The NASCAR Thread

[Ponch ®]

I still have issues with the Judge waiting so long to pass any judgment, but I keep hearing that he saw more documentation than was released to the public.  So I guess we will have to wait and see what that documentation is.   And, I am sure that the additional documentation was supplied to NASCAR.  But, it's almost as if he waited until right before the Daytona 500 to release his judgment which I have a hard time accepting....the timing just looks all wrong.  If Kurt is guilty then he has no defense and I don't see many fans supporting him.   Kurt....perhaps you burned one too many bridges to ever be able to return.
 

"More likely than not", which is what the court said in regards to Busch, is not exactly a very high standard to meet and most courts are reluctant to dismiss a case once it has been met. It's pretty self explanatory - all that needs to be shown is that its more likely that it happened than it didn't, but it does not have to be certain.

So let's say there's a robbery. Witnesses say it was a tall guy in a black car wearing a white shirt that did it. You get stopped and arrested as a suspect because you're a tall guy, driving a black car and wearing a white t-shirt a few blocks down the street. You had nothing to do with it, but it's "more likely than not" than you did based on what the witnesses said. it doesn't mean you're guilty, it just means that (hypothetically) you'll go to trial and the jury will hear the rest of the evidence and determine that. (this is a very simplistic example that would probably not meet the standard, but you get the idea)

So, we don't know what the judge saw or heard, but as I said above, its not very hard to meet the "more likely than not" standard. It may or may not be much, but I guess it'll come out sooner or later. We do know its by "preponderance of the evidence" (which is bad for Busch), but you'd think the D.A. would have filed charges by now.

[JB400]

David Regan is going to replace Kyle in the 18.  Eric Jones will pilot the 54.

[hemi68charger]

...The penalty stems from activities last year involving Kurt Busch that resulted in a decision by the Family Court of the State of Delaware to issue an Order of Protection of Abuse against him. The penalty is an indefinite suspension. Earlier today, a three-person National Motorsports Appeals Panel upheld the original penalty assessed by NASCAR.

...remains in effect. He will not be allowed to race nor participate in any NASCAR activities until further notice.

Man, I don't condone this sort of behavoir at all........ BUT, the man hasn't been convicted, or charged, with anything thus far..... So, if he is exonerated, will that mean NASCAR will pay him back his salary and/or rebuild his reputation? I think people here get my point. I'm not his biggest fan, but I haven't loathed him......... Unless.............

[keith88]

Kurt bushes reputation has already been formed a long time ago and it probably part of the decision process.

[moparnation74]

Kurt bushes reputation has already been formed a long time ago and it probably part of the decision process.

He may not be convicted but that is between Kurt Busch and the state court.  Just Google his name and look at the drama listed on his Wikipedia profile   The evidence is clearly not in his favor.  I may be wrong but Nascar does not have to allow anyone to race it is a privilege and not a right.  Especially, when their rules are violated.  Image is everything today!

[Aero426]

I may be wrong but Nascar does not have to allow anyone to race it is a privilege and not a right.  

One hundred percent correct.     Kurt needs NASCAR a lot more than NASCAR needs him.    They don't owe him anything. 

[Ponch ®]

Man, I don't condone this sort of behavoir at all........ BUT, the man hasn't been convicted, or charged, with anything thus far..... So, if he is exonerated, will that mean NASCAR will pay him back his salary and/or rebuild his reputation? I think people here get my point. I'm not his biggest fan, but I haven't loathed him......... Unless.............

what the last two guys before me said. Technically he doesn't work for NASCAR, he works for SHR and is considered an independent contractor as far as NASCAR is concerned.. As long as NASCAR is following its due process (suspension, appeal, etc) there's really not much he can do against them. It's messed up, but that's long been a point of contention between drivers and NASCAR (that they are considered independent contractors). Even then, its not like they don't have a reasonable motive to suspend him - they're basing it on what the court determined. Like I said earlier, after the Rice fiasco no one is taking chances in what could become a PR nightmare.

[wingcar]

When you own the Bat and Ball....you get to make the rules....

One thing I like about NASCAR is that they don't allow their "players" (drivers, and others involved in the sport) to get away with drugs and bad behavior....perhaps the other "stick and ball" sports could learn something from NASCAR.  NASCAR is not perfect but at least the sport is not making news on a regular basis due to the players acting like 12 year olds.......

[Ponch ®]

When you own the Bat and Ball....you get to make the rules....

One thing I like about NASCAR is that they don't allow their "players" (drivers, and others involved in the sport) to get away with drugs and bad behavior

I think that's more out of necessity specific to the sport: you get a driver that's high on something on the track, and he could kill himself and a few other guys too. I guess the argument could be made that a hockey or football player could screw up and fatally injure another player, but that's a lot less likely?

perhaps the other "stick and ball" sports could learn something from NASCAR.  NASCAR is not perfect but at least the sport is not making news on a regular basis due to the players acting like 12 year olds.......

you think so?

Two words for you: Jeremy Mayfield

"Not making the news on a regular basis" is more of a reflection of the sport's perennial state as a niche sport that gets very little attention from the media relative to the "big four" (NFL/NBA/MLB/NHL) unless something really good or really bad happens (see: the Tony Stewart incident last year). I mean, the Busch situation would be a huge deal if he was a stick and ball guy...but it largely goes ignored by the media.

In other words, not enough people care to make a big deal out of it. But there have been NASCAR "thugs" and problem children since the beginning. Hell, the fact that it has its roots in moonshiners - the crack dealers of their day- is a source of pride for the sport.
-Junior Johnson did prison time,
-Richard Childress almost got shot running shine,
-Tim Richmond may or may not have knowingly infected someone with AIDS,
-the tragic Dick Trickle,
-Rick Hendrick was indicted by the Federal government for bribery and fraud and had to get a pardon from Bill Clinton.
-Not to mention the bunch of drivers in recent years who've been suspended or kicked out of NASCAR for drug use or been busted DUI.

Boy Scouts they aint, but you know what they say....if a tree falls in the forest and theres no one around...

[dyslexic teddybear]

When you own the Bat and Ball....you get to make the rules....

One thing I like about NASCAR is that they don't allow their "players" (drivers, and others involved in the sport) to get away with drugs and bad behavior

I think that's more out of necessity specific to the sport: you get a driver that's high on something on the track, and he could kill himself and a few other guys too. I guess the argument could be made that a hockey or football player could screw up and fatally injure another player, but that's a lot less likely?

perhaps the other "stick and ball" sports could learn something from NASCAR.  NASCAR is not perfect but at least the sport is not making news on a regular basis due to the players acting like 12 year olds.......

you think so?

Two words for you: Jeremy Mayfield

"Not making the news on a regular basis" is more of a reflection of the sport's perennial state as a niche sport that gets very little attention from the media relative to the "big four" (NFL/NBA/MLB/NHL) unless something really good or really bad happens (see: the Tony Stewart incident last year). I mean, the Busch situation would be a huge deal if he was a stick and ball guy...but it largely goes ignored by the media.

In other words, not enough people care to make a big deal out of it. But there have been NASCAR "thugs" and problem children since the beginning. Hell, the fact that it has its roots in moonshiners - the crack dealers of their day- is a source of pride for the sport.
-Junior Johnson did prison time,
-Richard Childress almost got shot running shine,
-Tim Richmond may or may not have knowingly infected someone with AIDS,
-the tragic Dick Trickle,
-Rick Hendrick was indicted by the Federal government for bribery and fraud and had to get a pardon from Bill Clinton.
-Not to mention the bunch of drivers in recent years who've been suspended or kicked out of NASCAR for drug use or been busted DUI.

Boy Scouts they aint, but you know what they say....if a tree falls in the forest and theres no one around...

Always wondered how much the pardon cost Hendricks.........

[JB400]

The truck and trailer carrying Travis Kvapil's car got stolen this morning

[RallyeMike]

But there have been NASCAR "thugs" and problem children since the beginning. Hell, the fact that it has its roots in moonshiners - the crack dealers of their day- is a source of pride for the sport.
-Junior Johnson did prison time,
-Richard Childress almost got shot running shine,
-Tim Richmond may or may not have knowingly infected someone with AIDS,
-the tragic Dick Trickle, -
Rick Hendrick was indicted by the Federal government for bribery and fraud and had to get a pardon from Bill Clinton.
-Not to mention the bunch of drivers in recent years who've been suspended or kicked out of NASCAR for drug use or been busted DUI.

Trickle is primarily known and remembered as an honest and hard working racer, especially considering what he overcame to be so successful. Though his demise post-Nascar is certainly tragic, I hate to see him thrown into a list where everyone else is noted for criminal activity (convicted or accused).


***

As far as Nascar's suspension of drivers for criminal activities or any other behaviour that is damaging to the reputation of the sport......... there are a 10 qualified and respected drivers ready to move up right now behind each one that gets suspended. Good for Nascar. This is one thing they are getting right.

[Ponch ®]

The truck and trailer carrying Travis Kvapil's car got stolen this morning

Maybe this Model NASCAR citizen knows where it is...

Trickle is primarily known and remembered as an honest and hard working racer, especially considering what he overcame to be so successful. Though his demise post-Nascar is certainly tragic, I hate to see him thrown into a list where everyone else is noted for criminal activity (convicted or accused).

That's fair.

I guess it still drives the point that NASCAR a) isnt without it's share of flawed/tragic individuals and b) that this is the type of stuff that should make the news but doesnt.

[TruckDriver]

Kvapil's No. 44 Team Xtreme Sprint Cup car stolen

Team Xtreme confirmed Friday that its No. 44 entry for this weekend's race at Atlanta Motor Speedway was stolen in the morning hours outside the team's hotel. Team withdraws from Atlanta race after truck, trailer taken overnight

http://www.nascar.com/en_us/news-media/articles/2015/2/27/team-xtreme-sprint-cup-car-stolen-travis-kvapil-atlanta.html

[JB400]

List of drivers who didn't get a chance to qualify for Atlanta race due to failure to pass inspection.  Most will start at the tail end:  Alex Bowman, Tony Stewart, Matt Kenseth, Gordon, Jeb Burton, Reed Sorenson, Cole Whitt, Landon Cassill, Regan Smith, Michael Annett, Jimmie Johnson, Mike Wallace and Matt DiBenedetto

Video of Kvapil's truck getting stolen:    http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nascar-from-the-marbles/watch--video-from-hotel-where-hauler-containing-travis-kvapil-s-car-was-223147732.html

[TruckDriver]

Stolen No. 44 race car found in suburban Atlanta

HAMPTON, Ga. (AP) -- Police say they have found the NASCAR race car stolen from a hotel parking lot near Atlanta Motor Speedway.

NASCAR's Team XTREME says the car was found early Saturday northwest of Atlanta in Gwinnett County. The team tweeted a pictured of team owner John Cohen standing in front of the No. 44 Chevrolet, which was valued at $250,000 and appears undamaged.

http://www.nascar.com/en_us/news-media/articles/2015/2/27/team-xtreme-sprint-cup-car-stolen-travis-kvapil-atlanta.html

[JB400]

Kurt's going to try and get reinstated:

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/kurt-busch-guidelines-toward-nascar-reinstatement-171637486--nascar.html;_ylt=A0LEVw4lUvVUTOkAwW5XNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEzaHFrNWg5BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDVklQMjg0XzEEc2VjA3Nj

[TruckDriver]

I'm sure he will, but the question is, once he is, how long with that last 

[Chargen69]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/prosecutors-no-charges-nascar-driver-kurt-busch-151845220--spt.html

[Ponch ®]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/prosecutors-no-charges-nascar-driver-kurt-busch-151845220--spt.html

I called it!

[nvrbdn]

wonder how long till nascar reacts? wish harvick would leave that loser team so I could root for him again.

[JB400]

They should reinstate him immediately and compensate him for his missed appearances in the 500 and at Atlanta.   But, they won't.

[Chargen69]

They should reinstate him immediately and compensate him for his missed appearances in the 500 and at Atlanta.   But, they won't.

[Ponch ®]

They should reinstate him immediately and compensate him for his missed appearances in the 500 and at Atlanta.   But, they won't.

Keep in mind that the protective order against him is still in effect, so he hasn't exactly been exonerated. As far as compensation for missed races/appearances..yeah...NO. NASCAR, to its credit, acted prudently and reasonably given the circumstances by suspending him for those races. What if the outcome had been the opposite and charges had been pressed? Would you feel the same way? NASCAR would have egg on its face if they'd let him keep racing in the meantime.
Again, think of it in terms of what if he was a stick and ball guy...the likely public opinion would be "well, he shouldn't have put himself in that situation in the first place..."

As far as reinstatement, that's not really going to be up to NASCAR as much as it will be up to his team, sponsors, and manufacturers.

[wingcar]

Driscoll wanted to destroy his career and she may have done just that, but only time will tell.  God knows Kurt's been working towards that end with no help from anyone.  In the mean time the question remains...what team would want someone with his past behavior issues?  He's already driving for a second tier team, and no first tier team will touch him....plus he's already been through three of those.  And, with Chevy stating that they want nothing to do with him, it leaves him with only Ford or Toyota teams as his hope for a ride. 
The ways are going for him this year...I don't see his anger management issues going away soon...

I do hope he can overcome all the issues and return to racing, but he has a long road ahead of him and that road has a lot of potholes in it.......