DodgeCharger.com Forum

Mopar Garage => Engine, Transmission, Rearend, & Exhaust => Proven Engine Combos => Topic started by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:14:26 AM

Title: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:14:26 AM
So i bought my Charger out of southern California at the end of last summer.  :ricky: See here for reference if you'd like:  

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,60095.0.html


Then it sat for the fall while i finished building my detached garage for it,  :smash: here is that thread:

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,56750.0.html

Then about mid winter it was time to pull the engine and get it off to the engine builder.  I had enough money saved up to get a good start and i wanted to beat the spring rush guys to the engine shop.  So in February i pulled the engine out and off to the shop it went.  The snow was about 2 feet deep in my yard and i had to build a cradle for the block and put it on a 1/2 sheet of plywood for a sled.  Then i took the snowblower and made a path out to the street.  Then i rounded up the neighbors and we pushed and pulled it out to the street and i got it loaded up in my spouses mini-van.  I dont have a truck, just a wimpy puddle jumper comuter car.   :-\  I would rather have "Charger money" every month instead of a truck payment. :Twocents:

The engine builder knocked it down and found that the previous owner had cut out the valley pan in the center to make way for a NOS system.  He plumbed in NOS lines into the intake and neatly routed them under the intake and out the back.  The valey pan was duct taped and coated with blue silicone.  That blue stuff was all over inside the engine.  This intake will not be going back on.  I will be using the stock intake that came with the car so i can put the stock A/C system back on.

The heads were not seated completely in the bottom center either, you can see in the pictures where the gasket is not fully compressed.  This engine did run when i bought it and i drove it a few miles when i picked it up.  There was a small knocking sound that we couldnt figure out.  That will all be fixed now.  Anyways, here are a ton of pictures of the re-build so far.  The engine is being assembled today and it will go on the dyno later next week.  Then back into my Charger on Saturday of next week!

Oh and about the build.  The cam was a hemi cam that was way to big for the springs that were in the heads.  I am re-using the .030 over cast pistons, we bought new valves, springs, guides, etc...  I will post up all the specs on the engine once i get the dyno results from my builder so you can read exactly what went into this build and then maybe Ron can move this thread to the proven engine section after i get dyno results.

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:15:35 AM
 ;)
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:16:24 AM
 :o
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:17:36 AM
All cleaned up getting mag tested.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:18:29 AM
More mag testing.  Every checked out Great!  :cheers:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:19:12 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:20:15 AM
 All numbers matching..   :yesnod:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:21:16 AM
Oil pump is a little worn out.   :icon_smile_blackeye:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:22:21 AM
Tap out all the threads.   :yesnod:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:24:28 AM
Time for block hone.   :icon_smile_big:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:25:25 AM
 :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:26:27 AM
New arp bolts.   Final Hone.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:27:48 AM
Cut connecting rods for reconditioning.  and new Parts!
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:29:09 AM
Crank reground.  New valves cut to perfection.  Valve guide work.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:30:07 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 11:30:58 AM
And finally we are up to speed with today.  So i hope to have more to add next week.

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: tan top on April 09, 2010, 12:01:37 PM
 some motor work going on there  :yesnod:    matching #s  also  :coolgleamA: :drool5: ...... :'(


looks like some dudes been there before , don't look like stock pistons  :shruggy: :popcrn:



 good lot of pictures Paul , looking forward to more updates ,   :popcrn: :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 09, 2010, 12:47:48 PM
Quote from: tan top on April 09, 2010, 12:01:37 PM
some motor work going on there  :yesnod:    matching #s 
looks like some dudes been there before , don't look like stock pistons  :shruggy: :popcrn:

also  :coolgleamA: :drool5: ........  :'(

 good lot of pictures Paul , looking forward to more updates ,   :popcrn: :2thumbs:

thats right, i forgot to mention the engine was rebuilt once back in the early 80's.  Thats when it was punched .030 over.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 10:20:16 AM
Block and heads were decked yesterday.  As well as debur the block.  My engine builder will finish with prep today and start assembly!  I'm going down there at lunch tomorrow to drop off my carb for the dyno run scheduled for later this week.  :ricky: :boogie: :boogie:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 10:21:23 AM
 :cheers:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 10:22:20 AM
 :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: firefighter3931 on April 12, 2010, 11:32:31 AM
Looking good Paul. Nice work getting rid of that ugly casting flash  :2thumbs:

Have you measured how far those pistons are below deck ? Calculated compression ratio yet ?

That's important stuff ; especially when selecting the cam  :yesnod:



Ron
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 11:36:53 AM
Quote from: firefighter3931 on April 12, 2010, 11:32:31 AM
Looking good Paul. Nice work getting rid of that ugly casting flash  :2thumbs:

Have you measured how far those pistons are below deck ? Calculated compression ratio yet ?

That's important stuff ; especially when selecting the cam  :yesnod:



Ron

I'm going there right now over my lunch hour, i'll ask and report back what i find out.  I do remember him saying that he couldnt cut the deck down very far because the pistons dont have indentations for the valves.  I'll get all the details on the build though and post up when i get back.

Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: firefighter3931 on April 12, 2010, 11:43:07 AM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 11:36:53 AM
Quote from: firefighter3931 on April 12, 2010, 11:32:31 AM
Looking good Paul. Nice work getting rid of that ugly casting flash  :2thumbs:

Have you measured how far those pistons are below deck ? Calculated compression ratio yet ?

That's important stuff ; especially when selecting the cam  :yesnod:



Ron

I'm going there right now over my lunch hour, i'll ask and report back what i find out.  I do remember him saying that he couldnt cut the deck down very far because the pistons dont have indentations for the valves.  I'll get all the details on the build though and post up when i get back.




Cool....get a piston to deck measurement & combustion chamber volume. Then we can figure out your static compression and make sure you're headed in the right direction with the cam choice.  :2thumbs:


Ron
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: Ponch ® on April 12, 2010, 01:15:58 PM
Looking good, bro!  :2thumbs:

When that thing is done I might just have to fly out to MN to get a ride in it (and for Vainglory to show me around the local strip joints).
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 03:29:13 PM
Quote from: firefighter3931 on April 12, 2010, 11:43:07 AM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 11:36:53 AM
Quote from: firefighter3931 on April 12, 2010, 11:32:31 AM
Looking good Paul. Nice work getting rid of that ugly casting flash  :2thumbs:

Have you measured how far those pistons are below deck ? Calculated compression ratio yet ?

That's important stuff ; especially when selecting the cam  :yesnod:



Ron

I'm going there right now over my lunch hour, i'll ask and report back what i find out.  I do remember him saying that he couldnt cut the deck down very far because the pistons dont have indentations for the valves.  I'll get all the details on the build though and post up when i get back.




Cool....get a piston to deck measurement & combustion chamber volume. Then we can figure out your static compression and make sure you're headed in the right direction with the cam choice.  :2thumbs:


Ron

He has already ordered the cam.  And i think he uses clay to pack in the combustion chamber and then he weighs the clay to determine combustion chamber volume.   He is going to get me the cam specs tonight.  I think he said compression ratio will be closer to 9:1.  Between 9 and 9.5 anyways. 
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 12, 2010, 03:30:15 PM
Quote from: Ponch ® on April 12, 2010, 01:15:58 PM
Looking good, bro!  :2thumbs:

When that thing is done I might just have to fly out to MN to get a ride in it (and for Vainglory to show me around the local strip joints).

Ya buddy  :yesnod:  We can take it for a ride to the local strip clubs!  Maybe we can get the ladies to come outside for a photo opportunity.  :D
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:09:44 AM
Got some more progress to report.  The block is close to being assembled, but the dyno is not available untill Monday now at the soonest so i wont be getting the engine back this weekend.  Thats ok, though, i've waited this long, 9 weeks now, another week wont kill me and besides, that makes my spouse a happy camper because i'm still working on her honey do list, once that engine gets home she wont be seeing me for weeks, maybe even the whole summer .. hahahaha  :icon_smile_big:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:33:59 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:34:48 AM
 :Twocents:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:35:20 AM
 :icon_smile_wink:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:36:04 AM
 :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:36:43 AM
 :cheers:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:37:16 AM
 :icon_smile_cool:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 10:38:03 AM
 :angel:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: 694spdRT on April 15, 2010, 11:39:41 AM
Looking good Paul!  :2thumbs:

I am no expert but those pistons look a lot like the 0.030 over forged TRW/Speed Pro 2266's in my 440.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: charger_cody on April 15, 2010, 12:37:23 PM
I'm way impressed. They do good work!!!

Cody
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 15, 2010, 01:10:54 PM
Quote from: 694spdRT on April 15, 2010, 11:39:41 AM
Looking good Paul!  :2thumbs:

I am no expert but those pistons look a lot like the 0.030 over forged TRW/Speed Pro 2266's in my 440.

I'm no expert either but i do know they are .030 over forged TRW's.  You might be correct on the rest.  They were put in this engine in the early 80's when it was last rebuilt.  They were in good shape so we are re-using them.


Quote from: charger_cody on April 15, 2010, 12:37:23 PM
I'm way impressed. They do good work!!!

Cody

Thanks!  He is a one man operation in a small shop outside of town.  The list to get in is a few months wait and its well worth it.  :yesnod:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: tan top on April 15, 2010, 02:53:30 PM
looking good  Paul   :yesnod:  soon be laying rubber  :drool5: :dance: thanks for sharing all these pictures love looking at this kind of thing   :popcrn: :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: GPULLER on April 15, 2010, 04:00:02 PM
Good lord...the photography bill from the engine builder will exceed the engine rebuild costs!  Cool that the guy will take the time to document the rebuild.
Looks good!
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: bakerhillpins on April 15, 2010, 08:19:05 PM
Quote from: GPULLER on April 15, 2010, 04:00:02 PM
Good lord...the photography bill from the engine builder will exceed the engine rebuild costs!  Cool that the guy will take the time to document the rebuild.
Looks good!

:yesnod:  No kidding.. Great pics. 

Soon... So soon.   :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 16, 2010, 08:57:02 AM
He is just gettting started with a digital camera and a photobucket site.  Here are some more pics from yesterdays work.  I am penciled in at the dyno shop for Tuesday the 20th!   :ricky:

Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 16, 2010, 08:58:11 AM
 :cheers:  this guy is very good.  Very detailed in his work.  :yesnod:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 16, 2010, 08:59:33 AM
 :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 16, 2010, 09:00:41 AM
 ;)
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: firefighter3931 on April 16, 2010, 10:23:55 AM
It's coming together nicely ! :icon_smile_big: :2thumbs: :cheers:



Ron
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: General_01 on April 16, 2010, 04:24:55 PM
Looking good. :2thumbs:

I see you opted to not go bigger than me though. That's all right. I like the view of the front of your car in my rear view mirror. :nana:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 16, 2010, 09:08:34 PM
Quote from: General_01 on April 16, 2010, 04:24:55 PM
Looking good. :2thumbs:

I see you opted to not go bigger than me though. That's all right. I like the view of the front of your car in my rear view mirror. :nana:

Since i have driven your car, i will have to agree.   :o
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:20:24 AM
Ok everyone, Dyno is scheduled for tomorrow, i got bumped back at the dyno shop for some higher up clients (read: the person who actually owns the dyno) so thats fine, i was able to continue to work on my honey do list over the weekend.  Here are another batch of pictures for now.

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:22:52 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:23:36 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:24:50 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:25:41 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:27:05 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:28:35 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 19, 2010, 11:29:54 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: charger_cody on April 19, 2010, 12:42:06 PM
 :o Wow. I want a ride if i'm ever in town!!!  :icon_smile_big:

Cody
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build
Post by: PocketThunder on April 20, 2010, 02:36:12 PM
Just got back from the Dyno.  I dont have the sheets, my engine builder took them and will scan and e-mail me them this afternoon, but for now the results are:

467 HP
500 LB-FT
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: 694spdRT on April 20, 2010, 03:04:08 PM
 :woohoo:

That should do the trick!  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Dans 68 on April 20, 2010, 03:11:38 PM
Nice numbers for a basically stock engine.  :2thumbs: I look forward to seeing the dyno sheets!

Dan
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on April 20, 2010, 03:15:16 PM
nice !! 500 ft lbs  :coolgleamA: , thats going to move that R/T :yesnod:   :coolgleamA: :2thumbs:    good lot of pictures Paul  :popcrn:  looking forward  to seeing  more  :yesnod: :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Just 6T9 CHGR on April 20, 2010, 03:28:42 PM
Must have had some tricks up their sleeve with those #'s :cheers:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: General_01 on April 20, 2010, 06:35:20 PM
Nice!!!!! :yesnod:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 20, 2010, 08:30:12 PM
Dyno Sheets.    :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: metcoll on April 21, 2010, 05:39:37 AM
that is going to be one fun driver, nice power levels @great rpm ranges....congrats & good work...what cam specs are you using....
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 22, 2010, 08:07:49 AM
The Dyno Video.

http://s685.photobucket.com/albums/vv212/mastermotorworx/Hemi%20Charger/?action=view&current=DynoVid.flv

I will get all the details up soon on the build.  Pretty busy right now with work and home and everything inbetween!
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: charger_cody on April 22, 2010, 08:18:34 AM
Liking the looks of that!!!!!!!!!  :yesnod:

Your gonna enjoy every second your in that car!

Cody
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on April 22, 2010, 08:34:08 AM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 22, 2010, 08:07:49 AM
The Dyno Video.

http://s685.photobucket.com/albums/vv212/mastermotorworx/Hemi%20Charger/?action=view&current=DynoVid.flv

I will get all the details up soon on the build.  Pretty busy right now with work and home and everything inbetween!

:yesnod: cool !! :popcrn: :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Just 6T9 CHGR on April 22, 2010, 03:51:27 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 22, 2010, 08:07:49 AM
The Dyno Video.

http://s685.photobucket.com/albums/vv212/mastermotorworx/Hemi%20Charger/?action=view&current=DynoVid.flv

I will get all the details up soon on the build.  Pretty busy right now with work and home and everything inbetween!

Oh boy....not promising if the engine guy thinks its a Hemi..... :rotz:

;)
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 22, 2010, 08:31:36 PM
Quote from: Just 6T9 CHGR on April 22, 2010, 03:51:27 PM
Oh boy....not promising if the engine guy thinks its a Hemi..... :rotz:

;)

My engine guy lives close to my friend at work who is a Chevy guy.  I always ask my Chevy friend how the work is going on his Biscayne (he has a 70 Chevelle SS454 4-speed) or i come up with some other Chevy make besides Chevelle.  His Chevelle happens to be stored in my garage for the winter. 
So in retaliation he and my engine builder always ask me how my 440hemi is doing.  Hence, the Hemi Charger reference....  get it?   :-\    :icon_smile_big:     :icon_smile_big:

My engine guy usually does lots of Chevy and Fords but he has only done a half dozen mopars recently and he was exited to dyno one for the first time and have a record about what can be done with them.  My engine, and the lot of pictures he took will be used for reference in future mopar builds at this shop in the future.

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Charger-Bodie on April 22, 2010, 08:44:35 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 22, 2010, 08:31:36 PM
Quote from: Just 6T9 CHGR on April 22, 2010, 03:51:27 PM
Oh boy....not promising if the engine guy thinks its a Hemi..... :rotz:

;)

My engine guy lives close to my friend at work who is a Chevy guy.  I always ask my Chevy friend how the work is going on his Biscayne (he has a 70 Chevelle SS454 4-speed) or i come up with some other Chevy make besides Chevelle.  His Chevelle happens to be stored in my garage for the winter. 
So in retaliation he and my engine builder always ask me how my 440hemi is doing.  Hence, the Hemi Charger reference....  get it?   :-\    :icon_smile_big:     :icon_smile_big:

My engine guy usually does lots of Chevy and Fords but he has only done a half dozen mopars recently and he was exited to dyno one for the first time and have a record about what can be done with them.  My engine, and the lot of pictures he took will be used for reference in future mopar builds at this shop in the future.

Paul


Thants all fine and good Paul..........Lets see some pics of it under the hood!
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: firefighter3931 on April 23, 2010, 10:24:28 AM
Those are very good numbers for a mild build  :2thumbs:

If you run manifolds in the car it will lose some power but it's still going to be a handfull on the street  :icon_smile_big:

Congrats Paul : I'd be happy with those results.  :cheers:



Ron
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 24, 2010, 06:27:27 PM
Quote from: 1HotDaytona on April 22, 2010, 08:44:35 PM

Thants all fine and good Paul..........Lets see some pics of it under the hood!

Engine is in the car as of 10:30 last night..   :yesnod:

I should have it fired up tomorrow afternoon.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on April 24, 2010, 06:32:16 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 24, 2010, 06:27:27 PM
Quote from: 1HotDaytona on April 22, 2010, 08:44:35 PM

Thants all fine and good Paul..........Lets see some pics of it under the hood!

Engine is in the car as of 10:30 last night..   :yesnod:

I should have it fired up tomorrow afternoon.

thats  quick , no messing around   :yesnod: looking forward to seeing pictures &  video  ;) :coolgleamA: :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: General_01 on April 24, 2010, 06:34:00 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 24, 2010, 06:27:27 PM
Quote from: 1HotDaytona on April 22, 2010, 08:44:35 PM

Thants all fine and good Paul..........Lets see some pics of it under the hood!

Engine is in the car as of 10:30 last night..   :yesnod:

I should have it fired up tomorrow afternoon.


Very cool!! You must have drove straight to the shop from work and then brought it home and threw it in the car. Sounds like your a little anxious to get that thing going. :icon_smile_big:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: General_01 on April 25, 2010, 09:37:24 PM
So, where's the video and pics? :shruggy:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: 375instroke on April 30, 2010, 06:10:02 PM
So what was the cam?
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 30, 2010, 06:13:40 PM
Quote from: General_01 on April 25, 2010, 09:37:24 PM
So, where's the video and pics? :shruggy:

I got this one for now.  I'll get more when i can.  I drove to work 3 days this week.  what a blast!!!!  :boogie: :boogie:

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on April 30, 2010, 06:14:14 PM
Quote from: 375instroke on April 30, 2010, 06:10:02 PM
So what was the cam?

Comp Cams XE268
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on April 30, 2010, 06:22:33 PM
good stuff Paul  :yesnod:  :coolgleamA: .............. :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Charger-Bodie on May 01, 2010, 01:16:40 PM
Glad to see you got her up and running Paul!!  :drive:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: 694spdRT on May 01, 2010, 01:31:54 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 30, 2010, 06:13:40 PM
 I drove to work 3 days this week.  what a blast!!!!  :boogie: :boogie:

Paul

Congrats......that is more than I have drove mine all year.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: General_01 on May 01, 2010, 01:46:01 PM
Quote from: 694spdRT on May 01, 2010, 01:31:54 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on April 30, 2010, 06:13:40 PM
 I drove to work 3 days this week.  what a blast!!!!  :boogie: :boogie:

Paul

Congrats......that is more than I have drove mine all year.


Same here. Looks good Paul. Hope I will get a ride in it this year.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: 375instroke on May 01, 2010, 04:25:35 PM
So that dyno run is with headers, but you are going to use manifolds, right?  With the 476HP, and 4200# weight, I get 12.76.  If I drop 50HP for manifolds, I get 13.25.  Does that sound right?  My Charger's slow, and I'm just wondering what I'll get with a stock rebuild, and just a cam.  That's what you've done here, isn't it?  Just attention to detail.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: FlatbackFanatic on May 03, 2010, 09:05:56 AM
Looks great Paul!!! Can't wait to se it this summer!! :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 04, 2010, 08:59:25 AM
Quote from: 375instroke on May 01, 2010, 04:25:35 PM
So that dyno run is with headers, but you are going to use manifolds, right?  With the 476HP, and 4200# weight, I get 12.76.  If I drop 50HP for manifolds, I get 13.25.  Does that sound right?  My Charger's slow, and I'm just wondering what I'll get with a stock rebuild, and just a cam.  That's what you've done here, isn't it?  Just attention to detail.

Basically yes, its a rather stock rebuild and the cam has been changed up.  I did use a Edelbrock 750 cfm carb.  But i'm using the stock intake, and the rest of the parts are stock.   :yesnod:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: bakerhillpins on May 04, 2010, 03:08:35 PM
Glad to hear its back in and you are enjoying yourself!   :popcrn:

I'd comment more by my neck hurts from trying to read that dyno graph.  :slap:

Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: hemigeno on May 05, 2010, 01:49:10 PM

Quote from: bakerhillpins on May 04, 2010, 03:08:35 PM
I'd comment more by my neck hurts from trying to read that dyno graph.  :slap:

:haha:


Nice numbers there, Paul!  Glad to hear you have it back on the road as well.   :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: charge69 on May 07, 2010, 02:42:18 PM
Congrats on having someone who knows what they are doing rebuild the engine! Very nice numbers on the dyno with a great spread on the torque side. Got to be a blast on the street.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 07:46:20 AM
what is this blue box?  voltage regulator?
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on May 25, 2010, 07:57:34 AM
yes !think its a race only one though , for a electronic ignition set up  :scratchchin:   :scratchchin:???? :popcrn:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Hemidog on May 25, 2010, 08:05:44 AM
Quote from: tan top on May 25, 2010, 07:57:34 AM
yes !think its a race only one though , for a electronic ignition set up  :scratchchin:   :scratchchin:???? :popcrn:
yep :iagree:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 09:12:42 AM
Quote from: Hemidog on May 25, 2010, 08:05:44 AM
Quote from: tan top on May 25, 2010, 07:57:34 AM
yes !think its a race only one though , for a electronic ignition set up  :scratchchin:   :scratchchin:???? :popcrn:
yep :iagree:

Should i replace it with a black one?

I'm driving my Charger last night and the tach needle starts jumping all over the place and the car is cutting in and out.  Is this the ballast resistor going bad?  The coil?  The voltage regulator?  Something with the electronic ignition?   :shruggy:

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: GPULLER on May 25, 2010, 02:00:16 PM
Quote from: Hemidog on May 25, 2010, 08:05:44 AM
Quote from: tan top on May 25, 2010, 07:57:34 AM
yes !think its a race only one though , for a electronic ignition set up  :scratchchin:   :scratchchin:???? :popcrn:
yep :iagree:


Huh...I been running the P3690732 in my '66 for 20 years with no problems.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on May 25, 2010, 03:09:35 PM
Quote from: Hemidog on May 25, 2010, 08:05:44 AM
Quote from: tan top on May 25, 2010, 07:57:34 AM
yes !think its a race only one though , for a electronic ignition set up  :scratchchin:   :scratchchin:???? :popcrn:
yep :iagree:
they can over heat & cook the coil when used on the street  :shruggy:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DCC-3690732
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Brock Lee on May 25, 2010, 04:11:41 PM
Did you find any remains of the mandatory emissions reduction kit?
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 04:21:19 PM
Quote from: Brock Lee on May 25, 2010, 04:11:41 PM
Did you find any remains of the mandatory emissions reduction kit?

I'm not sure what that all includes..?..

I'm going to start with replacing the ballast resistor tonight and see how far that gets me.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tan top on May 25, 2010, 04:34:56 PM
think its advance weights in the distributor  , but you have electronic  now !  turn down tips  & twin snorkle  ,  might be ignition timing &  leaner carb :popcrn: settings ,  , just hazzarding a guess  :shruggy:

Chris of just6t9 will know all about this stuff
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: 375instroke on May 25, 2010, 05:42:23 PM
I hate the shotgun method.  The ballast resistor is just a wire.  It works or it doesn't.  If the car runs, tap it to see if there is something loose causing your intermittent misfire.  Same for the coil.  I've never had a coil or ballast go bad on me, and I've been driving pieces of junk for 25 years now.  All of them with points and a ballast.  Seeing as you have the "race" ignition module, I'd suspect it.  The tach jumping is what leads me in that direction.  It's driven by the ignition system, not engine RPM, so an erratic ignition would cause it to jump around.  What's the voltage on your coil positive terminal when running?
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Brock Lee on May 25, 2010, 08:28:52 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 04:21:19 PM
Quote from: Brock Lee on May 25, 2010, 04:11:41 PM
Did you find any remains of the mandatory emissions reduction kit?

I'm not sure what that all includes..?..

I'm going to start with replacing the ballast resistor tonight and see how far that gets me.

There was a little brain box with wires, a vacuum switch, a temp probe, and a label in the engine bay that instructed to retard the timing. The law was overturned I believe in 1976 and many were removed, but sometimes you will find remnants of the system, and occasionally on cars rarely driven, they will still be intact.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 08:32:26 PM
Quote from: 375instroke on May 25, 2010, 05:42:23 PM
I hate the shotgun method.  The ballast resistor is just a wire.  It works or it doesn't.  If the car runs, tap it to see if there is something loose causing your intermittent misfire.  Same for the coil.  I've never had a coil or ballast go bad on me, and I've been driving pieces of junk for 25 years now.  All of them with points and a ballast.  Seeing as you have the "race" ignition module, I'd suspect it.  The tach jumping is what leads me in that direction.  It's driven by the ignition system, not engine RPM, so an erratic ignition would cause it to jump around.  What's the voltage on your coil positive terminal when running?

I just ran the car and the voltage at the coil between the positive and negative is between 7 to 8 to 12 and back to 7.   i'll get a video of it shortly.

Here it is:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0DBSizZyt4

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 09:43:50 PM
Quote from: tan top on May 25, 2010, 03:09:35 PM
Quote from: Hemidog on May 25, 2010, 08:05:44 AM
Quote from: tan top on May 25, 2010, 07:57:34 AM
yes !think its a race only one though , for a electronic ignition set up  :scratchchin:   :scratchchin:???? :popcrn:
yep :iagree:
they can over heat & cook the coil when used on the street  :shruggy:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DCC-3690732

Is this what i should be using instead of the race voltage regulator?
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: General_01 on May 25, 2010, 09:50:45 PM
That looks like the one that was on my '69.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 09:54:04 PM
Looks like i need the VR706...  :shruggy:

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,58463.msg653549.html#msg653549

(http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=58463.0;attach=103832;image)


EDIT:  I found the one i need.  I did some research at lunch time and i found the company that makes the one i found on ebay.  They are called Regitar, and they are out of Alabama.  They located the nearest dealer to me who was in Michigan called Barsanco 800-421-3374.  I called and ordered two of them for $7.50 each plus shipping.  One for a spare.  I'll find out in a couple days after they arrive how good they are.

Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: 375instroke on May 26, 2010, 01:36:33 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 08:32:26 PM

I just ran the car and the voltage at the coil between the positive and negative is between 7 to 8 to 12 and back to 7.   i'll get a video of it shortly.

Paul
Is this between the positive and negative coil terminals?  I mean from ground to the positive coil terminal.  The negative coil terminal is constantly switching between an open, and ground, with points, and a current sink with electronic ignition.  The positive terminal gets full battery voltage when starting, which would be about 9 volts or so because of the starter load, and gets about 9 volts when running because it's in series with that ballast resistor.  Turn the key on, but don't start the car.  Now check the voltage at the positive coil terminal while you tap on the ballast.  It there isn't a change in voltage, I'd say it's good.  It will probably be 12 volts, not 9 volts, because there isn't a load on the circuit.  Is there an analogue bar graph with that meter so you can see how fast it's fluctuating when running?  What is the output of the voltage regulator?  What is the output of the alternator?  Check at idle, and at 2000RPM, or so.  I'm sure there's a reason that electronic ignition module is labeled race only.  I'm not sure about that blue regulator, but I have seen ones that look like it, although I don't know if they were the same part numbers, sold with the stock electronic ignition conversion kits sold by Mopar.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on May 26, 2010, 02:17:04 PM
Quote from: 375instroke on May 26, 2010, 01:36:33 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 08:32:26 PM

I just ran the car and the voltage at the coil between the positive and negative is between 7 to 8 to 12 and back to 7.   i'll get a video of it shortly.

Paul
Is this between the positive and negative coil terminals?  I mean from ground to the positive coil terminal.  The negative coil terminal is constantly switching between an open, and ground, with points, and a current sink with electronic ignition.  The positive terminal gets full battery voltage when starting, which would be about 9 volts or so because of the starter load, and gets about 9 volts when running because it's in series with that ballast resistor.  Turn the key on, but don't start the car.  Now check the voltage at the positive coil terminal while you tap on the ballast.  It there isn't a change in voltage, I'd say it's good.  It will probably be 12 volts, not 9 volts, because there isn't a load on the circuit.  Is there an analogue bar graph with that meter so you can see how fast it's fluctuating when running?  What is the output of the voltage regulator?  What is the output of the alternator?  Check at idle, and at 2000RPM, or so.  I'm sure there's a reason that electronic ignition module is labeled race only.  I'm not sure about that blue regulator, but I have seen ones that look like it, although I don't know if they were the same part numbers, sold with the stock electronic ignition conversion kits sold by Mopar.

Yes it was the negative terminal on the coil.  I'll re-run the tests tonight that you asked for and report back.  I used my timing light to get the voltage readout and i dont think it has an analog readout, but i'll double check tonight.

Thanks for your help,

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: moparstuart on May 26, 2010, 02:43:03 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 09:54:04 PM
Looks like i need the VR706...  :shruggy:

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,58463.msg653549.html#msg653549

(http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=58463.0;attach=103832;image)


EDIT:  I found the one i need.  I did some research at lunch time and i found the company that makes the one i found on ebay.  They are called Regitar, and they are out of Alabama.  They located the nearest dealer to me who was in Michigan called Barsanco 800-421-3374.  I called and ordered two of them for $7.50 each plus shipping.  One for a spare.  I'll find out in a couple days after they arrive how good they are.


use the thin one they are great

I  am running them on my 69 road runner and they do the job great , no more bouncing gauge  
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tricky lugnuts on June 22, 2010, 12:19:57 PM
I've been following this thread, as I'm also considering a "close to stock" rebuild of my 440 engine, trying to get the best performance and mileage that I can for my limited dollars.

Great documentation of the process and great work and sounds like a great engine you've got.

Sorry to pester you now that you're out cruising, but when you get a chance, can you update exactly what parts went into this build?

I know you reused .03 over TRW pistons and went with a EX268 Comp Cams camshaft, but do you know what the deck height and compression ratio were? All other parts were bone stock?

Is this the camshaft you used:

http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CC&Product_Code=21-223-4&Category_Code=WDGCAMhydFTXE
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on June 29, 2010, 12:05:10 PM
Quote from: tricky lugnuts on June 22, 2010, 12:19:57 PM
I've been following this thread, as I'm also considering a "close to stock" rebuild of my 440 engine, trying to get the best performance and mileage that I can for my limited dollars.

Great documentation of the process and great work and sounds like a great engine you've got.

Sorry to pester you now that you're out cruising, but when you get a chance, can you update exactly what parts went into this build?

I know you reused .03 over TRW pistons and went with a EX268 Comp Cams camshaft, but do you know what the deck height and compression ratio were? All other parts were bone stock?

Is this the camshaft you used:

http://www.compperformancegroupstores.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CC&Product_Code=21-223-4&Category_Code=WDGCAMhydFTXE

Oh dont worry about disturbing me from cruising, i'm not doing any of that at the moment http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,70995.0.html

:brickwall: :brickwall: :brickwall:

I'll come back and try to put up more detail of the build after lunch.  But its basically everything you see here already.  Compression ration came in at 9.6:1

Paul
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: tricky lugnuts on July 01, 2010, 09:53:42 AM
That's cool. Thanks for following up with my post.

I've been reading about your difficulties with local wildlife. I'm sorry to hear about those troubles. You have my fully sympathy, man. That's a terrible thing to see happen.

Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: PocketThunder on July 20, 2010, 11:49:31 AM
I've got almost 1200 miles on the car now and i am averaging 13 mpg.   :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Supercharged Riot on October 29, 2012, 09:33:19 AM
nice thread!
Lots of pics of the rebuild process
I wish i had a 440  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: mhinders on November 11, 2012, 04:30:02 AM
Quote from: PocketThunder on May 25, 2010, 09:12:42 AM
I'm driving my Charger last night and the tach needle starts jumping all over the place and the car is cutting in and out.  Is this the ballast resistor going bad?  The coil?  The voltage regulator?  Something with the electronic ignition?   :shruggy:
Paul
I had the bouncing tach needle in my 67 and the reason was a bad grounding between the gauge cluster and battery ground. You can easily check by installing a separate grounding wire.
Title: Re: 69 "Cali"fornia Car 440 stock build ......... DYNO RESULTS
Post by: Supercharged Riot on November 17, 2012, 02:57:53 PM
This is an great detailed thread.
Thanks for posting!  :yesnod: