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Discussion Boards => Charger Discussion => Topic started by: green69rt on March 09, 2009, 10:05:39 PM

Title: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on March 09, 2009, 10:05:39 PM
I've just acquired a 69 charger that I want to restore so I thought I would start a thread to describe the stages and details of that work.  This is my first restoration so a lot of you will recognize old problems, mistakes and steps.  I will post whatever is going on at the time an will try to put a lot of detail in the thread.

So here goes.

I bought this 69 Charger from a guy near Chicago that advertised is fairly clearly.  First problem is that one man's description is another man's problem (more later!!) I've had the car about two years and have spent the time tearing in down and figuring out what I need to do.  I will add more notes and pictures as I get time.  

All comments are welcome.  There is such a hugh amount if knowledge out there that I am overloaded.

Here is a picture of it on arrival.  It is a SE car with a 383 2bbl auto, 273 no sure grip rear end.

All I can say is it was in much worse shape than I hoped.  More later
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 69*F5*SE on March 09, 2009, 10:48:14 PM
Is that car F5 green?  Can't really tell by the pic.  :shruggy:  Ted
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 09, 2009, 10:51:01 PM
Build sheet says F3 but I want F5.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 09, 2009, 10:59:25 PM
Second try to add more detail.

The car came with a bunch of parts.  Evidently the guy I bought it from had hopes of restoring it but backed out.  The package deal included a new interior, bumpers, floor pan, and a bunch of other parts.  The car did run and we actually drove it into the garage, where it sets now. Brakes didn't work and it had no exhaust system ( cut off after the stock exhaust manifold. )

I will skip the dissassembly.  First section will talk about the rear section of the car.  Frame rails had seen a bumper hitch (I think) come and go. Lots of repairs for rust.  The rust was not stopped, it was everywhere!!  Hand made rear cross member (behind the rear valence.)

So here are a couple of pictures.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: The70RT on March 09, 2009, 11:04:34 PM
Nice car, good luck on the resto. I had a 69 the same color back 30 years ago.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: skip68 on March 10, 2009, 01:01:54 AM
 :cheers:  Welcome to the site green69rt.    What are the plans for the car ?  Keep it stock or pump it up with some more power ?   
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: FlatbackFanatic on March 10, 2009, 01:35:35 AM
Welcome! Looks like you got alot of work ahead of you.Good luck, and keep us posted, there is alot of info you can get here.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: mopar_nut_440_6 on March 10, 2009, 02:03:10 AM
Good luck with your project. they are a lot of work but well worth it in the end!

Looks lie a great start.

Welcome

:2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on March 10, 2009, 04:21:36 AM
hello & welcome  :wave:  looks a good project  :yesnod: , keep the pictures coming  :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1969chargerrtse on March 10, 2009, 05:33:42 AM
Hey there and welcome to the site.  I did the same thing with my car which is post my slow restoration as I moved along.  The plan is to print out every page for a book to keep for memory lane.  Beautiful car and I know what you mean by " All I can say is it was in much worse shape than I hoped. ".  Looking forward to further pictures and progress.  Rob.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Just 6T9 CHGR on March 10, 2009, 08:41:33 AM
Good luck with the resto & welcome to the site :cheers:

F3 green is a really nice color when its fresh & not a common color in the sea of reds & darker greens.

Please take the time to register the car is you haven't already..
www.1969chargerregistry.com


Some F3 examples
(http://www.1969chargerregistry.com/gallery/albums/69chargers/F3_GREEN.jpg)
(http://www.1969chargerregistry.com/gallery/albums/69chargers/69_F3_Charger_440_driver_side_cropped_resize.sized.jpg)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger_Fan on March 10, 2009, 06:07:32 PM
Welcome to the site. :wave:
Looks like you got a good project on your hands, despite it's rust ailments. The good part is that your timing was excellent, as far as parts availability. With all the new repop stuff that's been coming along, the job has been made quite a bit easier. :2thumbs:

Looking forward to progress updates. :)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Davtona on March 10, 2009, 10:13:04 PM
Looks like it is a vinyl top car. Curious what color was the vinyl top? Are you going to put it back on or not. Also wondering what color the interior is.    :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: vancamp on March 11, 2009, 07:19:24 AM
Best of luck with it, keep pictures posted :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 11, 2009, 09:26:28 PM
Quote from: NOT Just 6T9 CHGR on March 10, 2009, 08:41:33 AM
Good luck with the resto & welcome to the site :cheers:

F3 green is a really nice color when its fresh & not a common color in the sea of reds & darker greens.

Please take the time to register the car is you haven't already..
www.1969chargerregistry.com


Some F3 examples
(http://www.1969chargerregistry.com/gallery/albums/69chargers/F3_GREEN.jpg)
(http://www.1969chargerregistry.com/gallery/albums/69chargers/69_F3_Charger_440_driver_side_cropped_resize.sized.jpg)

I actually had a new 69RT in my younger and more foolish days,  Drove it around up north for 10 years and it literally fell apart in my driveway.  I ended up parting it out to some hot rodders in 1981 (they just wanted the engine and tranmission.

My intent is to make the car F5 green which is between the two cars you show ( I think).
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 11, 2009, 09:29:44 PM
Quote from: skip68 on March 10, 2009, 01:01:54 AM
:cheers:  Welcome to the site green69rt.    What are the plans for the car ?  Keep it stock or pump it up with some more power ?   

Car came with a 383 2bbl.  I want to put a 440 stroker in it.  There is a local place near here called DiamondBack motors.  They build a wide selection of Mopar engines.  Anybody got any news on them??
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Sublime/Sixpack on March 11, 2009, 09:42:46 PM
F5 should look good on your car.   A stroker will be fun.  P.S. I'd hang on to the 383 if its the original mill.  Good luck with your resto.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: hemigeno on March 12, 2009, 12:53:37 AM
Quote from: green69rt on March 11, 2009, 09:29:44 PM
There is a local place near here called DiamondBack motors.  They build a wide selection of Mopar engines.  Anybody got any news on them??

Diamondback used to be owned by Dave Schultz (a/k/a Big Kahuna) from MoparStyle.com.  I thought he still owned it, but when I visited 'Style just now to confirm that fact I found a thread where he said back in January of this year that he no longer owns Diamondback and was liquidating a bunch of parts. 

Are you sure Diamondback is still in business?  Could be that he just sold off to someone else, I dunno.

BTW, welcome to the site.  F3 Green is a good color, a friend of mine has a F3 Green '69 HemiCharger that I like the looks of quite a bit.  Good luck with the resto!

:cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: bsakal on March 12, 2009, 04:50:50 PM
Keep it F3! I like F3, that's what color mine is. But it's your car, I'm sure any color you pick will be cool.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 16, 2009, 07:44:30 AM
Can anyone give me a hint on how to add pictures inside of a note rather than as an attachment?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: hemigeno on March 16, 2009, 01:13:08 PM
Quote from: green69rt on March 16, 2009, 07:44:30 AM
Can anyone give me a hint on how to add pictures inside of a note rather than as an attachment?

If the pictures are hosted somewhere -- including pictures already posted on this site --, simply copy and paste the link to the desired picture inside [img][/img ] brackets (without the space inserted before the last bracket).

Lots of information about posting pictures in the Help section too.

:cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 426HemiCharger on March 16, 2009, 09:44:42 PM
Keep her all stock - Restoration guideline: If you are not happy with the car and you modify it it wasn't the right car to buy first of all.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: PocketThunder on March 17, 2009, 12:41:20 PM
Quote from: 426HemiCharger on March 16, 2009, 09:44:42 PM
Keep her all stock - Restoration guideline: If you are not happy with the car and you modify it it wasn't the right car to buy first of all.

What?   :popcrn:

Maybe the guy can build his car the way he wants.   :Twocents:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger_Fan on March 17, 2009, 01:43:23 PM
Quote from: PocketThunder on March 17, 2009, 12:41:20 PM
Quote from: 426HemiCharger on March 16, 2009, 09:44:42 PM
Keep her all stock - Restoration guideline: If you are not happy with the car and you modify it it wasn't the right car to buy first of all.

What?   :popcrn:

Maybe the guy can build his car the way he wants.   :Twocents:
:iagree: This car isn't a 1 of 6 HEMI car or something, it's not even an R/T. Building it the way he wants will not make it any less valuable & will make it more fun for him, the owner to drive.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 426HemiCharger on March 17, 2009, 03:52:10 PM
Keeping it stock is not the same as #s matching so that STILL means he can build it the way he wants.





:icon_smile_angry:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 24, 2009, 10:39:18 PM
I still haven't figured out how to insert pictures inside the text yet, if anybody knows how could you give me a hint?

After I cut of the rotten rear frame rails I was going to repair the driver side wheel well that had been patched by a previous owner.   This is the patch in question (first picture.)   It was spot welded and screwed on to the old section of wheel well. I started by stripping all the paint, undercoating, seam sealer, rubber sealant, etc off.  Then began adding some weld metal to fill the holes and rugged seams.  Then ground down to make it look better, weld, grind, weld, grind, weld, grind.  I was spending a lot of time. As I look ahead I see that there is more patches to be made and my dress-up of the old patches is not looking very good (second picture.)

Things look bad when I get to the front part of the well (third picture, notice the rotten inner rocker.  Another story.)  More patches and some more rust holes where the well meets the rear floor board.  I decided to cut out the old patches, buy a new wheel well and do my own patch.  It can't look any worse than what was there. 

So, here's the result (fourth picture.)  I know you can't see much, especially since I slathered POR Patch on the seam.  This is turned out so much better than the old patch.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 426HemiCharger on March 25, 2009, 04:04:35 PM
What the hell are you talking about, thats great!!! :yesnod:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 30, 2009, 10:34:20 PM
OK, here is a question for you folks!  I'm reaching a point of decision, replace the quarters or not?  Here's the situation.  The existing quarters have been repaired at least once and probably twice.  You can see seams inside the trunk that show where the repairs were made (underneath all the undercoating that was sprayed inside the trunk!!)  See the first picture.  The outside of the quarters show that the body lines have disappeared.  See the second picture.  I also need to get to the rear part of the rockers (sometime called the sill rails to do some repairs) on the inside and outside.

So the questions are 1.) do I replace the quarters (my intent was to do it?)  2.) Who makes a good skin or quarter panel with nice sharp lines? 3.)  What's easiest, to replace up to the line where the sheet metal turns horizontal or to go over this line and get into the top part(close to the gas tank filler cap?)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: mopar_nut_440_6 on March 31, 2009, 11:05:07 AM
Quote from: green69rt on March 30, 2009, 10:34:20 PM
OK, here is a question for you folks!  I'm reaching a point of decision, replace the quarters or not?  Here's the situation.  The existing quarters have been repaired at least once and probably twice.  You can see seams inside the trunk that show where the repairs were made (underneath all the undercoating that was sprayed inside the trunk!!)  See the first picture.  The outside of the quarters show that the body lines have disappeared.  See the second picture.  I also need to get to the rear part of the rockers (sometime called the sill rails to do some repairs) on the inside and outside.

So the questions are 1.) do I replace the quarters (my intent was to do it?)  2.) Who makes a good skin or quarter panel with nice sharp lines? 3.)  What's easiest, to replace up to the line where the sheet metal turns horizontal or to go over this line and get into the top part(close to the gas tank filler cap?)

If it was me I would install full quarters right up to the seam in the sail panel. I am currently working a a 2nd gen which had the RH quarter welded along the seam at the top edge of the 1/4 where it meets the flat edge of the 1/4 and this was not too bad to deal with. There is minimal filler on this side and it was a quick easy finish. The LH side was cut along the top of the panel about half way into the gas filler cap area (2 inches in on the flat)and it was a mess. The heat warped this panel quite badly and I spent many hours hammering and dollying it back into shape. The oil canning was very bad. It came out pretty good but at one point I was ready to cut the panel off and order a new AMD full 1/4. I like the AMD products I have used them and they seem to fit very well and I feel the quality is good. Just my opinion!

The other thing to keep in mind is every time you open your trunk you would look at the inside and think "Why did I not change the 1/4's? I would anyway. I am not a professional bodyman but I can weld and fab much better so it is far easier for me to start with nice new metal than to have to try to sculpt a body! Looking at your pictures I would bite the bullet and change the 1/4 and I am confident you will be happier in the long run knowing that you repaired the car, IMHO, the correct way!

Cheers,

James

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 426HemiCharger on March 31, 2009, 11:12:53 AM
Looks like a great repair but I really can't judge it since its not my car and I can't see the repair. Anyway I would order a new quarter from Goodmark

Here's the link:

http://ecom.goodmarkindustries.com/cgi-bin/NLNETUPD?co_id=GM/&reqr_type=O&session_no=RROTZD4DREEU19O94GO4GO97E&NL_ORDER_NO=0&cust_no=999999&LOC_NO=001&request_id=QCSTKLST1&mkt_level_1=1969&mkt_level_2=DODGE&mkt_level_3=CHARGER&mkt_level_4=600-699&mkt_level_4_title=quarter%20panels%20and%20skins,%20wheelhouses,%20bedsides

I would only cut and replace what is necessary to keep maximum structural integrity. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger74 on March 31, 2009, 12:02:21 PM
Quote from: hemigeno on March 12, 2009, 12:53:37 AM
Quote from: green69rt on March 11, 2009, 09:29:44 PM
There is a local place near here called DiamondBack motors.  They build a wide selection of Mopar engines.  Anybody got any news on them??

Diamondback used to be owned by Dave Schultz (a/k/a Big Kahuna) from MoparStyle.com.  I thought he still owned it, but when I visited 'Style just now to confirm that fact I found a thread where he said back in January of this year that he no longer owns Diamondback and was liquidating a bunch of parts. 

Are you sure Diamondback is still in business?  Could be that he just sold off to someone else, I dunno.

BTW, welcome to the site.  F3 Green is a good color, a friend of mine has a F3 Green '69 HemiCharger that I like the looks of quite a bit.  Good luck with the resto!

:cheers:

I think he sold it off to one of his partners, I think it's Damon Kuhn (Fugly) that owns it now.    Damon is a good builder and should be able to build you a great motor.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charger_cody on March 31, 2009, 01:20:36 PM
Looks good man.
Keep those pics coming.   :cheers:


:popcrn:


Cody
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 426HemiCharger on April 30, 2009, 10:01:25 PM
post more!!! I love to watch restorations go together.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 69*F5*SE on April 30, 2009, 11:21:43 PM
Yeah, I'd like to know how things are moving along too. 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1969chargerrtse on May 01, 2009, 05:19:54 AM
Hello?  Looking good.

:popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 17, 2009, 11:19:50 PM
Ok, here's my story of working on the rear corners of my 69 Charger.  I've heard all the stories of how the repop parts don't fit so I was prepared.  I have a pair of corners I bought and was starting to go through the process of adapting them when I said to myself 
"why don't I get out my old corners and see how they compare to the repops??"

I keep all the old parts of the car until the new part are in.  I like to check shape and weld points etc.  As I was looking I said "why spend many hours adapting the new parts when the old parts would work??"  Picture one shows the old and new, lots of difference!!  The actual height is about 3/8 inch!!  So I cleaned up the old part, it will take some weld repairs to fix the points where I cut it off the car but the parts that show are perfect!!

Another picture of the old (left) vs the new (right). 

So after cleaning up the old corner I've started to fit it to the car.  I have a valance from Y1 and it so far the old corner fits fine!!  So much better than the repop!!




Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Hemidog on May 17, 2009, 11:34:37 PM
Hey, if you're old ones are in that good condition, they are a 1000000 times better!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 69*F5*SE on May 18, 2009, 09:04:18 AM
Yeah, if you can get away with using the original corners by all means use them if they fit better. They look to be in good condition. 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 20, 2009, 08:38:28 PM
Quote from: 69*F5*SE on May 18, 2009, 09:04:18 AM
Yeah, if you can get away with using the original corners by all means use them if they fit better. They look to be in good condition. 

I'm going to use the originals.  I spent the day cleaning them up, welding up the cuts I made getting them off and doing a little more fit up.  I may take the new flanges off the repops and weld those to the old corners to complete the installation.  More later.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration rear frame and trunk floor.
Post by: green69rt on May 23, 2009, 10:02:25 PM
I'm kind of skipping around a little on the story but here's the some more.  Since I started in the trunk I have now replaced the rear frame rails, rear spring brackets, gas tank brace, rear frame cross member (behind the valance) and the rear shock brace.  Both inner wheel wells have been patched and the new trunk floor is in. 

Picture one shows the new rear frame and spring brackets and the gas tank bracket.  The spots on the frame are where I left holes in the POR15 so I could plug weld the trunk floor to the frame.  I started by placing the floor in and marking the underside of the floor with an outline of the frame.  Pulled the floor out.  Then I drilled a bunch of 5/16" holes (next time I think I'll just go with 1/4".)  Then I put the floor back in and marked through the holes with a sharpie onto the frame.  Pulled the floor back out.  I stuck little paper circles to the frame over the sharpie marks then painted inside and outside the frame with POR15.  Pulled the dots off and painted the bare spots with weld-thru primer.  Put the floor in, AGAIN, and clamped it in place.  Plug welded all the holes, ground them down and finished the inside of the floor with POR15 then some high build primer to clean up the remaining pits in the welds.

The second picture shows the passenger side wheel well patch.   It's shiney because the paint is still wet.  Third picture is the passenger side well from the passenger compartment.  The fourth picture is the trunk floor ready to install with a bunch of plug weld holes drilled in it.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration Trunk floor part 2
Post by: green69rt on May 23, 2009, 10:09:04 PM
Just a little more info.  The first picture shows the trunk floor in primer and before sanding.  Let me say first that I put the primer on with a brush!!  Two coats.  For the trunk it won't matter to me and besides I'm going to sand the whole thing down before the final spray on coat of primer.  The second picture shows the underside of the floor before I get under it and dress up all the weld burn marks.  My appologies for the poor pictures but it's hard to shoot good ones in the trunk and from 2 feet away under the car.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: mopar73 on May 23, 2009, 10:26:27 PM
Keep up the good work :2thumbs: gotta love the pics
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 426HemiCharger on May 23, 2009, 10:39:21 PM
I know I love the pics. ;)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 10, 2009, 08:36:18 PM
Quote from: Davtona on March 10, 2009, 10:13:04 PM
Looks like it is a vinyl top car. Curious what color was the vinyl top? Are you going to put it back on or not. Also wondering what color the interior is.    :2thumbs:

From the pieces of the old top still on the car it was a green vinyl top.  I'm still debating going with the original (I like the look) or a black top.  Probably stick with the green.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 10, 2009, 08:49:26 PM
Quote from: 426HemiCharger on March 16, 2009, 09:44:42 PM
Keep her all stock - Restoration guideline: If you are not happy with the car and you modify it it wasn't the right car to buy first of all.

I'm pretty happy with this car other than the fact that my expectations of the condition were higher.  I deliberately bought this car because I wanted to feel free to modify it to suit myself. Engine mods, suspension mods, electronics are all up for grabs.  Basic body and appearance will stay stock but the rest is up to me.

This is not a number matching car, it would not be a high value car and I think that today a lot of folks would consider this a "parts" car.  While I understand your comment I hope you can see what my thought process was when buying the car.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: hemigeno on June 11, 2009, 10:02:43 AM
Quote from: green69rt on June 10, 2009, 08:49:26 PM
Quote from: 426HemiCharger on March 16, 2009, 09:44:42 PM
Keep her all stock - Restoration guideline: If you are not happy with the car and you modify it it wasn't the right car to buy first of all.

I'm pretty happy with this car other than the fact that my expectations of the condition were higher.  I deliberately bought this car because I wanted to feel free to modify it to suit myself. Engine mods, suspension mods, electronics are all up for grabs.  Basic body and appearance will stay stock but the rest is up to me.

This is not a number matching car, it would not be a high value car and I think that today a lot of folks would consider this a "parts" car.  While I understand your comment I hope you can see what my thought process was when buying the car.

Don't sweat the comment made about your car or chosen restoration path.  There's a reason why that particular member isn't welcome around here at the moment.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 30, 2009, 09:29:25 PM
Next episode!  This restoration is really taking longer than I thought, but I also don't have as much time to work on it as I thought!

So I got the trunk floor in and tacked the new rear valance on.  Then I thought that I would just do a test fit of all the final pieces on the rear of the car before I went any further.  The bumper braces that mount inside the trunk took a little work but nothing remarkable, the trunk lock brace fits fine except for one place at the bottom which required a little trim.  Then comes the bumper!

I must have fit that thing up three or four times before I decided to take the bumper off and test it for straightness.  What I found was that the bumper was curved downward at both ends, like it was sagging at the ends from its own weight.  This bumper was purchased by the previous car owner and was still in the box from Goodmark.  I had no reason to think there was anything wrong so planned to use it as is.  After closer inspection the chrome job was pretty poor so I guess I will take it to a local shop to get straightened and re-chromed.

The bumper fit looks good from a few feet in the camera but not any closer. If you look at the ends you can see how low the bumper sets down from the quarter end moldings.  Maybe 3/8 inch on both ends and thats with the center a little high.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 06, 2009, 09:58:51 PM
It's been a while since I put anything up.  Things move a lot slower than I hope.  With the trunk floor in I moved on to the driver side outer wheel well.  It was a lot easier than I thought.  The inner and outer wheel wells came from different makers and so were slightly different in the flange shape.   They still fit but getting both from the same maker would probably have made the fit up easier.  I just cut the old well at the flange and welded the new well on top of the old flange, another 1/16" of metal wasn't going to make any difference.

First pic is the new wheel well installed.  Second pic is of a small patch that was needed because rust got into the inner window frame.

Now I plan to move on to replacing the inner and outer rockers (yep, both!!!)  The third Pic is of the inside of the rocker that I took from the rear wheel before I put in the new well.  Lots of rust!  The inner rocker is to the right, see the rotten metal??  To the left is a bent out piece of the rear quarter,  The rocker metal underneath had been cut away and not replaced in a previous incarnation.  The metal edges you see are the old cut. 

Finally, the fourth pic is of what I found in the driver side rocker.  Something had taken up residence sometime in the past and left its nest behind.

More on the rocker saga later.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 06, 2009, 10:22:02 PM
Now on to the driver side rocker. The outer and inner need replacing.  AMD supplies the outer metal.  I had a fab shop make me up a piece of 16 ga. for the inner. It's pretty much a straight piece of flat plate with a few indentations for the various braces. More on that later. First a look at the existing rocker. The fist pic is of the front of the rocker. The outer rocker had been patched sometime in the past by someone that just welded the new metal on top of the rusty old metal so when all the old metal was gone the rust moved right into the new. When I inspected the bottom flange on this rocker I found four layers of metal, old inner, old out, new outer and some patches on the inner.  

The second pic is at the rear of the driver side inner rocker, in some places I could put my hand inside the rocker through the rust holes. The third pic is of a inner rocker patch. Funny thing about this patch is that is was only welded at the bottom so any water that was washed up on it would be sure to migrate into the rocker and continue the rust process!!  Fourth pic is of the patch after I cut off the bottom weld.  It just fell off!

Now onto the repair plan.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: The70RT on October 09, 2009, 06:28:02 PM
Sorry that you found more carnage. Looks like youre handling it well though :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Aussiemadonmopars on October 11, 2009, 06:29:52 AM
I noticed too on post #167 photo no. 4 that there was a pile of insulation like material you pulled out of the rocker panel. I had the same shit in mine as well, it's got me buggered what it was for... and only on that side as well.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 11, 2009, 08:23:51 AM
Quote from: Aussiemadonmopars on October 11, 2009, 06:29:52 AM
I noticed too on post #167 photo no. 4 that there was a pile of insulation like material you pulled out of the rocker panel. I had the same shit in mine as well, it's got me buggered what it was for... and only on that side as well.

I assumed that it was the nest of some kind of rodent that had made a home in the rocker at some time.  If you had the exact same thing then now I wonder if it might have been something different???
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Hemidog on October 11, 2009, 08:48:33 AM
Quote from: green69rt on October 11, 2009, 08:23:51 AM
Quote from: Aussiemadonmopars on October 11, 2009, 06:29:52 AM
I noticed too on post #167 photo no. 4 that there was a pile of insulation like material you pulled out of the rocker panel. I had the same shit in mine as well, it's got me buggered what it was for... and only on that side as well.

I assumed that it was the nest of some kind of rodent that had made a home in the rocker at some time.  If you had the exact same thing then now I wonder if it might have been something different???

I had the same material in my rockers too, it's insulation from the carpet and seats that rodents have gathered.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2009, 11:25:47 PM
I keep having little victories and little setbacks, overall I think I am making progress.  The driver side rocker panel was in bad shape, both the inner and outer panels were either rusted beyond hope or had been patched to cover up the rot and rust.  Every time I worked on or around the rocker I would get a big shower of rust dropping to the floor.  The rocker is a major load carrying portion of the body as it connects the front of the car to the rear.  The only other thing that goes between the front and rear is the floor and the roof.

In the first picture you can see a portion of the driver side rocker.  You can see the big rust holes in it.  There's more holes that you can't see.  You can also see the front leaf spring hanger.  It was shot, rusted, bent and patched.  It has a little of the floor still attached.

The second picture shows the front section of the rocker (near the driver's feet.)   More holes.  This section is important because there are two braces that come off of it that connect to the front frame rails (front frame supports the engine.)

The third picture shows the new inner rocker metal.  I know it looks a little rusty but that is just some surface rust left over from spraying it with phosphoric acid/zinc phosphate solution)  I replaced the old metal that looked like 18 ga. steel with 16 ga. to add a little strength.  

And finally the new leaf spring hanger.  Welds need to be cleaned up, it's really difficult to get into some of these places with a wand and see what you're doing, but the welds are good, I checked the penetration.   Now on to the outer section!!!

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: The70RT on December 20, 2009, 07:05:31 PM
Looks like you are progressing  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration, question on splash shields
Post by: green69rt on April 29, 2010, 03:27:10 PM
Just a question for now.  I took the front fender off and the splash shields that go between the wheel well and the door post.  Attached picture shows the new one in place for testing.  My question is does this shield have any gasket or sealant between it and the body of the fender??  If a gasket, does anybody know where to get them??

Thanks
Mitch
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration, question on splash shields
Post by: tan top on April 29, 2010, 04:04:20 PM
Quote from: green69rt on April 29, 2010, 03:27:10 PM
Just a question for now.  I took the front fender off and the splash shields that go between the wheel well and the door post.  Attached picture shows the new one in place for testing.  My question is does this shield have any gasket or sealant between it and the body of the fender??  If a gasket, does anybody know where to get them??

Thanks
Mitch


yeah got mine from yearone

http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/part.asp?pid=SR2&c=0&e=0&cat=1&hid=120CT15405&trk=


been a few years since i orderd them just looked , cant recall that part# could of changed though !!  :shruggy:

 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration, question on splash shields
Post by: green69rt on April 30, 2010, 10:27:21 AM
Quote from: tan top on April 29, 2010, 04:04:20 PM
Quote from: green69rt on April 29, 2010, 03:27:10 PM
Just a question for now.  I took the front fender off and the splash shields that go between the wheel well and the door post.  Attached picture shows the new one in place for testing.  My question is does this shield have any gasket or sealant between it and the body of the fender??  If a gasket, does anybody know where to get them??

Thanks
Mitch
yeah got mine from yearone
http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/part.asp?pid=SR2&c=0&e=0&cat=1&hid=120CT15405&trk=
been a few years since i orderd them just looked , cant recall that part# could of changed though !!  :shruggy:


Thanks, I'll call Y1 and see if I can get any more info.

Mitch
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 01, 2010, 11:22:20 AM
More on the driver side rocker.

Since I now have the inner rocker replaced I feel I can cut out and replace the outer rocker.  It wasn't as bad of a job as I thought it would be.  Just took some patience and fitting up and taking down the new part about 20 times.  The new rocker from AMD fit real nice but it took a lot of triming and straighning of the old metal to get it to fit as well as I wanted.  The first picture shows the old rocker gone.  The second is the final fit up of the new metal.  The last picture shows the part welded in.  The white runs are where I coated the weld areas with weld through primer before welding.  I also coated the inside of the new inner rocker with POR15 before I closed the rocker up.  I also spent some time sanding and painting the inside of the rear window well with POR15 since I had the quarter cut off.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 01, 2010, 11:28:41 AM
More on the drive side rocker.  Finished!!

First picture is rocker installed and cleaned up.  Second picture shows rocker and also finished window well, no rust ever again!!  Third picture is the front rocker with the end cap
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (door post repair)
Post by: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 08:27:53 AM
Well It is now time to tackle the repair I've been putting off because it looked so messy and difficult, the passenger side hinge door post.  It looks pretty bad along with the inner kick panel and the rust has even gotten into a little of the firewall. First picture shows original condition of the kick panel (before I replaced the rocker.)  Second shows the outer post and its condition.  Third picture shows a patch on the outer section that someone had done in the past.  Fourth picture is another from the outside.  At this point I have started to cut away some of the worst of the rot and also cut away the front of the rocker.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (door post repair)
Post by: tan top on July 03, 2010, 08:31:32 AM
Quote from: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 08:27:53 AM
Well It is now time to tackle the repair I've been puting of because it looked so messy and difficult, the passenger side hinge door post.  It looks pretty bad along with the inner kick panel and the rust has even gotten into a little of the firewall. First picture shows original condition of the kick panel (before I replaced the rocker.)  Second shows the outer post and its condition.  Third picture shows a patch on the outer section that someone had done in the past.  Fourth picture is another from the outside.  At this point I have started to cut away some of the worst of the rot and also cut away the front of the rocker.

thats time consuming to put right  :yesnod:  anychance to cut a chunk out of another car & splice it in  :scratchchin:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 08:36:05 AM
Demo is done.  I've cut away all the rot and am down to good metal all around.  As I posted in previous posts the rocker is now 100%!.  It's amazing how little of the bottom of the post is left.  I spent time makeing sure the car was braced with 2x2 angle iron before I started cutting anything. 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (door post repair)
Post by: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 08:38:09 AM
thats time consuming to put right  :yesnod:  anychance to cut a chunk out of another car & splice it in  :scratchchin:
[/quote]

Thought about it but the parts are so small that cutting the donor parts, preping and fitting did't seem like any faster than what I did, stand by.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 08:43:16 AM
So I just took this step by step.  First the inner door post.  This is actually a lot of the strength, it's heavy gauge metal.  Looks to be 14 or maybe even 12 ga.  I took ann old piece of frame (from a previous demo) and used as the repair.  I also added a little weld material to the existing metal to add some strength since it was badly pitted.  Probably overkill but not a lot of work.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 10:03:47 AM
I decided to do the kick panel next.  The first two pictures show the final product.  Biggest problem was how to fab the piece aroung the hole in the kick panel.  Third picture shows what I did.  I happened to have a firewall from a donor car (Picture shows my car not the donor, but you get the idea) and the hole the steering column goes through matches the profile of the kickpanel almost exactly.  Cut and paste!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 03, 2010, 10:16:48 AM
And finally the outer door post.  First picture is of the part I had to fab.  It is made up of a bunch of curved pieces welded together.  Took me a whole day to make. The second and third picture shows part being fit up.  And the fourth is the final installed part.  Actually I took more pictures because I was so proud of this job.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on July 03, 2010, 08:21:00 PM
nice  work!!!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: goosesgarage on July 04, 2010, 12:47:28 AM
good work its nice to know there are still people out there that will not take any shortcuts on sheet metal repair. Seen way to may cars full of bondo and undercoating
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on July 04, 2010, 02:31:04 AM
 :scope:   ........... :yesnod:  nice work  :2thumbs:................. :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 04, 2010, 11:55:12 AM
Thanks for the comments and encouragement.  Now it's on to a small firewall repair and then the transmission cross member.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: dodgert68 on July 05, 2010, 12:35:30 PM
Just wanted to make a note of your use of POR15 as i see you really like it. Its a decent product for use on rusty metal but is terrible for clean unrusted metal, it won't adhear very well. I recently did a 69 Charger that had POR on some new rear whell tubs and i was able to blow it off the metal with a blow gun and high presure air. It would be better to paint the new repaired areas with a good quality epoxy primer and then as in the rocker panels coat the insides with a good undercoating. POR isn't cheap stuff and i hate to someone wasting money by improperly using a product. Looks like your doing a nice quality repair job keep up the good work.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 05, 2010, 01:29:44 PM
Quote from: dodgert68 on July 05, 2010, 12:35:30 PM
Just wanted to make a note of your use of POR15 as i see you really like it. Its a decent product for use on rusty metal but is terrible for clean unrusted metal, it won't adhear very well. I recently did a 69 Charger that had POR on some new rear whell tubs and i was able to blow it off the metal with a blow gun and high presure air. It would be better to paint the new repaired areas with a good quality epoxy primer and then as in the rocker panels coat the insides with a good undercoating. POR isn't cheap stuff and i hate to someone wasting money by improperly using a product. Looks like your doing a nice quality repair job keep up the good work.

I've heard the same thing, as you said, from others also.  So I asked around and found that by cleaning the metal with a Norton Stripper wheel I can clean the metal and also give the metal some "tooth" that makes the POR15 stick so well that I've not had any peeling problems.  In fact, if I need to get it off I've had to sand or use the same stripper wheel to get it off.  Some of the places have been coated for over two years and are holding up like new.   I did have a little problem when I first started using it just like you said but adding the "tooth" to the metal seems to have fixed it. Just as a final note, even though I'm using POR15 on all my new and old metal, I plan to blast the whole car when all the sheet metal work is done and then use a 2X epoxy primer.  For now the POR15 is keeping the rust at bay.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 05, 2010, 03:36:44 PM
I note on how I prepare metal for painting.  I use a Norton "Rapid Strip" wheel on an angle grinder (first picture.)  I use it to remove paint, rust, undercoating, seam sealer and anything else I can reach with it.  Cons are that it can't get into some corners and they are fairly expensive, about $6 apiece.  I've used 20-30 so far and will probably need 10 more to finish this job.  So figure 40 X $6 = $240 to strip and metal prep my car, maybe not so bad.

The other thing I have tried is a paint stripper wheel that mounts on a portable drill (second picture.)  I didn't like them because they didn't seem to do as good a job on rust and where harder to Maneuver.  Just my :Twocents:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on July 05, 2010, 06:10:43 PM
I also have used the por 15 on clean metal after prepping it with a 3M stripping wheel on a roloc tool.  Also I use a Metal etch solvent and have had no issues with peeling .


Keep it up  your going great!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charger_fan_4ever on July 08, 2010, 02:04:00 PM
I just had the passengers side door hinge pillar changed on my 70. I bought a set of rust free ones that already had the spots drilled. Luckily the inner rockers and inner beside the kick panel,firewall and splash shield were not rotten. The whole cowl is cut off and the inner and outer cowls are seperated blasted/primed ready to be installed in 2 pieces.

I'll have to start a thread too.

I'm going to be another AMD poster boy lol.

How is your inner rear window frame ? Thats the only stump i've come across. Mine is non existent about 6 inches up from the corners. For everything else there is AMD  :smilielol:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 07:06:56 PM
Quote from: charger_fan_4ever on July 08, 2010, 02:04:00 PM
I just had the passengers side door hinge pillar changed on my 70. I bought a set of rust free ones that already had the spots drilled. Luckily the inner rockers and inner beside the kick panel,firewall and splash shield were not rotten. The whole cowl is cut off and the inner and outer cowls are seperated blasted/primed ready to be installed in 2 pieces.

I'll have to start a thread too.

I'm going to be another AMD poster boy lol.

How is your inner rear window frame ? Thats the only stump i've come across. Mine is non existent about 6 inches up from the corners. For everything else there is AMD  :smilielol:

My rear window was good except for a couple of holes down in the lower corners.  A little weld metal and some epoxy putty and they are good as new.  I'll be interested to see the cowl work.  I have to do some repair of my lower front window frame.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charger_fan_4ever on July 08, 2010, 08:40:36 PM
Shoot me your email and i'll send you a pic of it with the upper and lower cowl completely off. The pic is larger than 200kb. My cowl was rotted in the lower corner drivers side where it met the top of the firewall, lower window channel non existent rot came over onto the top side of the upper, vent grille was even pitted. Lower cowl was rotted around where the 2 large vent holes are. Passengers corner of the lower cowl out over the splash shield was rotted. We contemplated patching the lower, but chose to replace all with a  rust free cowl, separated it blasted/primed it. Lower is 1/2 welded in. Before the whole cowl was cut out the front floor and new passengers hinge pillar was welded in along with a piece of tubing spotted between the A pillars. New cowl and door pillar fit in like a glove, measured out identical to the original.

My two brothers run a body shop. I do most of the dismantling,blasting,priming. The welding I left to them.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 10:31:10 PM
PM sent.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 10:38:04 PM
Quote from: charger_fan_4ever on July 08, 2010, 08:40:36 PM
My two brothers run a body shop. I do most of the dismantling,blasting,priming. The welding I left to them.

You're lucky to have blasting and painting facilities available.  I'm still trying to get a blasting setup for my home garage.  Just bought the biggest compressor that I can run off my house current.  Ingersol Rand 3 HP with a 60 gal tank.  Folks tell me that it will barely do the job with a blaster but what can I do?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charger_fan_4ever on July 09, 2010, 07:00:55 PM
Quote from: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 10:38:04 PM

You're lucky to have blasting and painting facilities available.  I'm still trying to get a blasting setup for my home garage.  Just bought the biggest compressor that I can run off my house current.  Ingersol Rand 3 HP with a 60 gal tank.  Folks tell me that it will barely do the job with a blaster but what can I do?

They have a 7hp compressor and when blasting you can't do much else on another hose.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 10, 2010, 02:19:53 PM
Quote from: charger_fan_4ever on July 09, 2010, 07:00:55 PM
Quote from: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 10:38:04 PM

You're lucky to have blasting and painting facilities available.  I'm still trying to get a blasting setup for my home garage.  Just bought the biggest compressor that I can run off my house current.  Ingersol Rand 3 HP with a 60 gal tank.  Folks tell me that it will barely do the job with a blaster but what can I do?

They have a 7hp compressor and when blasting you can't do much else on another hose.
Yes, I figure I going to be spending some time waiting for my new compressor to catch up when I go blasting.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: XS29L9B2 on July 14, 2010, 01:14:42 PM
there is so rusty  :o
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 23, 2010, 03:55:49 PM
Working on the pass side rocker is the same story as the driver side with the addition of the door post repair.  So no big news here.

First pic is the old pass inner rocker, same story as the driver side, lots and lots of rust and holes.

Second pic is the pass side front spring hanger, again same as the driver side, it will go!

Third pic is the new inner rocker installed.  No pic of new outer rocker, it would be repeating driver side.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 23, 2010, 04:05:58 PM
So now that the rockers are solid, a little repair of the firewall and it will be on to the next job.

First pic is inside of pass side firewall.  I didn't spend a lot of time grinding down the weld since it's going to be buried under the sound proofing.

Second is the outside of the pas side.  I did grind this side down smooth, I know it's not very visible either but I did it so no wise cracks.

Third is starting the same process on the driver side.  I got both patches off of a donor firewall.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 23, 2010, 04:17:03 PM
Next thing I took on was the torsion bar cross member.  It had been patched sometime in the past, as you'll see.  AMD makes a replacement so I'm going to take a shot at it.  Turns out it was actually pretty easy.  Demo is always the messy part and this was no different.

First pic shows the bar gone.  I have to leave the connections to the front frame rails in as an alignment reference to the new Xbar.  Hopefully AMD will get production of the front frame rails going soon!!  I plan to get a pair.

Second pic shows the new TB Xmember installed.  Only work required was rebending the flanges on the end to match the slope of my homemade inner rockers.  Otherwide I just stripped off the EDP coating from the weld points, primed the weld points with weld thru primer, stuck it in and welded away!  Oh, I forgot, I also installed the torsion bars just to insure good alignment with them.

Third pic shows a cross section of the TB Xmember with the multiple layers of metal someone had added.  I could see the original metal inside the patches and, again, the new was just welded on top of the old so as the old rusted away the rot continued into the new metal.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 23, 2010, 04:29:31 PM
Spent a little time cleaning up the driver side quarter window regulator parts and replacing the rollers.  Sure was a  lot easier to install with the quarter gone.  I should have waited to pull all the parts out till I had the quarter off rather than do is as part of generally stripping the car.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: The70RT on August 23, 2010, 08:22:49 PM
Looks like your doing a great job. After you get this one done you will know all the tricks to get the next one done easier. Oh yeah I got the part today. Thanks again.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: ionracer24 on August 24, 2010, 12:43:22 AM
wow,  congrats on ur ingenuity,  i'm probly going to have to do alot of "freestylin" metal work on my 70 also,  ...looks great though, love the pics
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: DC_1 on August 24, 2010, 09:24:29 AM
Quote from: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 10:38:04 PM

You're lucky to have blasting and painting facilities available.  I'm still trying to get a blasting setup for my home garage.  Just bought the biggest compressor that I can run off my house current.  Ingersol Rand 3 HP with a 60 gal tank.  Folks tell me that it will barely do the job with a blaster but what can I do?

I would go rent a gas powered compressor and Sandblaster (if you don't have one) and do all your blasting at once. The small compressor you have will be difficult to use for this job. Something that small will not have the CFM to supply the blaster consistent air volume. You'll spend more time waiting to build pressure than blasting. Also the compressor will run continuously and as a result build up moisture which will end up in the lines and then clog up the blast nozzle.( don't ask how I know all this, its a frustrating experience I want to forget.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 24, 2010, 09:53:10 AM
Quote from: Sydmoe on August 24, 2010, 09:24:29 AM
Quote from: green69rt on July 08, 2010, 10:38:04 PM

You're lucky to have blasting and painting facilities available.  I'm still trying to get a blasting setup for my home garage.  Just bought the biggest compressor that I can run off my house current.  Ingersol Rand 3 HP with a 60 gal tank.  Folks tell me that it will barely do the job with a blaster but what can I do?

I would go rent a gas powered compressor and Sandblaster (if you don't have one) and do all your blasting at once. The small compressor you have will be difficult to use for this job. Something that small will not have the CFM to supply the blaster consistent air volume. You'll spend more time waiting to build pressure than blasting. Also the compressor will run continuously and as a result build up moisture which will end up in the lines and then clog up the blast nozzle.( don't ask how I know all this, its a frustrating experience I want to forget.)
I  have received the same advice from others so am strongly considering you plan.  Was actually considering just sending it to someone to have it done.  Probably the $$ will decide which plan I follow.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: bakerhillpins on August 24, 2010, 10:29:22 AM
WOW, you are my hero! Looking great.  :2thumbs: And I am with you on smoothing down the welds regardless of their visibility!

As far as sandblasting, maybe just send out the big stuff and work the smaller ones with the setup you have put together?  :shruggy:  :Twocents:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (Window roller assembly)
Post by: green69rt on December 15, 2010, 08:55:39 PM
I've seen several threads and notes on how to replace the rollers on the windows but when I got to it I adopted a fairly simple method.  Pics show how it works:

Pic 1:  place a suitable open end wrench in a vise.
Pic 2:  place the window roller assembly in the opening of the wrench.
Pic 3:  knock the assembly out of the nyloin roller with a pin driver (punch with a flat face.)

Use a pair of large pliers to press the new roller onto the pin, take some care to get it all the way on, that it goes on straight and that you don't mar the roller or the assembly.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 15, 2010, 09:18:23 PM
Ok, so now with the frame in good shape, the window regulator working nicely and the wheel well and rocker repaired I have moved on to tackle the driver side quarter.  So the good part is that my decision to use only a quarter skin vs. a full quarter really worked well.  I bought skins (yes both sides) from AMD and they really fit nice.   The old ones had been patched at least twice, had lots of filler on them and I had to cut big holes in them to replace the wheel wells and rockers so they weren't worth saving.  At this point I am actually adding more metal to the car than I am cutting off!!!

First pic shows the finish of cutting all the old quarter off.  The new parts are actually reproduced to be replaced up to the line on the roof (white band) but I didn't want to get into messing with the trunk gutters, roof bracing etc, so I just cut the metal into the top part of the quarter and bought what's called a "skin".  Blue paint is the trunk floor in primer and the black thing is the new wheel well.

Second pic:  Ok, so the first fit-up.  I've been emailing with people that have done this and compared to some of the horror stories I've heard, this seems to fit like a glove.  Just a little massaging around the tail light panel and it was done.  The biggest worry I had was the little flip-up at the back end of the panel and blending the new metal to the old so I just left the old flip-up alone and cut the new panel to butt up to it.

Door fit is great, wheel well fit is great. It took a little work at the very bottom where the panel connects to the rocker but not too bad.  Now take it back off, strip all the EDP paint off (black stuff) at the points that I'm going to be welding, prime the weld points up with weld-through-primer and on to the final step!!

Third Pic: Ok, for better or worse, it's on!!  The body line down the middle of the fender is now visible, on the old fender it had been repaired so many times that it had been smoothed over.  I did have one small problem that we'll see in the next picture.

Pic 4: Here's the ugly!  People have told me about this and it happened to me but not for the reason that others told me about.  If you look closely at the top of the fender near where the roof connects you can see some waviness in the metal, this is called "oil canning" because it resembles the crinkles in old time oil cans (you can actually see it in the first pic if you look carefully and this is before any welding.)  Anyway I caused this because I decided to use my flanging tool to set up the old metal.  Trouble is that the flanging tool is meant to be used on FLAT metal not curved.  Every time I clamped down with the jaws it tried to flatten the metal in the immediate area and put stress between that area and the rest of the curved metal, result is oil canning.  So it will take a small amount of body filler and some block sanding.  Looks like nothing thicker than about 1/16 inch.

So with this lesson learned, it is on to the passenger side!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: BB1 on December 16, 2010, 10:02:19 AM
You are a body GOD! :popcrn: Nice work  :scope:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2010, 03:51:37 PM
Major work completed in the last couple of months. As I talked about in my previous post the driver quarter is on.  I used the lesson on that side to get the pass side on with less pain and time.  First I forgot about using the flanging tool and just did a straight lap weld.  I cut the old quarter along the line where the top goes out and then turns down. This made a nice guide for fitting the line of the quarter plus when you look inside the trunk you can's see the seam because it is in the corner.  Anyway the pass quarter is on and other parts are getting added fast (yeah!!)

I put both the trunk extensions in.  These were a bigger pain than I thought they would be.  Maybe the new AMD extensions work better than these ones I bought 3 years ago from Y1.  But it really didn't matter, just cut, bend clamp and hammer till they fit right and put them in.  I also got the valence corners added and they took some work because they hook up to the valence, quarter and rear cross brace.  But again, I just took my time and I must have fitted them up 20 time before they got tacked in place.

Also put the jack socket (??) and the jack spring hook in place.  ALso added a couple of pieces of sheet metal where MOPAR left the big holes at the corners of the trunk floor,  now it won't take a pound of seam sealer in each corner to keep the water out.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on December 16, 2010, 04:29:42 PM
good stuff ! keep the pictures coming  :popcrn: :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (trunk finish)
Post by: green69rt on January 09, 2011, 08:27:16 PM
SO with the quarters and trunk extension installed I wanted to take a little time to spray some primer inside the trunk and to seal it up.  I was so tired of having a multicolored car that I wanted at least one part to look clean.  SO I shot the trunk with some epoxy two part primer and then sealed all the cracks up with SEM seam sealer.

So the first pic is a general shot of inside the trunk.  All the dark lines is the seam sealer, it really stinks, I mean REALLY stinks!! Second shot is the back of the tail light panel and the driver side of the trunk.  The third shot is the inside where I welded the skin onto the passenger old quarter.  The seam is really hard to see.  If fact if I didn't tell anyone that it was there I don't think they could tell what I did.  So at this point I need to install the bumper bracket braces and the trunk lock bracket, touch up the primer and the trunk is finished till it's time to paint.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: drifter69 on January 09, 2011, 10:21:13 PM
I got to tell you man, when I first looked at your car I said to myself, Looked at cars before I bought the one I am restoring now that were better than yours and passed them up because they were so far along in the rust. That being said I am so glad to see that there are people like you that are able to take a car like this and save it from where I would have let it go. It does make me now wonder if there are more Chargers out there than I originally thought. I have looked at production numbers and what is registered and after seeing what you have done with this car I have to take into consideration that there are more people like you and that the numbers of cars still alive might be more than I thought. You are an inspiration to those who really want a Dodge Charger. I do have to say that now I am wondering if I made a mistake passing on a 69 R/T SE car That was rusted to the center body line on the car. :scratchchin: Nice job brother they ain't makin anymore like em. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on January 09, 2011, 11:56:15 PM
Quote from: drifter69 on January 09, 2011, 10:21:13 PM
I got to tell you man, when I first looked at your car I said to myself, Looked at cars before I bought the one I am restoring now that were better than yours and passed them up because they were so far along in the rust. That being said I am so glad to see that there are people like you that are able to take a car like this and save it from where I would have let it go. It does make me now wonder if there are more Chargers out there than I originally thought. I have looked at production numbers and what is registered and after seeing what you have done with this car I have to take into consideration that there are more people like you and that the numbers of cars still alive might be more than I thought. You are an inspiration to those who really want a Dodge Charger. I do have to say that now I am wondering if I made a mistake passing on a 69 R/T SE car That was rusted to the center body line on the car. :scratchchin: Nice job brother they ain't makin anymore like em. :2thumbs:
There are only a fixed number of these cars out there.  Every one that is parted out is one less that will be around 30 years for now for people to remember what a muscle car was (does that make sense??)   I may not finish the one I'm doing but when I pass it on it will be better than it was and maybe someone will take it as a family member and keep it alive. 

Enough of the philosophy, and on with the rebuild, slow but sure.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: djcarguy on January 10, 2011, 12:29:25 PM
 : :2thumbs: :popcrn:       wow- some great work in saving that charger , i can do some hammer and panel swap.  but man your :2thumbs: skill and drive to stay at it and conquer all those rust areas. sure makes me wish i had kept the rust free shells ,even 4 doors for doner panels. who know 20 years ago and on west coast we dont see that massive rust . my 69 dart gt was just front unibody damage 3o yrs ago. friend scraped 69 sattillie ht quarter damage no rust.i may end up in mopar fire pit..   great work and what u mean may not keep it after all that??????   and what is even left to blast,   you have like replaceD  EVERYTHING,ALLMOST,LOL ..   keep and drive it :icon_smile_wink:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger_Fan on January 10, 2011, 11:00:24 PM
You've really made some awe-inspiring progress on that car! :o I'm really looking forward to future installments on your project, keep at it.  :bow:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (Trunk finished)
Post by: green69rt on January 16, 2011, 06:31:32 PM
I am declaring victory on the trunk!!  Last week has been really cold here in Houston so not much done but I did take enough time to get in there and weld in the bumper braces, and the lock brace.  Then I went over the whole trunk floor again to clean up all the burn marks plus marks left from me climbing in and out and the hose marks from the welding lines.  Then I shot another coat of primer to freshen everything up.  I even shot the outside of the tail light panel so my wife can see that I'm making progress ( I don't think she had much confidence that anything was getting done!!)  So first pic is of the outside of the tail light panel.  Second pic is the inside of the panel then the next two show the new braces and the the trunk lock brace.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charge69 on January 16, 2011, 06:51:23 PM
Some very nice work going on there! I haven't really followed your thread but, it must have been pretty far gone when you started.  Keep at it and it will get done.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on January 16, 2011, 07:28:27 PM
looking good  :yesnod: :coolgleamA: :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on January 19, 2011, 04:43:56 PM
Well the I've decided to tackle the front window frame next.  It is another part I have not been looking forward to.  Both lower corners are in really bad shape.  Rusted through, but the rust does not look like it got into the flange where the upper cowl meets the lower cowl.  It does look a little ugly aroung the bottoms of the A pillers.  I'm thinking of going after this in one of three ways.  All three involve cutting up or using a whole new upper cowl from AMD so it is on order today I think I got a good deal thru 521 Restorations.  Got the discount from this website.

First is to only replace the window channel.  This would involve the least replacement of metal but welding in the new channel right up to the point where it turns out to the top surface of the cowl looks a little dicey.  And I will have to go that far cause the rust is right up to that point.

Second is to cut the top part of the cowl away down to where it is behind the hood but not to where it attaches to the lower cowl and firewall.  This looks easier than the first method but only leaves a small amount of the old cowl and why do that instead of....

Third, replace the whole thing and be done with it.  I can then get inside the cowl and clean it all up and rust proof inside the cowl easily.

Attached are pics of the window frame areas that are of concern.   Pic one and two are the lower corners.  Three is the top edge which looks real good and the fourth is one of the A pillers.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charge69 on January 19, 2011, 08:35:11 PM
My hat is off to you, Mitch and I will also wait for an answer from the experts for you.  That just looks like too much rust for me to tackle but, I am not that good at this sort of thing. With all the rust, I would just bite the bullet and replace as much as I could but that is   just me!   

Good luck on the work and an answer.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Patronus on January 19, 2011, 08:45:01 PM
I've used Jeff from 521 Restorations for all my big ticket items. Quarters, glass, valence, grille chrome.. he's always been super great to deal with. Got some items dropped shipped when he was away, or saved on group purchasing/shipping, even went to pick up in-stock items. He's got quite the stable and shop facilities so he knows what he sells. 

You may want to try leading some of that, much of that a pillar was lead from the factory.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: XS29L9B2 on January 20, 2011, 05:56:35 AM
nice work your car was very rusty  :o
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (reason for doing this particular car)
Post by: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 05:15:26 PM
Just thought that I would throw this up.  The attached picture is my wife beside the car I bought new on the day of our first date.  She was 17 so you can do the math.  When I retired I decided to need a full time hobby so I bought the car that I am restoring and want to make I a clone like we had when we first got married.  It's been a pretty good 40 years, just wish that I had kept the old car along with the wife.  I think the picture was taken with an old Kodak instamatic so no complaints about picture quality.

New episode coming as soon as I can pick out the pictures of the cowl replacement.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: stripedelete on May 18, 2011, 05:49:42 PM
Just read your entire thread.  How do you walk with those giant testicals?

So, you're actually building a time machine.  Very cool..:2thumbs:

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (reason for doing this particular car)
Post by: tan top on May 18, 2011, 06:30:56 PM
Quote from: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 05:15:26 PM
Just thought that I would throw this up.  The attached picture is my wife beside the car I bought new on the day of our first date.  She was 17 so you can do the math.  When I retired I decided to need a full time hobby so I bought the car that I am restoring and want to make I a clone like we had when we first got married.  It's been a pretty good 40 years, just wish that I had kept the old car along with the wife.  I think the picture was taken with an old Kodak instamatic so no complaints about picture quality.

New episode coming as soon as I can pick out the pictures of the cowl replacement.


good back in the day picture  !  thanks for sharing  :cheers: :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (new cowl is installed!)
Post by: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 07:32:21 PM
I finally decided how to handle the front window frame.  I replaced the complete upper cowl with new metal from AMD (they should give me a big discount!!)  I spent a while sanding the lower cowl and getting it prepped for the new piece.  I stripped and sanded and then coated the whole thing with POR15.  Then I put the windshield wiper pivots back in to help with the alignment of the new piece.  Stripped off the POR15 from the places I wanted to weld and coated those place with weld thru primer. 

Now, I had to decide how to seal the upper cowl to the lower cowl along the flange where the dash bolts up.  If this is not water tight then water can get from inside the cowl into the passenger compartment.  I ended up using SEM Heavy Body sealer (part no 40377).   I used that particular sealer because it's advertised as having an extended working time of 15 to 30 minutes as opposed to the regular sealer that only gives you 10-15 minutes (I know, I used the regular one on my trunk.)  First I scuffed up the POR15 and the weld thru primer in the area that I thought that would be in contact with the sealer so it would bond well.  Then I put a heavy bead down on the flanges with a little extra on the side towards the passenger compartment.  Then I clamped the new upper cowl to the lower cowl.  Lots of clamps!!  Then I cleaned up the sealer that squeezed out of the flanges and plug welded everything down.

If I had to do it again, I would not plug weld the flange where the dash attaches.  I would either notch out the upper cowl to provide weld points or just seam weld along that flange.  Either method would keep the heat of the welding further away from the sealer.  As it was, every time I welded the flange the seam sealer caught fire and I had to keep putting it out with a wet rag.  It turns out that the seal was still good (I tested it by getting a garden sprayer with a flexible hose in the cowl thru the vent openings and sprayed water to test the seal, all A-OK.)

First pic is the lower cowl prepped for paint.
Second pic is Cowl clamped in place and shows all the sealer oozing out.
Third pic is the cowl clamped in place for welding (notice all the clamps!!)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 07:44:55 PM
One final issue around the cowl.  Mopar soldered the area between the cowl and the A piller.  I debated a long while on how to handle this joint.  When I took off the old cowl I ended up removing all the old solder (I assumed it was a lead solder) by heating it up with a butane torch till it ran and scrapiing off as much as I could.  I really worked hard at this step because I knew that I would have to grind any residual off which I did with a funny looking sheet over my body and using a industrial grade particulate mask.  

So when the cowl was installed I had a fair size gap between the new cowl and the rest of the body.  I kind of fished around for a solution (soldering was considered, but I didn't want to spent much effort on new tool and skills) so after talking to some body guys I just decided to fill the gap with some weld material.  I laid a layer of weld bead down and ground it down then another on top of that and a final grinding got it real close.  A thin layer of filler and it will be done.

First pic shows the gap in question.
Second pic shows the welded joint waiting on primer and filler.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 72Charger-SE on May 18, 2011, 09:33:03 PM
I am intimidated to cut the floor pan out of the driver's side as I am unsure how to weld the new one back in.  All the frame rails and frame supports have undercoating from the factory and what wasn't undercoated was covered in red clay which pretty much preserved it.  I wish I had your knowledge, ability, and vision...  I am very impressed and look forward to seeing your car completed.   GOD Bless! 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 09:40:17 PM
Quote from: 72Charger-SE on May 18, 2011, 09:33:03 PM
I am intimidated to cut the floor pan out of the driver's side as I am unsure how to weld the new one back in.  All the frame rails and frame supports have undercoating from the factory and what wasn't undercoated was covered in red clay which pretty much preserved it.  I wish I had your knowledge, ability, and vision...  I am very impressed and look forward to seeing your car completed.   GOD Bless! 

Thanks for the kind words but I was in the same situation as you.  I've never doen this before, I'm a fair mechanic but very amateur body man.  Look on this site for help.  My thoughts as I go through this job is to do what I can at each stage.  If all you know is that you need to cut out rust then find a way to do that.  Then work from there.  Most important is to develop your welding skills.  Two things about welding...  1) practice counts so get some scrap and practice and/or take some lessons at your local high school (I did, twice!!) 2) remember the the grinder is the welders friend.  You can always cut out a bad piece and do it again or you can grind down sloppy welds to look good.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (reason for doing this particular car)
Post by: 1969chargerrtse on May 19, 2011, 05:19:54 AM
Quote from: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 05:15:26 PM
Just thought that I would throw this up.  The attached picture is my wife beside the car I bought new on the day of our first date.  She was 17 so you can do the math.  When I retired I decided to need a full time hobby so I bought the car that I am restoring and want to make I a clone like we had when we first got married.  It's been a pretty good 40 years, just wish that I had kept the old car along with the wife.  I think the picture was taken with an old Kodak instamatic so no complaints about picture quality.

New episode coming as soon as I can pick out the pictures of the cowl replacement.
Wow R/T SE.  I love old original pictures.  So It came with those white walls?  You're doing a awesome job.  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (reason for doing this particular car)
Post by: green69rt on May 19, 2011, 07:42:59 AM
Quote from: 1969chargerrtse on May 19, 2011, 05:19:54 AM
Quote from: green69rt on May 18, 2011, 05:15:26 PM
Just thought that I would throw this up.  The attached picture is my wife beside the car I bought new on the day of our first date.  She was 17 so you can do the math.  When I retired I decided to need a full time hobby so I bought the car that I am restoring and want to make I a clone like we had when we first got married.  It's been a pretty good 40 years, just wish that I had kept the old car along with the wife.  I think the picture was taken with an old Kodak instamatic so no complaints about picture quality.

New episode coming as soon as I can pick out the pictures of the cowl replacement.
Wow R/T SE.  I love old original pictures.  So It came with those white walls?  You're doing a awesome job.  :2thumbs:
Yeah, I remember those old Firestone Wide Oval nylon tires with the thin white walls.  I think they last 2200 miles!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: TUFCAT on May 19, 2011, 09:10:54 AM
Awesome work!!!!...are you sure you've never done this stuff before?

Just FYI, theose were Goodyears not Firestones....Chrysler didn't use a Firestone tire on a car until the Omni/Horizon came out.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 19, 2011, 02:14:33 PM
Quote from: TUFCAT on May 19, 2011, 09:10:54 AM
Awesome work!!!!...are you sure you've never done this stuff before?

Just FYI, theose were Goodyears not Firestones....Chrysler didn't use a Firestone tire on a car until the Omni/Horizon came out.

Now that you jog my memory, I think you are right.  Whatever they were, they  sure wore out fast!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: TUFCAT on May 19, 2011, 04:17:50 PM
...and a 440 will do that! :D

Its truely amazing to see a guy do all this metal work himself - in his home garage!! .... I can't wait to see the finished project.  :2thumbs:

Do you have any pics of the car as purchased?  I'm curious to see how it looked before it came apart showing off all those hidden "treasures". :o  
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 19, 2011, 06:55:22 PM
Here's a couple of pic of the car when I received it.  This is a classic case of not having the car professionally inspected before purchase.  

First pic... doesn't look too bad except for the dented front fender.
Second pic....  I knew the rear frame was in bad shape, you can see what looks like holes from a trailer hitch or something.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: TUFCAT on May 19, 2011, 10:25:30 PM
Wow, it really didn't look that bad on top...or the bottom actually :shruggy:

I bought a Tennessee car that looked pretty good on top except for dead original paint. I didn't think Tennessee cars got any "real" rust compared to Michigan cars, but I found an unusually rusty one.  It showed typical rust the bottom of both front fenders and lower quarters (found to be the type that makes big holes when poked with a screwdriver) but I was shocked that the floors and crossmembers were a rusty mess - but nothing like yours thank goodness. :eek2:

This car must have lived on, and been driven on dirt roads for years. Thick dirt can hold moisture like a sponge especially when parked on a dirt floor, or a damp place. This car from Tennessee was actually rusting from the bottom up!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: TUFCAT on May 19, 2011, 10:26:45 PM
At least the grille looks nice....:2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 19, 2011, 10:34:02 PM
The car did run when I got it home, I drove it into the garage.  Had to be careful as one wheel cylindar was leaking and the brake fluid ran out fast.  Almost ran into my work bench except that I did a Fred Flintstone to get it stopped in time.  That was the last time it moved under it's own power.  Biggest disappointment I've had with the car was how bad the rockers and the front frame rails were.  I was counting on all the other bad stuff but not the rockers and the front frame rails.  Life is full of little surprises, right?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration - engine bay work
Post by: green69rt on August 09, 2011, 10:59:25 PM
With the heat in Houston this summer, it's been a little slow going.  I have started the engine bay work.  I've been taking things easy as I wait for AMD to start producing the front frame rails, so I knocked out a couple of easy things.  The inner fenders needed replacing and the firewall needed a good cleanup.  It seemed the easy thing to do was to clean the firewall up while the inner fenders were gone.  I've only screwed the inner fenders in till I see how I'm going to put the new frame rails in.  I know there are several different paints in the pics but it'll all get primed later.

Pic 1:  The old engine bay
Pic 2:  Driver inner fender gone
Pic 3:  Firewall cleaned up
Pic 4:  Both new inner fenders screwed in place and firewall cleaned up.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on August 10, 2011, 02:41:16 AM
 :coolgleamA:  .............. :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: ACUDANUT on November 28, 2011, 10:15:27 AM
Please don't paint it green, after all that hard work. :Twocents:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: BigBlockSam on November 30, 2011, 08:15:11 PM
 :cheers: :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: lexxman on December 01, 2011, 08:12:29 PM
it's looking good ........ :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 04, 2011, 09:55:12 PM
Quote from: ACUDANUT on November 28, 2011, 10:15:27 AM
Please don't paint it green, after all that hard work. :Twocents:

I know there is some concern about another green car....but this will be green.  I plan on the F5 semi metalic geern.  That was my former car and as someone said, this is a time machine for me.  

Buy the way I did finally get the front frame rails from AMD and I will post pic later.   Right now the wife has me doing a full rebuild of our guest bath room and it is eating my lunch!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: buckeyecharger on December 05, 2011, 10:40:41 PM
Couldn't agree more with you Mitch! Paint it F5. Mine still has it's original F5 paint and when it gets repainted, it'll be F5 again just like when it came out of the factory! Keep the pics coming.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: red69superbee on December 06, 2011, 12:02:04 AM
very good pics Mitch, i have a charger just like it and f3 color too, so its neat to me to see it that way.Cant weait till its done !
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on January 01, 2012, 04:14:43 PM
Been a while since I posted anything.  I've been spending all my time rebuilding our upstairs bathroom.  Getting close to done.  No progress on the my car but I thought I would just add a couple of pics so folks can see what I'm up too.

First pic is my garage which is the staging space for the construction,  I can't belive what a mess I have.  It'll take me a couple of weeks just to clean up so I can get back to work on my car!!

Second pic is my workbench, you really can't see the work surface because of all the crap piled on it.

Third pic might be of more interest.  AMD finally shipped my front frame rails to me.  Notice that the shock tower is not attached when they shiped it.  I don't know why, the box was easily big enough to ship everything as one piece.

This is one of the first times I have been dissapointed with an AMD product.  Notice that the e coating is gone, I had to strip it off because it appeared to me that the rail had been laid in the mud or had been splashed with mud and then e coated over the top of the mud!  When I stripped everything the e coating came off as the black I expected and then a layer of brown stuff underneath came off, and the layer of brown was not rust, it was brown dirt!


Antway I think that as soon as the garage is cleaned up I'll get back to work.  More later.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: freddyd02 on February 04, 2012, 03:33:15 PM
You're doing an amazing job! Cant wait to see the end result  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration - front frame rail
Post by: green69rt on May 31, 2012, 06:43:51 PM
Wow, been a long time since I had any progress to report but I'm finally getting some time to work on the charger again.  The front passenger frame rail took some work and some thought.   Here's what I did.  First I made sure that the body of the charger was level and square.  I started by making sure the rockers were level on both sides.  Then I leveled across the body in several places (example in pic one.pic #1 and #2).  I also checked the measurements out of the FSM.  They all checked within 1/8 inch.

Now I checked level across the front frame rails (it was good), cut the passenger rail out and clamped the new one in and rechecked everything again (pic #3.)

Just for grins I also checked that the bottom radiator support was level (notice that the pass side panel is missing, it's being replaced with a 26" piece.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration passenger shock tower
Post by: green69rt on May 31, 2012, 06:58:49 PM
Now onto the thing that has been worrying me, installing the shock tower.   AMD ships the tower separate from the rail so it's up to the installer to get it right.   First thing is that I attached the k member to the rails (after I spent a couple of days trying to get the layers of grease and dirt off), pic 1.

I also screwed the inner fender back in just to keep things lined up (pic 2.)

Then I got the old control arms and spindles out and installed them and braced the spindles so the that the hight adjustment was in spec.  The I set the cam bolts to the middle of their slots and tested the level of the spindle faces to try to get as close to neutral as possible so the car would take an alignment for camber and castor when the time came.  (pic 3)   With everything set it was tacked in place, ALL the measurements were repeated and final welding begins.

While I had the rail out I took time to get in and clean up the pass side inner fire wall, kick panel and underside of the cowl and paint them (pic 4).
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (front frame complete!!)
Post by: green69rt on September 04, 2012, 09:52:10 PM
I think the old lady is now sturdy enough to stand going up on a rotiserie or supporting an engine.  The driver side front frame rail is installed (pic #1) and to record it for the history books the old frame is gone (pic #2).  Still big hunks of rust inside when I dropped it on the floor.  Again, getting the shock tower tacked in was a labor of measuring, testing and a little prayer (I'm not above asking for help.)  Pic #3.  Just to show one of the tests -- I set the control arms up with the cam bolts set to the middle of their adjustment (after setting the suspension height) and then set the face of the spindles so they were straight up and down with a level.  (pic #4.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 04, 2012, 10:04:42 PM
And so the front frame and inner fenders are done!!  (pic #1 and 2.)   In between working on the frame I spent time cleaning the inside of the firewall and repaired a couple of the floor braces that had seen better days.  Inside the firewall is all primed up (pic #3) and bracing is ready ((Pic #4.)  Now on to the floor, but AMD is out of stock of the piece under the rear seats so I'm waiting again.  Shipping them seperate is pretty expensive.  So I will spend some time cleaning up the passenger compartment ceiling and what ever else I can find to keep me busy (maybe I will break down the doors.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: TUFCAT on September 04, 2012, 10:32:15 PM
WOW!  Your attenton to detail on this build is amazing. Skills like this are usually reserved to pro shops. :yesnod: CONGRATS on doing it yourself!  :2thumbs: :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ryan on September 05, 2012, 12:52:47 AM
You are going a great job. Keep it up.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on September 05, 2012, 06:22:27 PM
amazing the amount of parts that are available for the b body,  i'm starting to think you cold build an entire car from air!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ghoste on September 05, 2012, 06:39:13 PM
It's a refreshing change from not too many years ago isn't it?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 24, 2012, 10:05:22 PM
Yes the amount of parts available keeps me guessing.  I just discovered that AMD has been making the braces that attach to the front frame for a few months.  Kind of would saved me some time but cost some money so a little of a quandery.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 24, 2012, 10:18:52 PM
Some good and some not so much.  I used the filler in the first pic on a recommendation.  I have to say that I would not use it again.  Not easy to sand and the fact that it has fiberglass in it ment that I wore a lot of protection while sanding.

Second pic is something that I think is a great tool.  Got it from Autobody toolmart.  A disc that mounts on an angle grinder using my existing sanding pad.  It applies a little heat to high spots of metal and as the metal cools it shrinks down closer to the surrounding metal.  Excellent!!.

Just a couple of more shots of the quarter.  The filler is all less than 1/16 thick but the filler I used was not the best.   Still works but I think you could come up with something better.  On the other side I think I will use something called "light weight filler".  We'll see how that works out.   The last pic shows just how loooooong the quarter is!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ryan on September 27, 2012, 02:05:35 PM
looking good.

Now hurry up and paint it so I can see some pictures of the fresh F5 and then maybe I can make up my mind about painting mine f5 or not.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration - engine bay work
Post by: hemi68charger on September 27, 2012, 02:09:22 PM
Quote from: green69rt on August 09, 2011, 10:59:25 PM
With the heat in Houston this summer, ...

Houston !!!  This is in Houston? I need to come by and see this puppy !!!  I'll drive the Daytona over...  :icon_smile_big:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: model maker on September 27, 2012, 02:13:53 PM
keep up the good work.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (K-member work)
Post by: green69rt on September 27, 2012, 10:14:48 PM
I kind of got side tracked while waiting for the floor parts.  I decided to finish cleaning up the k-member.   Firm feel use to do refurbs on the unit and then quit for a while(just sold the kit to DIY.)   So I bought the kit, really just a bunch of cut up metal pieces that you had to weld on yourself.  Just found out the Firmfeel is now doing k-members again.  
First pic shows the reinforcement around the stabalizer sockets and also where I rewelded some of the other joints around the stearing box mount.  I also welded the complete edge of the member and ground the welds down so they look nice.

Second pic shows the washer that gets welder around the LCA socket.

The kit comes with a skid plate, I paid for it so I added it on (pic #3.)
Pic #4 shows some of the reiforcement that gets added around the stearing box mount. A little blurry, sorry.

I don't know how much of this is really needed, can't hurt but is it worth the cost(?), who knows.
Anyway, the whole thing gets hot tanked and then sent off for powder coating along with all the other front bumper mounting hardware.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 04, 2012, 03:53:27 PM
K frame is all done and powder coated along with some other stuff on the front end (pic 1.)  I used a powder call mini-tex.  I like it because it looks a lot like under coating and is not shiny   I think it looks right on the under side of the car.  Pic 2 is of the front of the car after preping, lots of sanding and then wiped down with reducer to get it extra clean, maybe over kill but I didn't want to sand the thing again to get rid of mistakes.   Finally oa couple of shots of the primered front.  Now on to the roof.  Still waiting on  the rear floor section from AMD so I can do the floor.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger4404spd on November 04, 2012, 07:07:10 PM
Man all I can say is "WOW". Wished I had just half of your knowledge :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 04, 2012, 11:25:47 PM
Most of what I know I got off of this site.  Even that doesn't mean that it will turn out ok,  some of the folks here can probably point out plenty of mistakes,,,, so fire away.  It will help someone do their project.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: lexxman on November 05, 2012, 12:45:49 PM
hey man,the car looks great. The good thing with this stuff you learn as you go.Half the time I`m just winging it. If it looks good in the end ,it`s all good. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Finn on November 05, 2012, 01:24:30 PM
Nice work!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 440 Fanatic on November 05, 2012, 11:06:11 PM
Absolutely amazing work !!  Can't wait to see more!!   :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (Roof and ceiling)
Post by: green69rt on November 05, 2012, 11:10:37 PM
I decided to start on the roof and ceiling today.  Lots of old insulation glued to the ceiling (pic 1).  I just took a putty knife to it and got most of it off.  I hate working above my head so I'm tempted to take the lazy way out and just leave the old glue up there and put something over it.  Like some kind of sound insulation, maybe dynomat(??).  I can see spending a lot of time removing the old glue.  The rest of the ceiling looks good with only some surface rust around the edges and the seams so I though I would spend a little time knocking the rust down then spray it with a couple of coats of etching primer.   Same for the inside of the sail panels (pic 2.)

Then the roof needs some attention.  When I got the car, some years ago, the vinyl roof was mostly gone so I stripped the rest off then stripped the roof metal down to bare metal and applied Por15.   Seems to have attached itself really well because I took some 150 grit paper to it today and all I accomplished was to take some of the gloss off (pic 3).  

Question is do I paint or just touch up the Por15 or what??  It will have a vinyl roof again.

The roof to quarter seams need to be epoxyed and then a little filler added to build them back up so the vinyl roof will lay flat (pic 4).

Any thoughts??
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: The70RT on November 27, 2012, 08:25:00 AM
I would probably primer and get it ready for paint and just put one coat on it to seal it.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 27, 2012, 02:50:00 PM
Yeah, that's what I ended up doing.  I stripped the Por15 off the roof and put a couple of coats of Epoxy primer on it.  My avatar shows the car as it sets.  I just got word from AMD that the floor is in stock now so they should ship it soon and I can get back to work.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (xmas at my house!!)
Post by: green69rt on November 29, 2012, 05:14:10 PM
The new floor for the car came in today but AMD forgot to send me the passenger side footwell.   (pic #1)
So the only part of the old floor that is left is the under rear seat area, I left it in just to add some strength to the body while I did all the other work but now it needs to go. (pic #2).   And it's gone (pic #3) except for a little piece to use as a reference point for the new rear section.

Just one question, this bolt exists on each side (pic #4.)   When I took the car apart there was nothing bolted there, just the hole and bolt.   SO what's it for??  The new AMD floor does not have a predrilled hole for it so maybe I'll just leave it out?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger-Bodie on November 29, 2012, 05:32:41 PM
It was part of the original build process. holds the floor nice and tight for the welding process.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ghoste on November 29, 2012, 07:41:29 PM
I never knew that.  Cool. :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on November 29, 2012, 08:33:48 PM
I installed one of AMD's floors and was very suprised how well it fit.  I only had to trim about a 1/16 of an inch off the passengers side front corner.    I would be interested to her how yours fits
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on November 30, 2012, 08:12:17 AM
 :coolgleamA: :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger-Bodie on January 07, 2013, 11:19:42 AM
 :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on January 08, 2013, 12:07:42 AM
Well, it's been a pretty cold winter in Houston  :lol:  temps in the 30's at night and only getting up to 50's or 60 during the day.  Plus the holidays and then the wife and I both got a cold so that slowed things down a bit.  But I do have a few things to share with those that are interested.  I've started cleaning up the rear of the passenger compartment in preperation to installing the rear floor section.  Lots of nooks and crannies and since I was doing it all by hand it took a while. Worst part is the inside of the rear quarters (pic #1.)

A lot of 100 grit sand paper and elbow grease got the job done.  I did find a lot of light grey coating that sanded right off along with some paint overspray.  I assume the light grey stuff is some kind of primer or rust inhibitor??  I didn't get it all off but I did hit every square inch with the sand paper so hopefully the new primer I apply will stick.  I can see why some like to sand blast a car.  If I do another it will either be sand blasted or dipped.

The new floor I got did not have a exhaust hanger on the driver side (pic #2) so I ordered one from Hoover auto parts.  Something to remember....

A little side note, I did get a neat t-shirt for X-mas (pic #3.)

As for fit, the rear floor section seems to be pretty good, not great but good.  In my early years of working on cars I used to think that parts would just lay down and fit perfect! Now I know better.  Final note on the rear floor, the bolt holes for the seat belt did not line up but that's not too bad considering (pic #4.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: JB400 on January 08, 2013, 01:01:44 AM
Glad to hear it's still moving along :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1974dodgecharger on January 08, 2013, 07:16:23 AM
FCKIN LOVE THE SHIRT  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (floor issues)
Post by: green69rt on February 06, 2013, 09:07:33 PM
Well the rear (under the rear seat) section of floor is in along with the cleaned up seat brace (pic #1.)  Nothing unusual just some hammering and testing to get it to fit well.   You can see I had the front floor section in place for its first test fit.

After looking at the front section fit it seems it's going to need considerable work.   More on that later.  First thing I did was install front seat braces.  For anyone reading this and planning on doing the same, here's a little tidbit.  The four braces are not the same.  Left to right are mirror images but the front to back are not the same.  It's not obvious to a casual look (pic #2.)

A closer look shows that the rear brace allows the floor to set lower(see the one I'm touching in pic #3)   I didn't realize that before I installed mine but the car gods must have had pity on me because I got them in correctly!!  

Oh, a final piece of info, the spacing between the seat mounting holes, from front to back, was 10 7/8 "  center to center on my car.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on February 06, 2013, 09:59:52 PM
wow you are doing a great job!!!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Mopar1979 on February 06, 2013, 10:41:00 PM
Impressive :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: six-tee-nine on February 07, 2013, 06:11:50 AM
I'm there myself with my 69 so i know it is a helluva time consuming and nervewrecking job to to all this stuff nice and right.
And my car only needs a trunk floor and a new valance along with some new lower quarters.

Heads up and good job!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on February 07, 2013, 07:28:54 AM
 :coolgleamA:  nice work   :2thumbs: :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger-Bodie on February 07, 2013, 08:20:23 AM
Really filing a fine job there.  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: mopar4don on March 12, 2013, 10:32:51 PM
Looking good Mitch! :2thumbs:

Say I wanted to ask, when you put the epoxy primer down, did you use a rattle can?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 12, 2013, 11:31:03 PM
Quote from: mopar4don on March 12, 2013, 10:32:51 PM
Looking good Mitch! :2thumbs:

Say I wanted to ask, when you put the epoxy primer down, did you use a rattle can?

Nope, used a gun with Dupont Shop-line per the instructions but added 5% medium reducer.  Went on really well once I learned how to do it.   Make sure to use a hood or chemical mask, it's not nice to breath the fumes.   There are rattle can primers but kind of expensive to use on a whole car and I don't know how good they are.  Others probably have a better idea of what's good and why.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration - engine bay work
Post by: green69rt on March 15, 2013, 11:56:12 PM
Quote from: hemi68charger on September 27, 2012, 02:09:22 PM
Quote from: green69rt on August 09, 2011, 10:59:25 PM
With the heat in Houston this summer, ...

Houston !!!  This is in Houston? I need to come by and see this puppy !!!  I'll drive the Daytona over...  :icon_smile_big:
Welcome any time!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 16, 2013, 12:12:59 AM
I just remembered that I did use some rattle can primer in the trunk.  Seems to be ok but not as robust as the spray on type.  Hard to explain as an amateur.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: gers1968rt on March 16, 2013, 06:39:58 AM
Looking good, so are you going to replace those locating bolts? Was it difficult to remove the Por15 from the roof? Ger
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 16, 2013, 10:35:37 AM
Quote from: gers1968rt on March 16, 2013, 06:39:58 AM
Looking good, so are you going to replace those locating bolts? Was it difficult to remove the Por15 from the roof? Ger

Yeah, I'm putting the "mystery bolts" back in.  Not a big deal.   The POR15 on the roof took some work to remove.  Others say that the stuff doesn't stick but I had to use a stripper wheel mounted on a angle grinder to get it off.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on March 16, 2013, 05:39:29 PM
fyi  i have had great results with the SEM metal etching primer,  no mixing needed.     Also for finish work the Clausens "all you need"high build primer works well 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on March 19, 2013, 05:41:52 AM
Quote from: green69rt on July 05, 2010, 01:29:44 PM
Quote from: dodgert68 on July 05, 2010, 12:35:30 PM
Just wanted to make a note of your use of POR15 as i see you really like it. Its a decent product for use on rusty metal but is terrible for clean unrusted metal, it won't adhear very well. I recently did a 69 Charger that had POR on some new rear whell tubs and i was able to blow it off the metal with a blow gun and high presure air. It would be better to paint the new repaired areas with a good quality epoxy primer and then as in the rocker panels coat the insides with a good undercoating. POR isn't cheap stuff and i hate to someone wasting money by improperly using a product. Looks like your doing a nice quality repair job keep up the good work.

I've heard the same thing, as you said, from others also.  So I asked around and found that by cleaning the metal with a Norton Stripper wheel I can clean the metal and also give the metal some "tooth" that makes the POR15 stick so well that I've not had any peeling problems.  In fact, if I need to get it off I've had to sand or use the same stripper wheel to get it off.  Some of the places have been coated for over two years and are holding up like new.   I did have a little problem when I first started using it just like you said but adding the "tooth" to the metal seems to have fixed it. Just as a final note, even though I'm using POR15 on all my new and old metal, I plan to blast the whole car when all the sheet metal work is done and then use a 2X epoxy primer.  For now the POR15 is keeping the rust at bay.
mitch don't blast it , you have doe repaired all bad to this car leave the por 15 , extra protection on your fantastic work
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on March 19, 2013, 06:27:25 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on March 19, 2013, 05:41:52 AM
Quote from: green69rt on July 05, 2010, 01:29:44 PM
Quote from: dodgert68 on July 05, 2010, 12:35:30 PM
Just wanted to make a note of your use of POR15 as i see you really like it. Its a decent product for use on rusty metal but is terrible for clean unrusted metal, it won't adhear very well. I recently did a 69 Charger that had POR on some new rear whell tubs and i was able to blow it off the metal with a blow gun and high presure air. It would be better to paint the new repaired areas with a good quality epoxy primer and then as in the rocker panels coat the insides with a good undercoating. POR isn't cheap stuff and i hate to someone wasting money by improperly using a product. Looks like your doing a nice quality repair job keep up the good work.

I've heard the same thing, as you said, from others also.  So I asked around and found that by cleaning the metal with a Norton Stripper wheel I can clean the metal and also give the metal some "tooth" that makes the POR15 stick so well that I've not had any peeling problems.  In fact, if I need to get it off I've had to sand or use the same stripper wheel to get it off.  Some of the places have been coated for over two years and are holding up like new.   I did have a little problem when I first started using it just like you said but adding the "tooth" to the metal seems to have fixed it. Just as a final note, even though I'm using POR15 on all my new and old metal, I plan to blast the whole car when all the sheet metal work is done and then use a 2X epoxy primer.  For now the POR15 is keeping the rust at bay.
mitch don't blast it , you have doe repaired all bad to this car leave the por 15 , extra protection on your fantastic work
Mitch fantastic car this will be because of your efforts, hand rebuilt much better than new, keep it green , they say genius only pick green cars , if you put the vinyl top back on consider the 68 year instead 69 yuck puke green , the 68 one two tone alligator skin look alike, will suit this gorgeous car that it will be , in awe of your work and commitment to what you can achieve , take note you young fellas who think its too big a job, message me whe your ready Mitch to tackle that strokes , just finished my victor junior headed 511 striker, glad to give any help I can, Hughes engines over there one of my favourites and so much help and detail to my build Geoff from australia
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: moparcharger on March 22, 2013, 12:25:02 PM
Wow, I was reading this for the 1st time and I KNOW I would not be that patient or have the skill to do what you have done.
I just purchased a 69 Charger back in November and I need to replace the back frame rails (just where the truck floor pan is) other than that the car's frame is in pretty good shape. It came with alot of brand new sheet metal for the pcs. that need to be replaced, but so far, the hood, both doors, front fenders and trunk lid are the ones that came with the car and do not need to be fixed. My body guy has not and will not start on it for a month or 2 more, but I am excited. Going to take at least a year. It's an all numbers matching car 383 auto on the floor. I was given a 440, and I am going to build it into a 440+6 and make it a 4 speed ( had 4 speeds many years ago). Might badge it as an R/T.
I have been driving myself crazy on what color to paint it. I do not want red, orange or purple. Maybe black, but hard to keep clean and it shows EVERYTHING...even dents more than other colors. Car came Dark Met. Bronze, black interior with a black vinyl top.
I am looking forward to seeing you finish it. Keep up the excellent work!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 69 OUR/TEA on March 22, 2013, 02:52:22 PM
Coming along great!!!Keep up the good work !!! :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 22, 2013, 05:12:43 PM
Getting close to having the floor in, I'll post more when its permanently attached.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on March 30, 2013, 04:22:48 PM
Well would you take a look at this.   The floor is installed.  Not without problems (maybe some I made myself :shruggy: ) Anyway a couple of pics to document it is really installed.  I still need to grind down all the plug welds and then a lot of cleaning and sanding before it gets primed....yeah!!!!
pics 1 and 2 shows the floor installed.
Pics 3 and 4 show a problem.  The profile of the front floor where it met the firewall seemed to be off as much as 1/2 inch.  So I cut the floor at the two bends and matched it to the firewall and then tacked some scape metal in to fill up the gaps that where created.  Got the mismatch down to about 1/8 inch which will probably be hidden by the seam sealer.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: gers1968rt on March 31, 2013, 09:10:10 AM
Looks great! Must feel good to finally have it back in.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: nvrbdn on March 31, 2013, 09:26:10 AM
looking good. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on March 31, 2013, 09:41:55 AM
looks really good !!!!    :yesnod:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: ACUDANUT on March 31, 2013, 10:52:13 AM
Great job !!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tan top on March 31, 2013, 12:36:05 PM
nice work  :yesnod: :2thumbs: :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on April 02, 2013, 04:50:54 AM
Quote from: green69rt on March 30, 2013, 04:22:48 PM
Well would you take a look at this.   The floor is installed.  Not without problems (maybe some I made myself :shruggy: ) Anyway a couple of pics to document it is really installed.  I still need to grind down all the plug welds and then a lot of cleaning and sanding before it gets primed....yeah!!!!
pics 1 and 2 shows the floor installed.
Pics 3 and 4 show a problem.  The profile of the front floor where it met the firewall seemed to be off as much as 1/2 inch.  So I cut the floor at the two bends and matched it to the firewall and then tacked some scape metal in to fill up the gaps that where created.  Got the mismatch down to about 1/8 inch which will probably be hidden by the seam sealer. Great work as usual, Mitch could you post some extra photos of putting it in , I have a friend over here in Australia up to the point, but I am too far away to be hands on help, going to get him to look at your posts for help and not be afraid to improvise to get things to fit great work
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on April 02, 2013, 07:32:44 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on April 02, 2013, 04:50:54 AM
Quote from: green69rt on March 30, 2013, 04:22:48 PM
Well would you take a look at this.   The floor is installed.  Not without problems (maybe some I made myself :shruggy: ) Anyway a couple of pics to document it is really installed.  I still need to grind down all the plug welds and then a lot of cleaning and sanding before it gets primed....yeah!!!!
pics 1 and 2 shows the floor installed.
Pics 3 and 4 show a problem.  The profile of the front floor where it met the firewall seemed to be off as much as 1/2 inch.  So I cut the floor at the two bends and matched it to the firewall and then tacked some scape metal in to fill up the gaps that where created.  Got the mismatch down to about 1/8 inch which will probably be hidden by the seam sealer. Great work as usual, Mitch could you post some extra photos of putting it in , I have a friend over here in Australia up to the point, but I am too far away to be hands on help, going to get him to look at your posts for help and not be afraid to improvise to get things to fit great work
I see what I can come up with and try to write up some more detail. Is he doing only the front or back or complete floor?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: RIDELIKEHELL on April 02, 2013, 08:14:02 AM
 Keep it up Mitch  :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 16, 2013, 05:23:19 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on April 02, 2013, 04:50:54 AM
Great work as usual, Mitch could you post some extra photos of putting it in , I have a friend over here in Australia up to the point, but I am too far away to be hands on help, going to get him to look at your posts for help and not be afraid to improvise to get things to fit great work

Sorry for taking so long but I can give a couple of hints that might save some heartache.  AMD supplies the floor with the inboard seat mounting holes predrilled but not the outboard ones.   Don't get smart and drills the outboard holes before the floor is in.  I've also heard from various folks that the floor goes in as-is or it takes a lot of work.   Maybe the difference is how the original car was made, who can tell :shruggy:.  Mine was not painless but nothing that couldn't be overcome with some thought.  Most of the mismatch in mine was taken up in the footwell pieces that join the front and rear sections.  

I did add these parts before I put the floor sections in because I don't have a rotisserie and didn't want to weld above my head more than necessary.

Speedo cable bracket.
Inboard seatbelt reinforcement plates.
Emergency brake cable bracket.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on May 17, 2013, 09:44:04 PM
He is doing the entire floor like you , having a lot of trouble getting things to fit, clearance too large, gaps over cross member , floor seems bowed, sorry Mitch didn't realise you had replied
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on May 17, 2013, 10:45:12 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on May 17, 2013, 09:44:04 PM
He is doing the entire floor like you , having a lot of trouble getting things to fit, clearance too large, gaps over cross member , floor seems bowed, sorry Mitch didn't realise you had replied

Some of the same problems I had.   Just take time and work thru the problems.  Without being there it's hard to give advice.   Sounds like I had some of the same problems your friend had.  The back section fit fairly well for me.  The front section was the real problem.  I found that the gaps were large over the torsion bar cross member till I made some mods that let it sit down further on the front frame rail sections.   It took some sectioning of the floor over the front frame rails then all of a sudden the torsion bar cross member fit was a lot better.  Also the gap between the front and rear was not very even.  The difference was taken up by how I installed the rear foot wells.  Nothing more than 1/2 inch but enough to cause a bunch of work.

Really the important parts are to make sure the bolt holes for the seat belt anchor bolts match.  Everything else is appearance.  Most important (in my opinion) is that you do not introduce a lot of stress to the body.  Don't "pull" the parts down till they meet.  Spend a little time to bend the new floor till it settles within about 1/8inch of a good fit.  Others may have more info :popcrn:  Whoever has ideas please contribute.......
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: projectanimal on May 18, 2013, 08:18:44 AM
Very impressive, great work!   :cheers:
I've been working with POR for weeks and its great stuff.  About 75% of our undercarriage is covered and all the inside!
Look forward to seeing your progress!  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (primed and sealed!!)
Post by: green69rt on July 04, 2013, 10:13:20 AM
Would you look at this.  Pic #1...Whole car is in primer (except the underneath, it needs blasting before paint.)
Pic #2 floor in, primed and sealed (again, sealer is really stinky!!) By the way, notice the wire covers, I put those in backward, the short piece goes toward the front of the car.   Found that out after they were in.  It doesn't seem to make a dif to me so I left them alone.  For those doing a correct restoration, take note.
Pic #3 engine bay primed, and firewall sealed to floor and cowl.

Pic #4 that loooong driver quarter with the seam gone and the roof seam dressed up ( I striped some of the filler when I took the old paint off so it had to be redone.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on July 04, 2013, 10:40:51 AM
lookin great Mitch!!!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 04, 2013, 10:47:23 AM
Quote from: cdr on July 04, 2013, 10:40:51 AM
lookin great Mitch!!!!!

Thanks Charlie, more to come.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 04, 2013, 11:28:54 AM
I just had to put up a couple of before-and-after pics.

Pic # 1is the passenger side rear floor when I got the car.
The second pic is the floor now.

Third pic is the driver side rear floor.

And just for good measure, one more pic of the front floor.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 04, 2013, 11:40:35 AM
I've set a goal of shipping the car to the painters by the end of July, we'll see how that goes.  I've looked at three places, the first stores their cars outside so I don't like that.  The second told me they are cutting back on their projects and don't have room for me.  The most likely shop is called MoMuscle in Conroe, Tx.  I talked to the shop manager and looked over their shop, impressive.  They even said they will loan me a set of bolt-on car dollies to get the car to their shop.  I plan to have them finish the welding underneath the car ( a few points), blast the underside, finish whatever putty work it needs and block, sand and paint.  Then fit up the fenders doors, hood and trunk lid.  When I get it back it should look like a charger again.  Maybe I'll have them do the vinyl top, not sure about that yet.


I have some final filler work to do on the car, especially where the quarter meets the rocker, and depending on the time available to me, I might spend some time getting the 80 grit sandpaper scratches out of the primer.  Also the trunk floor got really dirty from all the flying metal dust and sanding dust so I might get in there and clean that up.  Getting close!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on July 04, 2013, 12:01:24 PM
did you talk to s&t paint & body?  they are around the corner from you.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 04, 2013, 01:29:31 PM
Quote from: cdr on July 04, 2013, 12:01:24 PM
did you talk to s&t paint & body?  they are around the corner from you.

No, where are they, phone number?? edit...just looked them up.  They are really close!!  Have you had any experience with them??
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on July 04, 2013, 03:07:24 PM
yes i know them.talk to JEFF,HE IS ONE OF THE OWNERS.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 06, 2013, 05:07:07 AM
Mitch always great to see your progress, fantastic work , we'll thought out always , and executed, have enjoyed watching your work, you should be proud of you efforts , better than new, I can't think of any one I would rather see put that vinyl top on , look on you tube for the install video, with your patience  no one will do the job you would , not that hard if you take your time, again great work on a car most would find too daunting, this one saved only because of you and all your hard work,  been watching for an update for a while now , keep posting , I have been using your build to help and inspire a good friend of mine with he's similar build , thanks for all the detailed photos
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 06, 2013, 08:23:18 AM
Thanks  fy469rtse.  It's always nice to know someone is paying attention.  I try to add some of the goofs as well as the progress.  Maybe someone can learn from my mistakes, I usually do.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger-Bodie on July 06, 2013, 09:56:57 AM
Quote from: green69rt on July 06, 2013, 08:23:18 AM
Thanks  fy469rtse.  It's always nice to know someone is paying attention.  I try to add some of the goofs as well as the progress.  Maybe someone can learn from my mistakes, I usually do.

Oh theres lots of us watching. You are doing a top shelf job here and you should(and probably are)be proud of what youve accomplished here.  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 07, 2013, 06:08:06 AM
No goofs that I have seen , just damn fine quality work, and a ton of patience, will follow this thread all the way , what a great car this is going to be
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 07, 2013, 02:32:57 PM
Looks like I'm on track to send the car off for final sanding, paint and panel fit up.  I have a very little sanding to do on the rockers and the rear valence corners.   I've been using 80 grit to sand the filler.  Started putting some high build primer a few places to fill the 80 grit marks.  I'll be sanding that primer with 180 grit.  That's as far as I will go, let the paint shop take it from there.

Pic #1 shows the seam between the rocker and the quarter.  This is probably the thickest putty, up to 1/8 inch.   You can't see how far out the putty goes because I've started to put high build primer on it, but it is feathered out about 8 inches to the front and rear of the seam.

Pic #2 shows the valence corner as I get close to finishing the putty and sanding on them.  I haven't decided if I will restore the seam lines or just French everything in  :shruggy:

Pic #3 shows that looooong passenger quarter where I patched the new skin on, the shiny stuff is high build primer where I'm starting to take the 80 grit sanding marks out.

Finally, the trunk, it looks bad now.  It's an accumulation of about 2 years of sanding and grinding dust that I need to clean up.  Too late to wish I had protected it better.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (now hunting down all the parts)
Post by: green69rt on July 07, 2013, 02:42:22 PM
As I get the car ready to ship I've started dragging stuff down from the attic and off of shelves.  I've been accumulating this stuff for years so naturally I've lost track of the exact location of things.  I don't even remember what I've bought that I might need now so I have to go thru everything.

I had a small box that I put all the bags (yes they are labeled) of small parts and have been trying to get out the hood hinge bolts (sometime in the past I bought a new set) and fender mounting bolts (still haven't found the old ones and I want new ones anyway.) All the bags are super dusty from setting all these years but the labels still make sense and haven't faded.  I put the labels on pieces of paper inside the baggies not on the outside.

Found the front valance that came with the car and the old hinges and some splash shield.  Need to find the other splash shields and all the rubber seals that go with them.  


Now back to the garage for more sanding....
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: JB400 on July 07, 2013, 07:33:52 PM
Looks good. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 07, 2013, 08:04:44 PM
mitch with that filler tube , dummy you tank in first and just drill a hole roughly where you think , and dummy fit filler tube to enlarge hole , take you time here , that seal not very forgiving for moving it over, hope this helps you avoid a goof as you call it ,don't ask me how I know , one of my goofs lol
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 07, 2013, 10:41:58 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on July 07, 2013, 08:04:44 PM
mitch with that filler tube , dummy you tank in first and just drill a hole roughly where you think , and dummy fit filler tube to enlarge hole , take you time here , that seal not very forgiving for moving it over, hope this helps you avoid a goof as you call it ,don't ask me how I know , one of my goofs lol

Yeah, after looking at it I think I'll do it your way.  I can see that there is considerable play in how things go together.  The seal looks funny and I don't want to chop up the floor and have to do a repair.  Actually the seal looks different from the crappy one I took out, maybe I got the wrong one??  It's supposed to fit 69 charger (and 70 if I remember right.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 08, 2013, 05:14:53 AM
No your ok that's a repop seal , looks correct, are you going to put the line on , cut it in the filler on rear valance to separate corners, or the joint gap, I did mine similar to yours but cut a line or groove in, also another goof of mine , I should have paid attention to condition of my hood hinges, you can get reproduction hinges, or get new pins , weld up sloppy or oval holes , re drill hole and press new pins in, you can weld and add metal to teeth to elimate slack in hinges, one of those area's I wish I had taken notice of when I disassembled car, everything painted, reassembled car and realised one hinge has a bit more play then the other, I'm sure a lot of us on this site have done this, take your springs off and check them Mitch, you will curse later when hood doesn't lift like it should
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 08, 2013, 07:20:47 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on July 08, 2013, 05:14:53 AM
No your ok that's a repop seal , looks correct, are you going to put the line on , cut it in the filler on rear valance to separate corners, or the joint gap, I did mine similar to yours but cut a line or groove in, also another goof of mine , I should have paid attention to condition of my hood hinges, you can get reproduction hinges, or get new pins , weld up sloppy or oval holes , re drill hole and press new pins in, you can weld and add metal to teeth to elimate slack in hinges, one of those area's I wish I had taken notice of when I disassembled car, everything painted, reassembled car and realised one hinge has a bit more play then the other, I'm sure a lot of us on this site have done this, take your springs off and check them Mitch, you will curse later when hood doesn't lift like it should

Interesting, I hadn't thought about the hood hinges.  I was just going to blast them, paint and install.  Another little item to think about!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Brian in GA on July 08, 2013, 03:07:31 PM
I was gonna recommend some billet gas charged hinges I'd seen recently, until I looked online and saw they sell for $750/pair.   :o

They sure are nice looking.  For that kind of money they ought to be made out of fairy dust or something.  Or add 150 hp.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 08, 2013, 04:20:32 PM
Quote from: Brian in GA on July 08, 2013, 03:07:31 PM
I was gonna recommend some billet gas charged hinges I'd seen recently, until I looked online and saw they sell for $750/pair.   :o

They sure are nice looking.  For that kind of money they ought to be made out of fairy dust or something.  Or add 150 hp.



Wow :o :o
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (big oops!!)
Post by: green69rt on July 16, 2013, 10:38:32 PM
Well I was feeling pretty cocky about getting things done.  The body work was going ok.  Then I sprayed the last (I hoped!!) coat of primer and crap!!!   I think what happened is the high build primer I used was not compatible with the epoxy primer.  Anyway, you can see the results in the pictures.  Needless to say, I spent the last two days stripping the new primer and the high build primer off.  Could have been worse but glad I found out now rather than a year down the road and the finish paint started to come off.  I found out that I could actually get a putty knife under the high build primer and just flake it off.

Back to the 80 grit and a little filler.  Hope I have time to set things right before it goes to the painters.

You can see how the primer just crinkled up over the areas where the high build primer was present. Sand, sand, sand.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 16, 2013, 11:37:24 PM
Mitch do you have original fenders and after market front valance, you might want trial fit those, where the bottom line joins the valance you might have issues there , just a tip to prevent some frustration later, if after market front fenders, the issue with these is to the door opening edges not formed or tapped around enough, also the leading edge front of fenders not as round as it should be , shape not correct if you compare it to nos fender or original :popcrn: still watching , love watching this cars progress
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on July 17, 2013, 07:56:07 PM
Going forward its not a good idea to mix product brands, I would pick one brand of product and use there system start to finish,    for what its worth I like Clausens
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on July 17, 2013, 08:09:03 PM
Quote from: sardillim on July 17, 2013, 07:56:07 PM
Going forward its not a good idea to mix product brands, I would pick one brand of product and use there system start to finish,    for what its worth I like Clausens

thats what i have it is very good stuff !!!!!    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.clausenautobody.com%2Fproddetail.php%3Fprod%3Dall-u-need&ei=CkDnUZGpAorO9ASn1YHIAw&usg=AFQjCNEC4GY6z6inULEKajhKWXfNToGZyw&bvm=bv.49478099,d.eWU&cad=rja
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 17, 2013, 10:28:16 PM
Quote from: cdr on July 17, 2013, 08:09:03 PM
Quote from: sardillim on July 17, 2013, 07:56:07 PM
Going forward its not a good idea to mix product brands, I would pick one brand of product and use there system start to finish,    for what its worth I like Clausens

thats what i have it is very good stuff !!!!!    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.clausenautobody.com%2Fproddetail.php%3Fprod%3Dall-u-need&ei=CkDnUZGpAorO9ASn1YHIAw&usg=AFQjCNEC4GY6z6inULEKajhKWXfNToGZyw&bvm=bv.49478099,d.eWU&cad=rja

That stuff looks good, wish I'd known about it 4 weeks ago.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (ready to ship to the body shop.)
Post by: green69rt on August 14, 2013, 07:46:11 PM
I've found a shop that will take my car.  Surprising how hard it is to find an available and good restoration shop in a city the size of Houston,  maybe they hide away?? :shruggy:

Been getting the car ready to go.  The shop (Mo' Muscle) even loaned me a car dolly to mount my car on for the transport (Pic #1).

I've been bolting things back onto the car, seems easier than shipping a bunch of separate pieces. The rest I just threw inside.  The previous owner had bought a front valance so I just threw it inside the car.  Not AMD so we'll find out how it fits. (Pic #2)

As you can see, I bolted the hood and trunk lid back on.(pic #3)

Then comes my next boo-boo.  In pic #4 notice that there is no door gap.  It was tight before I replaced the quarter, funny how those 1/4 inch tolerances can sneak up on you.  Hinges are adjusted all the way forward so looks like this door will need to have the edge shaved.   Not a big deal (I think) but another few bucks for the body shop to bill me.  The back of the quarter lined up beautifully, teaches me to not have the door in when I aligned the quarter.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: lukedukem on August 14, 2013, 08:20:42 PM
Can't wait to see it get back from paint. Glad to here you went with mo muscle. My buddy has his 59 el Camino there. They're good people.

Luke
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: bull on August 14, 2013, 09:00:04 PM
Dang, Mitch. If you had to guess, what percentage of the car would you say has been replaced? :o

Excellent work though. :2thumbs: More than I would want to take on. I commend your work and patience.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 14, 2013, 09:58:21 PM
Quote from: bull on August 14, 2013, 09:00:04 PM
Dang, Mitch. If you had to guess, what percentage of the car would you say has been replaced? :o

Excellent work though. :2thumbs: More than I would want to take on. I commend your work and patience.

Seemed like a lot got replaced, but AMD makes it possible.   If I had to do it again I would have to think twice.   It is fun, though, to see something come back from the dead thru your own efforts!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 14, 2013, 10:10:06 PM
Just looked at my first post and it's been at least 4 years since the first post, and really 5 years since I got the car in my garage.  Learned a lot and had a huge amount of fun.  I can't imagine doing this project without the help of everyone here.  A big thanks!

Now just to get the thing painted and start rebuilding!!! :laugh:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Homerr on August 15, 2013, 09:16:18 AM
Regarding the door gap - is the trim, rubber, and glass going to fit if the door is shaved?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 15, 2013, 12:16:49 PM
Quote from: Homerr on August 15, 2013, 09:16:18 AM
Regarding the door gap - is the trim, rubber, and glass going to fit if the door is shaved?

Yeah, what gets trimed is the big pinch weld that connects the inner and outer shells of the door.  The glass opening and the seating surface of the door gasket won't change and their relation to the body of the car won't change.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 15, 2013, 01:31:15 PM
Quote from: bull on August 14, 2013, 09:00:04 PM
Dang, Mitch. If you had to guess, what percentage of the car would you say has been replaced? :o

Excellent work though. :2thumbs: More than I would want to take on. I commend your work and patience.

Forgot to answer your question.  I've probably replaced at least 50% of the metal, may 60% if you count the two front fenders.  I hope to save the hood and trunk lid and one door.  Driver side door is a mess so not even going to try to save it....my estimate just went up to 65%.

What's left that is original is - the firewall, lower cowl, door hinge posts, door striker posts, kick panels, roof, sail panels, package tray, Dutchman, tail light panel, trunk gutters and the rear frame rails under the rear seat.   Maybe another small piece here or there.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (Gone to paint!!)
Post by: green69rt on August 26, 2013, 03:55:54 PM
The car was loaded up this morning and taken to the paint shop.  Pics attached show:

In the garage this morning ready to go.
On the transporter.
Leaving.
Setting in the paint shop.

Great news!!  The bad news is that when I went to order the two new fenders, AMD is out of stock on the driver side fender and don't expect to make a run before October.  At that rate I might not get a fender till after Christmas.  At least I will have plenty of time to do the dash, grill and heater box.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: nvrbdn on August 26, 2013, 04:14:52 PM
sweet.  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on August 26, 2013, 04:37:35 PM
GOLBOWS GARAGE TOWED IT ,thats good,i worked in the repair side of the shop for about 14 years,,VERY good people.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 26, 2013, 05:02:00 PM
Quote from: cdr on August 26, 2013, 04:37:35 PM
GOLBOWS GARAGE TOWED IT ,thats good,i worked in the repair side of the shop for about 14 years,,VERY good people.

Yeap, the guy got right to work and delivered the car with no problems.   Car did get rained on a little.  Where's a Texas drought when you need one!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Baldwinvette77 on August 26, 2013, 05:06:25 PM
been waiting for more of this  :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: spoolinhard on August 26, 2013, 05:58:18 PM
Try ebay for the fender:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Dodge-Charger-Front-Fender-LH-/281070291557?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4171184a65&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Dodge-Charger-Front-Fender-drivers-side-/180423711065?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a02175959&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-69-Dodge-Charger-Front-Fender-OEM-drivers-side-Left-side-GREAT-PIECE-WOW/400560585232?rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D17216%26meid%3D850481614130155966%26pid%3D100005%26prg%3D8039%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D281070291557%26
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 26, 2013, 06:37:25 PM
I did look on ebay but most are just resellers of AMD fenders.   If you look carefully they will not say they can deliver it from stock but it will be drop shipped from AMD.  I've called and most know that the fender is out-of-stock but keep their ads up anyway...hmmmm.  One guy was selling a OEM fender so I'll check that out.  Thanks for the links.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charge69 on August 26, 2013, 07:34:54 PM
It's been a long and rough road to get to this point but, you have done a fantastic job of restoring a shell that many of us, including me, would not have had the skills and patience to take on.  I know you cannot wait to get it back from paint and begin the assembly process.

Beautiful job and I am impressed with your skills and work to get it to this point. Really looking forward to the pics of it painted!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 26, 2013, 08:32:13 PM
Quote from: spoolinhard on August 26, 2013, 05:58:18 PM
Try ebay for the fender:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Dodge-Charger-Front-Fender-LH-/281070291557?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4171184a65&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Dodge-Charger-Front-Fender-drivers-side-/180423711065?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a02175959&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-69-Dodge-Charger-Front-Fender-OEM-drivers-side-Left-side-GREAT-PIECE-WOW/400560585232?rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D17216%26meid%3D850481614130155966%26pid%3D100005%26prg%3D8039%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D281070291557%26

Thanks to spoolinhard.  I contacted one of the people on his link and found a usable fender.   If everything goes well I will have it around 15 sept, take it to the shop and work can take off!!  By the way, this person does take old wrecks apart so if you need hard to find parts he may be a good source.  Just pm me.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: spoolinhard on August 26, 2013, 09:46:29 PM
Glad to be of use! :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on August 28, 2013, 06:04:13 AM
Mitch , watch out for the difference with amd fender compared to the original, nose not the same shape,
Not as round, and top of rear to door opening, folded over area not formed right , needs tapping around a bit, just thought I would mention this in case you don't mock up fittment of panels , also some of the amd fenders a bit tight towards the bottom and don't fit as the originals do ,
Don't forget to check the door opening especially at the top gap, or it will be like mine , the first time I opened door it took paint off , hope this helps avoid any issues Mitch

Cheers geoff
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 28, 2013, 08:25:55 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on August 28, 2013, 06:04:13 AM
Mitch , watch out for the difference with amd fender compared to the original, nose not the same shape,
Not as round, and top of rear to door opening, folded over area not formed right , needs tapping around a bit, just thought I would mention this in case you don't mock up fittment of panels , also some of the amd fenders a bit tight towards the bottom and don't fit as the originals do ,
Don't forget to check the door opening especially at the top gap, or it will be like mine , the first time I opened door it took paint off , hope this helps avoid any issues Mitch

Cheers geoff

Good thought's Geoff.  I've talked to the paint and body man at the shop and the first thing he wants to do is put all the panels on to check for issues like you mentioned.   I'm going out to see him Thursday or Friday to take the door and trunk gaskets and door locks for the first assembly.   I'll discuss you ideas with him and make sure he follows up on them.

Mitch
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: djcarguy on August 28, 2013, 09:00:30 AM
  are those repop door hinges??? thinking they can be off causing door gap to close up???  just a idea  might enlarge the hinge  holes too hinge post for little adjust room?  looking good an best on fit an paint. 


   impressed with all the work ya did and watching to see it come together,,, :popcrn: :2thumbs: :popcrn: :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 28, 2013, 12:24:11 PM
Quote from: djcarguy on August 28, 2013, 09:00:30 AM
 are those repop door hinges??? thinking they can be off causing door gap to close up???  just a idea  might enlarge the hinge  holes too hinge post for little adjust room?  looking good an best on fit an paint.  

They are repop hinges and I also thought they might be the problem so I put the old hinges back on (I've learned...never throw anything away, never!!!) and it was the same problem.  Problem was only the pass side so I'm pretty sure it was my fault.  I am sure I had the driver side door in when I did the driver quarter, I can't remember on the pass side so I suspect I did the pass quarter without the door installed.

Edit:  well, I just went back thru this thread and I can see the pictures of the car with the pass side door in while I was installing the quarter so I guess it is just sloppy work :shruggy:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Stevearino on August 28, 2013, 07:52:05 PM


Edit:  well, I just went back thru this thread and I can see the pictures of the car with the pass side door in while I was installing the quarter so I guess it is just sloppy work :shruggy:
[/quote]Sloppy work my a##. Everything here looks first class. You are taking a lot of care to do the best job you can do. More so than some so called pro's.
If you don't do this type of thing on a daily basis for a long time it is just impossible to not miss a few things. Keep up the stellar effort. It looks great.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on August 31, 2013, 04:24:29 AM
Mitch looks fantastic  :popcrn:  :2thumbs: , funny feeling huh after all that work watching it go on the flatbed, bet there were times you thought you would never see it ready for paint , god this car is going to look good with paint
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on August 31, 2013, 08:45:39 AM
Yeah, the garage feels strange because of the big space where the charger was.

I'll be taking a little vacation to Oregon, then I'm going to clear out my working area and paint the floor.

I spent a couple of hours in the shop, yesterday, talking to the paint and body man and we went over my car in detail, what gets done, how it gets done and what materials to use.   I had made up a list of items that I thought were needed and we marked the list up, dated it and they made a copy to keep in their files and the original in the shop.  They made some good suggestions, some to save me money and some things I had missed.   I think we are in good shape as far as what gets done.   The paint guy is going to use the next couple of weeks to clear out some other cars and when the second fender arrives he plans to jump on mine!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Homerr on August 31, 2013, 08:08:12 PM
Would you mind sharing some of the arcane knowledge of that you went over with the shop?  Money savers, missed bits, etc?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 01, 2013, 12:24:50 AM
Quote from: Homerr on August 31, 2013, 08:08:12 PM
Would you mind sharing some of the arcane knowledge of that you went over with the shop?  Money savers, missed bits, etc?

Not at all.  I'll just talk about various stuff.

We talked a lot about what to do underneath the car.  There are a combination of coating on the bottom, EDP, POR15 and some scorch marks from welding.  The frame rail connectors will get some dress up of the welds with more welding, seam sealer. I did not install torque boxes. The plan is to blast those areas that need it (not the complete bottom) and then spray a kind of elastic coating on it (I see if I can find out exactly what the product is.)  Not undercoating, then the shop will shoot a coat of mixed base and clear on top of the elastic coating, almost like single stage to save a step and some bucks.  Gives the appearance of paint but most of the protection of undercoating.  I really don't like the appearance of undercoating so this seems like a good plan.  The wheel wells will get an extra coat of regular undercoat to protect against rock chips.

Most of the passenger compartment will be shot with lizard skin.  The shop uses Lizard skin a lot so rather than force them to another product, I said OK.  This includes the ceiling.  The ceiling still has a bunch of the old adhesive that I did not want to deal with.  They will get most off then spray with the Lizard skin.  Good enough.  The trunk will get what it gets, not a big concern (single stage.) 

Still thinking about the engine bay and underneath the hood.  Temperature is a concern so the shop is working up a recommendation.

Other than that I made sure that they will take care of the outside of the car.  I specified some areas to look at including... A pillars, rockers, cowl where it meets the a pillar, sail panels, the quarter panel extensions (eyebrows.) and I said that I want to approve any extra work that will effect the panel gaps ( I really want the gaps to look good so maybe some extra money here :shruggy:)  The actual finish of the outside of the car is still open.  I really want it to look good but without spending a ton of money so there will probably be some blocking and then more than one coat of base and clear, still not decided.

I want to add Vintage AC to the car and they offered to weld studs to the firewall instead of putting bolts thru it to mount the heater box.  Thinking about that.

I had considered powder coating the grill/headlight frame but they did not recommend it, said prime and paint is better for the thin metal with all the sharp edges.  Sounded right so I approved.

Roof will get painted single stage, no buffing, etc.  Vinyl roof going on.  They said paint is a better protection than just primer.  Since other parts of the car will be single stage they said cost is pretty small to add the roof, I approved.

There's probably more that I don't remember off-hand.  Hope this helps.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 01, 2013, 12:31:49 AM
I felt that what was really important was to write down what the shop would do, what materials to use, etc.  You may have different ideas but get them down on paper!!  I worked as a project engineer in the oil industry and one thing I learned is that nobody likes surprises.  If you write it down and talk to the people doing the work (talking to the manager is not enough) then things tend to go better and you tend to avoid surprises.  We'll see how things shake out.

Oh, I also dated the sheet and signed it.  Any changes will also get signed by me and dated so there are no miss-understandings.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Homerr on September 01, 2013, 09:21:49 AM
Exactly the sort of info I was hoping for!  Would you mind talking about the money side of the paint/body work?

I think this is one of the most gray areas of restoration and one where a lot of projects get stalled.  Collectively we all seem to have some issues around the money subject and talking frankly about how much things cost.  It seems there are only anecdotal figures that I would consider low-ball numbers, or ridiculously high numbers to justify something like a $60k+ XP car.  You've done an awesome job documenting how much work you were willing to tackle and there is a good record of how nice the car is now having left for the body shop.

I know how much I spent on paint/bodywork, around $6000 back in 1994 (roof, rear window, trunk, lower quarters, inner fender, paint w/ color change), but my best friend's dad did the work at a steep discount with me adding a ton of labor to offset some of the cost (and sometimes work on some of his project cars for him).  So I don't even really know the 'true' cost of the work back then and then how to add a multiplier for inflation.

If you're up for shining some light on the subject I'd really like to hear how costs are shaking out for this stage of your resto.  Overall breakdown of estimate (vs. reality later?), shop hourly rate, materials cost, estimate of hours, time-frame, etc.  Go as broad or as narrow as you like, my goal is to help budget for my eventual second Charger project!

If you don't want to go in to it, I understand and respect the decision all the same.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 01, 2013, 01:51:59 PM
The shop did not give an estimate but we did talk a little.  Their rate is $65/hr. plus materials.  I did talk to the owner/manager and at our first meeting I asked him if $5000 was a ballpark number, not because I expected that low a number but just because I wanted to start that conversation.  He said probably not.  Just too much work to do. Now I think I would be happy if it came in under $10K.   He did say as long as I didn't insist on a 100 point car and start nitpicking little extras here and there that $10k may be in the ball park.  That's why I spent the time to write down everything I could think of and gave them a chance to comment.

The paint/body manager and I spent about an hour just going over the car and talking about the work list, but I consider that as $65 well spent (if they charge me for it.)

For those with more experience, you can probably give a better idea of paint cost.  I wouldn't be surprised if the paint came in at $1000 or even more.. :eek2:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger-Bodie on September 01, 2013, 04:05:13 PM
Quote from: green69rt on September 01, 2013, 01:51:59 PM
The shop did not give an estimate but we did talk a little.  Their rate is $65/hr. plus materials.  I did talk to the owner/manager and at our first meeting I asked him if $5000 was a ballpark number, not because I expected that low a number but just because I wanted to start that conversation.  He said probably not.  Just too much work to do. Now I think I would be happy if it came in under $10K.  He did say as long as I didn't insist on a 100 point car and start nitpicking little extras here and there that $10k may be in the ball park.  That's why I spent the time to write down everything I could think of and gave them a chance to comment.

The paint/body manager and I spent about an hour just going over the car and talking about the work list, but I consider that as $65 well spent (if they charge me for it.)

For those with more experience, you can probably give a better idea of paint cost.  I wouldn't be surprised if the paint came in at $1000 or even more.. :eek2:

You will likely be looking at triple that in paint&materials.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 02, 2013, 05:25:36 AM
Quote from: Charger-Bodie on September 01, 2013, 04:05:13 PM
Quote from: green69rt on September 01, 2013, 01:51:59 PM
The shop did not give an estimate but we did talk a little.  Their rate is $65/hr. plus materials.  I did talk to the owner/manager and at our first meeting I asked him if $5000 was a ballpark number, not because I expected that low a number but just because I wanted to start that conversation.  He said probably not.  Just too much work to do. Now I think I would be happy if it came in under $10K.  He did say as long as I didn't insist on a 100 point car and start nitpicking little extras here and there that $10k may be in the ball park.  That's why I spent the time to write down everything I could think of and gave them a chance to comment.

The paint/body manager and I spent about an hour just going over the car and talking about the work list, but I consider that as $65 well spent (if they charge me for it.)

For those with more experience, you can probably give a better idea of paint cost.  I wouldn't be surprised if the paint came in at $1000 or even more.. :eek2:

You will likely be looking at triple that in paint&materials.

Dang!!! :o
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Generalkiwi on September 02, 2013, 09:20:16 AM
Hey Guys,

Yeah it would be great to talk numbers with others, especially for those about to head into a venture like a 69' Dodge Charger Restore , i myself am planning to do one soon and have a car lined up that i am looking at restoring (haven't purchased yet, still getting it assessed) . The figures i have been quoted are rough at this stage as the car hasn't been properly inspected. I will update the figures after inspection and hopefully have a more detailed estimate of what it will cost to bring it back to life.

My estimate is in NZ dollars (as that is where the restore will take place.) But the figures below are converted into US dollars to make things easier to compare.

Purchase cost of Car $14K
Panel/Paint man hourly rate = $49
Paint = $10.5K  (includes full rotisserie restore, spraying the underside of the car, boot, interior/exterior and engine bay and extra 01 and confederate flag graphics, this car is being restored as a General Lee)
Panel Work = $23K

Total without engine and trans $47.5K US

The car is in a pretty rough state but im told has all the parts. So add on top of that any replacement parts if required and then costs to re-build the motor and trans. (i am still looking into the cost of this)

So a total cost of $47.5K US just to buy the car and restore its looks, not cheap to do! , but then again we do it for the love of these old cars don't we. Would be interesting to compare dollar figure cost of a 69' restore with anyone if they want to share ? (i can start another thread for this if need be as i don't want to hijack your build thread mate!  :2thumbs: , just let me know )

Cheers
Kiwi

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: davidcam69 on September 02, 2013, 03:07:53 PM
Hello, this is my first post but I've been watching this forum for awhile even before joining. I couldn't resist putting in my  2 cents on this thread because this is exactly what I am going thru right now. I bought back my 69 RT that my dad had ordered new in 68. Like an idiot I sold it in 83 for 2000 and bought it back in 2009 for 8000. I'm not wealthy and worked hard for my money and do almost all my own service and repairs. This all seems like alot of money to me but I know I was lucky to get my #s matching Charger back for 8k. I'm 61 and retired a year and half ago thinking I'm going get all my projects done after retiring. Not so, not enough time for a busy grandpa that rides, boats and enjoys all the family gigs. The Charger is on the top or my bucket list. I rebiult the engine and drivetrain but unsure how to go about bringing back the body. I want it to be right but not being a bodyman or paintor I did not feel like expermenting on my Charger, I've got two other cars for that. I also want this car done in my lifetime. So I got on the web looking for a restoration shop to find out what I was in for and if I 'could even afford it. Found a shop four hours away that looked interesting and was pro Mopar. Took my wife with me. Now you would think that would'nt be a good idea but it was the best decision ever. Not a big or fancy shop but looked all business. Ok now lets get to the piont (sorry for my long winded story). With looking at pics of the car, which he didn't seem to interested in, it was always" if you want to do it right and do it one time" this is what you do. I like the way he thought and me thinking how to save money and taking a short cut or doing some things myself just wasn't fitting in. He didn't hold back. He said you could put 20k in body before paint and materials. 3000 in paint materials. Made my knees weak. Thinking this was some crazy money and wondering how my wife was holding up I then ask what process was and how he charged. You put $500 down to hold your spot.  If you change your mind he would refund your 500 no problem.They charge $55 an hour. Then you pay him $5000 and when that's gone you pay $5000 and when that's gone.......well you get it. Also you can buy or bring in your own parts to help save you money. This was January and said he could get me in sometime in June. About then my wife pipes up and says "will you take a check" ...liked to fell over, never even discussed it privately. Stripped the car down and made frame castors. Got the call and delivered it on Weds. Looked like Mitch's minus the nice metal work. Saved some money stripping it and removing all undercoating and seam sealer. They were surprised the car was in such good shape. Looks like trunk(already removed), rear window work, tail panel, lower rear quarters, and LF inner fender(replaced). They got right on it.       

This isn't for the faint of heart. I commend anyone like Mitch who does their own work with such skill, that kind of talent and self satisfaction is priceless.   I figure I will have 30,000 (low end) to 50,000(high end) when all said and done and that's not counting my hundreds of hours putting it back together.  If this wasn't my dad's-my car, I probably would not restore it. I would spend less money and time and find a good resto for less money.   

Mitch, since Generalkiwi brought it up I thought I would share my money story. Hope I didn't intrude with my long ass story.

Dave




2     
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charge69 on September 02, 2013, 03:43:39 PM
I commend both of you for committing such a large amount of money to restore your Charger but, the reality is, if you are going to farm out most of the bodywork and paint, it gets expensive real quick. Be prepared to go "over budget" on the restoration as it always ends up being more expensive than you thought!  Don't let that get you down or stop the restoration. When almost finished (they never are really finished) you will have a "unicorn" of a musclecar to enjoy!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Generalkiwi on September 03, 2013, 04:51:05 AM
Hey Guys,

Don't post anymore in here about figures, as i feel like we are hi-jacking Mitch's build thread, i'll start another thread and can we all post about figures in there, so with that said, back to you Mitch and your 69' build!!

Cheers
Kiwi
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on September 04, 2013, 08:34:05 AM
Yep back to Mitch  thread  :popcrn: guys all cars are going to be varing prices depending on what's needed and the work , finish needed, a lot of us are waiting for Mitch to post photos , ask him after its painted and how much extra it cost and why
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Generalkiwi on September 04, 2013, 08:39:44 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on September 04, 2013, 08:34:05 AM
Yep back to Mitch  thread  :popcrn: guys all cars are going to be varing prices depending on what's needed and the work , finish needed, a lot of us are waiting for Mitch to post photos , ask him after its painted and how much extra it cost and why

Yep good point, i have started a new thread here if anyone wants to comment further on costs for a restore.

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?topic=104446.new;topicseen#new

Mitch if you would please share with us panel/paint costs as you progress and any pitfalls that come along , that would be very much appreciated, if you choose not to then we all understand.

thanks mate!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 12, 2013, 11:10:50 PM
OK, I'm back from vacation.  I really like reading through the replies and I really don't mind everyone putting in their  :Twocents:.  I will have more to add on costs.  I'll try to be up front about them.  Few, if any are willing to share that part because it's so easy to look like a chump or that you're not getting a good deal.  More later, We got home from Oregon about 3 hours ago so it takes some time to catch up with things.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on September 13, 2013, 12:11:41 AM
 :popcrn: how could you go away and leave her in the care of others lol ?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: djcarguy on September 13, 2013, 03:14:03 AM
Quote from: green69rt on August 31, 2013, 08:45:39 AM
Yeah, the garage feels strange because of the big space where the charger was.

I'll be taking a little vacation to Oregon, then I'm going to clear out my working area and paint the floor.

WHATS IN OREGON???FEW dozon mopar guys an  graveyard cars by me,in springfield,,,, wildcat auto wrecker mopar yard near portland and  american classic cross river in vancouver wash,, an number of dc.com members near there.     Have ya got family out here or just fun too see a great state,lol..

     will bee great to see your 69 with paint and headed back together again. safe travels.watch out for us redneck ,hillbillies on the west best coast,hahaha...   DJ  :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 13, 2013, 12:39:03 PM
We drove up and down the coast, stayed in Cannon Beach, Bandon and Yachats (I think that is pronounced Yahots??)   We wanted to get away from the Houston heat and we did.  Last day was in Portland and, wouldn't you know it, they had their hottest day ever (95 F).  But really a beautiful coast, rugged, lots of crashing waves, magnificent trees.

But, what's with the 55 MPH speed limits everywhere????
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 19, 2013, 09:04:03 AM
Got the driver fender and took it to the shop yesterday along with some odds and ends.   No progress while I was gone but I didn't expect any.  Hopefully, they will start on it next week.  Waiting is already hard and the car has only been gone 2 weeks!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on September 20, 2013, 12:45:43 AM
Quote from: davidcam69 on September 02, 2013, 03:07:53 PM
Hello, this is my first post but I've been watching this forum for awhile even before joining. I couldn't resist putting in my  2 cents on this thread because this is exactly what I am going thru right now.       

This isn't for the faint of heart. I commend anyone like Mitch who does their own work with such skill, that kind of talent and self satisfaction is priceless.   I figure I will have 30,000 (low end) to 50,000(high end) when all said and done and that's not counting my hundreds of hours putting it back together.  If this wasn't my dad's-my car, I probably would not restore it. I would spend less money and time and find a good resto for less money.   

Mitch, since Generalkiwi brought it up I thought I would share my money story. Hope I didn't intrude with my long ass story.

Dave     

I kind of chopped your post up but I have to agree with a lot that you said.   This is a hobby for me so cost vs value was never an issue.  How much I will spend over the life of the project is an issue (does that make sense??)  But, as you said, these kind of projects are not for the faint of heart.  They take a lot of money and time.  If you look back through my thread you can see why I'm doing mine.  Folks have asked for dollar numbers and I Have to say that the dollars have been fairly low to this point ( a little here and there, mostly to AMD.)  But I warned my wife that there will be a lot of money going out the door now.  If I get away from the paint shop for $10k I will feel lucky. 

Looking at getting the rear end set up for about $2K.  Suspension (including brakes) another $3k.  Engine and trans, maybe $12K.  Interior, $4K.  Add 10% for items not included ( $3-5K)  Looks like I will be shelling out anywhere from $35-40K.  Original cost of car was about $14K and parts I've bought to date ($5K), total is in the $55-60K range.  Not going to sell this baby for a profit!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on September 20, 2013, 05:43:56 AM
Shit Mitch , you had better plan that engine out, list what you would like to do , and the price everything against that llist Mitch, you might want to rethink that stroker , I spent that on the engine alone, most of my parts bought over there, bought all the bits over a period of time whilst doing other things , quickly adds up,
I think I spent 3 to 4 just on trans including new high stall converter,
Wait a minute I have to stop myself and stop thinking about the cost , just build it , got that part Mitch , imagine if you had to pay some one to do all that work you have already done , add it up by hourly rate to all the hours you have put in , it's our hobby and interest, your have saved yourself a tonne of money on metal work alone , so don't be afraid to build your car the way you want, if it takes longer because of the cost so be it,can't wait to see progress, I know how I felt when it was in the shop to get painted, seemed like it was taking forever , so I worked on other parts , planned to all these bits to put back on her, didn't get half of them done , because suddenly she was ready to come home, so keep busy and it will be back soon
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration(good news and bad news)
Post by: green69rt on October 09, 2013, 07:45:40 PM
I visited the shop today and got some good news.  They've started on the car, first step was to install all the fenders, doors, hood and trunk lid to check for alignment.  The car actually looked like a charger.   At least it didn't set for months before they started on it.

Bad news is that there are some problems.  Either I made them or they are left over from before I got the car.   Doors and fenders don't line up well and the hood is bowed.   They are checking but it looks like the frame was pushed back by a hit.   I suspected this might be a problem and tried to correct it as I went along but didn't do enough.  The dimensions are in the 1/2" range but still enough to through things off.   They gave me a choice.   They can route out the mounting holes in the fenders and door hinges or take the front clip off and remount it correctly.   The problem is not with horizontal measurements its with the up and down measurements.   The nose droops.   They shop is working on an estimate.   We'll see. :shruggy:

Anyway here's a couple of pics in the shop.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: JB400 on October 09, 2013, 08:47:17 PM
At least they are working on it :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 09, 2013, 09:44:45 PM
Yeah, working on it is better than waiting thru more time.    Sounds like an extra few weeks in the shop.. :shruggy: :shruggy: :shruggy: :shruggy:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 01:27:31 AM
so Mitch she's bowed down, I would be taking her back home to sort out , you are better off doing it your self or have you had enough at this stage, did you have engine side skirts off, I cant remember,
drill out the spot welds to inner skirts near fire wall and induce the bow from there , time for us car tool frame ties,
or was she tired in the frame already, and you just put back as you took apart , close up shots to affected areas please, show me how far out it is.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 01:45:36 AM
Mitch that hood easily adjusted, put some bolts in the fenders , close up that hood is better then the one I started with , search the threads for panel line up, edge of hood front and rear and a bit of manipulation , check how the factory did it, they still use rubber mallets to this day
its only the sides to match fenders, the rest of that hood in great shape
sorry mate should have piped in and told you to align everything before you took it to the shop .
ignoring the fenders can the doors line up ok , find the point where you are out, don't like the idea of slotting hole to make things fit and would advise you not to let the do so,
find out where she's bowed from first Mitch,
not a big deal yet , but high lights the problem some guys get into whacking frame connectors in without checking fitment.
another visit to the panel shop Mitch , lots of photo's please, hopefully we can give you some advise to help fix this easily,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 01:57:07 AM
just another thought, you haven't got those repop hinges have you Mitch, junk not a good fit , grab your old ones if you have them , repin them , repops holes are out and make the job more difficult 
I zooming in on the photos you have posted and it doesn't look bad , it cant be that far out , if so not that difficult to fix , come back with close up photo's of those area's   
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 04:13:09 AM
Another thought sorry Mitch , those fenders have a lot of adjustment , look at your inner skirts you can lift the fenders mid stream , I did , the more I look at the photo's the better the options , which fender is the worst , I bet the AMD one , I found there not that great ,  but those fenders are just sitting there in the photos
If it was my car , I think I would be taking her home to sort it , your skill level and patience have shown on this car so far , minor issues , put her back on the stands and drill those spot welds out , inner skirts , don't have the stands under the front frame rails ,chock it at the sills and induce sag the other way,
And then think
US car tool frame connectors , I put a false top in mine just below the floor level to create a proper boxed section, if you put these in after correcting the droop in nose it won't go anywhere, better handling also a benefit, torque boxes also ?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 04:57:03 AM
Another Mitch , went back through you whole thread, nothing you did , sag was already there from the amount of structural rust , here's my new plan,
Fenders will adjust bonnet edges , if they won't , the the bonnet can be adjusted to suit , next align doors up to body gaps to quarter panels , fenders on and do the like car builders do cut or build up with weld to front door or fender gap edges and grind to suit , these cars were never built great o start with and this car is now better then the factory did,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 10, 2013, 08:18:00 AM
Lots of good stuff to think about.    Like I said, the shop will be giving me their assessment of what needs to be done and the hours to do it along with the new parts needed.   I think I will sit on their info till this coming Monday (at least) and let things percolate thru my head.   I don't want to pull the trigger on anything too quickly.  

They did mention a couple of other things that I'm going to keep as is.   They said one rear spring perch sets 3/8" further forward than the other.   They said they could cut it out and line it up, going to tell them no on that, it's close enough and any variation will just make a diff in the angle that the shackle hangs.    The other thing is the gap under the doors.  My car has fairly large gaps and did even when I bought it, as much as 1/2".   Best I can remember, even my new Charger back-in-the-day, had large gaps and so have others that I have seen.  They said they could cut up the outer rocker to close up the gap.   I'll go with the existing gaps.

As far as anything else they want to do, I'm going to make another trip to the shop to look for myself before I decide anything.

I have good confidence in these guys doing a good job, I just need to hold them back from trying to make me a 100 point car.

As for bringing it home, it's $400 each way so Ill have to see what the costs are......  (edit, transport costs were $300)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on October 10, 2013, 09:19:27 AM
if we need to take measurements my car is available to compare.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 10, 2013, 11:24:44 AM
Quote from: cdr on October 10, 2013, 09:19:27 AM
if we need to take measurements my car is available to compare.

Thanks Charlie, I thought about asking.  
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 04:40:57 PM
Mitch,
my car also has the large gaps under doors , that's standard,
yes I think they are trying to give you a 100 point car, 4 wheel alignment can be done by shimming the front spring hanger only,
mine will have to be done after the damage I repaired to one front spring hanger , and my car had a rear impact which will have distorted things, 
will that work shop let you fit up your panels to your satisfaction , the factory painted these cars complete didn't they,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 10, 2013, 06:40:22 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on October 10, 2013, 04:40:57 PM
Mitch,
my car also has the large gaps under doors , that's standard,
yes I think they are trying to give you a 100 point car, 4 wheel alignment can be done by shimming the front spring hanger only,
mine will have to be done after the damage I repaired to one front spring hanger , and my car had a rear impact which will have distorted things, 
will that work shop let you fit up your panels to your satisfaction , the factory painted these cars complete didn't they,

The shop and I will have to come to some agreement on how much to do.  The manager and I have talked at least once about the level so I guess I'll just have to keep repeating myself.   I've seen several beautiful cars in their shop, flawless paint, pristine interiors, etc.   I just don't want to pay for that level of a job just to drive it to Austin and have rocks making holes in the paint.

We'll have to discuss panel painting vs assembled paint job.   Since the paint is a semi metallic, I may be limited to painting the car assembled.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Homerr on October 11, 2013, 01:09:52 AM
Choose whether you want a car to enjoy driving or trailering.    :scratchchin:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 11, 2013, 07:26:21 AM
Quote from: Homerr on October 11, 2013, 01:09:52 AM
Choose whether you want a car to enjoy driving or trailering.    :scratchchin:

I'm going to drive this as much as I can.   Bet on it!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on October 12, 2013, 04:56:24 PM
Hey Mitch

I've been following your build and read about the drooping nose issue.  Theses B body chassis are not the most rigid to begin with.   I would think that the shop that has the car has some sort of frame machine and would be able to easily bring the nose back into spec.   After everything is square I would strongly suggest you add a stiffing kit.  I believe the one I used is from xv motorsports and it connects the inner aprons to the cowl.  Here is a link to my thread if you want to see how this installed.   http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,54842.0.html
 

Good Luck

Mike
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 13, 2013, 12:55:23 AM
Quote from: sardillim on October 12, 2013, 04:56:24 PM
Hey Mitch

I've been following your build and read about the drooping nose issue.  Theses B body chassis are not the most rigid to begin with.   I would think that the shop that has the car has some sort of frame machine and would be able to easily bring the nose back into spec.   After everything is square I would strongly suggest you add a stiffing kit.  I believe the one I used is from xv motorsports and it connects the inner aprons to the cowl.  Here is a link to my thread if you want to see how this installed.   http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,54842.0.html
 

Good Luck

Mike

Thanks.  When I replaced the inner rockers I used 14 gauge metal vs the 18 or 20 that is stock.  I'll will also add the US Car Tool frame connectors.     Beyond that we'll have to see.  I'm still not convinced that the nose actually droops but maybe just some bad alignment issues when I got the car or did the repairs.  Still waiting on the shops evaluation.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on October 13, 2013, 06:21:22 PM
This May Help You

Mike
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 13, 2013, 09:42:29 PM
Thanks, my FSM has a similar diagram that I used for the measurements that I took.  I don't know if the shop has these specs.  Think I'll take a copy of the diagram to them.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (new plan, bring the car home and fix it!!)
Post by: green69rt on October 15, 2013, 04:37:08 PM
Just got back from the shop. I had a long conversation and crawled around under the car for about an hour.   Basic problem is that the shop estimated $15,000 to fix the body.   That included correcting some measurements that were already to within 1/8" of the FSM diagram.   Some were out 1/2" around the position of the rear spring hangers.   Biggest problem is still the front end frame.


So, the car will come home and I'm going to see what I can do.  Cost was way to high for me to leave it in their shop.   Even after I deleted all the stuff that was really ok, the cost was still around $9000 to fix the front frame, and I think they forgot some parts.  Their plan was to cut off the complete front clip and replace it with new stuff and tack everything in place, hang the fenders and hood and doors and when everything looked good ;weld it back together.   I got to believe I can do it for less.  So next thing is to call the tow company and schedule the shipment.

Just for grins, I also asked what the paint job was going to be.......another $15,000 which includes $5000 for materials.   Is that a reasonable number!!!!?

So now I'm just sitting here thinking how strong a drink to fix (maybe 2 or 3.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 15, 2013, 05:05:45 PM
Shit, wish I was there to come give you a hand Mitch,
not as bad as this bill has made it seem, I notice paint just jumped up by a third,
photo's mate, before you take her apart, maybe we can help with plan of action , or the real work needed to be done , front clip is what's needed to be concentrated on,
you don't think I got mine perfect, ridgedly fixed down like you had it and propped to factory measurements, panels to be hung , off and on Mitch, minor stuff , that's what I want you to get your head around , it's made it seem worse leaving it there for an opinion from them,
$ Dollars of course your going to be cheaper its your labour ,would rather have you do it after seeing your work
get her home and start by posting photos, I would like to see how the doors line up, , don't want to get too far ahead yet , but how us some photo's close up Mitch espicially to where these bolts wouldn't line up, fenders and door alignment ? start by purchasing those US car tool frame connector's and the torque box's are a must, and will start from there       
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 15, 2013, 05:28:32 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on October 15, 2013, 05:05:45 PM
Shit, wish I was there to come give you a hand Mitch,
not as bad as this bill has made it seem, I notice paint just jumped up by a third,
photo's mate, before you take her apart, maybe we can help with plan of action , or the real work needed to be done , front clip is what's needed to be concentrated on,
you don't think I got mine perfect, ridgedly fixed down like you had it and propped to factory measurements, panels to be hung , off and on Mitch, minor stuff , that's what I want you to get your head around , it's made it seem worse leaving it there for an opinion from them,
$ Dollars of course your going to be cheaper its your labour ,would rather have you do it after seeing your work
get her home and start by posting photos, I would like to see how the doors line up, , don't want to get too far ahead yet , but how us some photo's close up Mitch espicially to where these bolts wouldn't line up, fenders and door alignment ? start by purchasing those US car tool frame connector's and the torque box's are a must, and will start from there       

Seems like I've been in this situation before.   Right now I just want to get it home and then sit and think about it for a week or two, maybe take a couple of measurements.  That always seems to help.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 15, 2013, 06:00:17 PM
Just reviewed critical points for me , I would be having a bourbon or two, get my head around that it its not that bad , no really its not that bad , just checked your thread for door hinge pillar and door alignment work , all good there,
I had a lot of trouble with the AMD fender lining up, after reviewing my photo's all the work lining up was done with the old fender and that was replaced after it got to panel shop, your's is front clip only, bonnet is good that's only adjustment 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on October 15, 2013, 07:04:02 PM
when it gets home call me,i will help you come up with a fix.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 15, 2013, 07:35:02 PM
Quote from: cdr on October 15, 2013, 07:04:02 PM
when it gets home call me,i will help you come up with a fix.

Deal!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: sardillim on October 15, 2013, 07:45:41 PM
That Sucks!

I will tell you that the nose can be moved around pretty easily.  I have used nothing more than a scissor jack to make a height adjustment on the left front corner of my car.  It shouldn't take much to anchor the car to something and align the chassis.  The trick will be establishing a datum line.  

Good Luck !
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 15, 2013, 07:56:45 PM
I agree, had structural members ( steel beams ) made a temporary jig so I could set measurements, note it still moved Mitch , but close enough to get it right, the more I look the more it becomes just the front rails , Clip
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 15, 2013, 10:44:01 PM
3 and working.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (returned to the garage)
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 12:25:27 PM
My car is back in the garage.  (pic #1)  Already taken the front fenders off.  Before I go any further I just want to say that I don't believe the shop I took it too were trying to pull anything.  They are a high end restoration shop and that's how they approach a job.  I saw many cars in their shop that were beautiful, and some that were just strange.  The one, that stands out to me, was a kind of British jeep.   Someone was spending thousands of dollars to have it fully restored. :shruggy: :shruggy:   They were just too expensive for my job.

I do want to show a couple of things I've noticed about the AMD sheet metal.  Pic #2 is the gap between the new AMD cowl and the original door, Pic #3 shows the gap between the AMD cowl and the new AMD door.  Seems like AMD takes some care to make their parts work together but not necessarily work with original parts.

Another place that I might need to work on is the bottom of the doors, just looks crappy to me, both curves are AMD metal.  Even the driver side that is an AMD door looks the same.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 12:45:08 PM
So a final note on AMD metal.  Even to an amateur's eye like mine, the reproduction is good but not exact.  Pic #1 shows the OE driver side fender.  Notice the smooth curve that I'm pointing at.  Pic#2 shows the AMD piece.  Much sharper curve, almost looks dented but I don't think it is, just a different profile.

Now on to the first repair.  The body man at the Mo Muscle recommended that I fix the pass door gap by making a slice down thru the front edge of the quarter and tap it back.  He said trying to grind the edge of the door should be a last resort.   So that' s how I going to do it.  Pic #3 shows the whole door and pic #4 show the mark on the door where he recommended the cut be made  ( I need to make it a nice clean straight line!)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: nvrbdn on October 24, 2013, 01:05:29 PM
so it would be just cutting and rewelding back together?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on October 24, 2013, 01:52:12 PM
on the lower rocker corner that is how they are from the factory  :Twocents:

let me know if you need some help.

charlie
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 01:54:41 PM
Quote from: nvrbdn on October 24, 2013, 01:05:29 PM
so it would be just cutting and rewelding back together?

Yeah, just cut along the line and make the cut about 1/8 or 3/16 wide.  Tap the edge of the quarter to push it back so the cut gets narrow and weld it back up.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 04:28:06 PM
So its the quarter that's too far forward Mitch,
is there still room for the latch part or is the jam area closed up too much,
that bottom of door standard, nose of fenders will just have a bit of filler to smooth radius out,
? what about the droopy nose issue,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 04:40:18 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 04:28:06 PM
So its the quarter that's too far forward Mitch,
is there still room for the latch part or is the jam area closed up too much,
that bottom of door standard, nose of fenders will just have a bit of filler to smooth radius out,
? what about the droopy nose issue,

Yeah the quarter was maybe 1/8" to 3/16" too far forward.  The rest of the latch pillar never moved because I didn't touch it, Just the quarter sheet metal.   So the latch and all the line-up for the windows etc. are all good.  And yes I figure it will take just a touch of filler to fix that nose or at least make it closer to my liking.


As for the droopy nose, I'm just looking now, letting things simmer in my head.   Like I said, the shop wanted to cut the whole front clip off and start with new metal, big bucks!!   I think I will go over to CDR' s house and take some measurements on his 68 and compare them to mine to see if that gives me a clue on how to go forward.  As soon as I finish with my door (see next reply for progress) I'm going to hang the fenders again and then we'll see.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 04:48:05 PM
So I bit the bullet and started slicing up the new quarter metal.   

First pic shows the cut and the "tapping" result.  I'm really surprised!   I think the gap came out almost perfect,  I may even have a little room for adjustment!!

Second pic - pulled the tape and tacked the slice to hold it in position.

Third pic - 10,000 tacks later the slice is closed,  grinding tomorrow!!

This really went a lot faster and easier than I thought and certainly easier than trying to grind down the edge of the door ( which might raise all sorts of window alignment issues.)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 05:14:37 PM
Looks good Mitch,
once that's ground down and a light layer of fill , you wont know that was an issue,
I wish when I was at this stage would I have modified the bottom corner of doors, I think I would have rounded them of to match sill and quarter, when you have finished this area, can you rehang fenders so we can see the issue of front, I'm assuming that its an issue at bottom fender bolts and gap to door to fender, unless you already have photos side on,
nose down or up ?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 05:21:59 PM
Just a little droop on the nose end.  With the fenders on - the bottom back of the fenders overlap the bottom of the doors (both side equally.)  you can't raise the front of the fenders because the fender brackets go on top and underneath the radiator support,  so...   When I get to that point I'll post some more pics.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 05:22:42 PM
that top edge of door to cowl , do the same Mitch,
mark it to clear and follow the shape, match the other side or use that as a guide for gap,  cut and weld, grind and finish off ,
that's the two major issues done,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 05:31:29 PM
Do you still have your old fenders to try on Mitch,
I think that this may be an issue with AMD fenders, did all my work and got to paint stage and the AMD fender fitted up differently to original, I thought at the time because my old fender had taken a hit or two that was the issue,
the reason I am thinking is that like me you replaced fenders late in the piece and suddenly you have issues, I too had clearance issues with the bottom,
and its this that's making you think the nose is out,
also the way there pressed affects the top,
had some difficulty like in your photos to match bonnet, fenders too flat on top, but that's adjustable with a little effort
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 24, 2013, 07:17:47 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 05:31:29 PM
Do you still have your old fenders to try on Mitch,
I think that this may be an issue with AMD fenders, did all my work and got to paint stage and the AMD fender fitted up differently to original, I thought at the time because my old fender had taken a hit or two that was the issue,
the reason I am thinking is that like me you replaced fenders late in the piece and suddenly you have issues, I too had clearance issues with the bottom,
and its this that's making you think the nose is out,
also the way there pressed affects the top,
had some difficulty like in your photos to match bonnet, fenders too flat on top, but that's adjustable with a little effort

Thanks for the info, I have one AMD fender and one OE fender.  I'll spend some time making the comparison.  Love this site, always someone willing to help (or to gripe about what you're screwing up.. :eek2: :eek2: )
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 24, 2013, 10:45:40 PM
No have to disagree , your not screwing Mitch, don't know of many people on hear or in the real world of cars that would have gone to the extent that you have, I look at it as you have saved another one , and a bad one at the starting point, great work, have loved watching the development of your car,
but your right good people on here willing to help, they have been good to me so keeping with the attitude on here and being helpful when I can.
regarding your bonnet , have a look at you early photo's regarding the lining up of guard to bonnet edge.
not bowed, just adjustment

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 25, 2013, 04:03:45 AM
That side now is going to have the best door gap on the planet, have you thought about slicing a little further down an correcting that door cnr now on that side you already have the quarter sliced , you could open that up a little and tap it to be more square to match door, either way is going to work ,
Keep at it Mitch great work
The front is not going to be as hard as you think , I repeat fantastic work, would have loved to have you as a neighbour when I was into mine, lots of areas on mine I wish I could do over ,
That's the trouble when you do the work, you know every fault or mistake
One of the biggest area's I would fix is that originally the doors hung out at the bottom, thus on factory sheet metal the tops of quarters matched doors, today you tend to gap these cars like the modern equivalent, by doing that tops not even,
every car I remember that was a factory ill that I wanted to correct and remembered after it was painted,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: mopar4don on October 25, 2013, 05:20:05 AM
Great Job Mitch! Keep at it, you are testing the waters that I will be going through with my restoration, and I'm sure others as well!
Keep those "how to" pictures coming!  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Generalkiwi on October 25, 2013, 05:25:16 AM
Couldn't agree more with the guys here , Mitch you are dong a great job, im learning so much reading this thread and following your "how to" pics also, big respect also to the guys (fy469rtse and others) who so kindly and freely offer advice and help, amazing to see and read about.

Keep it up mate!

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: nvrbdn on October 25, 2013, 07:48:23 AM
very cool. doing great work. pic's are great. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 25, 2013, 05:32:33 PM
First pic.  Passenger gap is ready for a little filler and off to the next problem. 

Second pic.  Notice how the passenger side holes set to the back of the holes in the rocker.  They should match up.

Third pic shows the bottom of the fender where it meets the rocker and the door.  Kind of blurry.  Sorry.

I marked along the fender so you can see how much overlap there is.  The top of the fender is fairly close.  I can't raise the front of the fender because the mounting holes to the inner fenders would be out and also because the front of the fender traps the radiator support between upper and lower flanges on the fender.

More later, getting ready for a Halloween party.  Who knows how much I'll get done tomorrow :icon_smile_big:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 26, 2013, 05:46:54 AM
Ok can your humour me Mitch
I would like you to put the following bolts in , you won't get a clear idea unless you do, first bolts on inner skirt along radiator surport, there's a bit off play in those so try and lift the guards up , the only thing this will affect is guard to bonnet edge gap ,
I noticed with your repairs no holes in the bottom, can you drill these in the right spot and put them in with the self threaded washes, it will take a bit of effort, but if you can get these in and with those front inner skirt bolts already in tight guard won't move forward, interested to see if the rest stays where it is and only induces more of a bow to side 
Not as bad a fit on my car but interestingly similar to the amd fender
Did you hang one of the originals to see if any difference ?
Great work on the door gap , once filled and under coated , you would never know
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on October 28, 2013, 01:58:59 AM
I would still like to see photos of original fender on there for comparison  , looking good Mitch,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on October 28, 2013, 08:02:38 AM
Took the weekend off.   I'll start again today. 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on November 08, 2013, 04:02:45 AM
What's the latest Mitch, looking for a bit of inspiration myself, lost my motivation
And is always good to see other members cars and the work being done
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 08, 2013, 08:36:12 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on November 08, 2013, 04:02:45 AM
What's the latest Mitch, looking for a bit of inspiration myself, lost my motivation
And is always good to see other members cars and the work being done

More info coming today (with pics.)

Later folks.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: nvrbdn on November 08, 2013, 10:50:10 AM
 :popcrn: :popcrn: :popcrn:  i cant wait.

  work is going great so far. lots of pic's or the fender alignment, and holes lined up/ not lined up. :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 08, 2013, 02:22:10 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on October 26, 2013, 05:46:54 AM
Ok can your humour me Mitch
I would like you to put the following bolts in , you won't get a clear idea unless you do, first bolts on inner skirt along radiator surport, there's a bit off play in those so try and lift the guards up , the only thing this will affect is guard to bonnet edge gap ,
I noticed with your repairs no holes in the bottom, can you drill these in the right spot and put them in with the self threaded washes, it will take a bit of effort, but if you can get these in and with those front inner skirt bolts already in tight guard won't move forward, interested to see if the rest stays where it is and only induces more of a bow to side 
Not as bad a fit on my car but interestingly similar to the amd fender
Did you hang one of the originals to see if any difference ?
Great work on the door gap , once filled and under coated , you would never know

I tried to do what you asked.  No luck.  The first pic below shows how far the fender brace that bolts to the radiator support is off.   I couldn't push the fender back far enough to line up the bolt holes.  I could line up the holes in the bottom of the rocker but it made the fender bow out so much that I was afraid it was going to cause the metal to kink so I quit trying.

I went over the CDR's house and we made some measurements on his car to compare to mine.  Just some simple things to check, not trying to match factory but just to see if we could see where the problem was.  Second pic shows how we measured from the front middle of the cowl to the radiator support.  His car was 41 1/2" and mine was 41 1/4".  Likewise from the top of the firewall to the radiator support was 39 1/4" on his and 39" on mine so looks like a little off there but not much.  Next we measured from the front edge of the K member to the first hole in the bottom of the rocker (sorry I couldn't get a good picture while holding the tape measure.)  His car 44 3/4" and mine 43 1/2".  Looks like the complete frame is set back about an inch too much!  We also took a cross measurement to make sure the front is square.  Looks good.

So the next is to check the relation of the TB cross member to the LCAs.  Got to mount them back up and put the TBs in to make sure that there is nothing funny going on there.  If that turns out ok, I going to cut the front clip including frame, inner fenders and radiator (as one piece) from the rest of the car.  Line everything up, mount the fenders and make sure everything fits, tack it back in place.  Check again, weld everything back up.  At the rate I work maybe done by Christmas.  If this works I will be out about $900 in parts and a lot of my time.   A lot better that the $15k the shop wanted.   

Stand by.    I hope to start tomorrow building  a support for the front clip to hold it while I do the alignment.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on November 08, 2013, 09:44:15 PM
So it's not just down at the nose Mitch , back as well, sorry mate,
You have a bit of work in front of you yet,
A set back but in no means out of your capabilitys , look forward to you posting , rest of the car looks great if you compare it the start, it's come a long way :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 09, 2013, 12:35:39 AM
Stand by, more to come.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 22, 2013, 06:26:34 PM
Well, the work continues.   Got the front clip cut away from the rest of the car and hung one of the fenders just to check I was going in the right direction.  What do you know, after moving the front clip forward about 3/4" the gaps between the door and the fender appeared!!  I also raised the front end about 3/4" to get the gap more even. (PIC #1.)

You can see where I cut the inner fenders from the car, I've already got new replacement metal ready so when everything looks good I'll figure out what to do. (PIC #2.)

The TB cross member was tough to cut out because of the close quarters but it's done and it looks like I can save it, just weld it back to the inner rockers when I'm ready (PIC #3.)

You can see my setup, I put "legs" on the front clip to hold it up and then a car jack to raise the front.   I use shims under the "legs" to hold everything in place once the alignment is correct.  Looks kind of crude but it works (PIC#4.)

Next get the fenders, hood and maybe the front valance installed and lined up, tack everything in place and then undo all the damage I caused.....
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Homerr on November 22, 2013, 07:41:25 PM
Mitch, thanks for posting and showing the work.  I'm learning all the time from your posts, even if it's what not to do.   :o
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 22, 2013, 09:40:10 PM
Quote from: Homerr on November 22, 2013, 07:41:25 PM
Mitch, thanks for posting and showing the work.  I'm learning all the time from your posts, even if it's what not to do.   :o

That's the idea.  Nobody like to show their mistakes but sometimes that helps most!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on November 23, 2013, 01:33:53 AM
That looks better Mitch , half way there to correcting it, your skills are amazing ,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 23, 2013, 08:43:05 AM
Quote from: fy469rtse on November 23, 2013, 01:33:53 AM
That looks better Mitch , half way there to correcting it, your skills are amazing ,

Thanks Geoff.  I just wished that I had known enough to keep the fenders and hood on while I was replacing the front frame.  Oh well, keeps me off the streets. 
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ghoste on November 23, 2013, 09:29:31 AM
Is that a separate floor under the car Mitch?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on November 23, 2013, 09:40:21 AM
Quote from: Ghoste on November 23, 2013, 09:29:31 AM
Is that a separate floor under the car Mitch?

Don't know what you mean.  While I had the car in the restoration shop I had my workshop area floor epoxied.  If you're talking about the little step, I had my garage expanded before I bought the Charger.  I needed space to work and store the car.   The step is where the old garage floor ends and the new one begins.  Now that I think about it I don't remember exactly why the builder did that vs. just making it the same level as the rest of the floor.

Edit, now I remember,  The we raised the foundation of the new part because my lot rises in the back and I wanted to keep the top of the foundation about 4" above ground level.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ghoste on November 23, 2013, 09:44:49 AM
Thats what Im seeing then.  I thought maybe you had built a specific floorspace just for the Charger and wondered.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: remta1 on November 26, 2013, 02:40:39 AM
workshop looks cleaner than mine
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: XS29L9B2 on November 26, 2013, 06:13:21 AM
very nice work i love that
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on November 26, 2013, 07:13:30 AM
No mistakes Mitch just a learning curve, love your work, not many would been prepared to do that level of work to one car, that's why mine has stalled, bit over it and I had half the work in metal that you have had to do
Fantastic , great to see you at it :popcrn: :popcrn: still watching, this is going to be a good thread all the way
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 09, 2013, 09:00:23 AM
The cold, here in Houston (32 degrees one night and don't laugh, my blood is thin,) and the holidays have slowed me WAY down.  Been spending a hour here or there on getting the front panels lined up and thinking about the reassembly process.   Also, I sent the rear axle case out to get powder coated and it now sets at in a mechanics garage waiting for the new parts from DR Diff (489 diff, lines, axle bearings, brake assembly.)  Only things that will survive  are the case and the axles.

So there is a tiny bit of progress, just not enough to warrant pictures.   I'll get some out when the rear end gets home.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 09, 2013, 05:03:59 PM
what centre are you putting in,
traclock , suregrip , your going to replace axle bearings with factory type and not get talked in to non load green type ford bearings ?
a good friend of mine showed me a good trick with your axles , spin them in a lathe to check for straightness, i had to press one of my flanges straight where the wheel sits, benifit of the lathe could skim the surface of that for 100 % true face,
if you find a bent axle you might want to check the housing"s straight as well, you can never assume when you dont know the use history of the car , i lesson i have learned   
good to see you still at it.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 09, 2013, 06:18:10 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on December 09, 2013, 05:03:59 PM
what centre are you putting in,
traclock , suregrip , your going to replace axle bearings with factory type and not get talked in to non load green type ford bearings ?
a good friend of mine showed me a good trick with your axles , spin them in a lathe to check for straightness, i had to press one of my flanges straight where the wheel sits, benifit of the lathe could skim the surface of that for 100 % true face,
if you find a bent axle you might want to check the housing"s straight as well, you can never assume when you dont know the use history of the car , i lesson i have learned   
good to see you still at it.


Shuregrip with 3.91 gears.  Stock tapered axel bearings.   Only thing I didn't plan on was the axel bearing retainer was shot.  Dr Diff makes a billit replacement for $130, I found a NOS one on ebay for $20 plus $5 shipping, guess which one I picked!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (new rear axle ready to go in.)
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 03:57:37 PM
When I shipped the Charger off to be painted, I also took the rear axle assembly to a local mechanic to have it taken apart.  I then took the case to be blasted and powder coated.   Took it back to the mechanic and bought all new goodies to go in the case, except for the axles.   Thank you Dr Diff for taking my money!  Came out looking pretty nice, just wish I could put it back on the car.  Oh well, into storage it goes.   First pic is "before"  next three pics are "after".  All that's left is to attach the parking brake cable.  I'm also going to paint the bare metal parts with Eastwood Cast steel gray paint to try to keep it looking good for a little longer.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 04:07:17 PM
I think I have the fenders and doors pretty well gapped.   I still want to try to attach the front valence.    I don't know if it needs to be on but after my recent experience, it's a small amount of work.    First pic is just a general shot of the car as it is right now.  Second shows the door/fender gap.  I still have a problem where the passenger door, fender and cowl come together.  Profiles don't match up (pic 3.)  Finally the hood is a little bowed.   I knew that was the case so now I'll have to see if I can fix it or I'll have to buy another, it's only money right :eek2:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: tsmithae on December 16, 2013, 04:14:23 PM
That's one nice rear end you've got there.   :yesnod:

Good luck with the hood, I think you can save it!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 04:26:08 PM
I agree ,
hood can be manipulated, but fit that valance up to make sure it fits to the new fender , how are those tail light buckets, only because there not that great even from factory,
the rest is looking great Mitch, everything lining up much better, looks great
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 04:40:23 PM
that fender to cowl area Mitch, just mark it how you want and slice and weld up,
your skills better than mine and thats what i would do,
actually i would take lots of photos and let us look at them and head off any issues before paint, theres parts i wish i could do over and someone had pointed them out
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 05:50:49 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 04:40:23 PM
that fender to cowl area Mitch, just mark it how you want and slice and weld up,
your skills better than mine and thats what i would do,
actually i would take lots of photos and let us look at them and head off any issues before paint, theres parts i wish i could do over and someone had pointed them out

I didn't think of doing a slice and dice on the cowl, interesting idea.  Just like I did on the door gap except not open the gap up but slice the cowl and push it closer to the fender and door to close the uneven gap up.  My first thought was to add about 1/8" of weld bead to the edge of the fender and door and grind the bead down to get the gap I want.  Let's see how things develop.

I had to fish around to find the valence mounting bolts.  Anyone have a picture of how the bolts are arranged?   Looks like four go along the bottom of the radiator support and three each side to mount the valence to the fender.  On the fender do the spring nuts(??) go on the fender or the valence?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 05:53:11 PM
Quote from: tsmithae on December 16, 2013, 04:14:23 PM
That's one nice rear end you've got there.   :yesnod:

Yeah, that's what my wife says...oh you're talking about the differential  :smilielol:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 05:55:20 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 04:26:08 PM
how are those tail light buckets, only because there not that great even from factory,

I never touched the tail light panel so it should still be ok, but that's another test fit I'll have to do before final paint.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on December 16, 2013, 05:57:56 PM
on the sides of valance the clips go in the fender except the front hole gets the clip on the valance
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on December 16, 2013, 06:01:52 PM
i edited my post it is correct now
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 06:14:35 PM
Quote from: cdr on December 16, 2013, 06:01:52 PM
i edited my post it is correct now

It seems pretty clear to me now.  Two clips on the fender and one on the valence.  Kind of makes sense because the bolt heads would be hard to get to any other way.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 06:28:01 PM
sorry Mitch, i meant cut the fender,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 07:43:54 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 06:28:01 PM
sorry Mitch, i meant cut the fender,

I didn't know which one but the door profile where it meets the cowl is also off so it will take more than just a fender cut to do the job.  But, hold that thought and we'll see how things develop.  I did a little measuring and we're only taking about 1/16" to 1/8" off so a small weld bead right along the edge may be enough.  I've seen it done before and looks to be a fairly easy fix (have we heard that before??)
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on December 16, 2013, 07:58:02 PM
i have seen thin welding rod mig welded on a edge & then ground to fit.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 16, 2013, 09:28:54 PM
Quote from: cdr on December 16, 2013, 07:58:02 PM
i have seen thin welding rod mig welded on a edge & then ground to fit.

Yeah, or a little piece of metal.  In my case, I think a single run of welding bead will be enough.  But first I need to get the valence on.   Turns out that the wooden "feet" I bolted on the frame rails stick out about 1/2" in front of the rails so I can't get the valence on.   I need to spend a little time repositioning the "legs".  It's always something, right Charlie??
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on December 16, 2013, 09:42:34 PM
aint that the truth
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 16, 2013, 11:37:06 PM
yes i know that feeling all too well Mitch
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (fixing a door gap.)
Post by: green69rt on December 24, 2013, 05:13:09 PM
Spent a couple of hours fixing the door gap on the passenger side.  The gap between the door and the cowl did not match at all.  I just added some weld bead to the edge of the door (pic 1.)

Then ground the bead flat and scribed a line where the edge should be (I don't think you can see the scribe line in the pic 2.)

Then started grinding the edge.  I cut a wooden shim, like you can get at Home Depot, so the thick end was as big as I wanted the gap.  Used the shim to fine test the gap till I got it where I wanted it. 

Final gap looks right on to me (pic 4.)  I still need to do a little cleanup on the edge with a file and a little filler or high build primer to clean it up.  Now I need to fix the door to fender gap and the fender to cowl gap.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: spoolinhard on December 25, 2013, 12:12:33 AM
I am a bit curious as to why you chose to work the gap on the door instead of the cowl? It appears to me that the aftermarket upper cowl was culprit in the contour that you are chasing :Twocents:.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 25, 2013, 12:28:54 AM
Quote from: spoolinhard on December 25, 2013, 12:12:33 AM
I am a bit curious as to why you chose to work the gap on the door instead of the cowl? It appears to me that the aftermarket upper cowl was culprit in the contour that you are chasing :Twocents:.

Yes, you may be right.  But, look at the fit between the cowl, fender and door.  To me, it looks like the fender and the door both have problems.   On the driver side, everything lines up pretty well.   So, if I tried to cut the cowl on the pass side, I don't know how I would make all the other parts fit??

Really, it's a case of where you want to do the fix.  I chose where I did and now will live with it??? :shruggy:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: JB400 on December 25, 2013, 12:31:20 AM
I think you chose wisely. :yesnod:  It's much easier to fix the gap where you did, then readjust the cowl.  Good job :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 25, 2013, 03:01:46 AM
Good job mitch, just how I would have helped, talked you into doing that way had I been there in your garage, after paint no one will notice, but they would have noticed that gap and how uneven it was ,
Now it's fixed and on to the next thousand task's ,  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: spoolinhard on December 25, 2013, 12:14:01 PM
Quote from: green69rt on December 25, 2013, 12:28:54 AM
Quote from: spoolinhard on December 25, 2013, 12:12:33 AM
I am a bit curious as to why you chose to work the gap on the door instead of the cowl? It appears to me that the aftermarket upper cowl was culprit in the contour that you are chasing :Twocents:.

Yes, you may be right.  But, look at the fit between the cowl, fender and door.  To me, it looks like the fender and the door both have problems.   On the driver side, everything lines up pretty well.   So, if I tried to cut the cowl on the pass side, I don't know how I would make all the other parts fit??

Really, it's a case of where you want to do the fix.  I chose where I did and now will live with it??? :shruggy:

I would have cut a slit on the edge of the cowl, moved it out and welded in a piece to fill the gap, if that makes sense. The gap seems to be off on the fender now, which could be fixed by welding metal onto the fender edge to line it up with the door/cowl gap. Don't mean to be a pain, just putting in my :Twocents:. If its unwanted please disregard. You are doing good work, I don't mean to imply otherwise.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 25, 2013, 01:05:50 PM
Yeah, spoolin, I understand exactly what you're saying.  I wanted to test this on the door before I tackled the fender.  Since I finished the piece on the door I'm not sure I like the way it lines up.  When looking from the very front of the car the gaps look funny because that door to cowl gap now turns into the cowl and on the other side the gap runs straight front to back.   I'll see if I can take a picture tomorrow.    more thinkin'   :scratchchin:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: MoparManJim on December 25, 2013, 05:05:24 PM
After looking at the photos, I think you picked the wrong part to adjust.. I think like the others said it's the cowl area not the door or fender. I think if you slit the cowl area and pull it outwards on the side and use metal filler you'll be good to go bud  :2thumbs:  
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 25, 2013, 09:48:44 PM
No more work.  Merry Christmas to all!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 25, 2013, 10:33:56 PM
The only down side to that if you were to modify cowl, you will have to get in try to put some sort of coating where you weld Mitch, remember the cowl Carries water making any unprotected welds a new rust area,
Post some photos so we can see difference , I think it looks god mitch,
Finish the door to fender gap next , high fill and prime it, then look at it
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: timmycharger on December 27, 2013, 09:54:05 PM
Just read this thread Mitch. Great job! My wife got a kick out of that old pic with your wife in it. My wife is petite too and seeing that pic reminded her of driving around in my car when we were in our 20's. Keep up the great work!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on December 27, 2013, 10:10:04 PM
To all that comment on my work or others, welcome!   Just a point to start the new year.... I always read the comments, sometimes they fit with the way I want to do things and sometimes I just get stubborn and do it the way I want (come hell or high water.)    Do any of you feel the same way??   But, it's always fun and I wouldn't miss it for a any reason.

And to Timmy... yeah...lots of great memories.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on December 28, 2013, 07:20:05 PM
Quote from: green69rt on December 27, 2013, 10:10:04 PM
To all that comment on my work or others, welcome!   Just a point to start the new year.... I always read the comments, sometimes they fit with the way I want to do things and sometimes I just get stubborn and do it the way I want (come hell or high water.)    Do any of you feel the same way??   But, it's always fun and I wouldn't miss it for a any reason.

And to Timmy... yeah...lots of great memories.

yes
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Ghoste on December 28, 2013, 08:38:34 PM
I bet that describes most of us.  :lol:

Here's to doing it our way. :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on December 28, 2013, 11:56:12 PM
Yes Mitch , always only friendly advise always, if my mistakes and things I overlooked or wish I had done better can help you, but you do it your way , get stubborn, if we weren't we wouldn't take up doing these cars and the amount of work needed to bring them back
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (2014)
Post by: green69rt on April 25, 2014, 04:51:27 PM
It's been a long, hard winter and I haven't done much but I did keep pinging away at stuff.   Time to put some more pictures up and continue the saga.

Most of this winter was spent spending an hour here and there trying to align all the doors, front fenders, hood and front valance up.  

Previous posts covered the problem with the pass door to quarter, that's done.  Driver door did not take any extra work (pic #1), it sets a little high at the rear because I figured that adding all the innards to it would cause it to sage some, we'll see.

fenders and hood actually went in fairly easily.

But I never want to put another front valance on.    The valance came with the car and was bought by the previous owner, I got it as part of the package.   Not an AMD part.   It took a lot of cutting, bending and a little weld filler to get everything right but one day I put it all together and it fit!!  I still need to clean up some weld bead and maybe route out mounting holes to get a little more adjustability but I think everything looks pretty good.

I've been going around to cruises and shows and checking out gaps on car I see.   The gaps are all over the place!!

Just to let you know some of the things I had to do you can see the pics.

Pic #2 -  the bottom of both fenders needed to be pushed in to mate up correctly with the valance.  I could have pulled them in with the bolts but I didn't want a lot of tension on the small ears that the bolts go thru, they would probably bend with time and the gaps widen out.

Pic #3 - Here's where I had to add a little weld bead because the AMD fender and the valance did not match up at all.

Pic #4 - shows the problem on the driver side, I'll have to add some weld metal to correct it.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on April 25, 2014, 05:06:04 PM
So here it is altogether, though, I don't know if you can see the valance?   Also you can see that the hood is new.  I was trying to get it aligned and it kept sliding out of adjustment.  Finally figured out that three of the hinge mounting threads in the hood were stripped> :brickwall:

A dent in the front, the warped hood and the stripped nuts were too much, I just didn't want to deal with them.   AMD made some more bucks off of me.


Now on to putting everything back together where I had to cut the front off.  Pic #2 shows the hole in the floor so I could get to the TB cross member.  Also the new floor patch is visible.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Stevearino on April 25, 2014, 05:27:43 PM
Great to see you are still plugging away. It is all looking great :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on April 26, 2014, 04:24:43 AM
Saw you had posted Mitch , so went back and read the whole thread again,
It does look very good , it's come a long way from what you started with ,
Great work in correcting that front sag, gaps look excellent Mitch ,
Told you those front valances were trouble !  :popcrn:  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: cdr on April 27, 2014, 10:19:15 AM
great to see your making progress.  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on April 27, 2014, 11:23:22 AM
Quote from: cdr on April 27, 2014, 10:19:15 AM
great to see your making progress.  :2thumbs:

Yeap, back to work again.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (working to repair the floor.)
Post by: green69rt on June 11, 2014, 05:42:53 PM
Hey guys,

Been a while.  I've been working and lurking on the web site.  The big floor patch is ready to weld in.    I had to cut out several braces to move the front clip around (pic #1 shows what I'm talking about.)   It was OK because I had hand made one or two and the other old ones where in pretty bad shape so AMD made some more money off of me.  This is really old news and nothing new so... pic # 2 shows the hole ready, silver weld thru primer and the new braces already installed.  I did prime and paint the top/backs of the braces because once the floor is in I won't be able to get to those areas.  I just used some rattle can Rustoleum primer and some old grey paint I had lying around.  Pic #3 is the patch in place.  Hopefully I will finish welding it in this weekend.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 11, 2014, 05:51:17 PM
I did have one change as I am mounting this floor.  On the previous floor, I had to cut and weld the front of the floor edge to match the profile of the fire wall.   This time I am just making the cuts, then mount the patch while pushing the edge to match up, THEN I'll weld up the cuts.  These pics show the cuts I'm talking about.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on June 11, 2014, 07:39:23 PM
good to see your atit again Mitch, looks great, :2thumbs: :popcrn: :popcrn:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on June 11, 2014, 07:44:52 PM
Mitch one area you should look at , is those aftermarket new fenders, barely noticable, but once you know its there it will bug even if no one else knows
compare the area where the the fender meets grill at bottom of opening ,
mine not finished correctly , have a look and see what you think, hopefully yours are better than mine were finished
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 11, 2014, 10:19:49 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on June 11, 2014, 07:44:52 PM
Mitch one area you should look at , is those aftermarket new fenders, barely noticable, but once you know its there it will bug even if no one else knows
compare the area where the the fender meets grill at bottom of opening ,
mine not finished correctly , have a look and see what you think, hopefully yours are better than mine were finished

Can you put up a pic?  Up till now I have just worked on making the lower valance match the fender...

As I welded up the frame I left the fenders/hood on so the gaps look good.  I don't want to go thru this again!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1965gp on June 11, 2014, 11:43:37 PM
Wow- fantastic thread. Really enjoyed reading through the developments. Great work and determination.

Where in Houston are you located? I am located in Spring. I just picked my 69 charger up from the body shop and when I get home I have to go check all of my gaps! I was happy with them but now I'm not sure...

MoMuscle builds some badass cars but they are very high end.

Keep the progress movin!

Jeremy
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 12, 2014, 01:00:59 AM
Quote from: 1965gp on June 11, 2014, 11:43:37 PM
Wow- fantastic thread. Really enjoyed reading through the developments. Great work and determination.

Where in Houston are you located? I am located in Spring. I just picked my 69 charger up from the body shop and when I get home I have to go check all of my gaps! I was happy with them but now I'm not sure...

MoMuscle builds some badass cars but they are very high end.

Keep the progress movin!

Jeremy

Yeah, I actually went to them (it's in the thread), just couldn't afford them. I'm in Katy.  ever go to the Nifty Fifties show???
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 12, 2014, 01:03:17 AM
Quote from: 1965gp on June 11, 2014, 11:43:37 PM

Where in Houston are you located? I am located in Spring. I just picked my 69 charger up from the body shop and when I get home I have to go check all of my gaps! I was happy with them but now I'm not sure...

Jeremy

I've kind of found that gaps are all over the place, even on show cars.  I've decided that it is more important that the gaps look even than really close.  Just my  :Twocents:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on June 12, 2014, 04:19:07 AM
Mitch , will take a couple photos to show you the difference at bottom area on eyebrow section, I missed it and now it bugs me ,
I have to post some up date photos anyway
I agree with your gaps even comment , you would have to weld every edge then file fit ,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on June 12, 2014, 07:08:16 PM
Mitch, here you go
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1965gp on June 12, 2014, 09:50:49 PM
Trust me- I can't afford them either! Only brought them up because you mentioned them in thread and agree that they are a high end shop. I have quite a few projects and could never get anywhere if I paid that kind of money. Same reason I do my interior myself now. Guys want $1000 to put seat covers on! It's not fun but a crappy weekend is much easier to handle than the $1000!

I go to Niftee Fiftee's all the time! I live a block away from where it's held now. I am usually in a blue 70 GTO judge on 17" honeycombs.

The guy that painted my Charger is in Katy and is more 'driver' focused. You are welcome to stop by and check out his work on your way to the cruise sometime. I am pretty happy with my 69- 1 flaw and they offered to fix it immediately. He has done about 10-12 cars for me.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 13, 2014, 08:28:14 AM
Quote from: 1965gp on June 12, 2014, 09:50:49 PM
The guy that painted my Charger is in Katy and is more 'driver' focused. You are welcome to stop by and check out his work on your way to the cruise sometime. I am pretty happy with my 69- 1 flaw and they offered to fix it immediately. He has done about 10-12 cars for me.

I've still not settled on a paint shop.  Who's the one that did yours?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1965gp on June 13, 2014, 09:14:37 AM
I sent you a PM with the shop info. You are welcome to stop by and check out the work sometime on your way to the cruise- I have seven cars here at the house he has done. It's not 100 point work, but I can't pay for 100 point work so that's fine with me.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1965gp on June 21, 2014, 07:31:09 AM
Any updates?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 21, 2014, 07:48:31 AM
Quote from: 1965gp on June 21, 2014, 07:31:09 AM
Any updates?

Nothing worth telling.  Haven't visited the shop.  I have been working on my car (heat makes it slow going.)  More later.   I did get your notes.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1965gp on June 21, 2014, 01:43:33 PM
It really does. Hoping to get the grill and front bumper / brush guard on mine this weekend. I at least want it to LOOK complete.

It's already pretty damn hot.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on June 24, 2014, 07:17:32 PM
Got the floor done, nothing that we haven't seen many times.  Worked on the cowl to door to fender gaps.  

I've been looking at my solution for a long time and just don't like it.  Adding weld beads here and there just seems like a mess and the more I looked at it the less I liked it, so.....

I cut a piece of scrap metal to fill up the gap and fitted it up (pic #1.)  I just didn't like the idea of cutting into the cowl and didn't like the appearance of adding weld bead to the edge of the door.

Tacked it in place with the top tack well below the finished surface. (pic #2.)

Used epoxy putty to fill the top edge, this will take some care to make the finished product match the rest of the cowl (pic #3.)

A little sanding, grinding and things are getting pretty close (pic #4.)

This will take a little more work to make things ready for final paint but maybe some high build primer will be enough. :shruggy:

And, oh yeah, it took some work to restore the door edge but it's a good lesson to learn....
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: Charger-Bodie on June 24, 2014, 09:01:23 PM
That looks tons better.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration (major metal work is done!!)
Post by: green69rt on July 28, 2014, 05:09:49 PM
Yesterday I finished welding in the driver side inner fender and brackets (made a little "how-to" on another thread. http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,112192.msg1379742.html#msg1379742)

Hung the fenders back on and laid the hood in place (pic #1) to make sure everything is still good.  Looks like it will all go together correctly now!  Yeah!!

During the work I did find a place on the firewall that had thin metal.  It was right under the firewall to inner fender bracket (pic #2.)  if I hadn't pulled the old bracket I would have never have found the hole (pinholes.)

So what's next, you say?  I want to find a rotisserie and get the car up and flipped over so I can finish the bottom.  It needs some screw holes filled and a lot of cleanup so I can prime it up.

Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: 1965gp on July 28, 2014, 06:47:44 PM
Good to see some progress on it Mitch!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: charge69 on July 28, 2014, 07:42:43 PM
Just keep going forward with the work and ,soon, you will be driving that beast!  Showing some great skills with a welder. Welding, especially on a car, is more of an art form rather than something that anyone can do with enough practice. AMD got a considerable amount of my money during my restoration and considerable "fitting" was needed to get everything right. Luckily, my guy is an artist with a welder. Hope to meet up sometime and swap stories about our restorations!  I live in the Spring area close to Old Town Spring.

To 1965gp: I went to the nifty 50ees show last Saturday for the first time this year. Did not bring my Charger as I wanted to wander the show and talk to the other MOPAR heads I could find. Actually found a few of them there including a 1969 Charger R/T F8 auto that was here with the son of the original owner. The son is the owner now. Also a fairly rare 1968 270-trim Dart 2-door hard top also there with the original owner!  Had a better time than I expected but left before dark as I was tired.

Carl
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: bill440rt on July 28, 2014, 09:20:53 PM
Always good to see progress! Keep chipping away!  :buff:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 28, 2014, 10:14:50 PM
Quote from: bill440rt on July 28, 2014, 09:20:53 PM
Always good to see progress! Keep chipping away!  :buff:

Chip, chip, chip!!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 29, 2014, 10:31:18 PM
Keep posting Mitch, the best part of your thread has been in the indepth detail,
By the way great work as always  :2thumbs:
No second threads pal unless we are starting your engine combo build ,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: green69rt on July 29, 2014, 10:50:08 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on July 29, 2014, 10:31:18 PM
Keep posting Mitch, the best part of your thread has been in the indepth detail,
By the way great work as always  :2thumbs:
No second threads pal unless we are starting your engine combo build ,

These threads can get a little long so probably will start a new one on finish work and painting.  Lot's of fun to come....  I'll will make a master thread so no one gets lost.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration
Post by: fy469rtse on July 30, 2014, 12:08:44 AM
Oh don't take me too seriously Mitch, one of the best build threads ever
Wished I had piped in earlier, I had mine on a frame similar to what AMD use just cruder,
When I watched you , I thought you had it down pat, I was wrong and should have offered something way back then ,keep going , love your work and perseverance  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on August 15, 2014, 02:33:33 PM
Ok, I'm going to quit posting to this thread (after all, it is 17 pages long! ) and start another on the next stage.  If you want to see what's going on look in this index thread.

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,112412.msg1382800.html#msg1382800
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal (the last little bit)
Post by: green69rt on January 31, 2015, 09:13:59 AM
Just wanted to post up a couple of pictures of the result of the door gap repair and the cowl gap repair.

Pic #1 is the front edge of the quarter, if I didn't know I did something to that piece of metal I wouldn't be able to tell anything happened.
Pic #2 the cowl came out really good.
Pic #3 another shot of the cowl.  The very top edge needs just a tiny bit of shaping to finish it off.  Anxious to see how the door and fender gaps look.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: 500Jon on January 31, 2015, 11:11:16 AM
Supersonic work Fella!

Is that a metallic green you are using?
This is my green, give or take?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: keepat on January 31, 2015, 11:35:36 AM
Great work and awesome dedication to your project! I have enjoyed checking your progress through the years!
Thanks
Pat
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on January 31, 2015, 11:48:26 AM
Quote from: 500Jon on January 31, 2015, 11:11:16 AM
Supersonic work Fella!

Is that a metallic green you are using?
This is my green, give or take?

Looks close to mine (F5), is that your color code?  Sometimes, it's hard to get a true color picture.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: 500Jon on January 31, 2015, 11:52:32 AM
Err its supposed to be F8 mine lol...
Much darker if you look at the Cowl.
Base and clearcoat always looks funky under fluorescent lights.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: MxRacer855 on January 31, 2015, 11:52:45 AM
I love these resto threads!

Great depth, and nice work!  :2thumbs:

:cheers:

Jeff
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: dodgepaul1969 on February 03, 2015, 01:11:36 AM
I came into this discussion very late. Wish I'd come across it years ago. I'll start digging into the whole thing in the coming days. My '68 is home from the paint shop after too long and is finally going back together. This and a couple other resto threads will be VERY helpful. Thanks to all who take the time to post in so much detail!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on December 18, 2015, 05:52:39 PM
I was getting down to preping the fenders for primer and noticed a couple of things.   The top front of the fender did not look right to me (mentioned in a previous post, page 12.)  So I took a little time trying to correct AMD's goof.  Next post shows how poor their QC is.

First pic is the driver side
Second pic is the passenger side
Third pic is work on a little dent I found (maybe during shipping or something I did  :shruggy:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on December 18, 2015, 05:59:00 PM
So I was working the fenders and thought that I would use a profile tool to make sure I was getting the two sides equal.  Wow, that was a mistake!  so I got out a piece of old fender to check it against the AMD piece.  Big diff.   Now that I see it I'll be looking at it the rest of my life and know that it's different. 

First pic show a original piece compared to the AMD fender nose.   I hope you can see how much diff there is.

Second pic shows the profile set up on the driver fender.

Third shows how much diff there is side to side!  It's actually worse than it shows because of the camera angle.

Nobody else would ever think to look at these and exclaim " OMG, what a diff"  but I'll know it's there.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: tan top on December 19, 2015, 08:04:53 AM
Quote from: green69rt on December 18, 2015, 05:59:00 PM
So I was working the fenders and thought that I would use a profile tool to make sure I was getting the two sides equal.  Wow, that was a mistake!  so I got out a piece of old fender to check it against the AMD piece.  Big diff.   Now that I see it I'll be looking at it the rest of my life and know that it's different.  

First pic show a original piece compared to the AMD fender nose.   I hope you can see how much diff there is.

Second pic shows the profile set up on the driver fender.

Third shows how much diff there is side to side!  It's actually worse than it shows because of the camera angle.

Nobody else would ever think to look at these and exclaim " OMG, what a diff"  but I'll know it's there.

 interesting  ,  :scratchchin:  this is a nother why repop a part & make it nearly right  :shruggy:    crazy  still its something you can get away with , although like you , it would bother me too  :yesnod:

 just out of interest , whats the top of fender to cowl  shape like compared to originals ?
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on December 19, 2015, 03:25:49 PM
Quote from: tan top on December 19, 2015, 08:04:53 AM
Quote from: green69rt on December 18, 2015, 05:59:00 PM
So I was working the fenders and thought that I would use a profile tool to make sure I was getting the two sides equal.  Wow, that was a mistake!  so I got out a piece of old fender to check it against the AMD piece.  Big diff.   Now that I see it I'll be looking at it the rest of my life and know that it's different.  

First pic show a original piece compared to the AMD fender nose.   I hope you can see how much diff there is.

Second pic shows the profile set up on the driver fender.

Third shows how much diff there is side to side!  It's actually worse than it shows because of the camera angle.

Nobody else would ever think to look at these and exclaim " OMG, what a diff"  but I'll know it's there.

 interesting  ,  :scratchchin:  this is a nother why repop a part & make it nearly right  :shruggy:    crazy  still its something you can get away with , although like you , it would bother me too  :yesnod:

 just out of interest , whats the top of fender to cowl  shape like compared to originals ?

The cowl to fender fit and profile seems to be pretty good, the fender to door...not so much.  In the following pictures you can see (or maybe you can't, hard to get a pic) where I had to notch the metal where it turns down underneath the fender and then "adjust"  the bend a little.  The fender, at that point, actually curved down, just a tad.  I had to turn the bend up, just a little, to make it match the door.  Changing the bend has produced a little distortion in the top of the fender that I now need fix.  Two steps forward, one step back......

Edit - now that I got the post up I see that I didn't do a good job taking the pictures.  I'll try again later.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: XS29L9B2 on December 20, 2015, 10:03:32 AM
nice work  :cheers:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: six-tee-nine on December 20, 2015, 12:04:34 PM
Well about the fender tips : I had both my fenders kinda dented in the front. So I had to remove the inner structure to hammer them back. But you never really know how they exactly looked 40 years ago, so I might have looked at almost every '68 / '69 google would provide me and I can tell you there are alot of cars out there that look different if you start to compare them. I guess no one will really ever see the difference in your case with the naked eye.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on December 20, 2015, 07:03:47 PM
Quote from: six-tee-nine on December 20, 2015, 12:04:34 PM
Well about the fender tips : I had both my fenders kinda dented in the front. So I had to remove the inner structure to hammer them back. But you never really know how they exactly looked 40 years ago, so I might have looked at almost every '68 / '69 google would provide me and I can tell you there are alot of cars out there that look different if you start to compare them. I guess no one will really ever see the difference in your case with the naked eye.

I agree, It's not very noticeable at all.  But I would expect the left and right to be mirror images of each other.   Overall, it's not a big deal but I'm being more careful about how things go together.  I don't want to start putting the grill in and find that the curve and gaps around the grill are screwy looking because of the way the fenders are made.  That would be noticeable!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: fy469rtse on December 21, 2015, 10:07:18 PM
Shit sorry mitch,
I did warn you earlier in this thread ,
another area not finished if you look at my build thread is area around grill opening , I took photo's to show how unfinished they are , also highly recommend fitting grill and support frame now ,
grill shape different to fender shape , found out, realised after paint
never occurred to me to check it
but its good because you don't have paint on it yet  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on December 21, 2015, 11:16:44 PM
Quote from: fy469rtse on December 21, 2015, 10:07:18 PM
Shit sorry mitch,
I did warn you earlier in this thread ,
another area not finished if you look at my build thread is area around grill opening , I took photo's to show how unfinished they are , also highly recommend fitting grill and support frame now ,
grill shape different to fender shape , found out, realised after paint
never occurred to me to check it
but its good because you don't have paint on it yet  :2thumbs:

Yeah, I remember.  I was going to put up a post about the grill-to-fender fit, just got caught up in Christmas stuff.  I have some photos of the area and will post later.  Merry Christmas to all!!
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal (Geoff, pay attention.)
Post by: green69rt on December 22, 2015, 05:58:25 PM
I got out today and took some more pics Geoff (hope I'm spelling that right.)   When you first showed me the problem, I thought you were talking about the gap between the fender and the grill.   I checked mine and it looks really good and the profile of the fender and grill match (pic #1).  Then I looked at you note harder and could see where that bottom corner looks unfinished.   So I looked at mine and sure enough the pass side is different form the driver and both will take a little work.  On side (pic #2), where my finger is, has the metal just folded around the corner and just hangs out in the air!  Nothing to support it, the other side the fold goes back a lot further but still a messy job.  Pic #3 shows another angle.   Pic #4 shows my old OE fender that has that "tab" connected to the inner bracing (hard to see in the picture.)  Not a lot of work but a person could see that the fender had a gap between it and the grill if I don't fix it now.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: fy469rtse on December 22, 2015, 06:12:49 PM
yep that's the area, ,
I have one finished off, and one looks like that ?
I wished I had paid more attention , rather then later once painted ,
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: cdr on December 22, 2015, 07:08:50 PM
that area is filled with seam sealer from the factory.
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: green69rt on December 22, 2015, 07:28:10 PM
I'm thinking of adding a weld tack to the one side (to tie it all together) and just a little filler to both to dress them up.   Not a big chore but I'd hate to get everything together and then not be happy....
Edit...I think I'm starting to get too anal about this stuff... :eek2:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: Patronus on December 22, 2015, 07:32:44 PM
No way mang. Do it right the first time!  :2thumbs:
Title: Re: Mitch's 69 Charger restoration -sheet metal
Post by: six-tee-nine on December 23, 2015, 06:25:34 AM
Agreed, I needed to do some surgery to my ront end as well, so i'm definatly going to mount my bumper and grill to testfit before sending my car off to the painter.....