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Author Topic: REAL Daytona hood - has these 2 indents near the bottom. Anything else?  (Read 1278 times)
odcics2
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« on: November 30, 2017, 12:30:48 PM »

I was asked about the differences between a 70 Charger hood and a real Daytona hood.

There are the 'lumps' near the front.   2 hood pin holes.
The 'scallops' near the bottom are small, like a 1969 hood.
Then there are the 2 indents, one on each side, near the bottom.

Anything else?     


* real 69 daytona hood has 2 indents....jpg (105.75 KB, 1280x960 - viewed 468 times.)

* real 69 dodge daytona hood - 2 indents.jpg (121.78 KB, 970x548 - viewed 460 times.)
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hemi68charger
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« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2017, 01:01:58 PM »

Well, that's nice !!!  2thumbs
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Troy
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odcics2
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« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2017, 05:23:08 PM »

Well, that's nice !!!  2thumbs

 cheers
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« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2017, 07:02:31 PM »

My 70 Charger hood had the structural "lumps" at the front on the underside...I had to remove them in order to get the hood to close correctly
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odcics2
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« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2017, 07:05:44 PM »

My 70 Charger hood had the structural "lumps" at the front on the underside...I had to remove them in order to get the hood to close correctly

Latch tray in the way!
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« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2017, 08:23:54 PM »

i think there is a difference in the small holes near the bottom as well?
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ernie helderbrand - 409053
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« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2017, 09:13:25 PM »

No hood wiring holes.
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« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2017, 10:43:05 PM »

I have these 2 hoods
The one on the left has the crash ribs on the front and the hood blinker wiring holes
The one on the right  has no crash ribs and no wiring holes
Neither hood has the dents in the cross member closest to the hindges


* hood 001.11.JPG (307.5 KB, 864x864 - viewed 378 times.)
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« Reply #8 on: December 01, 2017, 12:08:30 AM »

the hole differences i referred to are clearly visible in your photo


* hood 001.11fgg.JPG (309.38 KB, 864x864 - viewed 371 times.)
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ernie helderbrand - 409053
odcics2
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« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2017, 05:10:52 AM »

Need to see the scallops under the rubber seal, along the bottom edge of the two hoods pictured above .
70 hood is large, 69, and 69 1/2, is small.  
 
Any differences in the hoods you have, 70 sublime??

Would be cool to get some pics of 100% original Daytona survivor hoods of the details mentioned above.  coolgleamA
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hemigeno
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« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2017, 11:00:32 AM »

Taken yesterday, legit unrestored Daytona hood.  Today I pulled back some of the leftover hood pad insulation, and there is no hole for the turn signal wiring as I expected.  It's all smooth (I just didn't snap a picture of it yesterday with the camera).



* DSCN1541small.jpg (252.5 KB, 977x608 - viewed 335 times.)
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hemi68charger
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« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2017, 11:11:42 AM »

Taken yesterday, legit unrestored Daytona hood.  Today I pulled back some of the leftover hood pad insulation, and there is no hole for the turn signal wiring as I expected.  It's all smooth (I just didn't snap a picture of it yesterday with the camera).


mmmmmmmmmmmmmm, need that old hood any more Mr. Geno?   icon_smile_big
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Troy
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hemigeno
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« Reply #12 on: December 01, 2017, 11:17:22 AM »

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm, need that old hood any more Mr. Geno?   icon_smile_big

Actually, no.

I also spied a small locating(?) hole that did not appear to be on another photo of a '70 Charger hood I had...  see below.  Is this another '69-specific trait?


* DSCN1541smallhole.jpg (342.35 KB, 1177x833 - viewed 333 times.)
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« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2017, 12:06:29 PM »

if i only had some spare change.....

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odcics2
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« Reply #14 on: December 01, 2017, 01:30:26 PM »

Taken yesterday, legit unrestored Daytona hood.  Today I pulled back some of the leftover hood pad insulation, and there is no hole for the turn signal wiring as I expected.  It's all smooth (I just didn't snap a picture of it yesterday with the camera).



Here's a 70 Charger hood with the large scallops near the bottom. Note: it does not have the indents like hemigeno's photo of an original Daytona hood.   

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« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2017, 02:31:54 PM »


Here's a 70 Charger hood with the large scallops near the bottom.

I've seen '70 Charger hoods with small scallops though.  Interestingly enough, they had no holes for the turn signal wiring either but did have crash ribs up front.  

From what I've seen so far, there are at least 3, if not 4, versions of '70 Charger hood stampings (apart from what MAY be the '69-Daytona-only pattern)
     1.  No crash ribs, no turn signal holes, (unknown rear scallop size, but I'm guessing small scallops), no indentations near hinges
     2.  Crash ribs, no turn signal holes, small rear scallops, no indentations near hinges
     3.  Crash ribs, turn signal holes, large rear scallops, no indentations near hinges
  
There's 1 or two other ideas I have about possible differences, but haven't had a chance to properly research them yet.


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« Reply #16 on: December 01, 2017, 02:35:48 PM »

Dodge Don can shed more light on the wiring holes (or lack of) in the 70 hoods.....I think the early 70 hoods didn't have the turn signal wiring holes
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odcics2
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« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2017, 04:37:20 PM »


Here's a 70 Charger hood with the large scallops near the bottom.

I've seen '70 Charger hoods with small scallops though.  Interestingly enough, they had no holes for the turn signal wiring either but did have crash ribs up front.  

From what I've seen so far, there are at least 3, if not 4, versions of '70 Charger hood stampings (apart from what MAY be the '69-Daytona-only pattern)
     1.  No crash ribs, no turn signal holes, (unknown rear scallop size, but I'm guessing small scallops), no indentations near hinges
     2.  Crash ribs, no turn signal holes, small rear scallops, no indentations near hinges
     3.  Crash ribs, turn signal holes, large rear scallops, no indentations near hinges
  
There's 1 or two other ideas I have about possible differences, but haven't had a chance to properly research them yet.




Looks like a Daytona only hood has: indents near hinges, small rear scallops, no crash ribs, no signal holes...
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« Reply #18 on: December 01, 2017, 09:05:21 PM »

I moved a bunch of junk so I could get a picture of the bottom of my hood


* 01 12 2017.jpg (394.86 KB, 749x422 - viewed 245 times.)
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odcics2
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« Reply #19 on: December 02, 2017, 08:54:30 AM »

I moved a bunch of junk so I could get a picture of the bottom of my hood

What size are the scallops along the bottom edge?
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« Reply #20 on: December 02, 2017, 09:02:59 AM »

I moved a bunch of junk so I could get a picture of the bottom of my hood

What size are the scallops along the bottom edge?

I pulled the rubber off the bottom edge and took some pictures
I have to resize the pictures so I can post them later this evening when I have time
Will you be able to post a picture of that same area on a real Daytona hood ?
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Davtona
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« Reply #21 on: December 02, 2017, 10:14:02 AM »


Jeez seems like this stuff was a big secret the last time we discussed it here. Guess its out in the open now. Shot of another real unrestored Daytona hood. The scallops are 1.9 " long at the bottom and 2.7 inches long where they blend in at top. So far I have not found Geno's locating hole in it. I wondered if you still had that hood Gene.


* Daytona Hood Scallop.JPG (32.25 KB, 320x240 - viewed 209 times.)
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odcics2
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« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2017, 11:40:16 AM »

I moved a bunch of junk so I could get a picture of the bottom of my hood

What size are the scallops along the bottom edge?

I pulled the rubber off the bottom edge and took some pictures
I have to resize the pictures so I can post them later this evening when I have time
Will you be able to post a picture of that same area on a real Daytona hood ?

First photos on this thread are of a real Daytona hood...
The size of the scallops along the bottom edge are easily seen.   Small compared to a 1970 Charger hood.
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« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2017, 11:43:45 AM »


Jeez seems like this stuff was a big secret the last time we discussed it here. Guess its out in the open now. Shot of another real unrestored Daytona hood. The scallops are 1.9 " long at the bottom and 2.7 inches long where they blend in at top. So far I have not found Geno's locating hole in it. I wondered if you still had that hood Gene.

Photo posted shows an indent.
The scallops are along the bottom, usually obscured by the rubber seal. 

 cheers
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« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2017, 12:13:35 PM »


The scallops are along the bottom, usually obscured by the rubber seal.  


Here are a couple more pics without the rear hood seal. I might be missing exactly where the scallops are.  shruggy  Go figure!!   lol  I need to dig out a regular 70 Charger hood and compare the 2 side by side close up.



* Daytona Hood 1.JPG (32.56 KB, 320x240 - viewed 180 times.)

* Daytona Hood 2.JPG (32.6 KB, 320x240 - viewed 182 times.)
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« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2017, 12:51:57 PM »


[/quote]

Looks like a Daytona only hood has: indents near hinges, small rear scallops, no crash ribs, no signal holes...

[/quote]

You must have a good eye to have noticed those indents and that they aren't on any other hood.
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« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2017, 03:31:41 PM »

My 70 hood is missing the turn signal wiring routing holes....unusual for a 70 hood.
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« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2017, 04:35:27 PM »

Are my pics of my Ray Elder Daytona hood still floatin around? someone post them I haven't figured out how to post pics yet since PB got greedy.
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odcics2
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« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2017, 06:33:39 PM »

Are my pics of my Ray Elder Daytona hood still floatin around? someone post them I haven't figured out how to post pics yet since PB got greedy.

No problem, buddy.


* elder hood.JPG (174.57 KB, 488x518 - viewed 280 times.)

* elder hood detail.JPG (158.33 KB, 1590x1192 - viewed 268 times.)
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« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2017, 07:14:21 PM »

So when I took my other pictures of my hood I pulled the rubber seal off the back edge to take these pictures
Just resized them to post


* 2 12 2017 1.jpg (395.04 KB, 422x749 - viewed 268 times.)

* 2 12 2017 2.jpg (371.55 KB, 351x624 - viewed 267 times.)

* 2 12 2017 3.jpg (378.76 KB, 351x624 - viewed 268 times.)
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« Reply #30 on: December 02, 2017, 07:16:18 PM »

So is my understanding this is what a Daytona factory hood looks like ?
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odcics2
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« Reply #31 on: December 03, 2017, 08:38:40 AM »

So is my understanding this is what a Daytona factory hood looks like ?

A better pic would be helpful, but the small scallops are there and I can see the indent...


* daytona hood with indent small scallops.jpg (336.01 KB, 749x422 - viewed 249 times.)
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« Reply #32 on: December 04, 2017, 08:27:20 PM »


Off topic here a little bit but:

So with all the discussion on the Daytona only hood quirks it got me to thinking. I've never used any AMD panels or any other repo metal but how close to original shape and form are they. For instance floor pans, or inner fender wells. Are there differences between original metal and reproduction metal in the bends, depth of grove punches say on a floor pan. I got to believe they are not exact and someone who knew what to look for could pick out repo metal from original metal easily.

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« Reply #33 on: December 05, 2017, 04:36:41 AM »


Off topic here a little bit but:

So with all the discussion on the Daytona only hood quirks it got me to thinking. I've never used any AMD panels or any other repo metal but how close to original shape and form are they. For instance floor pans, or inner fender wells. Are there differences between original metal and reproduction metal in the bends, depth of grove punches say on a floor pan. I got to believe they are not exact and someone who knew what to look for could pick out repo metal from original metal easily.






While some of the repro metal may not be exact, the mere fact that something is available is a blessing, hunting for NOS, clean original is a thing of the past for most, not to mention the price gouge of NOS/original sheetmetal, what may have taken years to amass for a project is now a click/PH call away, only the most anal will insist on OEM/NOS for refurbishment
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« Reply #34 on: December 05, 2017, 08:06:43 AM »


Off topic here a little bit but:

So with all the discussion on the Daytona only hood quirks it got me to thinking. I've never used any AMD panels or any other repo metal but how close to original shape and form are they. For instance floor pans, or inner fender wells. Are there differences between original metal and reproduction metal in the bends, depth of grove punches say on a floor pan. I got to believe they are not exact and someone who knew what to look for could pick out repo metal from original metal easily.






While some of the repro metal may not be exact, the mere fact that something is available is a blessing, hunting for NOS, clean original is a thing of the past for most, not to mention the price gouge of NOS/original sheetmetal, what may have taken years to amass for a project is now a click/PH call away, only the most anal will insist on OEM/NOS for refurbishment

There are still a few of us that go the extra mile to do it correctly.  

Someone has to set the bar.  

Why bust our balls on various threads?   shruggy
 

 
 
  
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« Reply #35 on: December 05, 2017, 11:18:25 AM »

I do not know how many had hood mounted signal indicators but if there were no holes for the wire, I wonder how creative ran the wire?
Leave wire disconnected for first few cars?
Run under insulation pad if so equipped?
Drill hole? (I doubt it but I have not seen them all)
Did any of the hoods shipped to creative come with signal lights? Or none to simplify manufacturing?
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« Reply #36 on: December 05, 2017, 11:37:13 AM »

The Daytona hoods and front fenders have been of interest to me for years.
I would say at least 1/3 of the surviving Daytonas have 1970 Charger hoods in one form or another.
Even the top of the pyramid 426 HEMI 4 speed that David Spade bought has a 1970 Charger hood.
The original hood was modified with a scoop early on and then removed at restoration.
Most common is to remove the ribs up front and call it a day.
My first two pictures show a close up of the indents and then an overall of the area on my original Daytona hood.

My last picture shows a close up in the front of a stamped recessed area on an original Daytona hood.
This area may not be the same either on a 1970 Charger hood?
I have seen this area evened out when the ribs are removed.
I would like to see a close up of this area on a 1970 Charger hood with an unmodified rib panel.
MJ


* DEC 4047.JPG (161.71 KB, 900x675 - viewed 163 times.)

* DEC4048.JPG (172.54 KB, 900x675 - viewed 160 times.)

* DEC 4046.JPG (158.74 KB, 800x600 - viewed 161 times.)
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« Reply #37 on: December 05, 2017, 11:52:13 AM »

I do not know how many had hood mounted signal indicators but if there were no holes for the wire, I wonder how creative ran the wire?
Leave wire disconnected for first few cars?
Run under insulation pad if so equipped?
Drill hole? (I doubt it but I have not seen them all)
Did any of the hoods shipped to creative come with signal lights? Or none to simplify manufacturing?

My hood does not have the holes cut into the webbing for the turn signals wires but it has a row of these clips instead


* 05 12 2017.JPG (297.91 KB, 864x864 - viewed 161 times.)
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« Reply #38 on: December 05, 2017, 02:49:22 PM »

I do not know how many had hood mounted signal indicators but if there were no holes for the wire, I wonder how creative ran the wire?
Leave wire disconnected for first few cars?
Run under insulation pad if so equipped?
Drill hole? (I doubt it but I have not seen them all)
Did any of the hoods shipped to creative come with signal lights? Or none to simplify manufacturing?

My hood does not have the holes cut into the webbing for the turn signals wires but it has a row of these clips instead

correct, if the hood did not have the turn signal wire holes in the webbing, the wire was run along the outside of the webbing with the little wire clips that pushed into the pin holes
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« Reply #39 on: December 05, 2017, 04:18:19 PM »


Off topic here a little bit but:

So with all the discussion on the Daytona only hood quirks it got me to thinking. I've never used any AMD panels or any other repo metal but how close to original shape and form are they. For instance floor pans, or inner fender wells. Are there differences between original metal and reproduction metal in the bends, depth of grove punches say on a floor pan. I got to believe they are not exact and someone who knew what to look for could pick out repo metal from original metal easily.



I will freely admit to having pretty limited Charger bodywork knowledge compared to many on here but there seems to be quite a bit of variation even on the factory parts (the hoods in this thread for example). In the few original and nos floors and doors I've seen there is variation in the depth of floor strengthening ridges, hole positioning and door scallops...a couple of old doors I've seen had the scallops extending over and inch further back than mine. My left door indent starts very slightly further back from the A pillar than the one on my right door too! Can't beat that late sixties build quality!

....anyway ....BOT!
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« Reply #40 on: December 05, 2017, 08:17:08 PM »


I would like to see a close up of this area on a 1970 Charger hood with an unmodified rib panel.
MJ


Here you go John. Shot of a unmolested 70 Charger hood in that area.



* 70 Charger Hood 1.JPG (23.92 KB, 320x240 - viewed 124 times.)
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« Reply #41 on: December 06, 2017, 07:45:05 AM »


I would like to see a close up of this area on a 1970 Charger hood with an unmodified rib panel.
MJ


Here you go John. Shot of a unmolested 70 Charger hood in that area.



What about the indents near the front, on each side?  Any differences there between an original Daytona hood and a 70 Charger hood?   I assume the various 70 hoods would have to be investigated. 
John - can you post of yours?
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« Reply #42 on: December 06, 2017, 08:53:40 AM »


I would like to see a close up of this area on a 1970 Charger hood with an unmodified rib panel.
MJ


Here you go John. Shot of a unmolested 70 Charger hood in that area.


Thanks Dave!
 It looks like they are the same in that area.
So the hoods that I have seen with the ribs removed didn't include the recessed area in the NEW panel.
MJ
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« Reply #43 on: December 06, 2017, 12:02:04 PM »


I would like to see a close up of this area on a 1970 Charger hood with an unmodified rib panel.
MJ


Here you go John. Shot of a unmolested 70 Charger hood in that area.



What about the indents near the front, on each side?  Any differences there between an original Daytona hood and a 70 Charger hood?   I assume the various 70 hoods would have to be investigated. 
John - can you post of yours?
Greg,
 Here are some pictures of the bottom of my Daytona hood near the front.
MJ


* DEC 4050.JPG (196.44 KB, 950x712 - viewed 82 times.)

* DEC 4053.JPG (177.87 KB, 925x693 - viewed 80 times.)
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« Reply #44 on: December 06, 2017, 01:31:09 PM »

Interesting....I assume those stretch/stress marks are factory.
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« Reply #45 on: December 06, 2017, 02:20:55 PM »

Yes, factory. Here's a 70 hood. Looks more crisp.


* 1970 charger hood front indents.jpg (181.2 KB, 1600x1200 - viewed 71 times.)

* charger hood 1970 front indents.jpg (190.39 KB, 1600x1200 - viewed 71 times.)
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