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Author Topic: Looking to buy a General Lee? STAY AWAY FROM BK AUTO!! It's almost over!!!  (Read 384939 times)
dkn1997
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« Reply #50 on: November 16, 2008, 05:58:59 PM »

www.moparts.com

www.moparchat.com

www.forbbodiesonly.com
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General_01
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« Reply #51 on: November 16, 2008, 06:04:44 PM »

Moparts.com would be another board to post on.



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Troy
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« Reply #52 on: November 16, 2008, 06:09:11 PM »

Ok, according to their pictures, they re-cleared the car after the decals were put on. Assuming they also cut 'n buffed it after that would explain why they didn't clean up the mess under the fuel filler (it was already assembled and they just masked the car). In one of their pictures they show primer on the front of the driver's fender when the push bar is going on. Any idea what that was from? Are you installing a new cage? Because that one in your pictures isn't the same as theirs. Depending on when that Hemi was built, Chrysler had a very poor reputation for build quality. Nearly everyone who bought one disassembled it, had it checked at a machine shop, and reassembled correctly. Man, that headliner and the seat covers looked bad when they left the shop. It's hard to believe they replaced the rear valence (and corners) but didn't touch the rear cross member. On their site it says "Quarter extensions patched" and they obviously weren't - unless they are talking about that little flat piece of metal holding on to the quarter. In their pictures it appears that the car was put on a rotisserie and (mostly ) stripped to bare metal. Why go through all that effort only to cover everything with Por-15 and then undercoating without actually fixing the rust? You can see them sanding the Bondo in the rear wheelhouse in one of the pics. You may also want to really check out your tail panel thoroughly - around the lights and the passenger side trunk lip.

I'd say the pictures are intentionally deceptive - just like HLPAG. Anything you can do to expose these guys is great for anyone else looking for a car.

Troy
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jb666
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« Reply #53 on: November 16, 2008, 06:27:57 PM »

See my answers, below, in bold.

Ok, according to their pictures, they re-cleared the car after the decals were put on. Yes, but that's a story in itself. They put one coat of clear over my decals, which are all lifting under the clear. So now, in order to get the decals off, there's no easy way.

 Assuming they also cut 'n buffed it after that would explain why they didn't clean up the mess under the fuel filler (it was already assembled and they just masked the car). True, but I
v seen pictures where the car was just painted/wetsanded/buffed and the crap is all in the gas cap area.


 In one of their pictures they show primer on the front of the driver's fender when the push bar is going on. Any idea what that was from? This shot? . I have no idea. I'd almost assume they damages something while installing the motor?

Are you installing a new cage? Because that one in your pictures isn't the same as theirs. Yes, the "cage" they installed is out. It was horrible. 2.5" exhaust tubing BARELY ATTACHED to the floor (held on with a pc of scrap metal) I had a 6pt cage installed and I might upgrade it down the road.

Depending on when that Hemi was built, Chrysler had a very poor reputation for build quality. Nearly everyone who bought one disassembled it, had it checked at a machine shop, and reassembled correctly. SUPPOSEDLY this motor was checked out (not by Burger King), but I can't confirm that. I'll have it checked out now.

 Man, that headliner and the seat covers looked bad when they left the shop. You have no idea. The upholstery is a total butcher job. I've never seen a job done quite like it. You fold the front seats forward and the left-over material is just stapled to the back of the seat. It's gross.

It's hard to believe they replaced the rear valence (and corners) but didn't touch the rear cross member. I know. Then again, nothing is hard to believe with these guys any more.

 On their site it says "Quarter extensions patched" and they obviously weren't - unless they are talking about that little flat piece of metal holding on to the quarter. Who knows what they did, but it's horrible. It's a thin pc of scrap metal welded (very sloppy) to the other panels. It's disgusting.

 In their pictures it appears that the car was put on a rotisserie and (mostly ) stripped to bare metal. Why go through all that effort only to cover everything with Por-15 and then undercoating without actually fixing the rust? You're asking me a question that I've asked (along with everyone that's SEEN the car) a million times. There's NO EXCUSE for what they covered up.

 You can see them sanding the Bondo in the rear wheelhouse in one of the pics. You may also want to really check out your tail panel thoroughly - around the lights and the passenger side trunk lip. The tail panel has been replaced.. They did a crap job installing it, but that'll be straightened out when the quarters go on.

I'd say the pictures are intentionally deceptive - just like HLPAG. Anything you can do to expose these guys is great for anyone else looking for a car. That's exactly my plan.. I would hate to see anyone else get shafted from these crooks. At this point I think I'd rather post a link to this thread on other forums, it'd take too long to drag all of this information to other sites.


Troy

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jb666
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« Reply #54 on: November 16, 2008, 06:34:44 PM »

I got to talking to a buddy of mine today.. We were talking about web crooks, and how they are everywhere.. Well, he brought up how a friend of his bought an old Mopar from a guy in Chicago.. The guy selling the car told him the car was "mint" inside and out. It was around $6k.

His friend took delivery of the car and it was an absolute TOILET. It was a rotted mess that needed a full restoration..

He tried to reason with the guy and asked him to refund his $$. The guy WOULD NOT give him his $$ back, so he told him he'd "be sorry"..

Well, this person sent some bad people over to this guy's shop to try to "convince him" to refund the $$ to the buyer. Later on , the seller appeared with the $$ (for the car AND transportation) and asked to please "get the guys you sent to my shop off my back". He said "Oh I will, in time...."

The irony of this story?? The seller's name was Hans... I almost dropped dead when I heard who it was.. Our very own HLPAG friend..  Amazing what a small world it is some times, huh?

Ok, back to the regularly scheduled program.  popcrn
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jb666
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« Reply #55 on: November 16, 2008, 06:35:41 PM »


At this point, I'd like to ask a favor of you. If you (or anyone else here) are members of these forums, would you post a link to this thread? It would take far too long to drag all of this info to other forums.. I'd rather post links so they can see all of the details/replies.

Thanks  cheers cheers
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Hemidoug
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« Reply #56 on: November 16, 2008, 08:09:03 PM »

You better hope that who ever put that Hemi together knows what they are doing.....that doesn't go together like a wedge......lots can and DOES go wrong with Hemis.

Mopar Performance put it together, fortunately Burger King Auto didn't touch it except to put the motor in place and drop the carb on..



If MP put that thing together....you have more problems then you think. Take it from me...the MP motors are time bombs. I'd find a GOOD Hemi builder and at least do a teardown and inspection....I lost a motor this year to MP quality control...it sucks.
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« Reply #57 on: November 17, 2008, 09:19:35 AM »

My 472 crate Hemi had to be rebuilt too. I bought it in Feb. 06. If you go to cuda-challenger.com you can read all about it.
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jb666
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« Reply #58 on: November 17, 2008, 09:24:55 AM »

My 472 crate Hemi had to be rebuilt too. I bought it in Feb. 06. If you go to cuda-challenger.com you can read all about it.

Wow!!  Shocked , that is unreal..

Now my premise for buying this car in the first place is being questioned.. I assumed the drivetrain was rock solid because it was all new...  I've already talked to the shop owner about checking the motor out.

Thanks  cheers cheers
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skip68
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« Reply #59 on: November 17, 2008, 09:41:44 AM »

I'd make a small video and put it on youtube and then tell those idiots to look at what you did. Make sure you only show the facts to avoid slander. Then you'll get one or two members here a day to call them from all over and say they saw the bad work on youtube or this site and ask is that normal.   icon_smile_cool See if that gets their attention.  yesnod  I'd call.... 2thumbs   Chuck..............................
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skip68, A.K.A. Chuck \ 68 Charger 440 auto\ 67 Camaro RS (no 440)       FRANKS & BEANS !!!

jb666
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« Reply #60 on: November 17, 2008, 09:47:34 AM »

I'd make a small video and put it on youtube and then tell those idiots to look at what you did. Make sure you only show the facts to avoid slander. Then get one or two members here a day to call them from all over and say they saw the bad work on youtube and ask is that normal and see if that gets their attention.  yesnod  I'd call.... 2thumbs   Chuck..............................

Good idea, Chuck. Enough people calling/emailing might wake them up. What I'm staying away from is posting things that are not facts (things that can't be backed up). I'm not out to slam a business that MAY NOT have done something wrong, I'm here to show what they DID wrong.

I've gotten a couple of messages from people stating how I was "in a rush" and "got what I deserved for not checking it out".

Yes, I was in a rush.. I drove 10 hours with the wife and my daughter to pick this car up. It was a holiday weekend and every place was closed in the area. That's no excuse, because I could have planned my trip a little better, but truth be told, I couldn't wait to get down there and take this car home.. I had already (more or less) made up my mind, and anyone that knows me knows that once this happens, nothing will turn me away. I'm very determined.

I could have and SHOULD HAVE handled this different, and believe me, I will not do something like this again without thinking it through.

Now that the nitty gritty is out of the way, I'd like to move forward. The shop doing this work for me specializes in work like this and does AMAZING work. I am not selling any unborn children to pay for this work, primarily due to the fact that it's "off season" and I brought my car in at the right time..  I am happy this work is being done, and once it's done, this car will live a happy life..

Thanks for all of your comments, guys, I am not discarding anything written here.
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68charger383
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« Reply #61 on: November 17, 2008, 10:00:28 AM »

If they sell parts on ebay, you could buy something from them and leave a feedback statement telling anyone thinking about dealing with this shop to contact you for a photo presentation on your restoration. 
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jb666
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« Reply #62 on: November 17, 2008, 10:02:34 AM »

If they sell parts on ebay, you could buy something from them and leave a feedback statement telling anyone thinking about dealing with this shop to contact you for a photo presentation on your restoration. 

Oh, I've been watching.. So far, nothing but cars, but I'll keep my eyes open. 
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skip68
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« Reply #63 on: November 17, 2008, 10:03:07 AM »

You should sell copies of the youtube video on ebay next to their ads.  smilielol 2thumbs
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skip68, A.K.A. Chuck \ 68 Charger 440 auto\ 67 Camaro RS (no 440)       FRANKS & BEANS !!!

hemi68charger
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« Reply #64 on: November 17, 2008, 10:08:34 AM »

I used to live about a 1/4 mile from them.. Now about 8.......

Man, sorry for the bad news.. When I went over there once, there were some pretty rotted up 2nd generation carcasses...

Troy
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Troy
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jb666
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« Reply #65 on: November 17, 2008, 10:13:46 AM »

I used to live about a 1/4 mile from them.. Now about 8.......

Man, sorry for the bad news.. When I went over there once, there were some pretty rotted up 2nd generation carcasses...

Troy

What's odd is when I first started "looking" at this car (here), I had someone in that area drive by and was told it was a "respectable shop".  lol

Odd thing is (much like HLPAG I suppose) is they have a 100% EBay rating and I can't find (UNLIKE HLPAG) any bad publicity about them on the web.

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skip68
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« Reply #66 on: November 17, 2008, 10:23:22 AM »

One thing to keep in mind is what you have.  yesnod  And you will know what you have when it's done.  yesnod  I know it's alot of money but I think in the end you will be very pleased.  Try not to let this leave a bad taste in your mouth as it may in your wallet right now.  DON'T have buyers remorse.  You've still got a cool car.   drool5   2thumbs   Chuck................
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skip68, A.K.A. Chuck \ 68 Charger 440 auto\ 67 Camaro RS (no 440)       FRANKS & BEANS !!!

jb666
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« Reply #67 on: November 17, 2008, 10:29:35 AM »

One thing to keep in mind is what you have.  yesnod  And you will know what you have when it's done.  yesnod  I know it's alot of money but I think in the end you will be very pleased.  Try not to let this leave a bad taste in your mouth as it may in your wallet right now.  DON'T have buyers remorse.  You've still got a cool car.   drool5   2thumbs   Chuck................

Oh believe me, I have no buyer's remorse.. I still would have taken the car, I think I would have been more inclined to negotiate a bit had these issues been brought to light.  I love the car and am VERY optimistic about it's outcome. I know it'll be done right and will be as good (if not better) then new by the time it's done..

Thanks  2thumbs 2thumbs
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hemi68charger
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« Reply #68 on: November 17, 2008, 10:30:03 AM »

I used to live about a 1/4 mile from them.. Now about 8.......

Man, sorry for the bad news.. When I went over there once, there were some pretty rotted up 2nd generation carcasses...

Troy

What's odd is when I first started "looking" at this car (here), I had someone in that area drive by and was told it was a "respectable shop".  lol

Odd thing is (much like HLPAG I suppose) is they have a 100% EBay rating and I can't find (UNLIKE HLPAG) any bad publicity about them on the web.



I may have been the very person that told you that.. Maybe not... I've seen some of their work in progress. Albeit, it's nothing I would have ever spent money on, they seemed to be on the up and up....... Didn't follow them enough to develop a history to see any outcome of their work... But, I guess we see something now..

T
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Troy
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jb666
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« Reply #69 on: November 17, 2008, 10:32:41 AM »

I used to live about a 1/4 mile from them.. Now about 8.......

Man, sorry for the bad news.. When I went over there once, there were some pretty rotted up 2nd generation carcasses...

Troy

What's odd is when I first started "looking" at this car (here), I had someone in that area drive by and was told it was a "respectable shop".  lol

Odd thing is (much like HLPAG I suppose) is they have a 100% EBay rating and I can't find (UNLIKE HLPAG) any bad publicity about them on the web.



I may have been the very person that told you that.. Maybe not... I've seen some of their work in progress. Albeit, it's nothing I would have ever spent money on, they seemed to be on the up and up....... Didn't follow them enough to develop a history to see any outcome of their work... But, I guess we see something now..

T

Don't take that as me looking for someone to blame, here.. I know well enough to look in the mirror if I want that  slap
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hemi68charger
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Winged Duo..


« Reply #70 on: November 17, 2008, 10:54:49 AM »

I used to live about a 1/4 mile from them.. Now about 8.......

Man, sorry for the bad news.. When I went over there once, there were some pretty rotted up 2nd generation carcasses...

Troy

What's odd is when I first started "looking" at this car (here), I had someone in that area drive by and was told it was a "respectable shop".  lol

Odd thing is (much like HLPAG I suppose) is they have a 100% EBay rating and I can't find (UNLIKE HLPAG) any bad publicity about them on the web.



I may have been the very person that told you that.. Maybe not... I've seen some of their work in progress. Albeit, it's nothing I would have ever spent money on, they seemed to be on the up and up....... Didn't follow them enough to develop a history to see any outcome of their work... But, I guess we see something now..

T

Don't take that as me looking for someone to blame, here.. I know well enough to look in the mirror if I want that  slap

Cool,, I didn't think you were, I just hate the feeling if it was me that lead you to this person...  2thumbs
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Troy
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'69 Charger Daytona 440 auto 4.10 Dana ( now 426 HEMI )
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« Reply #71 on: November 17, 2008, 11:36:59 AM »

I haven't read the thread, just one or two posts, so forgive me if I miss some of the finer points.

Someone thought I should see whats being said in this thread in case I should want to make an argument. I don't think it is worth getting too involved in whats going on here, so I'll just say this and then leave it be.

Has anyone been to our shop and seen what we do? Do you judge by the best someone can do or the worst? I don't think there is a question that we can do quality work. for over a decade we have built cars for collectors, museums and everything in between from $20,000 up to $250,000. what you can afford, is what you can afford. We have a very good reputation, with only 3 compaints in 10 years, (four now counting this one). Every single one has come down to one thing: a customer who wants more than they can afford.

Point 1) This was not a 'restoration', it is a General Lee. I try to make it as plain as I can that movie cars do not get 'restored'. that's not up to me, its because the majority customers cannot afford it, and I personally would advise against it. It is a completely separate business from our restorations and is done in a completely different way. Movie cars typically sell in the $20-$40k range. Doesn't leave alot of room for restoration.

Point 2) What did we get paid for this car? Lets get out the receipts and put this nonsense to bed. $25,000. $25,000 covered the cost of the car to start with, all of the interior and exterior parts, everything but the driveline, body and standard paintwork. Starts to look alittle skimpy now doesn't it. The car was rotisserie blasted for gods sake, that's a $15,000 addition to any real restoration. the extra money that was spent? over $20,000 was PARTS ALONE. Send me a $20,000 engine, it doesn't get your car sanded. I don't car what you spend on parts, that doesn't pay a dollar of labor.

My meaning is this: Any quality shop can do the same job as another quality shop. there is no magic wand that makes things cheaper, unless the shop works for less. If they can afford it, that's great. Our business is not ran from my house, I have overhead and costs associated with being in the 4th largest city in the country. Parts cost what they cost, and I don't have illegal mexicans doing our work for $5 an hour either. most of our charges are $65 or $70 per hour. That's pretty par across the board with shops like mine. in fact, I tend to be alittle on the cheap side in comparison.

The movie cars are 'cheap' in comparison to anything else, just the way they are as dictated by the market base. They get employees that are less expensive, or new, or whatever it takes to make a car with a small budget. That doesn't mean you try to build a crap car, but it does mean I cant put $25,000 worth of metal work into a car that has a budget of $1500 for metal work. You do the math. You have to make choices on where its most important and where the time spent doesn't the most good for the finished product.

Now, this guy never set out to make a HEMI General, at least not that I was ever told. we talked for a long time back and forth because he wanted the cheapest General Lee I could build. Everyone else told him no. It was later, after I finally agreed that I could make a car for him at $10,000 less than everyone else was paying (because I had some new guys I could let break their teeth among other reasons) and had already started the work that he called to say a HEMI was showing up and would I put that in instead? And it all went to hell from there. He didn't know what he was getting in to, and couldn't afford it. Bottom line. we had already finished his body for the cheap car, there was no way to turn back and redo any of that. I forced him to build a better transmission, reinforce the body where it was still accessable and make what changes could be made to make sure the car wouldn't fall apart, and he fought me every step of the way.

Now, go ahead and judge, that's the fun part of see what someone else does. But at least you have a glimpse of the other side. This is a great target for people to jump at that either don't like businesses like mine or want to carve out a niche for themselves. But what I don't understand is how many of you can really afford to do a real six figure restoration? In real numbers its a very small percentage. When you get your car done somewhere and the guy makes it work for less, or saves you money, he is making choices to 'not do something', or do something less than perfect, or use a less expensive method, all in order to save you money and help your project get finished. I turn people away all the time because they cant afford it, and they get mad at me like I have done something wrong or insulted them. This job was taken back in '05 after I was phone badgered to death and gave in, then he changed everything without notice. I did the best I could with what HE COULD AFFORD. And it made a great looking car that ran like a raped ape and did everything a car should.

I've put in floors that were meant to be painted and spent thousands of dollars. I have put in floors for another customer for hundreds of dollars that are 100% as structurally sound as the former. Should I tell customer 'B" he is not allowed to have new floors put in his baby unless he spends like crazy and has me paint them as well? I think there is a line, but lets be careful where we draw it. Otherwise, alot of us would find ourselves getting turned away because we cant afford to build Chip Foose rides.

In this case, I regret ever getting sucked into this car. I thought I was doing some guy with a low budget a favor, and in the end the joke was on me, but with what I was given we made one hell of a car and I doubt anyone else could have done better given the same circumstances. I know the story. I know what we did and didn't, and I don't feel bad about one bit.

Thanks for the time,
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SFRT
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« Reply #72 on: November 17, 2008, 11:43:33 AM »

*prepares massive tub of popcorn*
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moparstuart
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« Reply #73 on: November 17, 2008, 11:50:31 AM »

 popcrn popcrn popcrn popcrn popcrn popcrn
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Hemidog
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« Reply #74 on: November 17, 2008, 11:52:58 AM »

popcrn popcrn popcrn popcrn popcrn popcrn
   yesnod popcrn
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