News:

It appears that the upgrade forces a login and many, many of you have forgotten your passwords and didn't set up any reminders. Contact me directly through helpmelogin@dodgecharger.com and I'll help sort it out.

Main Menu

Headlights won't go down fully, don't stay down, thoughts on how to fix?

Started by RammJaeger, April 23, 2018, 06:42:20 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

RammJaeger

Hi all,

I have an issue with my Superbird that I just got that the headlights won't go down all the way, as seen in the attached picture. Is there a way to adjust this, and if so could someone share how?

The other issue is that a few minutes after turning the car off, the headlights pop up on their own. I have read that you can remove the spring from them to solve this issue, but I assume that the source issue is that there is some type of vacuum leak. Any tips on where to look, and where to get parts to fix if they are available?

Thanks!

moparstuart

remove the springs or at lease just release the tension on them ,  you dont need them 
GO SELL CRAZY SOMEWHERE ELSE WE ARE ALL STOCKED UP HERE

3--Daytona

Got vacuum leak some where,,,start looking at head light switch

timmycharger

Also check for clogged vacuum lines if they are old. Blow some shop air through them if you have access to the switch and can take off the hoses from there.  :Twocents:

hemigeno

Are there shims on your headlight vacuum pods?  Seems like that might keep your headlights from retracting all the way down...?   :shruggy:






RammJaeger

Thanks for the feedback guys, and I will check the shims.

Can anyone say what the best way to get access to headlight vacuum pods is?

One thing to mention too, is that this car has apparently had this problem for over 40 years. The attached pictures is from 1977.

DAY CLONA

Quote from: RammJaeger on April 24, 2018, 10:43:11 AM
Thanks for the feedback guys, and I will check the shims.

Can anyone say what the best way to get access to headlight vacuum pods is?

One thing to mention too, is that this car has apparently had this problem for over 40 years. The attached pictures is from 1977.



If the headlight doors are fully closed when the engine is running, chances are any assembly/adjustments/alignments are fine,the common areas for wingcar "lazy eye" are the dash switch, not the electrical portion but the white plastic slider added to the switch and it's rocker, repairs/rebuilds are often useless or short term, repros are avaliable, or if you can find an NOS switch or slider, that would be your best bet if it's the culprit, 2nd area is usually a rotted vacuum reserve can located under the battery tray, again repros are available if needed, NOS also if you can find it, 3rd is hoses/vac harness, if the lines are dry rotted/cracking, chances are they are leaking, repros are available... last on the list is the vacuum pods themselves, pods are very rarely the culprit, but can not be ruled out, you don't want the repro pods, either nice used, NOS or have them repaired by Wilson Airgrabber Productions

Access to the headlight pods?, hope you have long arms and are flexible!  :icon_smile_big: if you want to access the rear of the pods or the headlight springs/brackets, your best off removing the latch tray, you might find that you'll generally have to remove the front center grille screen as well to access some of the latchtray fastners/wiring/clips/etc, if you have a lift, you could remove the lower valance corner and jamb yourself up into the cones internals, either way or employing all 3 methods, it's not fun or easy...welcome to one of the horrors of wingcar maintenance!

If you need to remove a headlight pod, it removes obviously from the back of the bucket with 4 bolts, but you'll need to remove the headlight bulbs and cups first so that you can access the front vacuum line on the pod to remove it, as well as the small clevis pin and clip thru the headlight outer door, long needle nose plyers and assorted other types of tools will be needed, along with small child sized hands...again another fun chore, usually there's 3 washers/spacers on each screw/bolt holding the pod bracket to the light bucket, these will fall out and find good hiding spots, so best to put a bucket/cloth under the light bucket area to catch them, when installing them, it's best to superglue them to the headlight pod bracket so you can keep your sanity when putting these things back together...

if your going to tackle a particular area, just ask here on the aero forum, we've all had to do it at one time and learn the best methods and what pitfalls to avoid...

Mike

PettyMower

I drive my car, including at night. And because of that I refuse to remove the springs. They are there to hold the buckets up in case of a vacuum issue while driving at night.

My buckets will creep up over time, and I've traced the microscopic leak to the switch. (I can pull a vacuum on the buckets alone and they remain down forever.)

Anyway, I made a lanyard that attaches to the bucket on one end, and an extension spring on the other. The lanyard travels through the drain hole in the bottom of the bucket area, and the loop of the spring clips on the threads of a bolt on the subframe.

By the way, if you remove the springs, you will have a little more "bounce" of the buckets while driving at night.

If the car is not going to be a driver, or driven at night, remove the springs.

odcics2

The filaments in the headlights will have a shorter life w/o the spring.   :Twocents:
I've never owned anything but a MoPar. Can you say that?

odcics2

Quote from: DAY CLONA on April 24, 2018, 04:02:29 PM
Quote from: RammJaeger on April 24, 2018, 10:43:11 AM
Thanks for the feedback guys, and I will check the shims.

Can anyone say what the best way to get access to headlight vacuum pods is?

One thing to mention too, is that this car has apparently had this problem for over 40 years. The attached pictures is from 1977.



If the headlight doors are fully closed when the engine is running, chances are any assembly/adjustments/alignments are fine,the common areas for wingcar "lazy eye" are the dash switch, not the electrical portion but the white plastic slider added to the switch and it's rocker, repairs/rebuilds are often useless or short term, repros are avaliable, or if you can find an NOS switch or slider, that would be your best bet if it's the culprit, 2nd area is usually a rotted vacuum reserve can located under the battery tray, again repros are available if needed, NOS also if you can find it, 3rd is hoses/vac harness, if the lines are dry rotted/cracking, chances are they are leaking, repros are available... last on the list is the vacuum pods themselves, pods are very rarely the culprit, but can not be ruled out, you don't want the repro pods, either nice used, NOS or have them repaired by Wilson Airgrabber Productions


NOS vac switch, if needed - http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,131305.0.html
I've never owned anything but a MoPar. Can you say that?

Aero426

Quote from: odcics2 on April 28, 2018, 05:10:49 PM
The filaments in the headlights will have a shorter life w/o the spring.   :Twocents:

I still have original 1970 installed Westinghouse bulbs and no springs since 1988.

I have never had a problem with "headlight bounce" at night.    There is enough vacuum to hold them up solid.   

I agree you want to make sure the system components are in working order.    Buying that NOS slider is a good part to have on hand.   

RammJaeger



odcics2

I've never owned anything but a MoPar. Can you say that?

Wingnut426

HEMI Daytona Convertible

Aero426

Quote from: DAY CLONA on April 30, 2018, 06:10:24 PM
Correct, but new repro is still available...

Are the reproductions any good?    The Chinese could not make vacuum actuators that worked properly.   

odcics2

Quote from: Aero426 on April 30, 2018, 03:07:03 PM
Quote from: odcics2 on April 28, 2018, 05:10:49 PM
The filaments in the headlights will have a shorter life w/o the spring.   :Twocents:

I still have original 1970 installed Westinghouse bulbs and no springs since 1988.

I have never had a problem with "headlight bounce" at night.    There is enough vacuum to hold them up solid.   

I agree you want to make sure the system components are in working order.    Buying that NOS slider is a good part to have on hand.   

If you have no bounce, yes, they will last ok.
If you have bounce, they won't!   Think how long a trouble light works with a regular light bulb versus a "rough service" unit.
I've never owned anything but a MoPar. Can you say that?

Aero426

Quote from: odcics2 on May 01, 2018, 10:12:07 AM
If you have no bounce, yes, they will last ok.
If you have bounce, they won't!   Think how long a trouble light works with a regular light bulb versus a "rough service" unit.

Actually, there are NO light bulbs in a trouble light that seem to last very long these days.    :rofl:

70 sublime

Quote from: Aero426 on May 01, 2018, 03:41:21 PM
Quote from: odcics2 on May 01, 2018, 10:12:07 AM
If you have no bounce, yes, they will last ok.
If you have bounce, they won't!   Think how long a trouble light works with a regular light bulb versus a "rough service" unit.

Actually, there are NO light bulbs in a trouble light that seem to last very long these days.    :rofl:

I had the same problem with my trouble light
I ended up buying an LED bulb that is the same shape as a light bulb but is thin ( like you sliced the two sides off it)
I have dropped it ten times now and it still works  :2thumbs:
next project 70 Charger FJ5 green

A383Wing

I never put the pop-up springs in my car.....never had a problem with bounce or anything

odcics2

Quote from: Aero426 on May 01, 2018, 03:41:21 PM
Quote from: odcics2 on May 01, 2018, 10:12:07 AM
If you have no bounce, yes, they will last ok.
If you have bounce, they won't!   Think how long a trouble light works with a regular light bulb versus a "rough service" unit.

Actually, there are NO light bulbs in a trouble light that seem to last very long these days.    :rofl:

New fangled stuff!    :lol:

I still use my old stuff from the 70s!  Have a few rough service bulbs left from then!  My 1.5 ton Sears jack still works fine, too!    :2thumbs:
I've never owned anything but a MoPar. Can you say that?

WINGIN IT

Quote from: Aero426 on May 01, 2018, 09:45:24 AM
Quote from: DAY CLONA on April 30, 2018, 06:10:24 PM
Correct, but new repro is still available...

Are the reproductions any good?    The Chinese could not make vacuum actuators that worked properly.   

Last repro I got was crap!

Installed the original back in.


hemi68charger

Could it be that the bucket just needs to be adjusted and pivoted with the bottom going back a little? That would bring the leading door edge when in the closed position down a little more, thus lining up with the headlamp bucket door opening on the nose?
Troy
'69 Charger Daytona 440 auto 4.10 Dana ( now 426 HEMI )
'70 Superbird 426 Hemi auto: Lindsley Bonneville Salt Flat world record holder (220.2mph)
Houston Mopar Club Connection

nascarxx29

You can rotate those circle end plates on buckets to get better fit and check end plastic bushings
1969 R4 Daytona XX29L9B410772
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23UOA174597
1970 FY1 Superbird RM23UOA166242
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23VOA179697
1968 426 Road Runner RM21J8A134509
1970 Coronet RT WS23UOA224126
1970 Daytona Clone XP29GOG178701

nascarxx29

Unhook actuator from pivot bracket and check headlight for binding.Also check where end of actuator connects to pivot bracket.Also seen where headlight bucket bolts where not 1'4 diameter.And bucket couldn't be moved much to adjust headlight opening.Do the  best you can these headlight doors warp over the years.And hard to achieve perfect gaps and fit
1969 R4 Daytona XX29L9B410772
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23UOA174597
1970 FY1 Superbird RM23UOA166242
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23VOA179697
1968 426 Road Runner RM21J8A134509
1970 Coronet RT WS23UOA224126
1970 Daytona Clone XP29GOG178701

RammJaeger

Thanks for all the help and advice everyone. I went with taking the springs off. They headlights stay up fine without them, and go down completely with them off. I may try putting them back on later and just adjust them better. For now though this looks WAY better. Passenger side headlight is basically perfect, driver side is really close, and I may do a bit more tweaking with it. Here are a few pics of the results.

moparstuart

GO SELL CRAZY SOMEWHERE ELSE WE ARE ALL STOCKED UP HERE

70 sublime

next project 70 Charger FJ5 green

RammJaeger

Quote from: 70 sublime on May 08, 2018, 08:11:50 AM
So what is on the top shelf in the garage ??


Care to venture a guess :) There are two cars up there. One should be easy to see what it is, the other only an old school MoPar guy would be able to get by those pics.

70 sublime

Quote from: RammJaeger on May 08, 2018, 10:45:59 AM
Quote from: 70 sublime on May 08, 2018, 08:11:50 AM
So what is on the top shelf in the garage ??


Care to venture a guess :) There are two cars up there. One should be easy to see what it is, the other only an old school MoPar guy would be able to get by those pics.

A Delorean and 53 Dodge ??
next project 70 Charger FJ5 green

Dave Kanofsky

"God sent his Son into the world not to judge the world, but to save the world through him." John 3:17, NLT

Racers For Christ Chaplain (www.teamrfc.org)

RammJaeger

Quote from: 70 sublime on May 08, 2018, 12:38:50 PM
Quote from: RammJaeger on May 08, 2018, 10:45:59 AM
Quote from: 70 sublime on May 08, 2018, 08:11:50 AM
So what is on the top shelf in the garage ??


Care to venture a guess :) There are two cars up there. One should be easy to see what it is, the other only an old school MoPar guy would be able to get by those pics.

A Delorean and 53 Dodge ??

You got the Delorean right. For the other car, you are in the right decade.

A383Wing

I must have spent a week adjusting, tweaking, and modifying both headlight buckets and pivot points to get them looking like this in the picture.......and I never put the pop-up springs on

Bryan