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Author Topic: Correct power booster check valve? 69 B-body disc  (Read 4473 times)
Just 6T9 CHGR
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« on: January 26, 2007, 05:37:51 PM »

Anyone have a pic of the "correct" power brake booster check valve for a 69 B body with discs?
This would be for the crimped style Bendix power booster.
Should it have 1 nipple or 2?  Color?
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Chatt69chgr
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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2007, 09:06:59 PM »

I don't have a pic but am interested in knowing the answer to this.  I looked up the brake check valve on rockauto for both a 69 charger and a 69 New Yorker (both used the Bendix crimped dual diaphram booster).  They list two Raybestos Part Numbers.  One is a CV89005 which was for the charger.  It has one nipple coming out the top of the valve and one out the side.  The New Yorker listed a CV89004 with one nipple coming out the side and the other coming out the other side (opposite 180 degrees).  They appear to be made of white or off-white plastic and come with grommet and plug if you don't need one of the nipples.  Didn't the charger have one line running from the check valve to the vacuum fitting on the manifold and another line running from the other nipple to the vacuum canister?  My car didn't originally come with a booster but I am retrofitting one so this is why I am interested.  Oh, there is a check valve and grommet package  for Bendix power brake booster listed on the long list of so called "NOS" parts that has appeared on this site in the past.  It is a 3420973 superseded to 4271382.  The last number is still active and lists for about $15.  I don't know what this part really is as the Dodge sites don't have pictures nor do I know if it has one nipple or two or the orientation of the nipples.  Anyway, someone will post a picture and that will solve the mystery.  Thanks.
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resq302
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« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2007, 01:23:05 AM »

Chris, my car has the check valve that has the off white color and has the nipples 180 degrees from each other.  This was what was on my car when I got it as it was coded for power disc brakes from the factory.  When I had my power brake booster rebuilt, they installed a new one that was exactly the same and the company said it was correct for disc equipped cars.  Knowing how Mopar changed vendors frequently, anything is possible and it could have also been plant specific. 

You also might want to check with MoparJohn as his car is a factory disc brake car and was built 3 days prior to my car to see what kind of check valve his car has also.

Brian
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
Just 6T9 CHGR
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« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2007, 05:45:22 AM »

I am definately getting conflicting reports....some say 1 nipple, some say 2.  I have seen 440 & Hemi cars with both  (Hemi cars mostly with a white 90º single nipple style)

The cars that I have seen with 2 nipples in use were the cars with cruise control.  Non cruise cars with the 2 nipples had one blocked off.  The vac line for the can always went to the manifold


Also some are saying that the valve should be painted black along with the booster/master assy
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resq302
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« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2007, 06:48:39 AM »

Chris,

I just dug out the factory repair manual and checked some of the pictures in there.  The show the check valve with the one line going to the vacuum on the engine going into the large flat surface of the check valve with a smaller nipple at a 90 degree angle to the one from the engine.  This is on the picture with a Bendix style booser and disc brake m/c.  (page 5-23 of the repair manual)

Now to confuse matters worse, below the above picture, they have a diagram for a Bendix power brake assembly drum and disc brakes with the drum m/c shown.  (I was always led to believe that if you got power drum brakes, you got a Midland Ross type booster)  That booster is the same as the booster above but has only 1 nipple and vacuum line going to it with no other nipple shown.  Yet where the vacuum line attaches to the engine only has a vacuum port with 1 nipple going into the intake manifold.

Looking at the lubrication and maintenance section on page 0-15 and 0-16 they show even more conflicting info as they show a Midland Ross style booster with a disc brake master cyl. on a 318 engine, yet it has an unsilenced air cleaner.    The m/c also appears to be a hemi style as the lines exit out towards the fender, not towards the engine.  The m/c is also painted black yet the booster is a lighter color, probably the gold cad like the Midland Ross units were.

I guess it all boils down to they installed what they had at the time your car came down the line. Huh shruggy Huh shruggy Huh shruggy
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
69CoronetRT
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« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2007, 09:49:09 AM »

I am definately getting conflicting reports....some say 1 nipple, some say 2.  I have seen 440 & Hemi cars with both  (Hemi cars mostly with a white 90º single nipple style)

The cars that I have seen with 2 nipples in use were the cars with cruise control.  Non cruise cars with the 2 nipples had one blocked off.  The vac line for the can always went to the manifold


Also some are saying that the valve should be painted black along with the booster/master assy

Chris,

FWIW...the vacuum fitting MAY be model/ application specific or possibly PNs were superceeded during the year. I did a quick scan of the 69 BS I have.

It appears that 69 Chargers B41/B51 recieved the '66' valve. But I also show the 66 was used on a B31/B51 and a B51 only car.

I also show for Chargers:

'38' for a B51 car and a B31/B51 car
'86' for manual as well as a B31 car
'25' also for a manual car.
I show '31' for two Charger 500's B41/B51 Hemi cars.

The only Charger application number that shows up for other 69 B bodies is '66' application for a B41/B51 Hemi GTX. The rest of the B bodies have different numbers.

I only cross referenced by B code and VAC FIT. I can look at it my sheet more in depth if you want me to.

This may be a partial answer to the paint question. If there were that many different vacuum fitting applications for the same brake set up, the brake assembly person would not know what specific application the booster/MC was going into so how would they know what check valve to install before painting? Wouldn't it make more sense to paint a more general application (the booster and MC) and have the unpainted valve installed later on the line?Twocents
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Seeking information on '69 St. Louis plant VINs, SPDs and VONs. Buld sheets and tag pictures appreciated. Over 2,000 on file thanks to people like you.
resq302
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« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2007, 09:56:52 AM »

Do you have a picture of what the "66" valve looks like?  Or does it look like the one in the pic below?  (that is what mine looks like)


* checkvalve.jpg (18.22 KB, 400x300 - viewed 570 times.)
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
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« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2007, 10:03:43 AM »

Do you have a picture of what the "66" valve looks like?  Or does it look like the one in the pic below?  (that is what mine looks like)

I'm curious, is the PN on the part?
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Seeking information on '69 St. Louis plant VINs, SPDs and VONs. Buld sheets and tag pictures appreciated. Over 2,000 on file thanks to people like you.
resq302
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« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2007, 10:13:49 AM »

Or are you talking about something like this?


* vacuumfitting.jpg (4.1 KB, 200x149 - viewed 562 times.)
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
resq302
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« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2007, 10:19:20 AM »

Do you have a picture of what the "66" valve looks like?  Or does it look like the one in the pic below?  (that is what mine looks like)

I'm curious, is the PN on the part?

I dont know.  That was just a picture I had saved to use as a reference in case I ever needed a new part that I would have the part number to compare it to or to try to order through a local Dodge dealer.
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
Chatt69chgr
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« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2007, 11:20:13 AM »

I looked up the 3420129 on mymopar and it says it's the check valve for most 69-71 Bendix boosters.  Tried looking it up to see if you could buy one and can't find it on any of the Mopar sites I have for buying new parts.  Must not be available from MOPAR anymore.  If someone has better resources, I would like to know if it is available and if so, what the Mopar number is if it has been superceded as well as the price.  If it isn't available anymore, the Raybestos CV89004 looks to be more or less the same thing.
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69fuchs
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« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2007, 02:40:59 PM »

This is the valve that has been on all of my pdb 1969 chargers. (I have had 3 original cars)  Someone was reproducing them for a while, but they were stupid expensive (like $100.00)


* check_valve.jpg (119.65 KB, 419x336 - viewed 582 times.)
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Just 6T9 CHGR
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« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2007, 05:20:36 PM »

Thanks for all the help guys.  I agree this a confusing stuff!

I was looking in the 69 parts manual and it seems that the correct # for a power disc brake car the # is 3004626 which a few of the "collector" dealers still have ...they want $60 & up for these.  It seems as though they are a dual nipple design with 1 pointing striaght up & the other off to the side 90º
Much like the above pic

I think for now I will grab the $8 Raybestos one & call it a day.....now should it be painted black with the rest of the booster scratchchin
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« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2007, 05:43:20 PM »

I was told it should be painted black.
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Just 6T9 CHGR
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« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2007, 06:23:08 PM »

1 for black.........
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« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2007, 06:27:22 PM »

2 for black (going by what Bill Alphin said)
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
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« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2007, 09:48:33 PM »

This is the check valve on mine,just bought the booster on Saturday from UAP/NAPA.I guess these guys can still get the check valve?


* booster.jpg (33.58 KB, 640x480 - viewed 550 times.)

* booster2.jpg (33.41 KB, 640x480 - viewed 554 times.)
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http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2987097

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« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2007, 09:58:17 PM »

Looks like that check valve has one extra fitting on it though.  Also, the booster doesnt look like an original Bendix unit.  Didn't the originals have recessed areas on it?
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
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« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2007, 05:11:27 AM »

Those are pretty much all anybody out there sells these days. I don't like
looking at a check valve that has three ports plugged, so I just use the one
port valve, but try and find one, if you can let me know.

The top picture is what I prefer, the bottom pic seems to be the way most of them are,
so I am thinking it might be correct  shruggy


* Brake_Booster_pic_111411.JPG (20.01 KB, 700x418 - viewed 550 times.)

* Brake_Booster_Hemi_115611.JPG (79.23 KB, 750x743 - viewed 551 times.)
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Just 6T9 CHGR
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« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2007, 08:09:24 AM »

This is the Cardone booster I got that is made of unobtanium........searched for almost a month for it and the correct master.....

It has this valve on it

Now another question to ponder........is there supposed to be a gasket between the master & the booster?


* 1-24-2007_7-11-29_PM_0003_exposure_resize.JPG (114.75 KB, 800x600 - viewed 540 times.)

* 1-24-2007_7-13-36_PM_0008_exposure_resize.JPG (126.94 KB, 800x600 - viewed 543 times.)
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« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2007, 07:39:04 PM »

Do you have a picture of what the "66" valve looks like?  Or does it look like the one in the pic below?  (that is what mine looks like)

Brian this is a drum brake ck valve I believe.I have one here in stock

Booster and valve are both painted gloss black as an assy.

I'll have to dig thru my pics and see if I have any of a 1969 survivor disc brake car .

Hmmmmmmm, power brakes this week, sounds like it's only a matter of time until the A/C is back on it .......
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Bill Allphin
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« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2007, 07:44:58 PM »

Bill,

Just to confirm, they were painted 30 degree gloss black? 

Brian
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
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« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2007, 07:50:20 PM »

Bill,

Just to confirm, they were painted 30 degree gloss black? 

Brian

By todays paint standards, Yes it will be a low gloss black. In 1969 it was just plain old TX9 paint
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Bill Allphin
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« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2007, 08:00:24 PM »

Ok, so the entire assembly was painted with the master cyl bolted to the booster.  I guess I need to paint the 4 nuts that hold the m/c to the booster then and find a correct check valve.
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Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto
Just 6T9 CHGR
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« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2007, 08:03:54 PM »

This is the one I just ordered from Rock Auto for $6

Bill do you concur that there was no gasket between the master & booster?




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