i burnt up my ammeter, now what. 7/4/13--- UPDATE

[lukedukem]

i've tried to search and i've found good info until this new issue. i had the bouncing ammeter like others on this site and found the info to fix it.
well i didnt act in time. i went to pull the car out saturday and turn it around so i can start to replace wires and trouble shoot the bouncing issue.
after i started car i opened all the shop doors and let i warm up a bit. when i got in i noticed the guage was pegged out to the right. but i knew this already, thats what i  am gonna fix.
while turing around the car the other guages started to fogg up, even the speedo, and after parking the car and shutting it down the amm meter guage is stuck. its pegged to the right and will not come down.
i guess i fried it. now i have to start over, becuase now i'm lost as to why this happened. and what my next move should be. i showed my wife and she smelled some burning.
i didnt, but i have bad sinus issues.
so what happened to my ammeter and what should be my next move. thanks

luke

[b5blue]

Lower the column and pull the cluster after unplugging the battery.

[Pete in NH]

Hi,

Sorry to hear what happened just as you were about to address the problem. I'm curious as to why the ammeter was pegged all the way to the right before it burnt out. Was the battery way,way down or has a shorted cell? The alternator was dumping a lot of current into something. There may be some kind of fault with the wiring like a short circuit somewhere that lead to this failure so, you may want to carefully inspect all the wiring harnesses for cracked or broken insulation. Forty year old plastic insulation can get really brittle and crack. I wonder if the ampmeter itself shorted to the dash frame somehow. I think your wise to ask what caused the problem before installing the wiring up grade. Take a look at the thread titled "Latest victim of the amp gauge ambush" below in this section. I outlined how I'm going to install this upgrade in my car.

[68 RT]

This happened to me while driving one time, it was the voltage regulator. Lucky I was close to home.

[skip68]

Those amp meters are bad news.  They can start a car fire and have.  Get rid of it and run a volt meter.   

[lukedukem]

Hi,

Sorry to hear what happened just as you were about to address the problem. I'm curious as to why the ammeter was pegged all the way to the right before it burnt out. Was the battery way,way down or has a shorted cell? The alternator was dumping a lot of current into something. There may be some kind of fault with the wiring like a short circuit somewhere that lead to this failure so, you may want to carefully inspect all the wiring harnesses for cracked or broken insulation. Forty year old plastic insulation can get really brittle and crack. I wonder if the ampmeter itself shorted to the dash frame somehow. I think your wise to ask what caused the problem before installing the wiring up grade. Take a look at the thread titled "Latest victim of the amp gauge ambush" below in this section. I outlined how I'm going to install this upgrade in my car.

the battery is new, so i know it wasnt that. it might be like 68 RT said, voltage regulator, or something else. this car was wired wrong when i bought it as stated in this thread
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,99586.0.html 
what ever happened i need to pull the cluster and see what other damage i did. and yeah, skip,i think i'm gonna run a volt meter. what do you recomend, is there one that will fit in the cluster, if not its cool.
thanks

luke

[b5blue]

New "OEM" brand ALT gauges are rated for 60 Amps, factory ones 30. Others convert ALT to VOLT @ I think "RPM Gauge Inc."
Read this... http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,33574.0.html   
Here for repairs.. http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,37999.0.html

[lukedukem]

New "OEM" brand ALT gauges are rated for 60 Amps, factory ones 30. Others convert ALT to VOLT @ I think "RPM Gauge Inc."
Read this... http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,33574.0.html  
Here for repairs.. http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,37999.0.html

Thanks for the info
What if I need to move the car. Will it still operate without the cluster in it

Luke

[Nacho-RT74]

splice the amm wires together with screw and nut... and isolate them ( tape )... will be able to drive the car

[lukedukem]

New "OEM" brand ALT gauges are rated for 60 Amps, factory ones 30. Others convert ALT to VOLT @ I think "RPM Gauge Inc."

i couldnt find rpm gauge inc, is there somewhere else.

luke

[Pete in NH]

I took a look through the March 2013 thread you referenced. Wow, that wiring is really hacked up! I think as others have advised you in that thread you have some serous wiring issues with that car. Forty year old cars can have a lot changed on them from the way they left the factory but modified wiring if not done correctly as others have stated can be dangerous. I think the advice that you install a few new reproduction harnesses is right on the money. New engine compartment and under dash harnesses will go a long way toward making your car safe and reliable. You really should consider putting the wiring back the way it left the factory.  I would also move the battery back to the front of the car. Trunk mounted batteries leave you with long high current cables under the car that really can't be fused for fire protection. This car has some issues a voltmeter conversion is not going to solve. I don't know what your skill or comfort level is with electrical work and installing even good reproduction harnesses can cause some head scratching at times. Perhaps, you know someone who could help you who is more knowledgeable on electrical work that could help. I do think others are right when they say disconnect the battery and don't use the car until you can get the wiring sorted out. Looking at the photo in the March thread, I'm not sure the fusible link off the battery terminal of the starter relay is still intact, see Nacho's drawings. This fusible link is basic fire protection. If it is not there this may be why your ammeter burned as it acted like the fuse. You've posted twice in a month about smoke and strange electrical issues, in a way you were lucky in that even though you lost the ammeter it could have been worse and might be the next time.

[lukedukem]

I took a look through the March 2013 thread you referenced. Wow, that wiring is really hacked up! I think as others have advised you in that thread you have some serous wiring issues with that car. Forty year old cars can have a lot changed on them from the way they left the factory but modified wiring if not done correctly as others have stated can be dangerous. I think the advice that you install a few new reproduction harnesses is right on the money. New engine compartment and under dash harnesses will go a long way toward making your car safe and reliable. You really should consider putting the wiring back the way it left the factory.  I would also move the battery back to the front of the car. Trunk mounted batteries leave you with long high current cables under the car that really can't be fused for fire protection. This car has some issues a voltmeter conversion is not going to solve. I don't know what your skill or comfort level is with electrical work and installing even good reproduction harnesses can cause some head scratching at times. Perhaps, you know someone who could help you who is more knowledgeable on electrical work that could help. I do think others are right when they say disconnect the battery and don't use the car until you can get the wiring sorted out. Looking at the photo in the March thread, I'm not sure the fusible link off the battery terminal of the starter relay is still intact, see Nacho's drawings. This fusible link is basic fire protection. If it is not there this may be why your ammeter burned as it acted like the fuse. You've posted twice in a month about smoke and strange electrical issues, in a way you were lucky in that even though you lost the ammeter it could have been worse and might be the next time.

i know pete. i should only have to move it one more time. i'm getting my lift in and need to move the car to install it. but i will be pushing it, not driving. i bought the harnesses, just need time to install, and correct the other stuff in my pics. i have read nacho's stuff and i think i can handle it. where would i get a battery tray and everything to move my battery back up front?

luke

[b5blue]

My bad... http://www.redlinegaugeworks.com/ 

[Pete in NH]

Wow, having a lift in the garage, I have to envy you on that one! I didn't mean to get on you too much about fixing the wiring. I just didn't want to see you loose your car over it. AMD has repro battery trays for not too much. I see Goodmark has positive battery cables for a 383-440 B block engine, don't know what you have in your car. AMD also lists the battery hold down and J bolts. All in all, it shouldn't be hard to find the pieces to move the battrey up front again. I think a little searching among the Mopar reproduction parts suppliers will turn up what you need. Good luck with the project!

[lukedukem]

Wow, having a lift in the garage, I have to envy you on that one! I didn't mean to get on you too much about fixing the wiring. I just didn't want to see you loose your car over it. AMD has repro battery trays for not too much. I see Goodmark has positive battery cables for a 383-440 B block engine, don't know what you have in your car. AMD also lists the battery hold down and J bolts. All in all, it shouldn't be hard to find the pieces to move the battrey up front again. I think a little searching among the Mopar reproduction parts suppliers will turn up what you need. Good luck with the project!

thanks pete, and don't worry about getting on to me about fixin the wire. its been an issue i need to get too.
yeah, the lift i will be picking up tomorrow and i'll try and install it this weekend, so the wire issue will wait another week. at least i can order the parts and then get at it again. plus lift it up so i dont have to bend over too

luke

[lukedukem]

ok, so my lift is in my shop, but not installed. my brother was suppose to help but went to Vegas till the 19th.

anyway, i stopped working on his motor(actually its both ours) to concentrait on my ammeter issue. so here are some pics. then i will ask ?'s later.

1st is of the back of the guage. CRISPY!

2. just a pic of how dirty the lens is. WOW i didn't realize it

3. this is the guage, i touched it and it just fell off.

[lukedukem]

the last is the housing, you can see not only where it broke but the burn marks

[lukedukem]

so my question is now what. i know i need to make the wireing upgrade to keep it from buring up anymore stuff but what do i do about the guage. its not fixable. where can i get one to replace it.
i don't care if its factory. it can be repop. my car is not matching numbers so i'm not concered with any of that. but like the stock look. and don't want to have to replace any other guages too

any ideas

thanks
luke

[lukedukem]

since its out i will probably redue the rest. the tach was installed before i got the car. but the clock dont work

anyway, Pic

[Pete in NH]

Hi Luke,

I guess you could always post a wanted ad. here. I think you might also find them listed on Evil Bay but you're really going to pay for it there. i don't think anyone is repoping them although it seems like a good item to repro. You might want to consider going to a voltmeter since you have the instrument cluster apart. I posted something earlier this morning about possibly adapting a Autogage 2356 1-1/2 inch voltmeter. That would be a low cost fix if it fits.

On another note be very careful when cleaning the smoke residue off the other cluster gauges. That paint on the markings may be very fragile after all these years. Maybe others can suggest how to clean them up. I think I would start with a very mild cleaner such as a few drops of dish detergent in water and rub very gentally with something like a Q tip cotton swab. Again, maybe others have some advice.

[lukedukem]

thanks pete. i might get a decal kit for the other gauges. they have been like that, its not the smoke that made them do that. it wasnt much smoke at all, that i could see anyway. i might do a whole aftermarket kit and sell the other factory gauges. i've been following that other thread and like what i see. i have a new dash harness though, is it hard to make new gauges work with it?
i'll see what others say too

luke

[Pete in NH]

Hi Luke,

You're likely to run into some issues fitting an after market set of gauges into your dash. One thing to check would be the fuel tank, oil pressure, and temperature sending units in the car already may or may not work correctly with the after market gauges. You would need to read and compare the specifications between the factory senders and the new gauges. One the wiring side,as you can see the factory gauges mount up on and connect to the wiring using a printed circuit board. If you go with after market gauges you will have to figure out how to mount your new gauges and then adapt them into the wiring harness. It can be done because as you know others have done it. but, it does require some electrical knowledge to get it all hooked up correctly.

The easier way out may be to repair/restore the stock instrument panel. That way you know it will match up with the new dash wiring harness. The simplest option I can think of is to replace the factory ammeter wit a new factory part. The voltmeter conversion would be the next simplest option and a new set of after market gauges would be the most complicated option.

[lukedukem]

ok, so i ordered the correct dash harness and i have a replacement volt gauge for the ammeter i burnt up.
so my question is, Do i still have to do the upgrade that nacho was talking about?

luke

[Pete in NH]

Hi Luke,

Yes, I think I would still do a partial modification. It would look a little different from Nacho's original modification because there is no need to run high current wires up to the dash for an ammeter when you install a voltmeter.

If I recall, I think you said your alternator is a 75 amp unit. I would run a # 6 piece of wire directly from the alternator output stud to the battery stud on the starter relay and I would install an 80amp Maxi fuse in that line. I would then run another piece of #8 wire from the battery stud on the starter relay through a 30 or 40 amp Maxi fuse to the wire that went from the old ammeter to the distribution splice in the dash harness that should be the #12 black wire. If you have a lot of new accessories in the car I would use the 40 amp fuse if not I would try a 30 amp.

On your new voltmeter, Connect the negative side to a good ground and the positive side to a point that is powered on when the ignition switch is in the on position. Did you find a voltmeter that would fit in the same place as the old ammeter?

[lukedukem]

Yeah Pete, I bought that one from summit that you suggested. It would fit but I decided to put the ammeter back in the dash just for looks and wire up the volt meter elsewhere. Thanks

Luke