440 Rebuild HOT STREET!!!

[Charger_Martin]

Hi.

Im new here and would like to know a few things.

Rebuilding my 440 block and want like to know how much this would cost.

I have no idea what parts to get since im kind of new to MOPAR CARS.

All I know is that I want around 500-550 hp.

Please help me out here, Martin

[Blown70]

Welcome to the site.  Do you have a buget?, or right off I would think some of the ALUM. Heads, possibly a stroker crank?

Edlebrock makes a nice head, that IMO is resonable.  You do not need them to make the horse you want just depends on what you want to do/ SPEND

I guess street use or track, weight of the car you are going to use it in.  DETAILS may help.

Tom

[Charger_Martin]

Is going in a charger from 1969.

No track, only street. Is it possible to not stroke my block but instead get the horses from just changing other parts?

Were thinking about spending around max 4000 dollars.

[Musicman]

A really nice smooth running street motor can be built without stoking that will produce 450 HP and 550 TQ, along with lots of vacuum for power accessories.
Of course the sky's the limit on power really, it's simply that the higher you go, the more street comfort you are going to sacrifice. That's where the mild strokers start to shine... they give you that extra power without having to sacrifice your street manners....but it will come at the cost of some extra parts and machining.

Is that $4K for the engine only? What about Headers and Exhaust, etc?
The cost of rebuilding a stock engine is minimal, performance on the other hand cost money... as the man said, "How fast do you want to go".

[Charger_Martin]

I have headers and exhaust. 4000 dollars is only the parts but I guess that it wont work anyway.
Need more cash than that.

Dont really know what to do. Talked to a couple of guys that does this for a living and said that its gonna cost between 7000-10000 dollars for a STOCK REBUILD ( included work and parts)

But if I wanted like 500 hp then it would cost between 15000 - 20000 dollars.

Not cheap here in Europe:(

[Blown70]

   Wow, for those prices you could get yourself a hemi here.  I dont see why you could not get some of the machine work done, are you able to put it together yourself or do you need it assembled too.

Also, no need for a ton of after market parts, you have a complete engine now?

[Musicman]

Dont really know what to do. Talked to a couple of guys that does this for a living and said that its gonna cost between 7000-10000 dollars for a STOCK REBUILD ( included work and parts)

But if I wanted like 500 hp then it would cost between 15000 - 20000 dollars.

$7k -$10K for stock... that's insane!!! I would even consider $700 to $1000 high for a "stock" rebuild, even with new pistons, etc...
You can buy a complete engine rebuild kit from Mancini for as little as $300, or around $700 if you want to get fancy.

[Charger_Martin]

$7k-$10k is for the parts and work but still its no cheap here. Maybe its cheaper to buy a new engine?
Read somewhere that mopar has some problems with making engines now and will not be available for a very long time.

Is this true?

[Blown70]

$7k-$10k is for the parts and work but still its no cheap here. Maybe its cheaper to buy a new engine?
Read somewhere that mopar has some problems with making engines now and will not be available for a very long time.

Is this true?

Go with one of the aftermarket guys.  Raybartonracing.com or the like,   Not sure on shipping cost etc, But as STATED for a stock rebuild without a lot of fancy parts I cannot see spending $7,000 much less $10,000?  OF COURSE I am on this side of the pond......

[SeattleCharger]

order the parts from the USA, you will get a lot for your money,  euro vs. dollar,  spend the money on machine shop for block bore etc. and hire someone to put it together,  for that kind of money you could order a built hemi from USA,   pm Norway Charger on our site, he has done this, the euro will buy a lot from USA companies, you can get everything and have it shipped,

[Charger_Martin]

Where should I buy parts and what?

I really dont understand anything of whats best etc.

Does anyone know what I should get?

If Im going to build a HEMI block, what kind of parts should I get?

Can I use the 440 block again, that I already have or should I buy a new block?

Thinking 426 or 472 hemi with around 550-600 horsepowers.

Please help me out here guys. It might take a year for me to buy all the parts but its worth it.


Let me know, Thanks

[SeattleCharger]

Well, I learned most of what I know about engine building from this site over the years, reading lots of threads in the engine section, asking questions,      I would just do that,  learn about cams, torque vs. horsepower, more high rpm horsepower you want, bigger cam, then you need a higher stall converter and lower rear end gears will help.  If you want lots of torque and low end and still have lots of horsepower, you can do a stroked engine (different crankshaft,)  if you go above 500 horsepower you will prob. want to build up your transmission some and probably the rear end,   you can learn about intakes, carbs.   A dual plane intake is better for the street and lower end response, etc.
hope that helps,  don't know what to say about exact specific parts for you to order, others know a lot more than me,
Nate

[Charger_Martin]

Im just thinking since its probably gonna cost me alot, why not just build a hemi instead.

Buy all the parts withinn 1 year and have it built. Can`t cost that much more here in Europe anyway, instead of doing alot of other things with the existing engine or a new one.

1 example: The 500 wedge bb cost between 8100-9500 dollars in the us, here its 16400 dollars, so all in all it would not be that much different from buying/building a HEMI.

So the question again is: Can I use the 440 ( 69 ) block to build a hemi or do I need a new block for that?

Is there like a list of the parts thats beeing used to build the 426 or the 472 hemi?

[mikepmcs]

Welcome to the site.   You will get the right answer soon enough be patient.
I will direct some guru's your way... although some have already posted.

v/r
Mike

[Charger_Martin]

I found this list. Is this something that could be used?

http://www.forhemisonly.com/426resto.html

[SeattleCharger]

Here's an online store where a lot of people buy parts, if you want to get an idea about the cost of some parts, some info reading also.

    http://www.440source.com/

I can't make much sense of that hemi build, above my knowledge,

[firefighter3931]

Have a look in the Proven engine combo forum....there are lots of nice builds complete with dyno proven results. 

For 4k you won't be building much of an engine, inmo.



Ron

[SeattleCharger]

Well, you can do a decent build if you go for around 450 horsepower that will be a lot more economical than 500-550 horsepower, good bang for the buck ,  a street combo that I kind of wanted to do:   

   the aluminum stealth heads from 440source website, 900 bucks, this lets you have higher compression while running pump gas,
  get an engle K58 or K56 cam, work great in 440's says firefighter, (can I quote you firefighter?)
use an edelbrock RPM performer dual plane intake, and an eddlebrock or similar 750 cfm carb,  buy some mopar performance rods and some decent forged pistons, and go for a zero quench deck lid, (this is determined by the head gaskets and the height the pistons will go up to the heads,   this combo will give you maybe 450 horsepower?  and you won't have to build up transmission and rearend and change a bunch of other stuff like a 550 horsepower engine will need,  lots of tire roasting power with 450 horsepower,   ,  get the block you have bored if necessary, get all the parts, and find someone who will put it together for you,  would be close to 4000 probably, except for the high labor it sounds like you might have to pay for the machine shop over there, 
  or look into a crate engine and take your chances on the quality of the assembly, and have it shipped to you,

[mikepmcs]

As Ron stated..here is that said forum

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?board=30

Now that is some good stuff!

v/r
Mike

[Challenger340]

I'm with Ron here, you aren't gonna get much of an engine for the 4K mark.

Realworld, for 500 H.P. 440 engine, you'll need more budget.

[crash]

go to 440source.com  they are fairly inexpensive, stroker kits are 1,797.00  aluminum heads are 899.00  i priced all the parts for a  wicked stroker motor through them for around 3,600.00   my dollar sign doesn't work on the computer.  but that much money sounds insane for a stock rebuild.

[Charger_Martin]

Would it be better for me to buy a new engine instead? It will cost me alot in shipping and tax also + to have someone to do the work.

Read a post here about the 500 wedge engine? Would that be a good pick since it is probably going to cost m about the same in the end.

[Musicman]

As I said before, you can get a good 450 HP Street Build fairly cheap since you would be using a good portion of your existing components, stock crank, etc... However that extra 50 HP required for a 500 HP street build will cost you a lot more, because now your talking about replacing the entire rotating assembly, and all the necessary support items to go with it.

If you were trying to build a 600HP Street engine that would be one thing, but a 500 HP engine.... Take your $4K and build on what you have, the extra 50 HP will never be missed...

[Charger_Martin]

Found this article somewhere in this forum. Could this be made with my 440? I guess I would need another cam since this one is a custom one.

Or it there another way of doing it?

Proven Horsepower Engine Combinations - 500hp

Mopar 440ci
Since the mid-'60s and the introduction of the RB engine (raised block), Mopar guys have had it pretty good. The venerable 440 has always been a relatively cheap, reliable source of horsepower and torque. Enthusiasts devoted to other brands have to pay extra for things that are stock on the Chrysler big-block, such as an external oil pump and shaft rockers. The skirted block, although heavy, provides a very stable bottom-end platform, and the cavernous crankcase lends itself to the addition of various stroker cranks without much fuss. However, since stroker engines can be expensive, do you really need the extra inches to make 500 street-friendly horsepower and 525 lb-ft of torque? That's the question we put to Mike Johnson at JMS Racing Engines in Monrovia, California. Johnson says, "No problem, with modern cam profiles and cylinder heads, 500 hp and 525 lb-ft should be relatively easy, and it shouldn't cost too much, either."

Johnson suggests the use of Edelbrock Performer RPM cylinder heads. Used in conjunction with stock replacement KB Silvolite hypereutectic pistons, the closed-chamber design of the 84cc heads provides a great quench area to deter detonation and puts the compression ratio at 10.3:1 when the pistons are at zero deck height. The heads can be used right out of the box with a Performer RPM manifold.

Johnson tells us the LY connecting-rod forgings are plentiful, inexpensive, and reliably capable of handling much more than 500 hp when equipped with quality hardware. Pre-'73 440s all have forged cranks that also will handle the load, so we used these essentially stock components.

Lunati ground the cam using some lobes designed specifically for the Chrysler lifter. As most Chrysler guys know, the large 0.904-inch lifters allow for faster ramp rates and higher lift without the penalty of long duration times, and Johnson planned to take advantage of this. He wanted the torque curve to be flat, with peak horsepower coming in below 5,800 rpm, so he chose a solid flat-tappet cam with 239/243 degrees of duration at 0.050 and 0.536/0.547-inch lift. The exhaust flow of the Edelbrock head is good enough that a larger split between intake and exhaust duration isn't necessary at this power level. The cam was ground with a 110-degree lobe separation and an intake centerline of 106 degrees.

On a dyno, this combo made 527 hp and 557 lb-ft. The peak horsepower was achieved at 5,600 rpm, and the peak torque occurred at 4,100 rpm, making over 500 lb-ft from 2,900 rpm all the way to 5,500 rpm. In fact, the average torque throughout the entire pull was 529 lb-ft. Even with all that power, it still pulled 12 in-Hg at an idle, just perfect for the street.

JMS Racing Engines
Monrovia, CA
626/357-2718
jmsracing.com

Parts List
Description   PN   Source   Price
Edelbrock RPM Chrysler heads   60929   Summit Racing   $1,359.00
Edelbrock RPM manifold   7193   Summit Racing   199.88
KB Silvolite pistons   KB237   Summit Racing   313.99
ARP rod bolts   135-6402   Summit Racing   51.88
Lunati cam/lifters   custom   Lunati   169.95
Crane 1.5 rocker arms   64790-1   Summit Racing   349.95
Holley HP 950   80496-1   Summit Racing   679.95

(http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/ccrp_0611_performance_engine_combinations/mopar_performance.html):

[SeattleCharger]

that looks awesome.    I think that when you order a cam, you can order it specifically any grind you want, so the fact that it is a custom cam isn't any different than ordering a cam in a pre-made grind other than you gotta tell em what you want exactly.  pretty sure about this, don't quote me.