every component to make this car viable. Sure hope your daughter is have better luck with her(your?) project.

Lloyd,

Sorry to hear you had to pull the motor, but it'll turn into a good project for your son to cut his teeth on, if your not going to swap the motor for a v8, and your going to repair the 6, the babbit in the pan might just be cam related if the rods/main look good, but you have it out, might as well do a general budget rings/cam/main/rod bearings/cam/etc/etc rebuild to freshen it up, I know it wasn't in the cards but you know the drill... shit happens,.... but do spend the money to have the block magnafluxed to make sure it's not cracked before dumping any coin in to it...

As far as my Daughter's car, we've replaced the gas tank/sender with repros, changed out all the fuel/brake lines for stainless, I'm currently getting an E body 8 3/4 rear ready for a swap to get rid of the 1961 pressed axle/drum dual servo from hell set up!... the power disc brake set up is next on the list, plus we just sourced some 15x7 steel wheels and new repro full dress hubcaps to upgrade from the 14's that are too small for these cars, now the kid has to come up with the cash for repro wide white walls she wants... finding a 4 barrel manifold for this poly v8 was harder than sourcing 426HEMI parts! ....dual poly 4's were dime a dozen...luckily Tony's D'Agostinos Parts had one, the kid wanted quads, but with her lead foot...uh..No!...lol!

Wish you and you son the best on your project!

Mike

Mike: Thank you. Her car will be really neat when you're done with it. 318 polys w/a stick are a great combination and I'm guessing that with a 4BBL it will be even better.  Thanks to COVID, both my buddy and I have the free time to screw with this little project now. A God-send, really, and a nice distraction for us both. My son's in school and working after now so his participation is, sadly, only peripheral. I'm hoping this engine rebuild gets this project over-the-hump, so to speak, and gives him(us) a good place to continue on from.

(http://i.imgur.com/Xl6g17ah.jpg) (https://imgur.com/Xl6g17a)

Any guess as to what the BCBCCC means? If it was a Volvo it would likely mean piston size.

(http://i.imgur.com/p23mbkjh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/p23mbkj)

Back in the yard early this morning (to avoid the heat-woke up the junkman to get in!). Got the factory (?) aluminum intake and the parts carb, linkage and a second (better?) distributor for $75. That early metallic turquoise (like the balancer pictured above) is clearly the original color we'll be needing to find for this rebuild. The exhaust manifold was cracked and the heater box was wrecked, so I'll order the re-pop one from eBay.

 Mopar blocks will sometimes display in paint/chalk the piston bore sizes in B/C/D/E/F sizes, crank journals are usually Q/P...just make sure to measure the bores/pistons and mark/return them to their designated holes, check your engine pad for any "extra" stamps that might denote various under/over bore modifications/notes when it was assembled...undersized cranks, lifters, pistons, bearings, etc can be installed from the factory

Mike

I have yet to find the pad on this engine. Below the distributor like on the v8s? I've yet to see that location mentioned in the reading I've done on the subject, such as in this article: https://www.slantsix.org/articles/dutra-blocks/slant-blocks.htm

you can allways to BLOW UP the engine ;)

(https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/9345255_f520.jpg)

more details:

https://axleaddict.com/cars/slantsix

BTW, just found this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-225-Slant-Six-Intake-Manifold-Never-Used/154055633981?hash=item23de6e6c3d:g:vO8AAOSwwDxfQX8S

Aw heck....don't let my son see that.

In Argentina Mopar guys are deep into the /6 engines, since most of the Mopars built there are /6. Maybe 80% of the old Mopars there are /6 and I have seen several on the web with blower setups.

The 4 barrels intake is a bargain! And hard to come by latelly.

Natcho: They aren't all that rare if you pony-up the usual $400 + shipping  price tag.  Then there's the cost of the 4bbl carb ($400) & the modified linkage ($50), & the modified exhaust system ($400) to justify the price of the now-necessary dual header system ($400) The costs spiral out of control very quickly for a 16-year old high-school kid who works part-time at Home Depot. All for a vehicle who's entire life-mission was to be a prudent and semi-dependable form of transport (and little more).  IF this car was even remotely "sporty" then... maybe, but as it stands now, it's a "heap" needing so many uncounted things as to even begin to resemble a safe & hopefully-viable form of transport.  The only reason the car isn't still moldering in our turnaround (after doing so for nearly 9-months now) is that my good friend and I are at loose-ends because of all the COVID horse-manure we've been forced to endure here, so he & I can now afford to waste a little time to do this little fix-up job.  Hopefully, it will be some fun for us both.

(http://i.imgur.com/KNr2O6gh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/KNr2O6g)

This aluminum intake clearly doesn't display the classic Pentastar logo anywhere. Anybody have an idea as to who might of produced this unit? In a now-defunct eBay advert, this guy implies that it is a Mopar unit designed to be used in hotter climates:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1960-Dodge-Plymouth-Aluminum-1BBL-Slant-6-Intake-Manifold-Mopar-2121675-/154012255535?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l10137.c10&nordt=true&rt=nc&orig_cvip=true

I suppose it could be OEM as there is a remnant of the original block paint color showing on the bottom.

Quote from: lloyd3 on August 25, 2020, 02:39:12 PM

This aluminum intake clearly doesn't display the classic Pentastar logo anywhere. Anybody have an idea as to who might of produced this unit? In a now-defunct eBay advert, this guy implies that it is a Mopar unit designed to be used in hotter climates:

It's an original Chrysler part, as evidenced by the "DPCD" (or is it "DCPD"???) logo embossing to the left of the part number.  That stands for Dodge Chrysler Plymoth DeSoto.  I don't think my '58 & '60 Poly manifolds had the pentastar on them, but that's going from memory.

Now - what your manifold's application was, I have no idea.  Galen's little white books don't mention that casting number, and I don't have many resources from that era.

Sorry I'm not any more help than that.

:cheers:

hemigeno: Thank you for that! Just the sort of deep institutional knowledge that I was hoping for here.

Well....using this book:

(http://i.imgur.com/ip8Lb8dh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/ip8Lb8d)

I've determined that this engine is not original to the car. It decodes to March 1, 1962.

(http://i.imgur.com/C5JgVYyh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/C5JgVYy)


No matter, really, just nice to know.

While we're waiting on a few parts, a little sheet-metal sure makes a big difference.

before...

(http://i.imgur.com/2gB1jj1h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/2gB1jj1)

after....

(http://i.imgur.com/W3XdmwKh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/W3XdmwK)

(http://i.imgur.com/9NOHWRFh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/9NOHWRF)

Those fenders were darn hard to come up with.

also....the one-year only green used on the slant 6 in 1960:

(http://i.imgur.com/9VKY1cEh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/9VKY1cE)

I took the motor mount in for color duplication at the paint shop last Friday.

The other one-year only slant 6 engine part:

(http://i.imgur.com/MaQEEmLh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/MaQEEmL)

The other lesson here has been the struggle to find parts you would otherwise think would be easy. Things like points and rings and other things that should be commonly available as they were used for over 20-years on later Dodges. Also, NAPA used to be the gold-standard for parts quality, but they're clearly competing with the lesser parts stores and have cheapened their stuff to price-match. You have to double check everything.

The fenders are a huge improvement.  :2thumbs:

The Exner era cars are awesome. :coolgleamA:

I hope to get one someday. :cheers:

The slant six didn't get hydraulic lifters until way later, sometime in the late 70s if I recall.

Thanks for posting on this.  It is a lot of fun to watch the progress.  Also fun to imagine what it must be like for you and your son.

:2thumbs:

Daytona R/T SE: Thanks, they sure do.

Kern Dog: Something like 1982 I believe.

XH29NOG: Glad you're enjoying the journey.

I've actually joined the Slant 6 forum for a little more insight into how (& where) to answer some questions and find some of these obscure parts. A little different, but interesting and extremely knowledgeable bunch of fellas there.  

Making progress...

(http://i.imgur.com/f4AcjxXh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/f4AcjxX)

Ready to install...

(http://i.imgur.com/rHPx6rLh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/rHPx6rL)

Looks great  :2thumbs:

Very nice  :2thumbs:

Thanks Guys. Good before shot...

(http://i.imgur.com/yEvlgL6h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/yEvlgL6)

Great progress. It will be a good car for him.

Looks better with eyebrows...

(http://i.imgur.com/tYtGjxKh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/tYtGjxK)

Engines need a functional transmission, so we went through this old 904. New front bushing and seals, new pan gasket and filter. Replacement parts have been a serious challenge on this project. What should fit doesn't. Fought all day to get the front pump back into this early 904. Ended up re-using the arguably original pump 0-ring as the "new" ones wouldn't fit (square versus the later oblong gasket body (post '63?) shape).

(http://i.imgur.com/pIdV7Udh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/pIdV7Ud)

My son isn't the only one learning a lot on this project....

(http://i.imgur.com/iFdkkjdh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/iFdkkjd)

Tomorrow is rewiring from the firewall up before the engine goes back in. Every time I open up a piece of toasted electrical tape, I find another potential disaster. Lord help me...

Quote from: lloyd3 on October 16, 2020, 10:00:08 PM
Replacement parts have been a serious challenge on this project. What should fit doesn't. Fought all day to get the front pump back into this early 904. Ended up re-using the arguably original pump 0-ring as the "new" ones wouldn't fit ........ Lord help me...

I feel your pain!.... it's bad enough dealing with Mopars from the late 60's to early 70's, fortunately parts are still somewhat available, however the late 50's to early 60's stuff can be a challenge though, and like any project, it's always another can of worms as you dig in....


Just an FYI, if you haven't had the "pleasure" yet of dealing with the rear pressed on drums, and or adjusting dual servo brakes, never mind finding parts... I just wrapped up the rear end swap on my Daughter 61 Belvedere just to avoid these issues, I used an 8 3/4 70-74 E body rear, complete bolt in, zero issues, leaf spring perch centers were right on the money, overall axle width is 1/2" wider than the original, you'll never notice it in the car 1/4" increase per side, plus side is readily available brake components/easy service... for now I eliminated the E brake hardware as the E brake drum is on the transmission, but should I update the tranny to a newer Chrysler unit, I'll have E brake provisions on the axle should I need them....something to consider in the future of these cars....


Up next for my Daughter and I, is the Scarebird front disc swap, I'll let you know how that goes, as I know your interested in that

mike  

Mike....thankyou.  The engine goes back in the car probably tomorrow.  If everything sorts out accordingly (leaks, carb, electrical, tranny, etc.) the Scarebird project comes soon after.  I'm hoping you'll beat us to it so I can learn from your experience. The rear axle is still down the road a bit yet.

Lloyd

it's in...

(http://i.imgur.com/iUaIudhh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/iUaIudh)

Quote from: lloyd3 on October 21, 2020, 10:25:25 PM
it's in...

(http://i.imgur.com/iUaIudhh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/iUaIudh)

Good thing because the nice weather ends tomorrow for a little while. Got the engine bay rewired (desperately needed!) and the exhaust hooked up. We then pushed it into the garage and up on the lift to torque the bolts on the torque converter

(http://i.imgur.com/9PLxNxzh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/9PLxNxz)

This unit has been converted to an internal filter (1960 904s had an external canister set-up).

(http://i.imgur.com/yJsS02Mh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/yJsS02M)

Great job, looks fantastic!  :cheers:

b5blue: Thanks.

It runs....

(http://i.imgur.com/QRjDZ2nh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/QRjDZ2n)

And very well. Smooth, quiet, no smoke, silky idle, but...it still runs warm.

Quote from: lloyd3 on October 23, 2020, 10:22:54 PM
b5blue: Thanks.

It runs....

And very well. Smooth, quiet, no smoke, silky idle, but...it still runs warm.

Did you change out the radiator/recore?.....type of thermostat? how "warm" is "warm"?

Mike

Mike: the radiator is about all that is left to replace. Everything else in the system is either new or has been completely checked out. We don't have the heater core included just yet and my son's theory is that we've short-circuited the system somehow. But...I'm not convinced. The factory gauge showed it to be in the upper end of the range after just 20-minutes of running, and the pressure (and heat) in the radiator was quite obvious. This radiator has clearly never been adequate over this car's entire life. It's been professionally rodded out and seems to flow adequately but....the engine we just rebuilt showed signs of endless overheating issues (badly sludged-up oil, burnt valves and head gasket, squeezed rings, etc.), that and the aftermarket temperature gauge in the dash makes me think it was never quite enough. There is no shroud and that 4-blade fan seems pretty anemic, but who knows? After all the work we've done so-far, I'm ready to replace it with a much bigger unit, whether aluminum or not.

Also....

(http://i.imgur.com/UrL111wh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/UrL111w)

We've looked for a replacement for the broken-out driver's side backup light since he bought it 9-months ago. We've done all the online sources we know about, and all the local wrecking yards, and have come up short. Can anybody here recommend another option? We're stumped.

Quote from: lloyd3 on October 23, 2020, 11:19:13 PM


Also....



We've looked for a replacement for the broken-out driver's side backup light since he bought it 9-months ago. We've done all the online sources we know about, and all the local wrecking yards, and have come up short. Can anybody here recommend another option? We're stumped.

Here's some on EBAY, spendy?...yes, but Christmas is coming :icon_smile_big:

Quote from: lloyd3 on October 23, 2020, 11:19:13 PM
Mike: the radiator is about all that is left to replace. Everything else in the system is either new or has been completely checked out. We don't have the heater core included just yet and my son's theory is that we've short-circuited the system somehow. But...I'm not convinced. The factory gauge showed it to be in the upper end of the range after just 20-minutes of running, and the pressure (and heat) in the radiator was quite obvious. This radiator has clearly never been adequate over this car's entire life. It's been professionally rodded out and seems to flow adequately

lloyd3, IMHO I'd dump the radiator, even if it been rodded out/flows great, there's a life expectancy metallurgically of a radiators core that they become inefficient at dissipating/transferring heat.... aluminum aftermarket units are quite affordable, unfortunately the 60-61 Mopars are neglected by the aftermarket (I'm in the same boat looking at radiators for the kids car) so it looks like either a late 50's repro or 62 B body repro is all that's out there, or a true universal aftermarket aluminum rad... you'll need to measure out what will fit/hose location

Mike

Here's a few more 60 Seneca parts listing for back up parts. the solid aluminum back up delete plates are an option if your not required to have back up lights for the 1960 model year in California? the seller of the delete plates is Chet Greenwood in RI

Mike: Wow! My son obviously needs a few tips in locating unusual parts. Thank you so much!

Winter arrived here yesterday. School closures today and darn cold. In preparation for the imminent storm, I stayed home Saturday to shut down and put away sprinkler and drip systems and prep my yard for winter. My boy went up to Boulder to put in some finishing touches on the assembly of the car. While there with my engineer buddy, they experimented with the cooling system to see if they could resolve that bedamnedable heating issue. They installed the hoses for the heater core and then replaced the thermostat with another he had laying around (from a Subaru of all things!) that fit into the opening of the casting perfectly (unlike the one-size fits all auto-parts store replacements). This thermostat has a "tickler" which evidently allows for some additional bypass of the flow regulation to allow for what...better filling? Anyway, upon re-starting, the car then violently overheated and spewed dramatically. Upon cooling down, they added in the remainder of the antifreeze fluids (that seemingly wouldn't go in before the event) and restarted it. They explained to me that it began to make the most curious (and alarming) sounds, thumping and whooshing with even pinging/cracking sounds. The temperature gauge then plummeted to the low-normal setting and the car began to run perfectly. Flows through the radiator were vigorous and "normal" for lack of a better description. They then ran it for a substantial period, even backing it out of the garage to clean up from the earlier overflow and reported no more heating issues. I'm at a loss to explain what happened, other to to guess that a "bubble" has finally passed through the system, allowing coolant to finally fill some of the more difficult sections of the water jacket to reach (?). The reported "cracking" sounds make me a little nervous, but my buddy (who's a very competent mechanic) hasn't found any issues to indicate further problems. Stable fluid levels everywhere (oil and coolant), no leaks, no bubbles in the radiator, etc. Clearly, I'm pleased but... a little perplexed. Any guesses here as to what might have happened?

Scary!!! specially because don't know what really happened!!!

how are the tail lights ? this look nice

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1960-DODGE-DART-PHOENIX-SENECA-CUSTOM-RATROD-TAIL-LIGHT-ASSEMBLY/202872480772?hash=item2f3c246404:g:JasAAOSwgPReFQzs

Nacho-RT74:  His tail-lights are pretty good, thank you!, and...they seem to be fairly easy to find. The back-up lights are a different matter and I just ponied up for a pair that Mike found.  Heck, I'm even finding replacement panels for the quarters in Canada (of all places!). I had hoped to get more done on the car this week but we haven't gotten above freezing for almost 3-days now. I'd really like to see it run at 180 degrees in person but...maybe later this week.

Well...I was out driving the Dart around Boulder yesterday with my buddy. It still has the quirk of heating up upon starting, puking, and then cooling down and running fine. Did some last minute repairs of the archaic brake and brake-light system (replaced the pressure switch on single pot reservoir and then replaced some tail-lights) and the BBS carburetor (sorted out a small leak and a check-ball failure in the accelerator pump) and then hit the road. It runs good! Smooth, quiet & cool, no smoke, smooth shifts and downshifts, no stalls, no overheating, and no electrical gremlins. Considering that literally everything under the hood has either been replaced, reworked, or rewired....that's saying something.  My present theory is that a "bubble" of-sorts forms in the head as it sits and then needs to be vented before everything settles down. We evidently haven't run it without the thermostat so that might be the next experiment. I also keep hearing about "bad" new thermostats as well, so...we'll see.

(http://i.imgur.com/3ZRBhjHh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/3ZRBhjH)

Last truly clean shot underhood?

(http://i.imgur.com/PVknI70h.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/PVknI70)

Getting all these lights to work has been a big deal...

(http://i.imgur.com/9F0koQBh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/9F0koQB)

Still need to get the headlights back in it. Winter is clearly on it's way here with lots still left to do and now...the window of easy weather to work-in is closing.

Any hope that a Forward-Look obsessed Swiss National will offer my son  too-much money to refuse on this relic?  I suppose not...

lloyd3,


Something to consider, and I've run into it in the past when dealing with vintage iron, is that the current thermostat may be installed "upside down".... I had a customer's vehicle that behaved just as you describe, I tore my hair out trying everything to no avail to prevent the very events you describe, the owner had various people attempt repairs/cures, I just kept repeating the same mistake with the thermostat the last mechanic made, installing it as I was use to doing, unfortunately it took me a while to figure out the coolant flow was reverse due to the pump design, the thermostat had to be actually flipped to function properly... so confirm your pump flow and the proper orientation of the thermostat...the vehicle I worked on had a more updated motor but the owner transferred the older pump to it to use the existing hose attachments/radiator, this changed the flow direction thru the motor...

Try running the motor with no thermostat first see what happens.... this is how I solved my dilemma

Mike

We will try that Mike, thanks.

(http://i.imgur.com/KUgiqblh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/KUgiqbl)

Finally....got her "eyes" in. Haven't made as much progress of late. Work, school, holidays, and even hunting seasons have kept everybody involved at other tasks. The heating problem seems to have fully abated without doing anything else except letting it sit and starting it occasionally. It no longer overheats and starts with barely a touch of the key these days. Currently waiting on a Tig welding repair of the front seat frame and replacing the single pot master cylinder with a more-recent two reservoir system. Christmas, of course, is the next distraction...

Lloyd3,


Considering some of the set backs with the engine, you've made good progress in short time....

Here's an upgrade I know you were interested in, front discs... here's the Scarebird kit that fits 1957-61 Dodge/Ply B bodies pn# FWD C20 retail $234 delivered kit has everything to mount your rotors/calipers, you need to purchase rotors, I recommend the Autozone Duralast 1977 Chry Cordoba units pn# 5311 $70 each, you'll need bearings, inners Autozone pn# SET17 and outers pn"SET2, and 2 seals Autozone pn# 5121, you'll need calipers Autozone Duralast pn# C269 passenger side and C258 drivers side $21 each (1990 Chevy Celebrity FWD application) the Duralast calipers and rotors were of very good quality...

Strip down the front drum backing plates from the spindle, 4 bolts of varying lengths, some castle and cottered, I replaced some with grade 8 hardware 7/16-20 as the caliper plate is thinner than the drum backing plate, you could reuse the OEM hardware if you use thick mega 1/8" thick washers on the backside of the spindle, after you mount the disc plate with the caliper mount towards the REAR of the vehicle (I recommend you put some hi temp red silicone on the backside of the caliper plate when bolting it on the spindle to prevent water from entering the backside/bearing/seal area), install the machined sleeve from the kit on the spindle (red arrow in pic) make sure it seats as far as possible, I'd recommend red loctite to prevent it from spinning in the future, even though the slip fit was tight, after that it's standard install of the rotors and calipers, note on the calipers: you need to mount the drivers side caliper C268 on the passenger side of your car and the passenger side caliper C269 on the drivers side of your car in order to have the bleeder screws mounted up high for proper bleeding, you'll need to use the spindle castle nut supplied with the kit because the OEM nut/retainer will over shoot the cotter pin hole, but DO USE your original keyed spindle outer bearing retainer washer with the new spindle castle nut... the disc set up will fit under the stock OEM 14" wheels if your running those?

As far as brake hoses, there's 3 applications depending on what you feel works best regarding travel and fixed frame bracket location: they are a 12" hose 1979-84 Buick Electra or 15" hose 1979-81 Camaro/Firebird or 17" hose 1979-85 Cadillac Eldorado...

Lloyd, the Scarebird kit was very well engineered, the plate was a beefy 1/4" thick plated steel, true bolt on, no mods or issues, just about everything needed was included...even dust caps that fit!

up next I'll be installing the 1973-76 Mopar A body Pirate Jack booster/master/PV assy retail $400 from my research it appears to be a bolt on deal...we'll see?

Total cost to get rotors/calipers hung on the front is just under $500, nice thing is you can buy it piece by piece, adding the booster along with the disc conversion as well as changing all the hard/soft lines should bring the total to $1000-$1200 to get power disc brakes on the car....

Mike  

.... Scarebird FWD C20 kit

Good information Mike, thank you. My boy needs to find a little work to help pay for the next few projects on his car. Once he's banked a little cash, the next steps can be taken.

Finally, brakes...

(http://i.imgur.com/VhaX7UJh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/VhaX7UJ)

Nothing is easy with this old 8 1/4 unit, tapered axles and all.

(http://i.imgur.com/R5oHt8ah.jpg) (https://imgur.com/R5oHt8a)

(http://i.imgur.com/VQwQYxBh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/VQwQYxB)

(http://i.imgur.com/QfyTXVKh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/QfyTXVK)

We've been busy here.  A fairly thorough re-do of the stock brake system with an upgrade of the single pot master.  The original rear axle wasn't as bad a re-do as we (I) had figured. New seals and bearings, new slaves, and a fluid change was much easier than a complete change-out would have been. Time will tell, of course, but I'm guessing a fully functional system will be a big improvement over the oil soaked mess that he had. Still figuring on a conversion to discs when funding allows for it.  Now, maybe those giant holes in the rockers and rear quarters can be addressed?

Very nice  :2thumbs:

Oh man, time to vault your garage roof!

Yeah, the low ceiling is a hindrance but...it's still darn useful. 

Big day here....my son drove his Dart to school today. A long time coming. Still lots left to do on it but.....he's finally getting to drive it. You'd think it was Christmas here last night. 

Yay! No pics?  :2thumbs:

That's awesome!! Bet he was so excited he couldn't sleep.

But did he drive it to school again today ? :icon_smile_wink:

His mom took pictures....

(http://i.imgur.com/i9zHgWzh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/i9zHgWz)

The old battery didn't make the grade this morning so.....no.  Typical old car, eh?

(http://i.imgur.com/VhKIQMeh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/VhKIQMe)

More life lessons. Old cars and very cold weather (& snow) don't mix very well. 

Much rejoicing here! The boy has a new job for the Summer at Home Depot. This will allow for ongoing work to be slightly-less subsidized by the parental units. The most recent activity was largely fine tuning the previous work done after a few highway miles had been put on it. The solid-lifter valve system needed a final adjustment and lots of little leaks needed some attention. Even a few loose and missing bolts (!) needed to be addressed before another pass through the tender mercies of the Air-Care Colorado Program emission station, this time in Boulder, Colorado (near to where the car is being worked upon). Current speculation is that exposure to such a "gross-emitter" will send many of the on-the-ground employees into a state of panic upon viewing the metal crankcase-vapor tube that discharges to the atmosphere below the engine on the passenger side of the car. Most will likely require hot coco and trauma counseling in the Safe Space Area set aside in their facility there.  Pay attention to the national news for ongoing updates...

(http://i.imgur.com/ddSUKU1h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/ddSUKU1)

One of the leaks that required a bit more follow-up was the oil pump. Upon further investigation, it was revealed that the original unit had developed some serious challenges since the initial assembly of the engine last Fall (shocking amount of wear in the lobes of the impellor due to some form of very abrasive material (!). An immediate oil change revealed fairly-dark fluids  but no obvious clues for this particular problem.) Long story-short, this necessitated the replacement of the original aluminum-bodied unit with an aftermarket, cast-iron cased version (not a high-volume unit, which was mandated by the later hydraulic lifter versions)  this was, again, not very easy to come up with. Local auto-parts stores no-longer stock such an item (how many million slant 6 motors were made over the years?) The other discovery was that the engine needed to be lifted off of the passenger-side motor mount in order to remove and then replace it. With later cars ('63 and up) that wouldn't be an issue evidently, but the '60 through '62 slants aren't nearly as cooperative.  Ma Mopar at her finest yet again.

Minor update. Had the car over to a fellow car-nut's garage (big drag racer locally, and an exceptional metal fabricator) for his input on some body repair. We looked everything over on this 1st-year unibody unit and he showed us what to cut out and where. He then suggested the process we need to use to shape and tack-in replacement metal with gauge and forming tips.  It's all new to me but he made it sound very doable.  The car is running much better after another go-through on the carb. Even simple carburetors don't do well with several amateurs' rebuilding them and this little Carter is no exception. My son also learned a critical lesson about replacing a fuel filter and not bypassing them when you don't have one handy. He pulled the filter between the tank and the fuel pump and caused all sort of mayhem by not replacing it and just plumbing it in without it.  I guess he thinks I put it there for decoration? We also got caught-out in a fairly major spring snowstorm on the way back to Boulder. Cars were running off the road all around us but this little (well, ~4500lb) Seneca just trudged right through it, skinny little summer tires and all.  The wipers weren't overly inspiring  (intermittent stoppages for no obvious reasons) but we made it anyway. Oh yeah, we also passed emissions again, this time with flying colors.

The OP messaged me at FBBO and stated that he was banned from here,
Why?
This guy never hurt anyone.   :shruggy:

See my reply in the other thread.  Probably not a "ban" at all, but I can't say why he's having issues or getting that message. 

Sorry...

That Seneca is really growing on me.  Good thread for sure.  Hope he squares away the techno glitch.  Or maybe a mod here can figure it out.

Quote from: hemigeno on June 28, 2021, 07:44:42 PM
See my reply in the other thread.  Probably not a "ban" at all, but I can't say why he's having issues or getting that message. 

Sorry...

Lloyd says that each time he tries to log in, it shows that he is banned forever.   

That sucks!!  :brickwall:I enjoyed following this thread.

I've sent Troy a PM and email.  He's not always able to check in due to job & other issues, but I'm sure he'll address it when he can.

:cheers:

Thank you. Lloyd has been sending me PMs at FBBO.  :2thumbs:

Thanks to Kern Dog, Hemigeno and Troy (and my IT savvy wife) it would appear that I have returned. Evidently, in my recent travels I'd used a bad wifi connection somewhere (airport?) and it corrupted my IP address (according to this system). Had to clear out a few cookies before it would "unban" me.

Spent the last few days working on the Dart. Even though I'd advised against using it regularly (not ready for prime time just yet!) my son couldn't keep his hands off of it and had been driving it with some frequency. It wasn't starting well for him over at his girlfriends place and her father (another car guy) diagnosed a bad starter solenoid  (in 1960, the solenoid is on the firewall near the battery, not on the starter like more-modern versions). They replaced that and even the voltage regulator (bad idea!). The starter solenoid was a direct bolt-on replacement for the original but the "new" voltage regulator didn't exactly fit the original location.  The car did start (and much better than before) and run, but somehow the generator had gone out of service without anybody noticing. It ran on the battery for a few days and then....it didn't. The exhaust system has also continued to deteriorate to the point where it had become a significant liability (carbon monoxide and noise).  Rescued him in a rainstorm last Friday night and then put my foot down. Back to my buddy's shop in Boulder for bodywork and all the other problems. My son is now working steadily for the summer at new Ace Hardware near to our home, so now he can put a little more skin in the game(!).  A new Diehard battery on Saturday morning and we were back in Boulder that day. A second generator (bought from eBay as a backup last summer) and a review and replacement with the reworked original voltage regulator had resolved most of the charging issues (ever hear of polarizing a generator? I sure hadn't.)  I also replaced the rather smallish fuel filter he'd used between the gas tank and the fuel pump with a much larger clear plastic unit. This gas tank is still sending lots of very fine red rust into the system and regular reviews (and then changes) of that filter are critical for dependable function.  After disturbing the peace in my buddy's neighborhood by driving it around to test the charging system, I dropped it at a muffler shop up there yesterday for a complete exhaust system replacement. As luck would have it, the proprietor of said muffler shop is a Mopar guy himself (framed Ma Mopar musclecar pictures all over the walls). He's promised to exactly duplicate the exhaust system by using the remains of original as a template and bending up a new one. Should be able to pick it up in a few days and get on with the next phase of this ongoing project.

(http://i.imgur.com/9gvk2sjh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/9gvk2sj)

The world's busiest driveway.....

Who would have ever thought that a "plain-Jane" single pipe, bone-stock muffler system could look so-good to me?

(http://i.imgur.com/zyf53ksh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/zyf53ks)

And...it sounds even better than it looks, btw. Check out the divot in that oil pan we had to pound out...

The last step in quieting down this little 225 was a final lashing of the valves on this solid-lifter motor. After something of a junk-yard fire-drill to replace one badly worn tappet-adjustment screw (good luck finding one of those on short notice!) this ancient Dart is running pretty darn good now. Oh yea...also check out the vent tube spewing crankcase "vapor" to the left of the transmission pan.  Bad, evil, awful, & not-PC.

Yeah....that exhaust looks great. The oil pan? Whoa!  :eek2:

KD: Yeah, that oil pan is probably why this motor has two number 4 connecting rods.  I always remembered slant 6s sounding like a sewing machine engine and thankfully, this one does now too. Instead of the constant "blat" of a leaky exhaust you can now hear lots of the other operating noises this car makes. The push-button shift mechanism and the whine of that early 904 shifting gears is pretty unique. We even (finally!) got a decent spare tire for it and mounted in the truck using the original hardware. The last spare had come out of a distant junkyard (rim and tire off of a '60 Pioneer) and didn't hold air for very long. Nothing has been easy with this car (and is probably why decent, unabused versions cost so-much now).  The price I'm paying for having a baby seat strapped into in the back seat of my Charger for so-many of his early years.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncLYIUsHXWE

This can't be real...

I found this, it may help your /6: https://www.slantsix.org/articles/dutra-blocks/slant-blocks.htm  https://www.slantsix.org/

(http://i.imgur.com/smLHsifh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/smLHsif)

b5blue: That slant6 webpage is a wealth of knowledge, for sure, but....sorry, hard to imagine this thing ever being fast (too-big and heavy). I'm just happy when it makes it to it's destination and then back home safely. My boy (a highschool senior this year) has interrupted the work process yet again and brought it home for a few social events with his friends. I get it (I was 17 once as well...). Those new mirrors on the fenders are not proper Mopar items, but they sure do go along way in making it safer to drive.

Went through quite the fire drill yesterday. Car nearly wouldn't run at all. Hard to start, poor idle, would die whenever you put it in gear. Went through nearly everything (pulled carb and checked float-drop, set up alternative fuel source to fuel pump, even checked lash on valves...). It was the points. Duh! 

Score !

Before....

(http://i.imgur.com/gdLKCbEh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/gdLKCbE)
(http://i.imgur.com/v9cAlbgh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/v9cAlbg)

After...

(http://i.imgur.com/5yI2f06h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/5yI2f06)

Slow here but progress none-the-less.  Rockers fixed on both sides and even the rear quarters (and that's metal, not bondo).  Paint looms.

Yeah, I haven't seen any updates for 3 months.  :2thumbs:

My son has been distracted by this...

(http://i.imgur.com/I5qFLgbh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/I5qFLgb)

(http://i.imgur.com/of6V9uah.jpg) (https://imgur.com/of6V9ua)

Pretty rare piece to be playing with.  :drool5:

Yeah, he's learning the lessons of junk car economics the hard way. The Dart needs very little now to be mostly finished and he's off on another project (a '51 Kaiser 2-door hatchback). The supercharger will bolt directly to his "new" cars rather anemic-flathead six so he's all worked-up about it. He has the run of a junkyard full of ancient cars (almost 70 Kaisers) which was part of the the deal for buying the '51 and he's doing everything he can before that door closes (the yard is being sold).  He'll be 18 in December and is working almost all the time now (when he's not in school or doing homework) and his grades are holding up so there's little I can say about it. My wife tells me it could be so-much worse (drugs, booze, psycho chicks, endless media, etc.) and she's clearly right so I've mostly stepped away from it. He's fiercely independent now (which means I've done my job right) and is busily applying to college for the Fall. We'll be empty-nesters here before too long. It sure went fast.

Quote from: JB400 on October 28, 2021, 12:05:18 AM
Pretty rare piece to be playing with.  :drool5:

Kaiser did not have a V8, so they used the McCullough produced supercharger to bump the power in their flathead from 118 to 140 hp to try and keep up with the others.    Very low boost, about 4 psi.

The Dodge is looking good.   Be nice to see it squirted and finished.   

Aero426: Amen to that one. I wish he'd just finish this Dodge first but....he doesn't always take my advice.  Like I mentioned earlier (& as we all know here), old car economics can be pretty tricky.  Sadly, he's got to learn this one on his own before it really means anything to him.  I was probably pretty thick at 17 too.

Another shot of that Kaiser huffer....

(http://i.imgur.com/skOuCx0h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/skOuCx0)

(http://i.imgur.com/OPQzF87h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/OPQzF87)

I can understand the appeal to him (heck, I think it's sort-of neat too) but the pitfalls are bloody endless here.  I'd love to just jump in and fix it all for him but that's clearly not the answer. I just listen to all the struggles and chime in occasionally. I won't let him get hurt but.... I won't do anything heroic either.

Quote from: lloyd3 on October 28, 2021, 04:32:23 PM
Aero426: Amen to that one. I wish he'd just finish this Dodge first but....he doesn't always take my advice.  Like I mentioned earlier (& as we all know here), old car economics can be pretty tricky.  Sadly, he's got to learn this one on his own before it really means anything to him.  I was probably pretty thick at 17 too.

I think most of us can say we've been distracted by some shiny object a time or two.    It's a lot easier to see the best choices from the outside.     

This is worth finishing now. If only to just sell it.

(http://i.imgur.com/ZhxwWmlh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/ZhxwWml)

I'm the one repairing the bad brake line.  To be fair, between work and school, my son doesn't have much free time anymore. This game seems to be getting harder to play all the time now and occasionally I find myself being sorry that I got him into it.  He's learning good stuff (and it arguably got him his job) but...it sure isn't as easy as it used to be.

My Brother in Law wanted to get into a classic car so I shopped around and in 2007, I found a derelict 72 Duster. He was 22 at the time and seemed really excited about it. He was out of state but would come to visit as often as possible to work on it with me. In 2010, he moved here and was able to work on it more frequently but seemed to lose interest. He moved back home in 2013 and rarely talked about the car. Last winter I assumed ownership and will finish and sell the car. It was a sad thing for me because I really enjoyed the mentorship it provided. I have no kids so it felt like I was passing along something to a worthy person.

KD: That would be very hard. My boy hasn't lost interest, on the contrary, he's going a bit overboard IMHO. I got his brakes fixed Saturday (had to have a flexible line fabricated) and he's driving it to school and work everyday now. The interest is almost consuming.  Hard to balance that with all the other things he really needs to be doing (typical parental refrain I suppose). I also struggle with the traffic he drives it in (6 lanes of combat, almost all the time now) and worry accordingly. But...considering what I was doing at his age (perish that thought!) he's a boyscout.  I just need to step away and let him do things his way.  

I'm happy for you that your son still has the desire for it.  :2thumbs:

Hi Lloyd, KD,                 07 November 2021

Lloyd, you are a good father and KD, you tried to be the same. Be grateful you aren't like mine was, he had a fascination for the bottle. Never turned a drink down and was also a beater.

God Bless you both.

Best Always

Christine, for the 426 Hemi Chicks

Hi Lloyd,                     07 November 2021

Looked at the photos of the Dart, that is a neat car. We can't imagine what the front end (Bumper, grill, etc.) would cost new these days. That's more steel and Chrome than is in half dozen new cars.

Our 09 Ram PU's frontend is all plastic, fenders, hood and all the trim around it.

We think your son is on the right track; you and your wife are the ones that put him there.

Take Care

Best Always

426 Hemi Chicks

Thank you ladies! Kind words indeed.

Wish I had a picture, but my son drove his Dart to school today with a discarded fake Christmas tree strapped to the roof.  He was even talking about getting low-wattage lights for it. Not sure what the goal is here but at least he's still having fun with it.

That is great!   :2thumbs:

(http://i.imgur.com/ispLuGnh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/ispLuGn)

Christmas dog.

Someone wants to go for a RIDE!  :lol:

(http://i.imgur.com/uYdVRG8h.jpg) (https://imgur.com/uYdVRG8)

Remember these scenes from our youth? I told him not to take it out before the storm but he did anyway. My son is 18 now and will be starting collage in the Fall so....I don't direct his life much anymore, I merely suggest what might work (or not). He finally did get it back onto it's perch in the driveway last night so it's not sitting out on the road anymore.

Good to see it driven and enjoyed.... but a price will be paid it that keeps up. Heck.... you shouldn't even wash a FL car with water they rust so easily. I just wipe them down.

I'm shocked it does so-well in all the ice and snow until I remember just how much it weighs (like 4,400lbs). It's still not ready for prime-time but I was 18 once myself and I understand the desire to take it out once in a while. He works all the time now, every weekend and 3 nights a week after school. Not my place to say "no" anymore.

How are his Kaiser projects coming along?

Aero426: Not much progress on that front of late. He has a new girlfriend and, of course, winter and junkyards aren't a great combination. As he describes it, he's been biding his time and saving his money for the next break in the weather. I do know he just bought some window seals so he could replace a bunch of glass in it (only one fellow in the world makes them). I just moved his blower off of my work bench so I could use it for another project so....he's got a long way to go still. This project used to drive me a bit crazy but... it's actually been a good distraction for him (this is the 1st girlfriend in quite a while).  All I know is what I was doing when I was his age (& he clearly isn't).

(http://i.imgur.com/eSEletZh.jpg?1) (https://imgur.com/eSEletZ)

No fear here. I wouldn't have taken it out, knowing this snowstorm was coming. But, of course, Dad was following him home with a 4x4 truck....

Every classic car that we pamper today was likely used as a daily driver for someone when they were new. Snow, rain, gravel roads, heavy traffic...all of that was normal usage.

(http://i.imgur.com/BcFoysCh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/BcFoysC)

Cold spring day here. The Dart almost looks like a real car now after a rattle-can touch-up.  Still needs a fuel filter change about every thousand miles because of all the rust in the tank and my boy tells me it's needing points again. Ah, the joys of older car, eh?

(http://i.imgur.com/WVASrFNh.jpg) (https://imgur.com/WVASrFN)

It did make it to the car show last Saturday though....and got at least as much attention as my '68 did, which was very fun for my son.

Really need a driver's door glass for this car at the moment. You folks found the unfindable for this car 2-years ago (back-up light lenses). Any chance of that happening again?

These cars have flat glass on the sides, so it is easy and fairly inexpensive to have it made. The shop should have dimensions for most cars, but you can always bring in your piece to use as a template (would also help match color). Search "custom auto glass" in your area and I'm sure you'll find a place.

Thanks Mike, we'll try that.

Thanks for the pictures, Lloyd. I like seeing that old car out in the mix with other cars. It really stands out!  :2thumbs:

KD: Thank you.

If you'll forgive me for bragging a little, our son graduated from highschool last Wednesday. Had family in town to attend and we spent several evenings involved with the process (a Lutheran high school, so a few more events than the standard public highschool process that the wife & I went through).

(http://i.imgur.com/nePlBhih.jpg) (https://imgur.com/nePlBhi)

He also had a little event with one of his buddies at his friend's local family ranchette, which both families attended. A nice little do with even a small car show there(!). This involved a few vehicles owned by his peers and some of the local friends and family (His car, my car, a '69 AMX, a 70 R/T, SE Challenger (clone), a '66 Mustang, & two or three older PU trucks.)  A food truck provided the chow and the libations were lemonade (and even blackberry lemonade!). In a moment of weakness, I allowed him to take his "buddy" for a short ride "around the block" in my car. The ride went a bit longer than he had initially described (& w/3 friends, not 1) and my car got a little dusty (he somehow drove it down a dirt road?). He was also followed back to the party by an irate neighbor "for going too-fast in the neighborhood" which has a 25mph speed limit.  He's still just an 18-year old kid, after all, and I was overly-trusting to do it (not happening again for a while now). It would seem that these cars are still a significant temptation after all...

Hi Lloyd,              12 September 2022

Congratulations on your son's graduation, you and your wife deserve a "Well Done." As we looked at the photo we thought we were seeing William Shatner, aka James T. Kirk.

What did you do the first time you got your hands on a hot car, see how slow it would go?

God Bless You and Your Family.

Best Always

426 Hemi Chicks

PS:

A brake pedal is for emergencies only.