Fuel type and cost, what do you use?

[b5blue]

  Just filled up at WaWa's, 93OCT at 3.79per and wondering what you use? I'm trying normal 10% ethanol mix after a few years of 89OCT non ethanol with my lower compression 440 that was swapped out recently. Itching to drive I let it sit for a full week to test fuel just sitting.

[b5blue]

Well it can sit for 3 days and starts with just a wee bit of hesitation. 

[DownZero]

I use the non ethanol. Sometimes I mix a little av gas if I'm feeling frioggy.

[426HemiChick]

I use the non ethanol. Sometimes I mix a little av gas if I'm feeling frioggy.

I have known several people that have run 100 LL Avgas in their pre no-lead cars.

Back in the late 60's we ran our 68 Hemi RR and 69 Dodge 440 Six-Pack on Sunoco 260 pump gas. Think we were paying about $0.36.9 / gal back then.

It was still available in 1978 but know nothing about it after that.

Have fun.

HC

[Kern Dog]

Back in the late 60's we ran our 68 Hemi RR and 69 Dodge 440 Six-Pack on Sunoco 260 pump gas.

Ah, back when MEN were MEN and women were women...The good old days.
Regarding the original topic, it is interesting how one can do everything right and have a car that knocks while in other instances, you can do a lot of things wrong and it runs fine.
When I built my first stroked 440, Hensely Performance guys said it would run fine on pump gas. It didn't.
In California, the best we get at the pump is 91 octane with "up to 10% ethanol".
The 440/493 was at 10.8 to 1. It knocked at anything over 1/2 throttle even with the timing limited to 31 degrees. I tried slowing the advance curve, tried 2 different bigger cams but the only thing that helped was higher octane gas. I was able to get 100, 104 and 110 octane gas in 5 gallon pails at the local NAPA store. It barely knocked on the 104 but the 110 totally eliminated it. I chose to change to thicker head gaskets to lower the compression to 10.17 to 1.
From there, it ran fine on 91. Years later the cam lost a few lobes so I pulled the engine and used this as an excuse to go through it all. I replaced the pistons with a set of ICON dished ones from the 440 Source. I'm now at 9.8 to 1 and can run 89 octane without knocking. I have not tried 87.

[496polara]

Thankfully non ethanol 93 and 89 are available at multiple stations within 5 miles from me. All three carb'd cars get this and the lawnmower too.
I have an 01 mustang gt that gets driven so infrequently it gets non ethanol too.

[426HemiChick]

15 Sep 25

If I remember correctly, if you order a new Dual fuel (E85, a flex fuel made from a blend of 51–83% ethanol and gasoline) car, it will come with a stainless steel fuel system. It'll run fine on 85 % alcohol to 100 % gasoline. You just don't have to worry about rust in the fuel system. Remember, alcohol attracts water. Also when running E85 fuel, milage and power are low compared to pure gasoline.

These vehicles are getting difficult to come by; not many people want them.

It's an expensive option but worth it in my opinion.

FKD

[Kern Dog]

You have your opinion, SIR but it sure seems like those of us that still have classic cars do encounter people that want to buy them.

[held1823]

Just curious, and nothing to do with the actual topic.

Someone seems to think of himself as "manly" yet he obviously feels threatened by something that has zero bearing on him. It doesn't affect his own life in any way whatsoever, other than he can't seem to get it out of his head. I'm just curious if it makes him feel better to make himself look small to everyone else...

[b5blue]

Yup

[426HemiChick]

16 Sep 25

Just for the record, we still have our 68 Hemi RR and 69 Six-Pack Super Bee with 4405 and 2681 miles respectively on their clocks .... and two Mustangs, an 87 Police Stang and a 2024 Mustang Dark Horse bought new. The 87 has 00003.1 miles on the clock and the 2024 has about 7K + a few. We do drive it .... to the grocery store.

We sold our 69 Hemi Daytona in 2020 and our 70 Hemi Cuda 4 Spd around 74 - 75. A year or so later a friend saw it in a wrecking yard rolled up in a ball. Have no idea what happened to the driver; hope he was't still in it.

We do have three other vehicles, two of which we still use.

Does the above qualify us to post here?

HC

[Kern Dog]

Those are great manly cars. Owning and driving them is what men do.    Cheers to you, SIR.

[Kern Dog]

Just curious, and nothing to do with the actual topic.

Someone seems to think of himself as "manly" yet he obviously feels threatened by something that has zero bearing on him. It doesn't affect his own life in any way whatsoever, other than he can't seem to get it out of his head. I'm just curious if it makes him feel better to make himself look small to everyone else...

You misunderstood. I remember the Hemi Dude had a thread here where he had a couple of classics in his garage and couldn't figure out how to open the garage door to get pictures of them. As a car guy, it seemed strange to own two desirable classics but have no ability to open a door to get a look at them. Awhile later, he did get the door open and snapped some pictures. His cars were cool and certainly worth owning. It was revealed at that time that he was a former member here with a different screen name. Somewhere between the old screen name and the new one, he decided to start pretending that he was a woman. This is deception and should not be tolerated. Do you like people lying to you?
If you are confused about this, imagine the life of a person that uses the name "Hemi chick" while being an 85 year old man. Those that go along with delusional thinking are doing no one any favors.
He is a man that pretends to be a "Hemi Chick".
I treat him for what he really is, a  man.

[held1823]

Just curious, and nothing to do with the actual topic.

Someone seems to think of himself as "manly" yet he obviously feels threatened by something that has zero bearing on him. It doesn't affect his own life in any way whatsoever, other than he can't seem to get it out of his head. I'm just curious if it makes him feel better to make himself look small to everyone else...

If you are confused about this, imagine the life of a person that uses the name "Hemi chick" while being an 85 year old man. Those that go along with delusional thinking are doing no one any favors.
He is a man that pretends to be a "Hemi Chick".
I treat him for what he really is, a  man.

I'm not confused about anything. One is a decent human being, and one isn't

[Kern Dog]

Pacifying delusional people is not being decent, it is promoting insanity.
Enabling a addict is just as bad.
"Identifying as" means "pretending to be".
Defending his actions really speaks volumes about you and others like you.
Now, I never started the fire here, I just treated him like a man. I did that because he is a man.

[John_Kunkel]

It was revealed at that time that he was a former member here with a different screen name. Somewhere between the old screen name and the new one, he decided to start pretending that he was a woman.

Revealed by who and verified y who?

[Kern Dog]

Late model engines have the advantage of computer controls that allow them to have higher compression ratios while running fine on the available fuels.
I was too young to drive a late 70s car when they were new but if the stories told are true, event the cars with low compression sometimes detonated on regular fuel. There were 400s and 440s with 7.8 and 8.2 to 1 compression. I've torn down 440s that calculated in the mid 7s! The 5.7 Hemis in later model trucks are around 10.5 to 1 and they run on 87 octane fuel, though in parentheses, they state (89 recommended)
I sure don't know it all so I take advice from those with more experience. I read that with quench, you have greater resistance to detonation at higher compression ratios. The factories proved this. Closed chambered heads help with that. Flat top pistons like this:



Are great for increased compression but quench/dished pistons like this...



are even better. Again, I'm no expert but I'm told that during the compression stroke, the flat portion of the piston causes the air/fuel mixture to swirl and move toward the dished area where the spark then ignites it. The swirl and movement cools the mixture and makes for a better burn.
I went with the dished pistons in 2022 and have had absolutely no detonation issues since.

[Kern Dog]

It was revealed at that time that he was a former member here with a different screen name. Somewhere between the old screen name and the new one, he decided to start pretending that he was a woman.

Revealed by who and verified y who?

I guess if I were inclined, I could dig way back and find the thread if it still exists. It may have been locked and deleted. It may have been heavily edited.
Please know that I have no issue with gay people. I have them in my family and I love them as I do everyone else.
I do have a big problem with lies and deception. Everyone should.

Here is something for you:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,135489.550.html

Scroll to the bottom of the last page.

[held1823]

Just curious, and nothing to do with the actual topic.

Someone seems to think of himself as "manly" yet he obviously feels threatened by something that has zero bearing on him. It doesn't affect his own life in any way whatsoever, other than he can't seem to get it out of his head. I'm just curious if it makes him feel better to make himself look small to everyone else...

You misunderstood. I remember the Hemi Dude had a thread here where he had a couple of classics in his garage and couldn't figure out how to open the garage door to get pictures of them. As a car guy, it seemed strange to own two desirable classics but have no ability to open a door to get a look at them. Awhile later, he did get the door open and snapped some pictures. His cars were cool and certainly worth owning. It was revealed at that time that he was a former member here with a different screen name. Somewhere between the old screen name and the new one, he decided to start pretending that he was a woman. This is deception and should not be tolerated. Do you like people lying to you?
If you are confused about this, imagine the life of a person that uses the name "Hemi chick" while being an 85 year old man. Those that go along with delusional thinking are doing no one any favors.
He is a man that pretends to be a "Hemi Chick".
I treat him for what he really is, a  man.

Where to start.

I very well remember the first post; it was made on the thread for my car, and it used the same name that is seen here.

The garage door issue was a bit more involved than just "opening the door". The hardware had failed, and no one, not even your alpha male self, would risk damaging any of the three valuable cars inside that two car garage without properly assessing the situation, let alone doing so at eighty years old.

There was no deception. A car that rare was remembered by long time fans, and never once did the owner pretend to not have been the owner all along. I don't feel compelled to "imagine the life" of anyone, but it's odd that you are so hung up on it. Last I knew, they didn't owe anyone an explanation nor do they have to live their life to fit your narrow mindedness.

"going along with it does no one any favors". That's fine, as no one but you is looking for anything. No one asks us to approve of how anyone else lives their life, but no one asked for your asinine commentary, either. It has ZERO impact on anyone here. Showing your ass about it does nothing but reflect on you. Your user name is "dog"- Do you see anyone bitching about you identifying as a dog?

Ironically, you mentioned posts being edited, when your original reply here was also edited. The original text is still in the quoted part of my reply above. I'm pretty sure you had been banned from here once before, but that might have been from a different site. Hopefully when one of the moderators comes along, you're gone again. Any positive impact you make here is undone by the pettiness, hatred, and bigotry that you spew.

[Kern Dog]

I never showed "my ass" despite your obvious desire to see it.
I only edited down the commentary from the Hemi guy only for the sake of concentrating on what pertained to my point. The words written were the words he wrote. I did not rework the context or the structure other than scaling it back.
Nobody on the forum needed to know what gender the man was but he was compelled to push his fantasy on others with the hope that they would accept or congratulate him for it. Oddly, those like you actually have by going along with the deception that he himself admitted to doing. If he were to simply have a "426 Hemi Fan" name or something unrelated to his pretend gender, it would have gone unnoticed and nobody would have cared. If he were to simple post comments with no reference to gender at all, he would have been just another member but there lies a common problem with "that" type of person. They want validation for their fantasy. I'm not one to support that sort of thing. If I saw the guy in a dress out in public, I'd shrug my shoulders and walk on my way but if he tried to get me to call him ma'am or to say he is a woman, fuck off...it will not happen.
You think that I am rude. That is fine. I am not wrong though. I did not lie, I did not make false statements either.
Honest truth disturbs some people.

[held1823]

Here's the point.

No one asked us to call them anything, respect anything, or reply to anything.
No one asked us for congratualtions, acceptance, or even understanding.
No one asked us for validation, nor asked us to even care.
No one asked us to rethink our personal views or opinions.
No one but you seems to have thought otherwise.
Scroll on by the things that bother you.
It's just that simple.
It's just that easy.

[Kern Dog]

Do you remember the slogan If you see something, SAY something?
I do.
I do also remember the Live and let live sentiment. If he were to have not used a false gender reference, I'd have never noticed anything unusual about him.
You mention what is simple, how about this?
Tell the truth or tell nothing.
Tell no lies. THAT is the truth and that is simple.

[LaOtto70Charger]

Kern dog.  If you see something say something would be us calling you out for being a bully. Not you calling out someone for having a screen name you disagree with. Live and let live would be you not mentioning anything about it and going out of your way to target someone.

[held1823]

Kern dog.  If you see something say something would be us calling you out for being a bully. Not you calling out someone for having a screen name you disagree with. Live and let live would be you not mentioning anything about it and going out of your way to target someone.

BINGO

not for nothing, "if you see something, say something" originated with Homeland Security in response to 9-11.
It's a bit dramatic to apply it as justification for bigotry
 

[Kern Dog]

Kern dog.  If you see something say something would be us calling you out for being a bully.

That is one way to look at it.
Another would be to see a lie being told and to call it out. It isn't being a bully to see a lie being told and root it out. This shows a sad lack of integrity to see people tolerate it.
To see so many people either defend a lie or to stay silent and go along with it is very disappointing.

Regarding gasoline, as I have tried to point out until held1823 kept interrupting, can be a tricky thing.
Rick Ehrenberg from Mopar Action magazine has written that the octane number on gas that has ethanol in it is often a higher octane than is listed on the label. I'd like to see a test on that. he may be right but I just don't know.
We gad 92 octane unleaded until the late 90s or early 2000s when it was scaled back to 91. They used an oxygenate called MTBE to reduce smog, that was found to pollute groundwater so they phased in ethanol. The red car is the only one that with which I have had detonation problems. I was told that detonation leaves ice pick type marks in the pistons but when I pulled the heads to slip in thicker head gaskets, the pistons looked great.
I swore I heard it knocking but there was no traditional evidence of it.



I was pulling my hair out trying to stop the knocking....so desperate I posted on several forums asking for help. That was 10-12 years ago.

[Kern Dog]

Back when I was trying the different octane fuels to stop the knocking, the 110 stuff I had was leaded.
I didn't use it all in the car since I had installed an air/fuel gauge with an oxygen sensor. I only ran a little of the leaded gas to see if it made a difference.
I ran the rest of the 110 through my lawnmower. Mowing the yard was great! It smelled like 1977 all over again....me as a little kid mowing lawns to earn money to buy parts for my bike, stuff I broke by jumping the bike in the big field behind the house.
It is interesting how the sense of smell can bring back a memory.
You smell eggs cooking and mixed with an aroma of sausage and pancakes in the air, you think back about grandmas house during a weekend stayover. Maybe you smell a perfume and think of some woman you used to know.

[Kern Dog]

Who has seen a Mopar with a propane or natural gas conversion?
A few years back a light blue early 70s Charger, Coronet or Satellite made the rounds at the car shows out west. It had cylinder tanks in the trunk in a way that looked home made.
I remember a buddy bough a propane converted mid 70s Camaro in the late 80s. From what I remember, propane engines don't get carboned up like poorly tuned gasoline engines do.
There is a dude that brings his electric Charger to two of the weekend cars and coffee events here. Nobody seems to show interest in the car but the guy keeps showing up, hoping....

[Mike DC]

                                   
                     
As for screen names, I didn't think much about the 'HemiChick' name when I saw it.  It's the internet.  Don't go on web forums if you cannot handle talking to 'Rush Limbaugh' and '69ChevelleSS' and 'deeznuts' and 'Assclown1776'.

Gender?  I dunno.  Is that a man or woman on that account?  LGBTQ?  Is it multiple people (a couple?) who post with the same screen name?  Is it a man's account who named it after his wife?  Or maybe it's named after the dog in the pic? 

Whatever.  I didn't feel a pressing need for an explanation.  Still don't. 

What gender is 'deeznuts?'

What gender is '69ChevelleSS'?

----------------------------


Gasoline: 

Of course I dislike ethanol but it's pretty hard to avoid in the midwest.  Especially on road trips.  I usually just roll with what's available. 

For my lawnmower/etc I tend to get lazy and buy the overpriced cans these days.  (Sometimes I mix that stuff with pump gasoline.)  94 octane + no ethanol or lead + stabilizers for storage.  The upside is that the lawn machines start on the first pull and they seem to work for a few years without attention.   


Compression ratios -
I never got the appeal of running barely-safe ratios on a street engine.  If the car can't handle being revved hard on a hot day . . . Umm, isn't that the main thing you do with it?  You probably don't drive it in the fall/winter.  You didn't put that hot cam & headers & low gears in it so you could baby it. 


The gen-2 Hemi heads had big combustion chambers because they were open chamber + big bore + Hemi.  The G3 Hemi heads have those big 'quench pads' added beside the valves to bring down the combustion chamber size. 

I have wondered why there aren't aftermarket G2 Hemi heads with that feature.  I'm not an engine expert but it seems to me like that might be a good idea (when paired with appropriate custom pistons).

G3 Hemi combustion chamber:


   

[Kern Dog]

For all of the doom and gloom that was said about ethanol, the only problem that I have had with it is that the rubber fuel lines do go bad faster. The cars always seem to run fine on it.

[John_Kunkel]

Your user name is "dog"- Do you see anyone bitching about you identifying as a dog?

 

Any positive impact you make here is undone by the pettiness, hatred, and bigotry that you spew.

 

[b5blue]

I just don't read anything he posts. He is intent on bickering to the point of destroying topics and there by making "search" useless. Ignore him and maybe he will go away.

[426HemiChick]

17 Sep 25

Does Terminal Cancer go away?

HC

[Kern Dog]

17 Sep 25

Does Terminal Cancer go away?

HC

Allowing insanity to run unchecked is just as bad as ignoring a disease and letting it kill you.
Last week's events shows us what terrible outcomes one can expect when delusional thinking runs amok.
The majority of the mass shootings of late trace back to sexually confused people. The media won't dig deep on it because they are part of the problem.

[426HemiChick]

17 Sep 25

Just filled up at WaWa's, 93OCT at 3.79per and wondering what you use? I'm trying normal 10% ethanol mix after a few years of 89OCT non ethanol with my lower compression 440 that was swapped out recently. Itching to drive I let it sit for a full week to test fuel just sitting.

Your $3.79 for 93 Oct looks good compared to our $3.99.9 for the lowest grade. Sadly, most of the fuel sold in Arizona comes from the state of CA.

HC

[John_Kunkel]

17 Sep 25

Does Terminal Cancer go away?

HC

Allowing insanity to run unchecked is just as bad as ignoring a disease and letting it kill you.
Last week's events shows us what terrible outcomes one can expect when delusional thinking runs amok.
The majority of the mass shootings of late trace back to sexually confused people. The media won't dig deep on it because they are part of the problem.

Atta boy, spout the party line like the trained parrot you are. 

[Kern Dog]

Was there any reference to any political party?
Since YOU mentioned it, WHO is pushing acceptance of violence against their opposition?
Did you know that one side is 6 times more likely to tolerate violence against their opposition than the other side is?
Care to spell out which side advocates for more violence than the other.
Here is a fact...
Dipshits on this forum fuck up more threads than I ever could. You idiots follow me around, quoting me and criticizing what you don't agree with which FUCKS UP THREADS far more than anything could.
The forum gets the most action when you idiots band together to criticize instead of actually commenting on automotive matters.
I try to start threads to get conversation going and despite my efforts, the old, the decrepit and the stupid want to glom onto something that I wrote that offends them. I don't care for that B5 Blue dude but the guy actually makes efforts to get conversations going. Lloyd does too in a smaller scale. What about the rest of you?
It is a fair guess that the critics are either too old to work on these cars anymore but you guys don't even try to keep the spirit alive here.
When was the last member that posted about actually doing something with his car?  TimmyCharger did a hood scoop and paint but who else besides he and I actually work on our cars?
I revived a thread from 2019 about the Hemi dude and the drama about his broken garage door saga....a $155 repair that had his cars stranded in a garage for 10 years and there was a mix of support and insults peppered in that thread.
A majority of the members that commented there don't come to this site anymore. Of the ones that do remain, we have maybe 10 good contributors and then there are the rest. One dude that thinks he is a woman,  another 80+ year old has been that can't spin a wrench but loves to follow me everywhere, Mike DC who I disagree with politically but is very smart with mechanical matters, Nacho, a friendly electrical guru and a few more that don't come to mind at the moment.
Why has this site faded so much while FBBO has increased it's membership? I know that Chargers are not the cheapest cars to buy and restore but if FBBO is doing so well, why is this site dying?
Maybe it is because over there, when members actually contribute, their critics are not allowed to run amok. If you chase away those that actually DO SOMETHING WITH THEIR CARS AND POST ABOUT IT, there is nothing to see on the forum.
A forum is only as good as the traffic it generates.
This topic was about fuel and I tried to comment on that, yet idiots like to muddy the waters.
Go back to post # 8 and think about what he wrote, then look back at what I wrote.
I never lied.