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Author Topic: A dip in my timing  (Read 839 times)
J-440
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« on: September 13, 2022, 09:43:40 AM »

 Got a FAST standalone with duel sync distributor and an MSD 6AL ignition. My base timing table is a nice, smooth transition from 20* at startup all the way to 35* at WOT. For some reason my timing ďdipsĒ between 1300-1500 rpm and my engine backfires through the exhaust and the car falls on its face. After 1500 she straightens out and is in time with the table. FASTís customer service is non existent so Iím asking the gurus on here. Any ideas on what could cause this?
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« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2022, 11:23:58 AM »

I have my timing table advance timing down around 1100 to help keep it from dipping. Maybe have your table bump some in around where the dip occurs  shruggy
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J-440
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« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2022, 02:24:54 PM »

 Well shoot.  Iíve tried 4 different tunes from the past (all were decent) and Iím getting the same results. This has got to be a distributor issue. Gonna pull her and inspect it soon.
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« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2022, 02:33:06 PM »

The distributor is just distributing spark, hard to imagine itís causing a problem. Although Iíve had rotor phasing off a good bit in the past, but that caused breaking up @ higher RPM. Almost sounds like a lean bog, have you recorded any data logs?
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J-440
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« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2022, 02:53:39 PM »

 Yeah Iíve made a lot but am a little inexperienced at reading it. I need to study more. But a lean bog in all 4 tunes?
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« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2022, 03:34:56 PM »

Good point, but 4 tunes on the same engine shruggy How is the ďaccelerator pumpĒ tuned in F.A.S.T? Iíd look at the AFR around the time of the dip
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cdr
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« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2022, 04:09:16 PM »

post a picture of your timing table
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« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2022, 04:57:36 PM »

Hereís both tables.


* 46864614-F587-46A1-9D28-B61010224A4A.jpeg (138.85 KB, 640x480 - viewed 156 times.)

* CA27439B-D5F2-42BC-B298-81F9DBBF97F2.jpeg (139.98 KB, 640x480 - viewed 157 times.)
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cdr
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« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2022, 05:20:03 PM »

what all is your engine have & car set up
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« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2022, 05:36:24 PM »

440 36lb injectors, 2000cfm throttle body, roller valve train, duel sync distributor, MSD 6AL box, Holley electric pump with -10 feed line and -8 return line, 6 speed GV tranny, 4:10 gears.
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cdr
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« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2022, 06:49:32 PM »

heads, compression, cam specs , intake
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
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« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2022, 06:50:53 PM »

does it only do it when going wide open, is it good at part throttle
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
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« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2022, 06:56:45 PM »

 Unfortunately it backfires right after idle. Around 2000rpm it smoothes out. It didnít always do this which leads me to believe itís something else.
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« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2022, 07:00:14 PM »

possible bad plug wires, plug wires not in the correct firing order, coil wire burnt, bad spark plug ect
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
Charger55 by Charlie Keel, on Flickr
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« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2022, 08:24:51 PM »

Preciate it bud. Gonna check those soon.
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« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2022, 11:42:28 AM »

2000 cfm throttle body? I bet it moves a lot of air even just cracked. Are you running open loop or closed? And I didnít read your first post well enough, so youíre actually seeing the timing retard when the dip occurs?
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« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2022, 12:47:38 PM »

 Running closed loop. Yeah the throttle body is overkill for now. I bought it for a future power adder setup. She breathes really nice. Yeah you can see the timing dip in a small section then jump back up to normal again. Plugs and wires look good. Still searching though.
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« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2022, 04:51:11 AM »

 Think I found the problem. One of my ECM harnessí is right next to my distributor wire harness and Iím getting electrical interference between the 2. I need to wrap these things in foil and get better sleeves. 
 Hereís something cool I found out. Turn your car on and let it idle. Grab an old AM hand held radio and tune it to a white noise station. Then move the radio around your harnesses and listen for high pitched or odd sounds coming from the radio. Youíve found your problem. Preciate the help Metal.
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« Reply #18 on: September 16, 2022, 07:02:57 PM »

 2thumbs No prob man, glad you are working through it. Interference is one of the few things to make sense shruggy
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« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2022, 02:38:05 PM »

 Well the aluminum foil wrap didnít make a difference. I got another question though. On the A/F ratio table, the football is at the very bottom of the table. Even when I rev the motor it shoots to the right with the rpmís and doesnít jump around like my base fuel table and the base timing tables do. Is that normal? Iíve even swapped my maf sensor and checked for vacuum leaks but I got the same results. Any ideas?
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« Reply #20 on: September 26, 2022, 03:58:46 PM »

post a screen shot of that table
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
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« Reply #21 on: September 26, 2022, 06:05:12 PM »

Here she is.


* 4F2AFB33-DB02-46F5-8CFB-293481091324.jpeg (136.92 KB, 640x480 - viewed 63 times.)
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« Reply #22 on: September 26, 2022, 06:24:13 PM »

Call FAST & see what they say, this is probably related to the running problem you have. if they are no help, call Rich @ FASTMANEFI , not sure he will help without charging you for his time UNLESS you bought the efi from him
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
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« Reply #23 on: September 26, 2022, 06:42:41 PM »

 Yeah FAST already told me that this was an electrical interference issue. Been talking to Rich off and on but his message board is not very active. Preciate the help Metal.
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cdr
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« Reply #24 on: September 26, 2022, 07:03:22 PM »

Yeah FAST already told me that this was an electrical interference issue. Been talking to Rich off and on but his message board is not very active. Preciate the help Metal.

Does the timing table football move like it should ?
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
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« Reply #25 on: September 26, 2022, 07:38:15 PM »

 Yes. Thereís no knock sensor either so the timing isnít affected.
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« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2022, 07:47:32 PM »

unless you have something wrong in the initial settings ie, afr learn turned off ect...I would say the ECU is defective
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68 Charger 512 cid,9.7to1,Hilborn EFI,Home ported 440 source heads,small hyd roller cam,COLD A/C ,,a518 trans,Dana 60 ,4.10 gear,10.93 et,4100lbs on street tires full exhaust daily driver
Charger55 by Charlie Keel, on Flickr
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« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2022, 08:58:23 PM »

 Man I hope not. Gonna keep trying.
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