The NASCAR Thread

[TUFCAT]

This is a very good video.  The corresponding article is also interesting from the Father's perspective. His statements seem to foreshadow that some serious litigation is coming....   

http://espn.go.com/racing/nascar/story/_/id/11347015/tony-stewart-actions-questioned-father-killed-driver-kevin-ward-jr

[odcics2]

This is a very good video.  The corresponding article is also interesting from the Father's perspective. His statements seem to foreshadow that some serious litigation is coming....   

http://espn.go.com/racing/nascar/story/_/id/11347015/tony-stewart-actions-questioned-father-killed-driver-kevin-ward-jr

   Tony has deep pockets.....   

[Aero426]

A civil suit would not surprise me, even if no legal charges are ever filed.   

[TUFCAT]

A civil suit would not surprise me, even if no legal charges are ever filed.    

Yes indeed...and if you need a reason see post above.   

[Aero426]

Can you say "settled out of court"?    I knew you could.

[A383Wing]

when someone grabs hold of sideboard of your wing as you go by , then slips an falls off . I think that pretty much done in you Tony haters who want have him convicted of murder. It's there between 11 - 14 seconds

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=1XvhrPu64Co

[stripedelete]

So what if one of the other drivers would have hit Ward?  Non Story

All I saw was a millenial having a temper tantrum and,,,,, he paid a high price for it. 

[Mike DC]

  
If NASCAR/etc had taken it upon themselves to start enforcing a tighter "stay in your car" rule WITHOUT this death having happened, wouldn't we be the first ones bitching about it?  It's all part of the Disney-fication of racing, real drivers from the old days wouldn't be able to handle all the corporate bullshit, etc.  

We wouldn't be thinking about the safety issue very hard if this hadn't happened.  Even if NASCAR had claimed they were making a tighter rule "for safety" we would have brushed off the idea that it was a serious safety problem:  "What idiot is actually going to waltz out into a field of speeding racecars under green conditions and get HIT?  Get real. That doesn't happen.  NASCAR is just enforcing the rule now for their image."

[wingcar]

Anyone, whether they be driver, crew member, etc. that fail to understand that motorsports is and always will be a dangerous sport shouldn't be involved.   Anytime you strap on a racecar, no matter the level of the series, you are taking on a certain about of risk.  And, if you really sit down and think about it...we all do this every day of our lives.  It all comes down to a tradeoff between Risk and Reward.   Am I willing to take on the risk involved in the activity I want to participant in for a given reward?  Each of us do this hundreds of times during a given day without giving it a second thought.  But, when you do, you are basing that decision on Risk and Reward.  Your decision to turn left at a busy intersection perhaps being a good example.  UPS feels the danger level is high enough to warrant a policy that its drivers make only right hand turns whenever possible.   What dangers do you accept at work each day?  We all have a level of risk we are willing to take in our pursuit of happiness.  Some take it to a higher level than others....which is why we all don't swim with sharks or jump out of perfectly good airplanes.  I personally fly for fun, but I have friends that will not even sit in an airplane.  I accept the risk associated with flying because I receive a certain level of reward.  You can't regulate safety to a level where you are 100% safe.  But you can chose what Risk vs. Reward you are willing to accept.      

[JB400]

Just announced, Jeff Burton filling in for Stewart this weekend at Michigan

[Mike DC]

You can't regulate safety to a level where you are 100% safe

Good luck convincing America of this today.

[wingcar]

you had to see this one coming a mile away...........................

NASCAR bans drivers from confronting cars in aftermath of Stewart/Ward incident

NASCAR drivers will no longer be able to get out of their cars to angrily confront another driver in a moving vehicle.

NASCAR vice president of competition Robin Pemberton made the announcement Friday morning. The rule is in effect immediately, but no specific penalty was announced for violation of the rule.

"During an event if a race car is involved in an on-track incident, and/or is stopped on or near the racing surface, and unable to continue, to make forward progress," Pemberton said, reading from the new rule. "Unless extenuating circumstances or conditions exist with the race car, example on fire, smoke in the cockpit, etc, the driver should take the following steps: shut off all electrical power and if the driver is uninjured, lower the window net. Do not loosen, disconnect or remove any driver personal safety equipment until directed to do so by safety personnel or a NASCAR official. After being directed to exit the race car, the driver should proceed to the ambulance or other vehicle or as otherwise directed by safety personnel or a NASCAR official."

"At no time should a driver or crew member or members approach any portion of the racing surface or apron. At no time should a driver, crew member or members approach another moving vehicle. All vehicles not involved in the incident or that are able to continue afterward should slow down to a cautious speed as outlined in [NASCAR rule] 10.4: yellow flag rules."

The rule is in response to the incident with Tony Stewart and Kevin Ward at Canandaigua (N.Y.) Motorsports Park Saturday night. After Ward hit the wall, he unstrapped himself from the car and walked down the track to confront Stewart. He was hit by Stewart's car and killed.

"It was one of those that was obviously, everybody paid attention to and [the rule] is on the heels of that," Pemberton said.
The rule will be applied on a case-by-case basis and drivers will likely have to show significant intent of a confrontation to be penalized.

Stewart is not racing at Michigan this weekend. Jeff Burton is driving in his place. The investigation into the incident is still ongoing and Stewart is not currently facing any criminal charges. Ward's funeral was Thursday.

After being involved in an incident, NASCAR drivers have not been prohibited from exiting their cars – angrily or not – before safety workers arrive. Many times if a driver is unhurt and even without circumstances like a fire, smoke or other factors, drivers quickly unbuckle their safety equipment, and begin the process of removing themselves from the vehicle before safety equipment arrives. That no longer is allowed.

And yes, this rule does eliminate the possibility of a helmet-throwing confrontation at the risk of severe penalties. Brad Keselowski admitted Tuesday that those type of confrontations had become a big part of the sport.

"I would say it has become that way, there's no doubt about that," Keselowski said. "I think if you look at the highlight reels that are shown, you think of Bristol, you think of Tony, other drivers at Bristol that have been known for it, Danica, whatnot. It certainly has become common, accepted practice."

Pemberton said Friday that safety trumped everything though it may take some time for fans to realize that the possibility of confrontation no longer exists. However, with what happened on Saturday night, our view of on-track confrontations had already been significantly altered.

"This rule is really put in place for the safety of all our competitors and it's safety first right now," Pemberton said.

Following the death of Dale Earnhardt in 2001, NASCAR made closed-face helmets and head and neck restraints mandatory for all drivers. (Earnhardt was wearing an open-faced helmet and no head and neck restraint.) After ARCA driver Eric Martin was killed in a practice crash at Charlotte in 2002 in an incident that could have been prevented with spotters stationed on top of the grandstands, NASCAR made it mandatory that spotters were perched up high in spotters stands for all race-weekend sessions

[Ponch ®]

I avoided watching the video at first.  From the second hand descriptions of the incident that I kept hearing, it sounded like Stewart went all Frankenstein on the kid and ran him down on purpose.

Then I watched it, almost inadvertently, on SportsCenter. It really could go either way, IMHO. Either Stewart tried to scare the kid and grossly miscalculated, or he simply couldn't see him til right before impact and, as reflexes kicked in to avoid him, made the situation worse by trying to avoid him or get past him.

Unless some sort of "Smoking Gun" (no pun intended) evidence like another video comes out, only Stewart really knows what he was trying to do and there likely isn't enough to hang a criminal charge on him. There will definitely be a civil action, probably for wrongful death. I mean, God forbid someone doesn't get paid (f---ng lawyers!) because of this tragedy.

My guess is that it will settle out of court. Stewart will want to avoid the expense and circus-like publicity of a trial, and Ward's family (if they have a good lawyer) won't let it go to trial either because NY is a "pure comparative fault" state when it comes to negligence: which means that if the jury says Ward was 75% at fault, his family can only get 25% of whatever amount of damages they are trying to get. Gonna be hard to convince a jury that Ward didn't bear a pretty considerable level of fault on this.

[ws23rt]

The rules changing for driver safety is understandable as the cars get faster. It happens bit by bit and accident by incident.
I see these races as two battles at the same time. 1 the cars and 2 the drivers.

For ultimate driver safety they could drive these cars from a remote control station but who would come to that kind of race?  The danger and the drama are what brings the fans.

In a bull fight look at all the safety gear the matador has on. If he wore the Michelin guy suit it could be fun but very different.  And not many would show up.

Getting out of a car during a race to fight man to car seems over the top and without a red cape that guy is doomed.

[Mike DC]

Then I watched it, almost inadvertently, on SportsCenter. It really could go either way, IMHO. Either Stewart tried to scare the kid and grossly miscalculated, or he simply couldn't see him til right before impact and, as reflexes kicked in to avoid him, made the situation worse by trying to avoid him or get past him.

I can't understand how the entire public is watching the video and thinking Stewart gunned the engine before he hit the guy.  Stewart's engine never audibly revved until the kid was already getting caught up in the car.


There are a bunch of possible scenarios for what happened there, but all of them would seem to have Stewart innocent of the fatality.  The worst possible theory I can picture is that Stewart intended to spray the kid with dirt, but acted AFTER the kid had already gotten himself fatally caught up in Stewart's car on his own. 

The way the kid was reaching out & going after Stewart's car, I could imagine Stewart reflexively goosing the throttle to get his car PAST the kid and out of his reach.  The kid looked ready to grab a rollbar, come aboard, and start hitting Stewart (harnessed into place). 



And besides all that - whose motor really revved in that video?   It could be Stewart's car but I wouldn't bet my house on it.  That sound seems too close-up for a car that was dozens of yards across the track at the time.  The whole video shot is zoomed in.
 

[stripedelete]

Were they under caution?  They talked about him revving and or accelerating under a caution flag early on like it was the smoking gun.   But now no one is mentioning it?   Maybe it's implied?

[Aero426]

Were they under caution?  They talked about him revving and or accelerating under a caution flag early on like it was the smoking gun.   But now no one is mentioning it?   Maybe it's implied?

Stewart did not touch the other car before the it went into the wall causing the caution flag.    The first time Stewart saw the situation confronting him was when he came back around the next lap under the yellow.   And it was over in a matter of seconds.    Because he sustained no damage, it's hard to argue that Stewart had a reason to be upset with the kid.   

[stripedelete]

Were they under caution?  They talked about him revving and or accelerating under a caution flag early on like it was the smoking gun.   But now no one is mentioning it?   Maybe it's implied?

Stewart did not touch the other car before the it went into the wall causing the caution flag.    The first time Stewart saw the situation confronting him was when he came back around the next lap under the yellow.   And it was over in a matter of seconds.    Because he sustained no damage, it's hard to argue that Stewart had a reason to be upset with the kid.   

So, they were under the caution when he hit Ward.   (Not that it changes my opinion, just haven't heard it mentioned since the story broke)

[odcics2]

and the word "CAUTION" means.....   

[stripedelete]

and the word "CAUTION" means.....   

EXACTLY.   Don't get out of your car!

[TruckDriver]

and the word "CAUTION" means.....   

EXACTLY.   Don't get out of your car!

x2

[JB400]

Confirmed:  Edwards leaves Ford for '15, moves to Joe Gibbs  http://sports.yahoo.com/news/carl-edwards-joins-joe-gibbs-142739917.html

[JB400]

Stewart returns to racing

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/tony-stewart-return-atlanta-204500282--nascar.html

[wingcar]

Tony's back...best of luck to him as it will be hard....but he had to come out sooner or later and face the public.  Like many many I really didn't except it this soon, but all things considered this is really a good time as the Chase hasn't started and so his return at this time will not take away from that....

[JB400]

MW is on Dancing with the Stars

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nascar-from-the-marbles/happy-hour--waltrip--kahne--stewart--xfinity-and-small-fires-194005784.html