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Anyone have wobbly repro Magnum road wheels? UPDATE! SOLVED!

Started by 1969chargerrtse, October 11, 2008, 06:17:30 PM

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1969chargerrtse

One of the issues bugging me with my car is that it vibrates after going over 60mph.  I had thought it was the drive shaft as the steering wheel is vibration free.  Also the shifter doesn't vibrate either, but I felt it was coming from the center of the car, somewhere?  Well, today I jacked up the rear and ran the car in drive.  I was shocked to see the rear wheels are not rolling true.  They kind of have a wobble to them.  I took my spare and threw that on and it was REAL bad.  I did feel at about 30 mph the back end of the car kinda going up and down like I had a tire with a bubble in the tread. Makes me wonder if they are just poorly made or the past owner couldn't drive for beans and hit curbes.  Anyone else have a similar issue with their wheels?
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

TUFCAT


Charger-Bodie

68 Charger R/t white with black v/t and red tailstripe. 440 4 speed ,black interior
68 383 auto with a/c and power windows. Now 440 4 speed jj1 gold black interior .
My Charger is a hybrid car, it burns gas and rubber............

1969chargerrtse

I was afraid of that.  Thanks guys.  Money is tight as we all know.  I'll just consider it a governor to keep me within the speed limits.  Because I'm not buying new rims.  It rolls just fine (up to 60 ).  :icon_smile_big:
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

Charger-Bodie

Quote from: 1969chargerrtse on October 11, 2008, 09:17:22 PM
I was afraid of that.  Thanks guys.  Money is tight as we all know.  I'll just consider it a governor to keep me within the speed limits.  Because I'm not buying new rims.  It rolls just fine (up to 60 ).  :icon_smile_big:


Have you had them balanced?
68 Charger R/t white with black v/t and red tailstripe. 440 4 speed ,black interior
68 383 auto with a/c and power windows. Now 440 4 speed jj1 gold black interior .
My Charger is a hybrid car, it burns gas and rubber............

1969chargerrtse

Quote from: 1hot68 on October 12, 2008, 03:37:06 AM
Quote from: 1969chargerrtse on October 11, 2008, 09:17:22 PM
I was afraid of that.  Thanks guys.  Money is tight as we all know.  I'll just consider it a governor to keep me within the speed limits.  Because I'm not buying new rims.  It rolls just fine (up to 60 ).  :icon_smile_big:


Have you had them balanced?
They have weights on the inside.  I don't think these are balance-able.  I may ask a friend to borrow two good wheels and swap them and then take it for a spin.
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

Just 6T9 CHGR

IIRC the repro wheels are not hub centric.  I'm pretty sure mine stated so right on the box.  You have to take it to a shop that is able to balance the wheels using the lug holes to mount it to the balancer & not the center hole.

I have'nt found a place locally that has this and I had the shop do the best they cound with the hub fixture.....I think this fact is contributing to my vibrations at 62-68 mph as well...
Maybe a winter project to fiind a shop that has this fixture locally....
Chris' '69 Charger R/T


1969chargerrtse

Quote from: Just 6T9 CHGR on October 12, 2008, 07:56:49 PM
IIRC the repro wheels are not hub centric.  I'm pretty sure mine stated so right on the box.  You have to take it to a shop that is able to balance the wheels using the lug holes to mount it to the balancer & not the center hole.

I haven't found a place locally that has this and I had the shop do the best they could with the hub fixture.....I think this fact is contributing to my vibrations at 62-68 mph as well...
Maybe a winter project to find a shop that has this fixture locally....
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOh.  I'll have to look into that, just not now. Winters coming. It starts, and runs.  Thats good enough for this season.  I swapped the rear wheel to the front today and the ride is different.  I think you have something there.  :yesnod: Many thanks.
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

Just 6T9 CHGR

QuoteWinters coming. It starts, and runs.  Thats good enough for this season.

I say the same thing... :slap:

Sad part is that I havent tried to have mine rebalanced since I got them........in 2002 :rotz:
Chris' '69 Charger R/T


NMike

Quote from: 1969chargerrtse on October 11, 2008, 06:17:30 PM
  I took my spare and threw that on and it was REAL bad.

so when you placed the spare on the car, it also wobbled when driven? that would be a bad flange.

resq302

He said he swapped the rear to the front and it made the rear feel much better without the wobbling, so it can not be a bad flange.

Also, every place that I know that balances wheels and tires does it from the hub.  I have yet to hear of a place that balances the rims and tires by "bolting" it up to a mock axle.  To me, that would be a huge hassle and waste of time and money since not all bolt patterns are the same.  Sounds like a lame excuse to me from the makers of the company. :flame:  Also, back in the day prior to having the high speed balancers they do now, they used to use a bubble balancer.  Basically, you had this special adapter that went through the hub and had a bubble, similar to a level, in the center.  Once you got that bubble within the red ring, the wheel was supposedly balanced.  They never really were acurate, hence, the new version for high speed computer balancing.
Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto

Charger-Bodie

Quote from: resq302 on October 17, 2008, 06:45:49 AM
He said he swapped the rear to the front and it made the rear feel much better without the wobbling, so it can not be a bad flange.

Also, every place that I know that balances wheels and tires does it from the hub.  I have yet to hear of a place that balances the rims and tires by "bolting" it up to a mock axle.  To me, that would be a huge hassle and waste of time and money since not all bolt patterns are the same.  Sounds like a lame excuse to me from the makers of the company. :flame:  Also, back in the day prior to having the high speed balancers they do now, they used to use a bubble balancer.  Basically, you had this special adapter that went through the hub and had a bubble, similar to a level, in the center.  Once you got that bubble within the red ring, the wheel was supposedly balanced.  They never really were acurate, hence, the new version for high speed computer balancing.

THey also used to have spin balancers that spun the whel and tire ON the car, Which balanced the Tire wheel and drum (or rotor) at the same time. Id like to get me one of those machines!
68 Charger R/t white with black v/t and red tailstripe. 440 4 speed ,black interior
68 383 auto with a/c and power windows. Now 440 4 speed jj1 gold black interior .
My Charger is a hybrid car, it burns gas and rubber............

Just 6T9 CHGR

Chris' '69 Charger R/T


resq302

Chris,

Thats the same one the GSP model that my old job (ETD tire center) now uses.
Brian
1969 Dodge Charger (factory 4 speed, H code 383 engine,  AACA Senior winner, 2008 Concours d'Elegance participant, 2009 Concours d'Elegance award winner)
1970 Challenger Convert. factory #'s matching red inter. w/ white body.  318 car built 9/28/69 (AACA Senior winner)
1969 Plymough GTX convertible - original sheet metal, #'s matching drivetrain, T3 Honey Bronze, 1 of 701 produced, 1 of 362 with 440 4 bbl - auto

1969chargerrtse

Quote from: NMike on October 16, 2008, 11:16:54 PM
Quote from: 1969chargerrtse on October 11, 2008, 06:17:30 PM
  I took my spare and threw that on and it was REAL bad.

so when you placed the spare on the car, it also wobbled when driven? that would be a bad flange.
No.  I jacked the car up on the rear and ran it in drive.  The two rear wheels didn't roll 100% straight, they had  a small wobble to them.  When I put on the rear it wobbled real bad as obvious the rim was bent.  I put the rear wheel on the front and the car can go a little with the rim swapping.  I'm pretty sure it's balance issue as Brian mentioned from the start.

I'm looking for one of those machines that they balalnce the wheel while on the car, as mentioned earlier.  No rush.
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

NMike

if you can see the wobble on the rim, it is a bad rim or a rim that isn't mounted 100%. tire balance is a slight up and down movement of the tire while running it in the air. you can feel it more than see.

1969chargerrtse

I hate to go back and forth with this, but yesterday I was on the highway for a good 1/2 hour doing 60ish and it really feels like its coming from the driveshaft near the rear end hump on the floor.  I have the rim from the rear on the front and I can feel slight vibration, but the rear floor area really shakes at 65 or faster.  I've looked at the drive shaft several times, there is no u joint play, I can't understand what would be off?  Would a poorly balanced shaft really vibrate that much?  I keep going back and forth, wheels/shaft. :shruggy:
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

NMike

take the drums off and mount a dial indicator. check the runout of the flange. examine the driveshaft and look for where a weight may have come off. is your trans mount good?

1969chargerrtse

Quote from: NMike on October 19, 2008, 03:48:08 PM
take the drums off and mount a dial indicator. check the runout of the flange. examine the driveshaft and look for where a weight may have come off. is your trans mount good?
Will do (just not now).  The trani mount is new.  I don't get any shifter shake either?
This car was sold many years ago to somebody in Wisconsin. I now am retired and living in Florida.

bull


RallyeMike

QuoteIRC the repro wheels are not hub centric.  I'm pretty sure mine stated so right on the box.

Knowing how 98% of shops balance wheels and tires, why would any respectable company make a wheel with a non-centric center? That's just plain crap!

QuoteI hate to go back and forth with this, but yesterday I was on the highway for a good 1/2 hour doing 60ish and it really feels like its coming from the driveshaft near the rear end hump on the floor.  I have the rim from the rear on the front and I can feel slight vibration, but the rear floor area really shakes at 65 or faster.  I've looked at the drive shaft several times, there is no u joint play, I can't understand what would be off?  Would a poorly balanced shaft really vibrate that much?  I keep going back and forth, wheels/shaft. shruggy

Yes, and unbalanced or bent driveshaft will do this. Any respectable driveshaft shop can check runout and balance for you. Jack up the car, remove 4-bolts and take it down there. Not fixed? Check the driveline angles which can make the same vibrations. Search the site and you'll find some driveshaft angle info. You need to buy a cheap angle-finder tool for this.

Wheels: No steel wheel is perfect. Manufacturers used to always punch the valve stem hole at the most out-round location. Tires are also always slightly out of round, and the manufacturers usually mark the tires with a dot to line up with valve stem hole. Indexing the dot with the valve stem will help round-out the wheel and tire combo. Most all tire stores don't have a clue about this, so the tires are never properly mounted. Even if you mention it, they say "it does not matter", or "we can fix it on the road force balancer". Don't settle for this.  You cant fix eccentricity or out-of-round on a balance machine! If these wheels are really so crappy that they cant even build them with centric hubs, they may be out of round beyond normal tolerances too, and then if not mounted properly with the tires, well..... you g-g-g-g-et the p-p-p-picture.


1969 Charger 500 #232008
1972 Charger, Grand Sport #41
1973 Charger "T/A"

Drive as fast as you want to on a public road! Click here for info: http://www.sscc.us/

Just 6T9 CHGR

Quote from: RallyeMike on October 22, 2008, 12:27:04 AM
QuoteIRC the repro wheels are not hub centric.  I'm pretty sure mine stated so right on the box.

Knowing how 98% of shops balance wheels and tires, why would any respectable company make a wheel with a non-centric center? That's just plain crap!




Beats me, they've been doing it since 1982 apparently....check their warranty page......last sentence.... :rotz:

http://www.specialtywheelsltd.org/warranty-info.html
Chris' '69 Charger R/T


lilwendal

I had to go through two sets of Wheel Vintiques before I recieved an 'acceptable' set.
I recomend having your tire shop mount the rim to the balancer and see how it spins prior to the tire being mounted.
That will show you if the rim is true.  All the WV ones where off to a degree.
Also they have a strict policy of not taking rims back once  a tire has been mounted so it verifes the rims quality prior to mounting.
I had two rims that where almost a 1/4 inch off.  They must have no quality assurance there.

RallyeMike

QuoteBeats me, they've been doing it since 1982 apparently....check their warranty page......last sentence.... rotz

Maybe their slogan, instead of "Manufacturing High Quality Wheels Since 1982, should be "Manufacturing on a Quality High Since 1982"  :shruggy:

1969 Charger 500 #232008
1972 Charger, Grand Sport #41
1973 Charger "T/A"

Drive as fast as you want to on a public road! Click here for info: http://www.sscc.us/

chicken-deluxe

I had gotten 1 bad one from a set of 4.    15x7's.   I chased a vibration this summer.  Still have a little.   Here are some things. 


1.   Tailishaft bushing worn in trans.
2.   Bad trans mount
3.   Bad rim
4.   Bad tire
5.   Bent drive shaft
6.   Bent axle
7.   Bad axle bearing race or bearing
8.  Unbalanced rear drum.
and what was causing most of mine....

9.  Wrong AXLE Studs disallowing rim to mount completely against drum.   I had a shop change my long studs when too busy and they installed studs with too long of a collar and the lugs never snugged the rim up!   It wobbled over 60 real bad.

10.   I also had a slipped front spring eye bushing in my expensive Eaton leaf springs.  Not sure if this contributed as the springs were changed at the same time as the wheel studs.

Hopefully these ideas help.

    Another one is an external balanced converter on a internal balalnced engine or vice versal