DodgeCharger.com Forum
December 12, 2019, 07:11:35 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Please remember: this is the place to discuss Chargers - NOT the place to discuss politics. Political posts will be locked or deleted at the Moderator's discretion.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Login Register Chat  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Charger 500 only comes with a Hemi.  (Read 4359 times)
1969chargerrtse
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6,642



« on: November 07, 2009, 06:59:11 AM »

I was bored last night and flipping through old brouchers I've had since 69 and I read how Dodge says the 500 only comes with a Hemi?


* chargerssk.jpg (101.57 KB, 634x763 - viewed 627 times.)
Logged
69_500
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9,068


WWW
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2009, 07:51:19 AM »

that was the original plan but they also realized that they would never sell 500 street HEMI cars so they began to offer the 440 in the car shortly after production started. I have a letter somewhere around here I think its out in the 500 still actually after the trip to Talladega that says they are going to offer the 440 in the car as well. Of the cars I have seen over the years the first 32 of them are all HEMI's before there is a 440 car even being built.
Logged
Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2009, 10:31:05 AM »

There was a 69 Charger ad run by Chrysler Canada that makes a similar statement but like Danny said, just pre-production press.
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
Dans 68
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3,810


Dad, Husband, and 2nd Gen Charger Owner


« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2009, 10:35:33 AM »

That tidbit is also somewhat mentioned in the Little Red Book in the '68 Charger section. I have attached the page paragraph that describes how after June '68 if you wanted a Hemi and a 4-speed then the car would come with a flush grill, exposed headlights and chrome windshield reveal moulding. Didn't happen for the '68's but interesting that it was thought about.

Dan


* Dans 68_1 Charger_03.JPG (102.46 KB, 600x505 - viewed 583 times.)
Logged

1973 SE 400 727  1 of 19,645                                        1968 383 4bbl 4spds  2 of 259
Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2009, 10:38:09 AM »

See, now that pisses me off.  Stuff that Chrysler prints in advance of production that has their stated intentions I fully understand but a book that is written years after the fact and is blatantly wrong is inexcusable and it isn't like it's the only example of that sort of thing either.
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
Dans 68
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3,810


Dad, Husband, and 2nd Gen Charger Owner


« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2009, 10:49:44 AM »

See, now that pisses me off.  Stuff that Chrysler prints in advance of production that has their stated intentions I fully understand but a book that is written years after the fact and is blatantly wrong is inexcusable and it isn't like it's the only example of that sort of thing either.

Agreed. Makes you want to brickwall your head.  rotz

Dan
Logged

1973 SE 400 727  1 of 19,645                                        1968 383 4bbl 4spds  2 of 259
Brock Samson
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 15,567


Scaring Ricers & Setting off Car Alarms since 1984


WWW
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2009, 11:26:51 AM »

note that pic also shows the recall wheels...  shruggy sometimes i guess things didn't work out as intended,.. the Daytona was gonna have a huge NASA scoop too...  yesnod
Logged

Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2009, 01:09:33 PM »

the Daytona was gonna have a huge NASA scoop too...  

I hadn't heard that before; any details?
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
nascarxx29
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11,648


« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2009, 10:15:55 PM »

If you ever seen the daytona anoucement brochure.As this is what you had to go by and order the car .without seeing it .There was changes made the hood with nasa ducts was one of them

Logged

1969 R4 Daytona XX29L9B410772
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23UOA174597
1970 FY1 Superbird RM23UOA166242
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23VOA179697
1968 426 Road Runner RM21J8A134509
1970 Coronet RT WS23UOA224126
1970 Daytona Clone XP29GOG178701
maxwellwedge
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5,821



« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2009, 10:21:01 PM »

What? Nasa is sending ducks into orbit now?
Logged
nascarxx29
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11,648


« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2009, 10:44:39 PM »

They didnt outright call them nasa ducts .They said aircraft type fresh air intakes on the hood



Logged

1969 R4 Daytona XX29L9B410772
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23UOA174597
1970 FY1 Superbird RM23UOA166242
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23VOA179697
1968 426 Road Runner RM21J8A134509
1970 Coronet RT WS23UOA224126
1970 Daytona Clone XP29GOG178701
nascarxx29
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11,648


« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2009, 10:59:29 PM »


Logged

1969 R4 Daytona XX29L9B410772
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23UOA174597
1970 FY1 Superbird RM23UOA166242
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23VOA179697
1968 426 Road Runner RM21J8A134509
1970 Coronet RT WS23UOA224126
1970 Daytona Clone XP29GOG178701
superbirdtom
Senior Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 732


« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2009, 01:56:53 AM »

theyre really called naca ducts but since nasa took over years ago   theyre reffered to as nasa ducts in some circles. National Advisory Comitte for Aeronautics N.A.C.A. Just a low drag air inlet that does not cause drag on a flat surface.
Logged
learical1
Senior Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 967

BFE (Metro Phoenix)


« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2009, 09:37:11 AM »

1.  As I heard the story, Dodge thought that, since the Charger 500 would be raced in NASCAR with a hemi, all 500 of them would have to be built with hemis.  NASCAR said Dodge need 500 hemis in any 1969 Dodge and 500 Charger 500's with any engine, so the hemi requirement was dropped.

2.  NACA ducts look the the scoop on an AAR Cuda, the 69 Shelby Mustangs had smaller versions of the scoop. 
Logged

Bruce
Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2009, 09:55:37 AM »

Personally I think the copywriter in that brochure when he wrote about "aircraft inspired hood and fender cooling vents" was talking about the scallops in the standard hood (and obviously the fender scoops of course).  I'm sure the writer of the brochure was just some lower level hack in the ad company who was given a photo and told to write something cool about the car in one paragraph.  I wouldn't be surprised to learn he had no other experience with Dodge or the Charger or cars and technical data in general.
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
learical1
Senior Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 967

BFE (Metro Phoenix)


« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2009, 10:15:47 AM »

http://aerowarriors.com/cda/cda_08_031769.html

http://aerowarriors.com/cda/cda_100969.html

No, they meant hood scoop.
Logged

Bruce
Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2009, 10:27:06 AM »

Hmmm, I'm inclined to believe we're both correct.  By the links it was obviously considered and tested in the wind tunnel for comparison with the cowl inlet favored in NASCAR.  I would still contend that the writer for that brochure would still have been nothing but a guy in the ad firm who never saw those two documents and was likely looking at the hood scallops.  I guess I base it mainly on the wording and the fact that it would be extremely unlikely for anyone within Chrysler (and especially engineering) to generate copy for a brochure.
Pure conjecture on my part of course, but it is what I believe.
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2009, 10:35:24 AM »

Then again, looking closely at the drawing in the brochure, there could be a NACA duct shaded in there where they were experimenting with it.
What was the release date for the brochure?
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
nascarxx29
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11,648


« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2009, 11:22:37 AM »

The brochure has recieved April 17 69 on it I believe
Logged

1969 R4 Daytona XX29L9B410772
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23UOA174597
1970 FY1 Superbird RM23UOA166242
1970 EV2 Superbird RM23VOA179697
1968 426 Road Runner RM21J8A134509
1970 Coronet RT WS23UOA224126
1970 Daytona Clone XP29GOG178701
Brock Samson
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 15,567


Scaring Ricers & Setting off Car Alarms since 1984


WWW
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2009, 11:33:20 AM »

 I seen a picture on the winged warriors site of the cobbled up NASA duct on the early engineering mock up, I belive it was the No. 22 car but you wing nuts,..  lol  would know better then me,.. maybe it was the Red No. 71 engineering mule.  shruggy even though it's my fav. all time car I don't have every parts no. and Vin # memorised...

 

 ok there's the pic...

 it's a Chrysler Engineering Wind tunnel test photo looks to about the size of the AAR scoop, and on a '69 style (wide spaced scallops) hood...

 for comparo purposes here's the Dan Gurney AARs' hood not quite the same being raised in plain view and not really a proper NACA duct..
 

an actual modern piece...
 
 it was of course eventually used..
 

 there is also mention of wider wheel openings to allow for wider tires,..
I'm sure the brochures' pic was done before an actual approved Daytona was built, notice the tiny little fender scoops or waste gates or whatever they're called..
 The really low wing in back...
 and yes, there is some kinda' small scoop in the center.
 And to point out that thay is not some low level "P.R. Hack" those are memos from Dodge engineering proper...
 I'm sure they had little time to tweak everything, the first press daytona was a quickly Modded street charger with a tunneled rear window and headlight lines made from tape... Why they didn't mod a 500 will probably never be known...

 unable to find that charger but I did find this....

 

 Please note the bottom pic!
 I have long wondered what the turbine engined charger looked like!  Cheesy
finding this really turns my crank!  drool5
 
 "Tom Golec, supervisor of car development recalls that low-volume tooling was ordered and approximately 500 Turbine Chargers were planned for the initial run. Mr. Golec points out that - a special no-slip clutch unit was developed for the '66 Turbine Charger, but was never used due to very high cost. Supposedly two '66 Turbine Chargers with the special clutch were built, but they were never shown to the - public. The Charger became a sporty Dodge with a conventional engine and slightly different trim (the Turbine job had a grille opening much like the 1970 Challenger)...the project was stillborn.

What killed the project? The mid- - sixties produced a variety of rumblings out of Washington. Insurance - companies clamped down on supercars, safety laws were written and smog laws took effect. Once the Clean Air Act - became reality. it specified control of NOX emissions and. according to - George Huebner, it was not known at that time if the turbine would meet future NOX requirements. The first direct result was to shelve the '66 Turbine Charger. The government was now in the car-making business and Chrysler was out of the turbine car business-at least on any mass scale. Regulations on conventional engines took on very high priorities, and though a sixth-generation engine was developed to meet NOX standards. Little was done with it-engineers were largely occupied with the emissions problems of piston engines."

 from... http://www.turbinecar.com/sia/sia57.htm
 these turbine engined '66s are my personal holy grail...
sorry for the hijack..
 Now,.. what if the '69 Daytona was turbine powered?..  scratchchin and had a NACA Duct?.,.
Logged

Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #20 on: November 08, 2009, 12:09:53 PM »

The brochure has recieved April 17 69 on it I believe

About a month after the product planning memo but several months ahead of the hood scoop wind tunnel test memo.
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
learical1
Senior Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 967

BFE (Metro Phoenix)


« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2009, 05:11:24 PM »

Ghoste, I wasn't meaning to argue with you, I just meant that when the PR guy wrote the blurb to go with the illustration, he was probably told to include the hood scoop in case the final product wound up having one.  I'm sure Dodge didn't want Ford whining to NASCAR that "the brochure don't say nothin' about having a hood scoop."
Logged

Bruce
Ghoste
Old Timer
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 40,795



« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2009, 05:39:24 PM »

Oh no, I wasn't seeing it as an argument and I wasn't trying to be difficult either.  I just tend to question things.  There seems to be so much folklore that turns into fact surrounding old cars generally and especially Mopars that I'm always lloking for proof.  It's just a learning process is all.  cheers
Logged

Support the Charger registries at

http://www.1966-67chargerregistry.com/

to submit info to the 69 registry, pm me

http://1970chargerregistry.com/
http://www.71chargerrtregistry.com/
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.062 seconds with 17 queries.