Increasing Rear tire clearance in a 68-70 Charger

[cdr]

I decided to weld instead of using the panel bond stuff.
The initial reasoning was my concerns about putting too much heat near the quarter panel. I got around that by doing short bursts and blowing compressed air afterwards. I'm having trouble with the welds though. They look terrible. I have a MIG with a 75/25 Argon-CO2 and am using .030 wire. The wheel tub sheet metal is thinner than the Charger wheel tub. I either get tall welds or I burn through. I've tried numerous wire speeds and can't seem to get consistent welds. I'm lucky this job will be covered in seam sealer and undercoating but crap...I wanted it to look better than this. I'm going to try some thinner wire, something like an .023 or similar.

I agree on welding, that inner well keeps the car tied together!!!

[timmycharger]

I decided to weld instead of using the panel bond stuff.
The initial reasoning was my concerns about putting too much heat near the quarter panel. I got around that by doing short bursts and blowing compressed air afterwards. I'm having trouble with the welds though. They look terrible. I have a MIG with a 75/25 Argon-CO2 and am using .030 wire. The wheel tub sheet metal is thinner than the Charger wheel tub. I either get tall welds or I burn through. I've tried numerous wire speeds and can't seem to get consistent welds. I'm lucky this job will be covered in seam sealer and undercoating but crap...I wanted it to look better than this. I'm going to try some thinner wire, something like an .023 or similar.

I had similar issues welding panels on my Charger and settled on .023 wire after trial and error. I am assuming the area you are welding is nice and clean?

[Mike DC (formerly miked)]

      
--  Another vote for smaller wire size.  Use .023 for body sheetmetal.  The larger MIG wires bring more amps to the weld, but it's less controllable.  If your MIG machine can supply enough amps to get it done with a smaller wire than that is preferable.  


--  Don't run the shielding gas pressure too high.  The stuff is only there to prevent bubbles/pinholes in the welds.  Once the gas pressure is high enough to do that, you won't gain anything by blowing it harder.  It just wastes the gas and takes heat away from the welds.    


--  Letting the metal cool off gradually is better than using compressed air to blow it cool.  Less brittle & warping issues.  Just keep the welds short & spaced apart and take your time on the whole job.

[Kern Dog]

I had similar issues welding panels on my Charger and settled on .023 wire after trial and error. I am assuming the area you are welding is nice and clean?

My local welding supply had .025 so I got that. I've heard of .023. .024 but not .025.
What a difference! The welds are less peaky and I have barely burned though. I'm "spot" welding as usual in the areas close to the wheel opening. By "spot" I mean just a quick buzz that looks like a head of a nail. Along the top and sides I do about 1/2" stitch at a time.

[Kern Dog]

     
--  Another vote for smaller wire size.  Use .023 for body sheetmetal.  The larger MIG wires bring more amps to the weld, but it's less controllable.  If your MIG machine can supply enough amps to get it done with a smaller wire than that is preferable.  


--  Don't run the shielding gas pressure too high.  The stuff is only there to prevent bubbles/pinholes in the welds.  Once the gas pressure is high enough to do that, you won't gain anything by blowing it harder.  It just wastes the gas and takes heat away from the welds.    


--  Letting the metal cool off gradually is better than using compressed air to blow it cool.  Less brittle & warping issues.  Just keep the welds short & spaced apart and take your time on the whole job.

Thanks, Mike.
I did back down the gas pressure from 18 to 13. The welds look much better but still not excellent. I sanded and wire wheeled the patch and existing wheel tub but they are not surgically clean. I sure can tell when I hit a dirty spot. Spatter and crackle instead of a nice sizzle.

[INTMD8]

Changing wire probably won't help.

IMO, first thing to make this easier is tight panel to panel fitment.  If there is a gap between sheetmetal and you aren't used to working with things like that, it can get messy quickly.

Not sure -how- you're trying to weld it but my unsolicited advice would be, certainly don't go in with the mindset that you're going to hold down the trigger for several seconds as you lay down a length of bead. 

When you're doing something very heat sensitive (so, sheetmetal that might not fit up tight)  just do a series of spot welds. As in, pull trigger and release to bridge gap. As it goes from glowing red to fading, do it again shifted in the direction you want to go but half overlapping the last spot weld, then do that a million times till you get where you need to be.

Last bit of opinion would be, do it in silicon bronze instead of whatever you're using.

[Kern Dog]

Changing the wire did help some. The welds were flatter and I rarely burned through. The quality is still crap compared to having the work in front of or under me. I still did short bursts to avoid burning.
Weld, grind...weld, grind.
I spread seam sealer over the perimeter and welded seams then today I sprayed the sound deadener/undercoating.
Total cost? Less than $130.
Wheelwell patches cut from a Ford truck in a junkyard: Maybe $40.
Welding wire and tips: $40.
Seam sealer and undercoating: Maybe $50?

The tire clearance improvement is great. I went out for a drive on a bumpy road that always resulted in tire contact. ZERO rubbing today even with 3/4 tank.
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It took me FIVE efforts to post this. I keep getting that stupid  error in regards to posting pictures. The operating system here is terrible.

[69rtse4spd]

Nice job.  .

[Kern Dog]

I have no intentions of making excuses about my welding ability. I would love to learn how to improve.

[Kern Dog]

I do much better welding with the work below me. Overhead welds that look good is still outside of my ability. My welds on the frame connectors and torque boxes was much better. Thicker metal there though.
I can't blame it on anything but myself. I need to meet up with someone that has the skills so I can learn what I am doing wrong.

I can state that this did greatly improve the clearance. These wheels and tires didn't rub until I lowered the car many years ago. I like the wheels & tires and I like the stance. I could have ran an 8 or 9 inch wheel and never had any rub but the goal for me was to have the tires out to the furthest edge of the body that I could.
Thanks to all that commented, even the critics!  

My issue with the pictures is....
The forum software wigs out when you try to post any picture twice UNLESS you rename it. It recognizes a file name from before and won't let you REpost it. You have to change the name to post the picture again.
 THIS is the only forum that has this strange condition.
I have thousands of pictures on this computer and my backup hard drive. In the interest of grouping pictures in clusters where the pictures tell a story, sometimes the name or number of the file is accidently duplicated. The computer doesn't care because the "duplicate" titles are stored in different folders.
Lets say I post a picture of my car titled "Charger 1". Months later I want to post the picture again....to do so, I have to rename it. I have my pictures categorized and numbered in order. Sometimes to comply with the program here, I have numerous REnamed pictures that are now out of order. Sometimes I forget and name a picture with a title that I used some time ago....then this site sends an error message that I already posted that picture when I actually didn't, I posted a different picture with a title that I forgot that I used years ago.
I'm not a computer expert so I get frustrated when I encounter these glitches.
I am thankful that the forum exists.

[rockitier350]

Here is a picture of the and rear inner widening wheelhouse. Putting the Uscar outer wheelhouses expanding piece on next.